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[Other/Multiple Enneatypes] enneagram 6 Vs 8

Red Ribbon

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I'm considering both types for myself. I have a seven wing for sure, so I'm either a 6w7 or an 8w7. I'd appreciate any kind of help. Ask me any questions. I can't really sort this out on my own.
 

magpie

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What are you afraid of and why?

How do you respond to a challenge?

What were you like growing up?

What do you need or want most from life? Why?
 

Red Memories

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well 8s fear being controlled and ruled over, so their goal is to consistently be in control and in "power". A six is less sure of themselves, anxious, questions people's intentions, and fears being without loyal companions to receive guidance from. If this helps at all.
 

Red Ribbon

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After making this thread I realized 9 is a better fit for me. Thanks for the responses though.
 

Lord Lavender

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If ths helps you can be both since 6w7 is a head type and 8w7 a gut type so its possible to be a 6w7 8w7 something. Id say first thing is to see if you have both in your tri. If anythings to go by you dont seem a double reactive to me so you probably have only one of them and I dont see the visceral and explosive reactivity I see in 8s from what I see of you but a more super ego reactivity which manifests in a anxious and paranoid reactivity like a mental reactivity. To see if you are a 86 of some sort do you relate to those two core fears (Fear of being controlled and vulnerable and fear of being without support).
 

Red Ribbon

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If ths helps you can be both since 6w7 is a head type and 8w7 a gut type so its possible to be a 6w7 8w7 something. Id say first thing is to see if you have both in your tri. If anythings to go by you dont seem a double reactive to me so you probably have only one of them and I dont see the visceral and explosive reactivity I see in 8s from what I see of you but a more super ego reactivity which manifests in a anxious and paranoid reactivity like a mental reactivity. To see if you are a 86 of some sort do you relate to those two core fears (Fear of being controlled and vulnerable and fear of being without support).

I'm not entirely sure. I always test as high in both 9 and 8 but I don't believe in the tests really. People have typed me as 9 before on PerC. I don't really relate to the passive nature of 9. Aside from that, I also suffer from Borderline personality disorder so a lot of my mental reactivity could come from that. Borderlines are paranoid and wary of people, like an unhealthy 6 but does being one make me a 6? That's my question if it makes sense.
 

Peter Deadpan

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Typing oneself in the presence of mental illness/personality disorder is extremely difficult. The only thing that you can do is research, introspect, and give it time. You'll figure it out eventually.
 

Forever_Jung

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I'm considering both types for myself. I have a seven wing for sure, so I'm either a 6w7 or an 8w7. I'd appreciate any kind of help. Ask me any questions. I can't really sort this out on my own.

You're a 6. You're welcome.
 

misfortuneteller

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6 and 8 couldn't be more different. I guess you could compare them based on reactivity but that's about it. 6s need guidance and 8s often see themselves as their own guidance. Massive difference. One is terrified of trusting others and the other needs to trust others because they can't make up their minds on their own.
 

Peter Deadpan

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6 and 8 couldn't be more different. I guess you could compare them based on reactivity but that's about it. 6s need guidance and 8s often see themselves as their own guidance. Massive difference. One is terrified of trusting others and the other needs to trust others because they can't make up their minds on their own.

I would add that 6 reactivity annoys 8s, and 8 reactivity (or sometimes lack thereof) worries 6s. 8s can view 6s as weak, and 6s can view 8s as insensitive.
 

neko 4

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Typing oneself in the presence of mental illness/personality disorder is extremely difficult. The only thing that you can do is research, introspect, and give it time. You'll figure it out eventually.

Actually, it wasn't hard for me at all, and I have a severe mental illness. I've always seen myself as a 4.
 

Peter Deadpan

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Actually, it wasn't hard for me at all, and I have a severe mental illness. I've always seen myself as a 4.

That doesn't mean you are right. There is plenty of room for error, especially when using multiple systems.
 
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If my testimony here can help good and if not good luck with your personal search of the SELF.


