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Spirituality and Religion.

LightSun

Member
Joined
Aug 9, 2009
Messages
992
MBTI Type
INFP
Enneagram
#9
“What is the difference between religion and spirituality? Why is the spiritual path more pure?

I am an existentialist, humanist and stoic, but primarily I am an empiricist from a philosophical point of view. I have a saying, “I don’t care what you believe or don’t believe. I focus on positive energy.”

They say that love will save the world. I say understanding, tolerance, communication and respect are key pivotal ingredients to make this a better world. I have run across dogmatic religious people and atheists.

They are both closed minded. I take the best of both secular and religious wisdom. I don’t give credence to any fundamental religious belief that says their’s is the only path to salvation.

To me this causes division. Blind to the fact they make a mark in the sand and say, “You are either with us or against us.” This is deplorable. It is a demonstration of extremely closed mindednesses.

My belief. I don’t force on anybody else. It is merely my position. I don’t believe in a single religions saying that theirs is the path to salvation.

I am not attacking anybody. You are entitled to your position. It’s just that I am educated. I take wisdom and truths from mythology, philosophy, psychology, comparative religion, theology, history and physics.

All my life I have been a seeker and searcher for wisdom and truth whether it is secular or religious. I take what resonated with me. I discount that which doesn’t resonate. This is metaphorical language. I can not prove it but it is an analogy.

Across countless times, cultures and beliefs there seem to be fundamental base beliefs that seek to propel mankind to a higher conscious.

Jesus saying, ‘The kingdom of heaven is within’ is replayed across countless religions, societies and the wisdom of both secular philosophers and religious mystics.

It is my fundamental belief and it is substantiated by many giants of thoughts whether philosopher, mystic, historian. And scientist that until we take responsibility for our own salvation, we will never evolve.

Certainly to the level we are capable of. To give credence to this line of thinking, “That Jesus is my salvation and I am a sinner,’ only keeps us in believing outdated supernatural belief.

As Buddha said, “Only we can save ourselves. Only we can walk our path and no other.” I like it in Hinduism, “There are many paths to the top of the mountain.”

Indeed as we all have different life lessons to learn and evolve. In effect saving ourselves in this lifetime by our own efforts and not relying on an external source or savior.

Like I said I take the best of all religions. I love Jesus. He and Buddha are a role model as well hero to follow their precepts. Those belief that I can resonate with.

I take from Jesus to, “Love thy neighbor as thy self and to love thy God.” I put God as a metaphor of the interrelatedness of not only our species but our connection to all life and indeed existence.

God is best represented as Nature to me. Yet we have this edict from Jesus yet we live in a world of hypocrisy. There are good and bad theists and non-theists. The important point is do you walk your talk and practice what you preach?

We live in a society, indeed on a global scale worshipping 1. Sex 2. Beauty 3. Violence 4. Wealth 5. Power and 6. Fame. Jesus and the Bible say be careful of who you associate with.

Yet Donald Trump uses cognitive distortions (as ascertained by psychology, CBT: Cognitive Behavior Therapy) such as 1. Labeling, pejoratives and name calling, even at the expense of his own party.

He is clinically a certified bonafide narcissist. He calls Rosie O’Donell a farm animal determined by scientists to have a higher IQ than a dog.

He lies. He says, “I have something on President Barack Obama and I can prove it. I shall shock people with the truth that President Obama is not a US citizen but is African in origin.

Lies, and either put up or shut up. He uses misogynistic language talking about women on a tour bus.

All. All was broadcast and yet, and I am generalizing, the Christian Far Right Evangelicals put Mr. Trump in office.

A damning statistic is that those who believe in a God or Universe which is 1. Fair 2. Just 3. Loving are far more judgmental according to research.

‘Belief In A Just World’

M.J. Lerner studied the tendency of individuals to believe in a just world. In a just world, good things happen to good people, and bad things to bad people.

Much of the research into a belief in a just world (BJW) centers around developing measures that indicate the degree to which an individual believes in a just world.

A strong belief in a just world increases the likelihood of “blaming the victim” since such a world view denies the possibility of innocent victims.”

Source: GRE Graduate Record Examination. Subject Test: Psychology sixth edition, 2016 Kaplan Inc.

The truth is statistically those who believe in a just, loving, fair universe and God are more judgmental. Religion is supposed to make us better.

It’s supposed to refine us and make us better yet those religions which in dogma sense say theirs is the only way and path are more judgmental and intolerant of others beliefs, practices, or cultures.

I reiterate there are open minded theists and non-theists. It is to those I appeal to. I can not change another. Moreover it is not my duty or responsibility. Each is entitled to believe or not believe as meets their sensibility.

The reason why we have judgment, persecution, wars, sin, intolerance, prejudices and why we don’t grow or evolve societally is because this is unconscious mostly.

The most powerful and true quote of any religion or philosopher is by Carl Jung. “Until we make the unconscious conscious we will never evolve or meet our potential.”

Learning all the biblical verses or learning religious texts or collecting secular philosophy will not teach you to be self reliant.

