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[MBTI General] xNTPs: how do you define Ti / when do you use it?

mintleaf

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Every source I've read (which, admittedly, consists of only two or three) basically defines it as "precision," but this is pretty vague and seems like it could apply to Te as well.

Can anyone differentiate between the two a little more clearly, and give examples of Ti use?
 

Fluffywolf

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Hmm, I wouldn't define it as 'precision'. Ti is a construct through which Ti users filter the world. As we develop ourselves, Ti continues to expand and connect the dots that need to be connected. But Ti is not about achieving a goal or anything like that. Ti is all about understanding.

Te on the other hand is very goal oriented. Therefor the word 'precision' would much better suit them. They have a goal and then look for the best way to achieve that goal.

Ti users deal with goals differently, ofcourse they can have goals but more as a means to get things out of the way, and Ti users would not neccesarily choose the best way, just the most effecient one they can think of.
 
S

Society

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priority:
Ti & Te both seek in resolve cognitive dissonance in general.
(Fi & Fe both seek to resolve emotional dissonance in particular).

core difference:
Ti (and Fe) reflects upon information to explore the outside.
Te (and Fi) super imposes information to express the inside.

temperament difference:
Te (like Fe) manifests as an information mapping mechanism, stressed by chaotic stimuli
-> Te (like Fe) pays more attention to the most cohesive information structure (Si or Ni).
Ti (like Fi) manifests as an information navigating mechanism, seeking maximum stimuli.
-> Ti (like Fi) pays more attention to the most stimulating information structure (Ne or Se).

beyond that, the differences between Ti and Te start to get fuzzy, because they become highly contextual. while the different approaches can demand developing different cognitive skills and intellectual habits, they are in the end of the day serving a similar purpose in a similar realm - relieving cognitive dissonance - making sense of reality.

for example:
- someone making a plan of action (Te) will gain experience in questioning the relevance of facts
- someone seeking to explore a theory (Ti) will gain experience in questioning the validity of facts.
but unavoidably, many plans of actions will depend on theories, and the act of fact checking will require a plan of action, both Ti and Te users will fall into situations where they will have to do both, and develop the skills and intellectual habits to support both. life simply isn't narrow enough to fit into anyone's preference.
 

Fluffywolf

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priority:
Ti & Te both seek in resolve cognitive dissonance in general.
(Fi & Fe both seek to resolve emotional dissonance in particular).

core difference:
Ti (and Fe) reflects upon information to explore the outside.
Te (and Fi) super imposes information to express the inside.

temperament difference:
Te (like Fe) manifests as an information mapping mechanism, stressed by chaotic stimuli
-> Te (like Fe) pays more attention to the most cohesive information structure (Si or Ni).
Ti (like Fi) manifests as an information navigating mechanism, seeking maximum stimuli.
-> Ti (like Fi) pays more attention to the most stimulating information structure (Ne or Se).

beyond that, the differences between Ti and Te start to get fuzzy, because they become highly contextual. while the different approaches can demand developing different cognitive skills and intellectual habits, they are in the end of the day serving a similar purpose in a similar realm - relieving cognitive dissonance - making sense of reality.

for example:
- someone making a plan of action (Te) will gain experience in questioning the relevance of facts
- someone seeking to explore a theory (Ti) will gain experience in questioning the validity of facts.
but unavoidably, many plans of actions will depend on theories, and the act of fact checking will require a plan of action, both Ti and Te users will fall into situations where they will have to do both, and develop the skills and intellectual habits to support both. life simply isn't narrow enough to fit into anyone's preference.

Great post, the crutch of the issue is indeed that Te and Ti isn't a black and white subject and it is hard to distinguish relevant differences. I think your post explains it well.
 

entropie

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Ti works a lot in the dark, while Te is aimed to be visible. This is one shade of the difference.

If you get around to watch "Chronicles of Riddick", you see good Ti use in him.
 

Nicki

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I've always been confused about Ti. What exactly is Ti precise about and why? What is its purpose?
 

Winds of Thor

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Ne gets you into the ball park. Ti refines down the details to a more accurate picture.
 

entropie

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I've always been confused about Ti. What exactly is Ti precise about and why? What is its purpose?

One fortitude of Ti or Fi for example is transformed thinking. It is said that some introverts (in special those with dom Ti or Fi) need time alone to process information. Thats true but its not the only thing they do. Ti and Fi do not always work linear. Thats why its terrible for a Ti type to articulate his or her thoughts. Its more like puzzling information together leaving blank holes in between which fill over time and form the big picture in the end. But only seldom Ti thinking is goal-oriented at all. Its goal-oriented when used in a job or in academics. In your daily life its more like you collect all sorts of information and you give them no evaluation whether they are necessary or not and you start to transform these bits of information and synthesize new ideas.

For example before Einstein the universe was widely regarded as a vast empty space. Vacuum was thought to be some sort of void layer, maybe filled with some gas but thats it. Einstein completly transformed the idea of a vacuum by giving it equal attributes like matter. One attribute in special which is gravity. He said that the vacuum layer is influenced by gravity. As an example he said that light which comes from the sun, does take longer to reach us than it is supposed to be according to the distance of the sun (which was measured a different way). That way it became clear that the gravity of the sun somehow pulls the vacuum around the star together into some sort of valley, which the light hass to pass thru before it travels to Earth.

This's hard to imagine and hard to arrive by with linear thinking cause it is the proposition of a new way of thinking. And thats basically what Ti is good at, it can trasnform thinking and the way to look at things, it can reinvent itself. And that means the same time that it doesnt follow a clear pattern. A pattern that could be written down postulated and made clear to everyone. Every introverted thinker differs from another introverted thinker, they all live in their own rich or poor inner worlds. And since its not fundamentally goal-oriented there is no outcome to be expected sooner or later.
 

