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[MBTI General] Why do INTJs spare INFPs their wrath?

IDreamtIWasABee

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This is more accurately titled "Three Questions About INTJs and INFPs," but if it's stylish, it's forgiven, amirite? (I know. "No.")

So. First. Why are the INFP's frequent lapses in logic and extreme over-tenderness given a pass (or even found endearing) when most other types aren't given that compliment (those poor ESFJs-oh, you're merciless to them!)? Is it the ease with which we change our minds while thinking out loud? Because your feuds with INTPs are legendary, and INFJs don't usually talk about deep subjects until they've already formed firm opinions.

Second, do you find our shameless sharing of shy-person-feelings to be tranquilizing when you're stressed? I know that an INTJ's calm, succinct stating of facts has calmed me immediately when I've been seriously worked up over stuff (you certainly calm things down over on the NF board).

And third, has it been your experience that INTJs and INFPs share an intelligent but offensive sense of humor?

Oh! Fourth and final. Has an INFP ever come to your defense? Usually it's you guys protecting us (and I know the INTJs in my life sometimes find it trying), but when my INTJ friends are off balance and attacked, I go into a Gohan rage that I'd otherwise be waaay too shy and inhibited to express.
 

Alea_iacta_est

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It could be to do with the fact that the INFP's dominant function is Fi, which is the inner child/relief function of the INTJ. Usually INTJs utilize Fi as a way to escape reality, and since it is in the tertiary slot (the child archetype of our personality), it reflects the innocent child-like nature of our emotional world. Therefore, (and I don't know any INFPs in real life, so I can't back this up with any hard evidence) INFPs (being Fi-doms) might remind INTJs of their innocent, child-like tertiary and might make them more kind and friendly to INFPs.

Every ESFJ I have ever known in real life has royally pissed me off just by making their presence known, that's why they don't get a break.
 

Coriolis

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Every ESFJ I have ever known in real life has royally pissed me off just by making their presence known, that's why they don't get a break.
ESFJs seem to expect the world to become more like them, or at least to do thing their way. INFPs, on the other hand, aren't pushy this way and seem content being themselves and letting others do the same. This is far more palatable to most INTJs.
 

HongDou

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(those poor ESFJs-oh, you're merciless to them!)

*psst* it's not just INTJs - it's the whole internet.

ISFJs get more of a break though. I guess since there are probably more Is on the web than Es, ISFJs get cut some slack because introversion makes them fit in more so they might get to sit at the cool kids' table.

I've also never heard of this phenomenon before. I think INTJs (like any other type...or human being) spare their "wrath" from the people they get along more positively with. Maybe, as a general tendency, INTJs get along better with NFPs than they do SFJs.
 

cafe

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I have an INTJ daughter and an INFP daughter. Generally INTJ lets things slide with INFP because the emotional fallout isn't worth it. However, when the INTJ lowers the boom, there is no question that the boom has been lowered.
 

Cygnus

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It could be to do with the fact that the INFP's dominant function is Fi, which is the inner child/relief function of the INTJ. Usually INTJs utilize Fi as a way to escape reality, and since it is in the tertiary slot (the child archetype of our personality), it reflects the innocent child-like nature of our emotional world. Therefore, (and I don't know any INFPs in real life, so I can't back this up with any hard evidence) INFPs (being Fi-doms) might remind INTJs of their innocent, child-like tertiary and might make them more kind and friendly to INFPs.

Every ESFJ I have ever known in real life has royally pissed me off just by making their presence known, that's why they don't get a break.

1. JCF* isn't that accurate for determining relationship patterns, love who you want based on who they are, not a 4 digit code, but if you are an INTp (INTJ) in Socionics (a JCF system more revolving around interpersonal relations with different definitions for functions) then ESFp (ESFP) is your dual and ENFp (ENFP) is your illusionary (one of the worst interpersonal relationships possible in Socionics).

2. I don't see any preferences for cognitive functions excepting the "weird, zany, wildly creative" that hints at Ne but could easily apply to any Pe dominant.

* Jungian Cognitive Functions

How does this explain INTJ distaste for ExFPs? Is is just I-types they get along with?
 