Wisdom can not be taught. In my own humble view all of the religions are merely stepping stones in the right direction. I am spiritual. I am not religious, not in the bit.

Dogma constrains us. And we fool ourselves by going to church, learning verses, but never learn to think for ourself and walk a path in life where we discover the truth within us verses memorizing outdated religious verses that I’m many cases were structured in a Bronze Age.” LightSun

#Wisdom #dogma #openmind #spirituality #Path
 
Last edited:

LightSun

Member
Joined
Aug 9, 2009
Messages
992
MBTI Type
INFP
Enneagram
#9
“I’d say religion blinds one to taking a spiritual path. A spiritual path forces one to find the answers within.

Religion is dogma, it is reinforced by societal mores, and norms and is not questioned without backlash.

All of the religions quotes were stepping stones in a direction to find ourselves. Spirituality can be encompassed by this Hinduism quote, “There are many paths to the top of the mountain.”

Religion conversely says this is right, this is wrong. You must do this to be saved. None of this allows independent thought.

It cripples a persons spirituality all in the name of following a truth that one person says. But each of us has to discover the truth within.

Hard religion, dogmatic following stifles one’s enlightenment and awakening and stunts a persons spiritual growth.” LightSun
 

LightSun

Member
Joined
Aug 9, 2009
Messages
992
MBTI Type
INFP
Enneagram
#9
“Are you religious or spiritual? What are major differences between spiritual and to be religious? If you are religious you take as a literal truth what your texts say.

You never question any text because you take it to being holy. If you are spiritual, one will bring into question every religious or secular quote.

Which is healthier? Which one will yield to salvation in the sense of becoming more psychologically, emotionally and spiritually mature?” LightSun
 

LightSun

Member
Joined
Aug 9, 2009
Messages
992
MBTI Type
INFP
Enneagram
#9
“What is the difference between religion and spirituality? Why is the spiritual path more pure?

I am an existentialist, humanist and stoic, but primarily I am an empiricist from a philosophical point of view. I have a saying, “I don’t care what you believe or don’t believe. I focus on positive energy.”

They say that love will save the world. I say understanding, tolerance, communication and respect are key pivotal ingredients to make this a better world. I have run across dogmatic religious people and atheists.

They are both closed minded. I take the best of both secular and religious wisdom. I don’t give credence to any fundamental religious belief that says their’s is the only path to salvation.

To me this causes division. Blind to the fact they make a mark in the sand and say, “You are either with us or against us.” This is deplorable. It is a demonstration of extremely closed mindednesses.

My belief. I don’t force on anybody else. It is merely my position. I don’t believe in a single religions saying that theirs is the path to salvation.

I am not attacking anybody. You are entitled to your position. It’s just that I am educated. I take wisdom and truths from mythology, philosophy, psychology, comparative religion, theology, history and physics.

All my life I have been a seeker and searcher for wisdom and truth whether it is secular or religious. I take what resonated with me. I discount that which doesn’t resonate. This is metaphorical language. I can not prove it but it is an analogy.

Across countless times, cultures and beliefs there seem to be fundamental base beliefs that seek to propel mankind to a higher conscious.

Jesus saying, ‘The kingdom of heaven is within’ is replayed across countless religions, societies and the wisdom of both secular philosophers and religious mystics.

It is my fundamental belief and it is substantiated by many giants of thoughts whether philosopher, mystic, historian. And scientist that until we take responsibility for our own salvation, we will never evolve.

Certainly to the level we are capable of. To give credence to this line of thinking, “That Jesus is my salvation and I am a sinner,’ only keeps us in believing outdated supernatural belief.

As Buddha said, “Only we can save ourselves. Only we can walk our path and no other.” I like it in Hinduism, “There are many paths to the top of the mountain.”

Indeed as we all have different life lessons to learn and evolve. In effect saving ourselves in this lifetime by our own efforts and not relying on an external source or savior.

Like I said I take the best of all religions. I love Jesus. He and Buddha are a role model as well hero to follow their precepts. Those belief that I can resonate with.

I take from Jesus to, “Love thy neighbor as thy self and to love thy God.” I put God as a metaphor of the interrelatedness of not only our species but our connection to all life and indeed existence.

God is best represented as Nature to me. Yet we have this edict from Jesus yet we live in a world of hypocrisy. There are good and bad theists and non-theists. The important point is do you walk your talk and practice what you preach?

We live in a society, indeed on a global scale worshipping 1. Sex 2. Beauty 3. Violence 4. Wealth 5. Power and 6. Fame. Jesus and the Bible say be careful of who you associate with.

Yet Donald Trump uses cognitive distortions (as ascertained by psychology, CBT: Cognitive Behavior Therapy) such as 1. Labeling, pejoratives and name calling, even at the expense of his own party.

He is clinically a certified bonafide narcissist. He calls Rosie O’Donell a farm animal determined by scientists to have a higher IQ than a dog.

He lies. He says, “I have something on President Barack Obama and I can prove it. I shall shock people with the truth that President Obama is not a US citizen but is African in origin.

Lies, and either put up or shut up. He uses misogynistic language talking about women on a tour bus.