I had been typed ENTJ _ 8 , then ESFP 7, by my enneagramm teachers in Paris at our famous school here in France 8W7, and then in Italy counterphobic 6, in Danemark they saw me as a 6,

and I did a stage last which typed me as INFP 4.


Honestly too many tests kill THE right Test. I think I am EXFP 7W8, but what if I am 8W7 ? Nothing of that detail would really change my life wouldn't it ?

I am part of those people whose wing is very strong (I scored something like 49/51 so they are extremelly close)

I could have taken revenge easily when I was younger...Etc.

Anyway depending on your age you do have a Second wing, don't forget this as you EXPEND your personality

and the goal is to grow and know yourself towards expansion of your true self.

I think typology MUST NOT help you to throw you into a cage of "I AM this or that" but help you throughout this tough journey on that earth to guide your steps gently.

Whether you're a leopard or a lynx you know anyway you can't be an elephant. But you can learn to understand elephants better and even develop some of their skills if you want to.

I don't know if my comment makes sense for your own individuality.

Typology can be a trap like so many other "boxes" people like to be shut into to feel reassured. Why not if some people like to enjoy the experiment this way ?


Nonetheless I think it should open doors on new landscapes, so it does not matter if you mistake your wings. Doubt is also creative. And also the less we find ourselves into the grip of this bloody ego the more we do have power

(vitality and freedom, not the egotic unhealthy 8 power). I hope my english was good enough to make myself clear about the message I wanted to pass you on.
 

LucieCat

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Actually, it wasn't hard for me at all, and I have a severe mental illness. I've always seen myself as a 4.
It also depends on the mental illness and the person I suppose. But it can be harder for a person with a mental illness to identify their type.

For example, someone with severe social anxiety could actually be an extrovert (extraversion is not just about other people). You can have Perceivers who seem like Judgers because of how OCD compels them to behave. A depressed extrovert can look like an introvert.

Of course that's more MBTI than Enneagram, but the same principle applies.

And sometimes people will have an easier time discerning with one system than another. I narrowed down my MBTI type fairly quickly (albeit for awhile I thought I was an INFP instead of an ENFP, but those types can look so similar), but Enneagram involved a lot more questioning and mistypes. One of my roommates self identifies as a 2, which I agree with (she seems 8ish though at times due to stress), but she is insistent that she is an INFP. I don't see this at all. I often surround myself with Fi and i joke with myself about having a collection of Fi-users. I think she's really an ENTP with an unhealthy reliance on Fe who has marginalized her Ti extensively.
Regarding the OP's question:

As far as 6 or 8, I find them to be very different. And I agree with the point about these two types having a negative perspective on the other's reactive nature.

8s will naturally come off as more self-confident and are usually a bit more aggressive. I don't mean aggression in a physical violence sense (not that that is impossible) but in a pushy, "this is the way it is and how we're going to do it" way. I see them as very dominant people.

6s are more likely to come off with a lack of confidence. There's an intense degree of self doubt. They question themselves and their abilities frequently.

If you're a 6 you would probably be a counterphobic 6, which could possibly explain the resemblance to 8. CP6's confront their fears head on and do seem more aggressive than their phobic counterparts.
 

Tomb1

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Let's stick with the fundamentals first. The "paranoid reactivity" traces back to the six's fundamental distortion that the world is a dangerous place....hence the core desire for the six is to avoid being harmed (ex. duped, conned, controlled, attacked, pushed around, picked on). Thus, the main interest of the six is self-protection and the main avoidance a sense of inferiority/victimization. With eight, the core avoidance is whatever you would call the state of not exercising power (ex. weakness, passivity, dependence, tender-mindedness).

Two underlying behavioral dynamics to take note of with type six include the exculpation of guilt onto others and the projection of hostility. The phobic solution is as exaggerated in its submission towards the object of perceived hostility as the counterphobic solution is exaggerated in its againstness towards the object of perceived hostility. Most sixes swing between a phobic - counterphobic style, but some are predominately one or the other. In the predominately counterphobic six, the key characteristics are bluffing and pugnaciousness - which, essentially, is a prolonged fight response to the perceived fear object. This exaggerated againstness on the perceived object of fear captures the essence of the counterphobic six. See Sheriff John Wydell in the Devil's Rejects for a great example of a counterphobic six. Captain Ahab is another example of the counterphobic six.