Alea_iacta_est

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How does this explain INTJ distaste for ExFPs? Is is just I-types they get along with?
(What I am discussing here is Jungian function archetypes; in Socionics, the function definitions are altered into strange categorizations like dynamic or static, et al.)

The INTp is a dual with the ESFp, and that is generally the happiest, long-lasting relationship, so there is no distaste there. In fact, usually in dual relations, the INTp often feels as though they aren't good enough for the ESFp due to the fact that Extroverted dual pairs don't recognize their introverted dual unless they converse with them often.

For ENFp-INTp, the relation is illusionary, explained in this quote.

These are relations of growing laziness. There are no other intertype relations that can deactivate partners so much as Illusionary relations. Illusionary partners find it comfortable being relaxed together, discussing different subjects. What one partner is talking about is always interesting, but in order to understand the partner better the other partner needs to force themselves. This difficulty in making an effort also makes achieving goals together almost impossible.

Mutual business or other activity is complicated, because Illusionary partners do not understand the reasons and motives of each other's actions. Whatever one partner tries to achieve usually appears insufficient and worthless to the other. Because partners expect different kinds of activity from each other, they become negative and may criticise each other's intentions and objectives. For an observer, this misunderstanding between partners can appear to be humorous.

The introvert partner usually tries to free themselves from the attempts of the extrovert partner to impose their opinions. The introverts seek independence. The extrovert partner wants to make their introvert partner into what they consider to be a "normal person". Both partners are distrustful of each other abilities.

Disagreements in these relations are usually short because partners are drawn to each other. From time to time Illusionary relations become really warm and caring. It normally happens when partners work together but not on the same task. Partners may feel inspired with the result of a successfully finished project, however when they try to start a new project, they again meet the same difficulties in co-operation.
 

prplchknz

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conclusion i've gotten from this thread, because *we* INFPs are fucking adorable to INTJs
 

Amargith

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You missed the part where they are fucking adorable to us NFPs as well with their teenage Fi :smile:

Basically Te fights with Fe and Ni fights with Si. Meanwhile tertiary Fi gets to enjoy the guidance of dominant Fi, while baby Te gets to be pampered by big brother Te.

Ne and Ni tend to be best buds in a partner-in-crime type of way, so...yup.


The only time I have trouble handling my INTJ is when he goes into Se-mode, as it triggers my Si-mode. Since they're both inferior functions, it tends to make him feel restrained and nagged at by me,while I feel like I have to be the damned adult and don't know how to respond in any way but with cynical remarks to snap him out of it already and return back to normal. It's weird being the cynical one, and it's not pretty on me. I'm..working on that :ninja:
 
R

Riva

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I have noticed this too between intjs - nfps.

Could it be because they are non threatening?
 

Doctor Cringelord

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I wasn't aware of this, but it sounds sickeningly adorable. The big mean INTJs protecting their soft Fi cousins or something.

Actually, I've noticed a similar camaraderie between INTPs and INFJs.
 

Coriolis

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conclusion i've gotten from this thread, because *we* INFPs are fucking adorable to INTJs
Running across an INFP is like finding a crocus in the snow.

1383307-bigthumbnail.jpg


The only time I have trouble handling my INTJ is when he goes into Se-mode, as it triggers my Si-mode. Since they're both inferior functions, it tends to make him feel restrained and nagged at by me,while I feel like I have to be the damned adult and don't know how to respond in any way but with cynical remarks to snap him out of it already and return back to normal. It's weird being the cynical one, and it's not pretty on me. I'm..working on that :ninja:
What causes him to do this, and how does he behave in this mode?
 

kquirk

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Who would want to hurt an INFP?



Also, easy targets.
 

Amargith

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What causes him to do this, and how does he behave in this mode?