All. All was broadcast and yet, and I am generalizing, the Christian Far Right Evangelicals put Mr. Trump in office.

A damning statistic is that those who believe in a God or Universe which is 1. Fair 2. Just 3. Loving are far more judgmental according to research.

‘Belief In A Just World’

M.J. Lerner studied the tendency of individuals to believe in a just world. In a just world, good things happen to good people, and bad things to bad people.

Much of the research into a belief in a just world (BJW) centers around developing measures that indicate the degree to which an individual believes in a just world.

A strong belief in a just world increases the likelihood of “blaming the victim” since such a world view denies the possibility of innocent victims.”

Source: GRE Graduate Record Examination. Subject Test: Psychology sixth edition, 2016 Kaplan Inc.

The truth is statistically those who believe in a just, loving, fair universe and God are more judgmental. Religion is supposed to make us better.

It’s supposed to refine us and make us better yet those religions which in dogma sense say theirs is the only way and path are more judgmental and intolerant of others beliefs, practices, or cultures.

I reiterate there are open minded theists and non-theists. It is to those I appeal to. I can not change another. Moreover it is not my duty or responsibility. Each is entitled to believe or not believe as meets their sensibility.

The reason why we have judgment, persecution, wars, sin, intolerance, prejudices and why we don’t grow or evolve societally is because this is unconscious mostly.

The most powerful and true quote of any religion or philosopher is by Carl Jung. “Until we make the unconscious conscious we will never evolve or meet our potential.”

Learning all the biblical verses or learning religious texts or collecting secular philosophy will not teach you to be self reliant.

Wisdom can not be taught. In my own humble view all of the religions are merely stepping stones in the right direction. I am spiritual. I am not religious, not in the bit.

Dogma constrains us. And we fool ourselves by going to church, learning verses, but never learn to think for ourself and walk a path in life where we discover the truth within us verses memorizing outdated religious verses that I’m many cases were structured in a Bronze Age.” LightSun

#Wisdom #dogma #openmind #spirituality #Path
Quote:
“Rigid and fundamental religion. What has it achieved for humanity? Further divisions. Where is peace?”

“This is true more so for the Western religions of Zoroastrianism, Judaism, Christianity, Islam, Sikhism, and Baha’i.

I like in the Eastern traditions one can be all three of these plus any other belief. This would include Buddhism, Taoism and Confucianism.

In fact I take the best of all the worlds religions and secular wisdoms and partake of what is agreeable with me.

The rest I merely let go. That being said Western psychologies CBT and REBT are good parallels with Eastern Buddhism.

Add the Stoic philosophy which was an ancient precursor to the emergence of western psychologies cognitive based approach.

Taken all together they help to discipline the mind. Of all the giants of wise sayings, Carl Jung comes to mind as extremely insightful. In fact his one quote of until we make the unconscious conscious, we shall not evolve.

Then there is Plato with his archaic term of the philosopher kings. The term is archaic but his insight his sound. Until we are governed by lovers of wisdom, we shall not evolve as a society but continue dysfunction.

Take Buddhism, CBT: Cognitive Behavior Therapy, REBT: Rational Emotive Behavior Therapy, Stoicism, Carl Jung and Plato and you have a prescription for societal success.” LightSun
 

skin

New member
Joined
Aug 4, 2008
Messages
20
MBTI Type
INFP
"You are entitled to your position. It’s just that I am educated."
 
Joined
Aug 7, 2019
Messages
773
MBTI Type
INTJ
Enneagram
-
When I search what the word religious and spiritual means, I found Religious means
relating to or believing in a religion.
(of a belief or practice) forming part of someone's thought about or worship of a divine being
belonging or relating to a monastic order or other group of people who are united by their practice of religion.
treated or regarded with a devotion and scrupulousness appropriate to worship
source
Spriitual means
relating to or affecting the human spirit or soul as opposed to material or physical things.
relating to religion or religious belief
source
When someone says that he/she is a spiritual but non religious person, he/she will probably probably mean that the person doesn't declare what specific religion he/she embraces, he/she is likely not a worshipper, and towards a faith in divinity he/she may identify him/herself as either an atheist or agnostic but he/she must believes that spirit as the opposite of material/physical being does exist despite its imperceptibility by the five senses.
However, spiritual and religious can also mean the same.
 
Last edited:

yeghor

Well-known member
Joined
Dec 21, 2013
Messages
4,275
“What is the difference between religion and spirituality? Why is the spiritual path more pure?

Religion=external moral code,
Spirituality=internal moral code i.e. conscience

You may be religious but not spiritual or spiritual but not religious.

Religion if not construed abstractly as a set of overall principles but construed literally as a manual will lead to dogma that actually restricts spritiual growth as circumstances change as of the first genesis of a religion, and therefore require constant reassessment.

That however requires abstract thinking and if people are deficient in abstract thinking they either interpret the religious text literally word for word and impose it to present-day issues, which does not necessarily fit, or they look up to people whom they deem to be religious leaders i.e. whom they think have a better abstract understanding of the original text.

Either path keeps them from growing spiritually i.e. developing their own abstract thinking.
 
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