In contrast to eights, sixes typically have a life pattern of falling behind the eight-ball due to interpersonal conflicts. They have a fundamentally adversarial nature that can manifest, as previously pointed out, through an exaggerated againstness and they can devote their entire lives to taking people down, for better or worse (the vigilante; the adversary, 'diablo')….a good portion of their aggressiveness goes towards ensuring that they are not made to feel inferior. But what happens when there is no fire to put out, when there are no external triggers to react to....the non-provoked state is where its easiest to see differences emerge. more productive sixes are prone to try and get what they want by hinting at what they want and approach business with an aim towards establishing strong alliances. sixes will call upon the authorities when they sense it can give them an advantage in a conflict whereas eights see 'running to the authorities' as weak. If you're talking about say an 8 and a 6 working at a job, the 8 won't have any problem asserting themselves for a raise or promotion; the 6 otoh will have to work themselves up for the event or wait until an external trigger fires them up and contraphobically lay it down, usually going overboard in the process and making a grave mis-calculation. They are sometimes assertive whereas the 8 is assertive 24/7.

In contrast to sixes, eights have an entirely aggressive personality -- somebody with the requisite temperament for outwitting, outmanuevering, and outmuscling others in order to acquire their own spot at the top of the mountain. They typically have a life pattern of empire building from scratch, resource acquisition, and using aggression instrumentally in order to preserve their own dominance/control/order. They are instinctually drawn to environments where boldness and hard-headed realism pays off, they are comfortable giving orders, and don't see a problem with using savage, diabolical methods. [As a point of note, Saddam Hussein, Idi Amin and Al Capone had their own personal torture chambers. Capone was known for spending all night in there.] The thing to look for is that whatever position you find the eight in they will use that position in the most aggressive manner possible but not at the expense of being incompetent at that position or presenting one's self masochistically (if that makes sense)….more often than not eights get their way. Aggression itself is a competency for getting ahead. They overexpress gut energy so express anger easily in the present moment but once it passes there's no trace left behind. In the less healthy levels, the eight is susceptible to engaging in criminal behavior through the use of violence and using intimidation/threats/manipulation of resources to make people do what they want and hold onto/expand their power base.
 

Peter Deadpan

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[MENTION=13911]Tomb1[/MENTION] - How have you completely neglected to acknowledge a healthy 8's propensity for self-control? Balanced 8s don't have to resort to aggression or rage.
 

The Tsarevich

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[MENTION=13911]Tomb1[/MENTION] - How have you completely neglected to acknowledge a healthy 8's propensity for self-control? Balanced 8s don't have to resort to aggression or rage.
Yeah I wasn't gonna say anything. But there are a lot of critiques I could make of the distinctions listed there. Now I'm gonna have to write them up.
 

Tomb1

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[MENTION=13911]Tomb1[/MENTION] - How have you completely neglected to acknowledge a healthy 8's propensity for self-control?

that's all involved with resource acquisition, empire building and competing in the rough and tumble

When I wrote, "They are instinctually drawn to environments where boldness and hard-headed realism pays off", that underscores the productive sublimation/self-command of aggression/rage.

Although this isn't a thread about healthy 8s, I'll point out that the healthy 8's propensity for restraint does not negate the fundamentally aggressive nature of the type. As an example, MLK was a healthy 8 but MLK was not rendered passive or milquetoast through his restraint....he was still fundamentally assertive/aggressive person with an interest in exercising power (but for the greater good) and showed an instinctual avoidance of weakness in the pursuit of such. Its that the propensity for restraint in healthy 8s is leveraged in a manner that wields power more masterfully.
 

Tomb1

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Yeah I wasn't gonna say anything. But there are a lot of critiques I could make of the distinctions listed there. Now I'm gonna have to write them up.

Then make your critiques...don't say what you're going to do, just do it.
 
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