Too much stress, mostly. He very occasionally does flip his silly switch and it comes out Se. Alcohol helps - though I'm unclear on whether the se causes the alcohol intake and then makes things even worse or if alcohol actually triggers it :D
Usually it'll be a day where he has nothing else to do, and its like the first day in weeks he has like that - he'll go completely childish on me and basically act out :doh: :blush:

He'll become loud and belligerent, piss off every waiter we get, and want to do the craziest things without a plan - so not used to that from him. They often turn into long dragged out physical activities with no end in sight and no goal which makes it...well, torturous for me and I have no way of knowing when it'll end. Suddenly he just *has* to see the city park. NO, it does not matter that it is cold and windy outside and that we've been wandering around forever, or lived here for 10 years and never have shown interest in the park before. Or, let's go explore the ugliest part of the city- the back alleys, and get completely lost. Yeah! And I'm like...so where is the fun in that? It's ugly, it is cold and raining, it is basically ugly houses on more ugly houses with shady looking characters and we have no clue where we're going or how long it'll take us to get back to my happy little nook in the wall where i'm safe from the world. Yeah - count me in. :dry:

It is kind of adorable to see him that way though and I wish I could relax more into it. I would - if he didn't include me in those crazy schemes and drag me along every time as well. No wait - that's a lie, my si would still worry all over the place since he really does go off the reservation when he gets that way :doh:

More restrained forms of it are when he has had a loooong day and goes on a idiotic youtube vids bender, or sings meme songs over and over again. It's sooooo not my type of humour and I cannot help but roll my eyes at it, which makes him go even nuttier.
 

prplchknz

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That is only a problem if you are planning to eat one.
:unsure: um what? please don't eat infps, we generally don't like being eaten, you know the whole dying part of being consumed orally
 

grey_beard

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This is more accurately titled "Three Questions About INTJs and INFPs," but if it's stylish, it's forgiven, amirite? (I know. "No.")
It's not forgiven because it is stylish. It is decreed to be forgiven because you are an INFP.

So. First. Why are the INFP's frequent lapses in logic and extreme over-tenderness given a pass (or even found endearing) when most other types aren't given that compliment (those poor ESFJs-oh, you're merciless to them!)? Is it the ease with which we change our minds while thinking out loud? Because your feuds with INTPs are legendary, and INFJs don't usually talk about deep subjects until they've already formed firm opinions.
It's twofold. No, three.
1) The INFP mind and the INTJ mind are completely different, but complementary: not opposite. The INTJ sees the world as fixed, and intuits their way through it, constantly *ping*ing with their radar and re-evaluating their actions and presentation for best fit. The INFP sees the world as endlessly branching possibilities, and is constantly trying each of these possibilities to see how they fit the fixed internal values of the INFP. The constant matching of possibilites against actualities is instinctive for each type, and we recognize a kindred spirit, even though "they're pronouncing it all wrong." This simultaneously leads to
:doh: AND :wubbie:
2) Similarly, the INFP and the INTJ work best in the realm of abstract metaphor for communication. More :wubbie:
3) The INFP fluffiness, has the same effect on the INTJ, as a laser pointer does for a cat. It will chase it FOREVER and not grow tired of it: it is because (I have come to believe) that the INTJ Ni loves to see the big picture or sparse-based connections between seemingly disjointed items, and so we intuitively grok the connection which to the INFP is instinctive and second-nature (for the INFP it is part of an integrated whole, as each note in a chord, each chord on an instrument, each instrument of a symphony), and the INTJ reaches the same point by music theory.


Second, do you find our shameless sharing of shy-person-feelings to be tranquilizing when you're stressed? I know that an INTJ's calm, succinct stating of facts has calmed me immediately when I've been seriously worked up over stuff (you certainly calm things down over on the NF board).
INFP's cotton candy outsides are a safe place for the entombed, frozen-in-Carbonite INTJ Fi to come out and play. INTJ's relentless, planet-crushing focus and logic are a safe harbor for the INFP among storms of emotion which buffet them relentlessly.
And each instinctively recognizes that the tough impenetrable outer shell of the INTJ is composed of the same material as the triply-reinforced rebar of the INFP inner values.


And third, has it been your experience that INTJs and INFPs share an intelligent but offensive sense of humor?
(winces, breaks down sobbing). I've never been allowed close enough to an INFP to experience their sense of humor. :cry:


Oh! Fourth and final. Has an INFP ever come to your defense? Usually it's you guys protecting us (and I know the INTJs in my life sometimes find it trying), but when my INTJ friends are off balance and attacked, I go into a Gohan rage that I'd otherwise be waaay too shy and inhibited to express.
Haven't experienced it: the most I've gotten is to have been allowed / vouchsafed some very *precious* INFP shards of comfort (expressed at one remove, but still world-bendingly powerful for all that).
 
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