Trump followers invade the capitol

[Coriolis]

This is all nonsense. "The government" as you call it is comprised of tens of thousands of individuals in different states/districts. I don't necessary "believe them" per se. Simply put, there has been no evidence of fraud provided. Furthermore, the scope of the conspiracy necessary to change election results across the country beggars belief. These are systems with Republican and Democratic volunteers working side-by-side...many of the former are Trump supporters. People who have put forth these false narratives of election rigging are having to walk-back their slander: https://www.americanthinker.com/blog/2021/01/statement.html.

Exactly. I wonder, as others have observed, whether any amount or kind of evidence would be sufficient to prove to election deniers that the results were legitimate. Partly this is because it is often very difficult to prove a negative: how do you prove there was no fraud? Perhaps this is one reason why our legal system operates on the presumption of innocence. If you think someone has done something wrong, you need to prove that they have, rather than demanding they prove they have not.

 

[Stigmata]

Exactly. I wonder, as others have observed, whether any amount or kind of evidence would be sufficient to prove to election deniers that the results were legitimate. Partly this is because it is often very difficult to prove a negative: how do you prove there was no fraud? Perhaps this is one reason why our legal system operates on the presumption of innocence. If you think someone has done something wrong, you need to prove that they have, rather than demanding they prove they have not.

I don't think any amount of evidence of non-fraud would be enough to placate them, especially for a constituency who prefer to engage in emotionally charged rhetoric which caters to their disposition versus logic and fact. In fact, they outright forsake logic and fact in favor of it. Some congressperson said their main suspicion of voter fraud was that they just couldn't believe Biden could get that many votes. Most of their arguments are based on, at best, armchair logic based upon the narrative they subscribe to.

If anything we've learned just how necessary concession is in political races-- If Trump himself hadn't ever planted the seed of doubt in their minds, going back to 2016, you may still have a munority who just refuse to accept the results for whatever reason, but it would be nowhere near anything on this national scale we're seeing now. This loss of faith will last long beyond Trump.

 

[The Cat]

How many licks does it take to get to the logical center of a political sucker?

 

[FemMecha]

I'm going to guess that among most people who hated Trump to begin with - and were deemed too irrational in that contempt, for predicting far less severe consequences, to assess his attributes fairly - never would have imagined it would get this far. I know I didn't.

I didn't either. Some have the audacity to still defend Trump and downplay these atrocities. I am struggling with a lot of anger towards the people down-playing and rationalizing this away. These are people used to being enablers for abusers among their friends and family. It has to stop.

 

[tinker683]

I'm going to guess that among most people who hated Trump to begin with - and were deemed too irrational in that contempt, for predicting far less severe consequences, to assess his attributes fairly - never would have imagined it would get this far. I know I didn't.

I would agree with this. I knew it would be bad, but I did not anticipate how resilient to facts and reality Trump voters and Republican congressional leaders would be. There was this constantly feeling over the past 5 years of the goals posts constantly moving, of what I thought any rational person would consider, "Ok, this is too much" constantly blown past.

This feeling is still persistent with me. It's ONLY now, with the attempted coup, that I am *finally* starting to see some pushback, some refusal to believe everything right-wing media is telling them and them reacting as I use to think people thought and felt before before 2016, but even then it's not total. I still have relatives, friends, and people I come into contact with on a regular basis who STILL believe in the illegitimacy of the election, of who STILL think antifa was behind the coup (or otherwise engage in whataboutism when the topic of the coup comes up) and that's something that while I wish I was totally numb too, I'm just not. It still hurts. It still bothers me enormously.

 

[Totenkindly]

Feeling Betrayed, Far-Right Extremists Have A New Message For Trump: 'Get Out Of Our Way'

So predictable... all of it.

 

[Lexicon]

Reuters: U.S. says Capitol rioters meant to 'capture and assassinate' officials - filing

The detention memo, written by Justice Department lawyers in Arizona, goes into greater detail about the FBI’s investigation into Chansley, revealing that he left a note for Pence warning that “it’s only a matter of time, justice is coming.”

“Strong evidence, including Chansley’s own words and actions at the Capitol, supports that the intent of the Capitol rioters was to capture and assassinate elected officials in the United States government,” prosecutors wrote.
​

That letter, in itself, doesn't seem like iron-clad proof of plans to capture and assassinate. It's unfortunate they're not listing any periphery information that supports this headline (like the nooses hung up outside).

