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Cold war 2.0

The Cat

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It's a Kansas City Shuffle.
They look left <---
---> but you go right
The only thing is, for a Kansas City Shuffle to work right.... you need a body.
Luckily, or rather unluckily I suppose, my country is just chocked full of would be volunteers.

As far as espionage goes...fuck shit jesus is right.

 

Red Herring

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Yes. That has been discussed here already between @Virtual ghost and myself. Russia keeps breaking contracts and making excuses, but so far reserves are filling up faster than planned. There is a new LNG terminal under construction and it's basically a race against time to get out of this energy dependence. We will likely have to buy from alternative sources and reduced consumption. But that is not the end of the world. VAT on gas will likely be reduce over the winter to help the average citizen with extra costs.

Worst case scenario is some companies might have to reduce production for a few months like they already did during Covid lockdown and a few neonazis and Putin friends (often the same thing) will demonstrate on the streets. But by this time next year Germany (and hopefully large parts of Europe) will be less vulnerable to blackmail by dictatorships and using greener energy than before. Better for the economy and better for the environment. Russia on the other hand will be running out of clients for its main export article. So I'd say in the long run it's Russia that is shooting itself in the foot with this unnecessary war of aggression and the childish power plays around gas deliveries.
 

Virtual ghost

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Yes. That has been discussed here already between @Virtual ghost and myself. Russia keeps breaking contracts and making excuses, but so far reserves are filling up faster than planned. There is a new LNG terminal under construction and it's basically a race against time to get out of this energy dependence. We will likely have to buy from alternative sources and reduced consumption. But that is not the end of the world. VAT on gas will likely be reduce over the winter to help the average citizen with extra costs.

Worst case scenario is some companies might have to reduce production for a few months like they already did during Covid lockdown and a few neonazis and Putin friends (often the same thing) will demonstrate on the streets. But by this time next year Germany (and hopefully large parts of Europe) will be less vulnerable to blackmail by dictatorships and using greener energy than before. Better for the economy and better for the environment. Russia on the other hand will be running out of clients for its main export article. So I'd say in the long run it's Russia that is shooting itself in the foot with this unnecessary war of aggression and the childish power plays around gas deliveries.


I agree, the whole idea that there will be some big energy problems in Europe doesn't seem too likely. Especially since the idea is mostly propaganda. First source is Russia and their allies that are trying to cause panic behind Ukrainian lines. So that people start to panic and therefore stop supporting the defense of Ukraine from Russia. Since Ukraine is totally dependent on Western help and this could lose them the war. While Russia would get the whole Ukraine and therefore food supply for the good chunks of Middle east and Africa. What in combination with China's manufacturing would make it quite easy to get plenty of influence in many places. Plus Russia would get closer to some who still support it in Europe, Since it would have border with Hungary and a path towards their supporters in the Balkans. However if Ukraine holds then these supporters are the one that will probably evaporate with time. While at the other source of such propaganda are probably energy companies themselves. Since if there is the impression of bigger crisis then they can get extra profit out of all this.


For years Germany was under heavy criticisms since it become too dependent on Russia but it is fairly certain that this trend broke before genuine dependency was made. After all you can make energy from other sources of energy than natural gas. Nuclear power is coming back online in Germany, there is local coal that is fairly abundant in Germany, there is renewable energy that makes pretty big share of the cake in Germany. Actually Germany was under so much criticism over Russian energy since many saw all this coming sooner or later. Therefore they build their own LNG terminals and some of them are working for years at this point. In other words EU is paved with various pipelines and therefore it is possible to deliver natural gas to Germany through neighboring countries. Therefore this is all mostly just a propaganda. It is true that things wouldn't go as smoothly as in normal times but alarmism is simply blown out of proportions. Especially since we are talking about some of the most wealthy corners of the world, which have enough resources to actually do something about this.
 

yeghor

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Worst case scenario is some companies might have to reduce production for a few months like they already did during Covid lockdown and a few neonazis and Putin friends (often the same thing) will demonstrate on the streets. But by this time next year Germany (and hopefully large parts of Europe) will be less vulnerable to blackmail by dictatorships and using greener energy than before. Better for the economy and better for the environment. Russia on the other hand will be running out of clients for its main export article. So I'd say in the long run it's Russia that is shooting itself in the foot with this unnecessary war of aggression and the childish power plays around gas deliveries.

https://summit.news/2022/08/17/germ...of-living-protesters-as-enemies-of-the-state/

1660887406755.png

Herbert Reul (people liken him to George Soros)

A top German official has trashed people who may be planning to protest against energy blackouts as “enemies of the state” and “extremists” who want to overthrow the government.