Little Linguist

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Question (and this is not a loaded question, even though it may appear so - I am really trying to understand):

Following on [MENTION=4109]entropie[/MENTION]'s post, would you say that Ti is like he said, "Its more like puzzling information together leaving blank holes in between which fill over time and form the big picture in the end," whereas Te might be "taking the puzzle pieces and fitting them together"?

I'm trying to make a vague mental image for myself so I can understand....
 

Fluffywolf

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Rather than looking how it works when we try to solve puzzles, one of the difference is also in lifestyle.

As Ti is like a big frame that continues to grow, it is absolutely imperative we store information in that frame as truthfully as possible. If we become half-assed and start to assume certain things without giving them any thought, that big frame we've built for ourselves is going to crumble. Every detail, every angle is going to be important to a Ti user.

A Te user is much more capable of ignoring relatively unimportant angles and details. Something a Ti user could not possibly do, even though the value of said relatively unimportant angles and details may prove insignificant in what needs to be achieved. They still need to be considered.


Question (and this is not a loaded question, even though it may appear so - I am really trying to understand):

Following on @entropie's post, would you say that Ti is like he said, "Its more like puzzling information together leaving blank holes in between which fill over time and form the big picture in the end," whereas Te might be "taking the puzzle pieces and fitting them together"?

I'm trying to make a vague mental image for myself so I can understand....


You know what I believe? I believe a Ti user would never fully be able to explain how Ti works. That is just what Ti is. :D
 

mintleaf

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priority:
Ti & Te both seek in resolve cognitive dissonance in general.
(Fi & Fe both seek to resolve emotional dissonance in particular).

core difference:
Ti (and Fe) reflects upon information to explore the outside.
Te (and Fi) super imposes information to express the inside.

temperament difference:
Te (like Fe) manifests as an information mapping mechanism, stressed by chaotic stimuli
-> Te (like Fe) pays more attention to the most cohesive information structure (Si or Ni).
Ti (like Fi) manifests as an information navigating mechanism, seeking maximum stimuli.
-> Ti (like Fi) pays more attention to the most stimulating information structure (Ne or Se).

beyond that, the differences between Ti and Te start to get fuzzy, because they become highly contextual. while the different approaches can demand developing different cognitive skills and intellectual habits, they are in the end of the day serving a similar purpose in a similar realm - relieving cognitive dissonance - making sense of reality.

for example:
- someone making a plan of action (Te) will gain experience in questioning the relevance of facts
- someone seeking to explore a theory (Ti) will gain experience in questioning the validity of facts.
but unavoidably, many plans of actions will depend on theories, and the act of fact checking will require a plan of action, both Ti and Te users will fall into situations where they will have to do both, and develop the skills and intellectual habits to support both. life simply isn't narrow enough to fit into anyone's preference.

really good explanation, thanks.

I've heard that people with Te tend to think best while in motion (pace frequently, solve problems best on paper, etc.), while the opposite is true for those who use Ti. I know it seems like a pretty simplistic differentiation, but it applies to almost everyone I can think of off the top of my head. What do you think?
 
S

Society

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really good explanation, thanks.

I've heard that people with Te tend to think best while in motion (pace frequently, solve problems best on paper, etc.), while the opposite is true for those who use Ti. I know it seems like a pretty simplistic differentiation, but it applies to almost everyone I can think of off the top of my head. What do you think?

i don't think that's the case, i can say for myself that i tend towards pacing around quite a bit, and there has being a thread about xxTPs thinking out loud that alluded that other xxTPs do the same (thinking out laud while walking down the street, doing groceries, etc).
 

Nicki

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Messages
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priority:
Ti & Te both seek in resolve cognitive dissonance in general.
(Fi & Fe both seek to resolve emotional dissonance in particular).

core difference:
Ti (and Fe) reflects upon information to explore the outside.
Te (and Fi) super imposes information to express the inside.

temperament difference:
Te (like Fe) manifests as an information mapping mechanism, stressed by chaotic stimuli
-> Te (like Fe) pays more attention to the most cohesive information structure (Si or Ni).
Ti (like Fi) manifests as an information navigating mechanism, seeking maximum stimuli.
-> Ti (like Fi) pays more attention to the most stimulating information structure (Ne or Se).

beyond that, the differences between Ti and Te start to get fuzzy, because they become highly contextual. while the different approaches can demand developing different cognitive skills and intellectual habits, they are in the end of the day serving a similar purpose in a similar realm - relieving cognitive dissonance - making sense of reality.

for example:
- someone making a plan of action (Te) will gain experience in questioning the relevance of facts
- someone seeking to explore a theory (Ti) will gain experience in questioning the validity of facts.
but unavoidably, many plans of actions will depend on theories, and the act of fact checking will require a plan of action, both Ti and Te users will fall into situations where they will have to do both, and develop the skills and intellectual habits to support both. life simply isn't narrow enough to fit into anyone's preference.

This is a really good description!
 

lunalum

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*feels left out*

True, the title should be xxTPs...... or if you have to narrow it down, IxTPs.


I'd say Ti is pretty much about finding a fit for everything in your universe. Te, in contrast is about finding a fit for everything in the universe (more messy, subjective matters are irrelevant). and Fi is also sort of fitting everything in your universe, but is equipped to deal with more matters of opinion than that of technicality.

Te is like figuring out whether a platypus is a mammal or a bird, Ti is more like "what really is this thing we call a platypus anyway?"
 

TheCheeseBurgerKing

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Ti is effective for driving a point home, but only when the crowd cares to listen. Ti used without effective Ne is a wasted round.


Ever heard that ISTPs debate for hours? That's why.
 
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