WaPo ran a similar headline, only additionally mentioning this:

One man, for instance, was arrested and accused of carrying a pistol on the Capitol grounds. Others wore tactical gear or brought zip ties, which can be used as handcuffs, officials said. And another was arrested after his truck was spotted nearby, allegedly with 11 molotov cocktails inside.
​

Yeah, there's a ton of evidence of collaboration on their militia sites (like Oathkeepers, civilian defense.org Proud Boys, etc). Also their Parler, Telegram, Gab, & 8kun activity clearly showed this. There were other, even more specific collaborative efforts posted online for plans for the inauguration, but they've been taken down by the FBI. Even the Wayback Machine archive had it removed for public safety.

Maybe not everyone present was aware of the planning involved, but there were certainly many groups well aware of it, & participated in that planning.

 

[Lexicon]

I think this is tragically funny, honestly:

Trump was more upset that Capitol mob looked ‘low class’ than about violent attacks, reports say | The Independent

He actually detests his blue-collar followers. I suspect stage lights at his rallies made it difficult to really see much of the crowd.

That said, quite a few followers are actually upper-middle class, but that's irrelevant. It's all about appearances. This guy even called owning pets "low-class," complaining about Pence's attachment to his 16yr old (now deceased) cat, Pickle, at one point...

It's amazing that the alt-right overlooks so much of this. Amazing, but, not surprising.

 

[Totenkindly]

Yeah, there's a ton of evidence of collaboration on their militia sites (like Oathkeepers, civilian defense.org Proud Boys, etc). Also their Parler, Telegram, Gab, & 8kun activity clearly showed this. There were other, even more specific collaborative efforts posted online for plans for the inauguration, but they've been taken down by the FBI. Even the Wayback Machine archive had it removed for public safety.

Maybe not everyone present was aware of the planning involved, but there were certainly many groups well aware of it, & participated in that planning.

Did you guys see later this evening that the justice department has now retracted that statement?

US takes back its assertion that Capitol rioters wanted to 'capture and assassinate' officials - CNNPolitics

 

[Lexicon]

Did you guys see later this evening that the justice department has now retracted that statement?

No, I was going off of things I personally found on those sites.

I’m not comfortable posting the more detailed, violent screenshots I have that involve Jan 6th & upcoming events on here.

I’m only referring to evidence of collaboration of storming the Capitol— not necessarily the specific plans to assassinate elected officials.

That said, I don't think [most of] these troglodytes are ignorant enough to overtly suggest assassinating anyone, at least not in writing.

 

[ceecee]

Feeling Betrayed, Far-Right Extremists Have A New Message For Trump: 'Get Out Of Our Way'

So predictable... all of it.

This so much.

 

[Maou]

Feeling Betrayed, Far-Right Extremists Have A New Message For Trump: 'Get Out Of Our Way'

So predictable... all of it.

The media? Yeah, it is.

 

[Jaguar]

 

[Lexicon]

Officer beaten by Capitol rioters describes attack for first time | wusa9.com

 

[Lexicon]

TSA stops passengers with 50 pounds of ammo in checked bags, as airlines ban guns in luggage to D.C. before inauguration | Public Safety | unionleader.com

 

[Julius_Van_Der_Beak]

TSA stops passengers with 50 pounds of ammo in checked bags, as airlines ban guns in luggage to D.C. before inauguration | Public Safety | unionleader.com

Cue hysteria about "freedoms." I like that they only care about private corporations making decisions about this kind of stuff when it affects them directly. It reminds me of how I reacted to a cousin upset about Trump's twitter ban... "so, what, should the government make a law about who Twitter can and can't allow on their platform?"

 

[ceecee]

Far-right personality ''Baked Alaska'' arrested in riot probe

lol

 

[Jonny]

TSA stops passengers with 50 pounds of ammo in checked bags, as airlines ban guns in luggage to D.C. before inauguration | Public Safety | unionleader.com

Fucking TSA. Basically Hitler. The 2A is sacred, and you’re basically being Joseph Goebbels spreading this Antifa bullshit propaganda. But yeah, go ahead. #FreeRittenhouse

 

[ceecee]

Baked Informant lol

 

[Lexicon]

'I’m facing a prison sentence': US Capitol rioters plead with Trump for pardons