The interior minister of the German state of North Rhine-Westphalia (NRW), Herbert Reul (CDU), says that anti-mandatory vaxx and anti-lockdown demonstrators have found a new cause – the energy crisis. Despite the very real threat of potential blackouts, power grid failures and gas shortages, Reul claimed such issues were feeding “conspiracy theory narratives.”

However, it’s no “conspiracy theory” that Germans across the country have been panic buying stoves, firewood and electric heaters as the government tells them thermostats will be limited to 19C in public buildings and that sports arenas and exhibition halls will be used as ‘warm up spaces’ this winter to help freezing citizens who are unable to afford skyrocketing energy bills.

As Remix News reports, blaming right-wing conspiracy theorists for a crisis caused by Germany’s sanctions on Russia and is suicidal dependence on green energy is pretty rich. “Reul, like the country’s federal interior minister, Nancy Faeser, is attempting to tie right-wing ideology and protests against Covid-19 policies to any potential protests in the winter.”

“While some on the right, such as the Alternative for Germany (AfD), have stressed that the government’s sanctions against Russia are the primary factor driving the current energy crisis, they have not advocated an “overthrow” of the government. Instead, they have stressed the need to restart the Nord Stream 2 pipeline, end energy sanctions against Russia, and push for a peaceful solution to end the war.”

Indeed, energy shortages and the cost of living crisis are issues that are of major concern to everyone, no matter where they are on the political spectrum. To claim that people worried about heating their homes and putting food on the table this winter are all “enemies of the state” is an utter outrage.

German party seat distribution and the political spheres of existence for each party. Based on the political compass (I hope it is accurate in its placement of the parties) and the stereotypes on the other meme chart:

SPD - The social democrat - IxxJs
B90/Grüne - The hardworking immigrant - ESxPs
FDP - The FDP Voter - IxTPs
Linke - Die Linke and the Children of Greta - ExFJs and maybe moderate INFPs
CDU - The senior citizen - IxTJs and moderate ExTJs
CSU - The neo-nazi and Putinists - ESxJs
AfD - The Reichsbürger - ExTJs

So according to the meme chart, CSU looks like the neo-nazis and Putinists you mentioned but CSU is aligned with CDU and Herbert Reul in the above news who complains about possible far-right government protests belongs to the CDU party. I've always thought race-supremacists, neo-nazis and skinheads to be more like ISTPs, because they are more criminally-inclined. They would fall under soccer hooligans and the prince on the meme chart (quite close to the FDP btw.)

Then why was Die-Linke pro-Russian and not the FDP?


 

Red Herring

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https://summit.news/2022/08/17/germ...of-living-protesters-as-enemies-of-the-state/

View attachment 26744
Herbert Reul (people liken him to George Soros)



German party seat distribution and the political spheres of existence for each party. Based on the political compass (I hope it is accurate in its placement of the parties) and the stereotypes on the other meme chart:

SPD - The social democrat - IxxJs
B90/Grüne - The hardworking immigrant - ESxPs
FDP - The FDP Voter - IxTPs
Linke - Die Linke and the Children of Greta - ExFJs and maybe moderate INFPs
CDU - The senior citizen - IxTJs and moderate ExTJs
CSU - The neo-nazi and Putinists - ESxJs
AfD - The Reichsbürger - ExTJs

So according to the meme chart, CSU looks like the neo-nazis and Putinists you mentioned but CSU is aligned with CDU and Herbert Reul in the above news who complains about possible far-right government protests belongs to the CDU party. I've always thought race-supremacists, neo-nazis and skinheads to be more like ISTPs, because they are more criminally-inclined. They would fall under soccer hooligans and the prince on the meme chart (quite close to the FDP btw.)

Then why was Die-Linke pro-Russian and not the FDP?


Oh, dear Lord, where to start?

Let me see
First of all, Summit News? I had never heard of them but almost laughed out loud when I clicked on the website and saw that it was a rather low-brown far-right extremist website selling very low quality journalism. But that in itself doesn't mean that they have to be wrong, so let's see ...

I wouldn't call Herbert Reul a top official, he's the minister of the interior in one of the bigger federal states. That's it. He isn't unknown but not one of the top politicians of the country either. He's also a staunch conservative of the law and order variety and I have never heard anyone compare him to George Soros. That sounds like utter bullshit. So I googled "Herbert Reul Soros" and couldn't find anything either. Not sure where that comparison is coming from, it seems completely unmotivated to me.

Energy security is one of the main topics on the political agenda and everybody is talking about it. There is lots of public criticism of past and present government actions. So far so normal. What Reul, and not just Reul, is referring to- as far as I can tell from this badly written and extremely biased propaganda article - is that secret service sources as well as anybody with a brain forsee that the far-right (mainly the AfD) will highjack this topic and try to use it for political gain. That's just common sense because they have done that with every single crises in the last few years. And why wouldn't they. That's the legitimate right of the opposition. The problem is that when the far-right protest, they don't just write letters to the editor or go on peaceful demonstrations. They write death threats and rape threats to polticians, journalists and scientists. They physically threaten and beat up journalists trying to cover their demonstrations. They tried to storm the parliamentary building. There already was an assassination of a minor local politician.

The people that think Germany should support Putin
the people who think climate change isn't real or not a really problem
the people who think Covid is fake or not a real problem
the people who think vaccinations are useless or even dangerous
the people who think refugees shouldn't receive help or are dangerous
the people who have a problem with LGBTQ people
the people who have a problem with supporting minorities of any kind
the people who support Trump or even believe in QAnon ...

... there is a huge overlap. It's always the same people. What gets their blood boiling changes from season to season, but it's the same people. The AfD feeds on them. So does, in part, the far-left. They take partially justified discontent and offer fake simplistic solutions.
It is reaonable to assume that the usual suspects will yet again protest, yet again become violent and yet again dream of overthrowing the government, install an authoritarian regime and execute the current government. I'm not making this up. There is a long paper trail of police and court records. This is a known fact. There are elements, a small minority of the population, who want to overthrown not just the current government but the entire state and install a new state and kill their political opponents. This is a simple fact. It is also a known fact that they try to and partially succeed in recruiting relatively normal average citizens during times of crises because they offer a way to vent both justified and unjustified frustrations. What Reul is saying, and I agree with him, is that this will likely happen yet again this winter when people suffer from higher energy prices. The reason for these higher energy prices, by the way, is a political decision by Russia, not Germany.

I'll get to party politics in the next post. This one is getting too long already.
 

Red Herring

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German party seat distribution and the political spheres of existence for each party. Based on the political compass (I hope it is accurate in its placement of the parties) and the stereotypes on the other meme chart:

SPD - The social democrat - IxxJs
B90/Grüne - The hardworking immigrant - ESxPs
FDP - The FDP Voter - IxTPs
Linke - Die Linke and the Children of Greta - ExFJs and maybe moderate INFPs
CDU - The senior citizen - IxTJs and moderate ExTJs
CSU - The neo-nazi and Putinists - ESxJs
AfD - The Reichsbürger - ExTJs
The placement of the parties in the Cartesian system is correct. The parliamentary distribution also looks right but a bit irritating because it has swapped left and right. The party descriptions however are far off:
Obviously attributing MBTI types to parties is a bit silly, but let's have a look at this anyway.
The SPD (Social Democrats) are historically the party of the working class but have lost their audience over time. Not sure what type they'd be, but IXXJ sounds weird. definitely not INTJ or ISTJ, maybe XSFJ. They are the elderly lady volunteering at the soup kitchen or your colleague from the works council who trains the childrens soccer team and volunteers at the local firefighters.
The Greens are also hard to place but I'm not sure where you're getting "hard working immigrant" (who is in a different quadrant altogether). They tend to be be the choice of urban and educated people though.
The FDP is socially and economicall liberal but mainly a "down with taxes, down with welfare" party and thinly veiled lobby group for higher income groups. XNTJ perhaps.
The Linke is definitely not the same as Children of Greta (once again different quadrant!). On the contrary, they have an awkward relationship with climate action and climate protesters (who tend to vote the Greens if anything). They see themself as defender of lower income people against the burden that comes with energy transition (and all the other challenges of our time). They also try to compete with the far-right over frustrated voters and often awkwardly agree with the other extreme of the political spectrum on quite a few issues (which is what the last cartoon is referring to).
CDU and senior citizens sounds about right. This is the ISTJ party. They are socially central-right, pro-big-government and pro-business.
The CSU is neither neo-nazi nor Putinist (maybe you are confusing them with the AfD)- they are a special case in that they have been governing Bavaria and only Bavaria since the dawn of the republic. They are a political mixed bag. Generally socially conservative but much less extreme than the AfD (or the American GOP) and actually in favor of Covid measures and climate action. They can be either to the right or the left of the CDU depending on the issue at hand but have been historically the most conservative party that is still plainly democratic and "working within rather than against the system".
AfD - (Right-wing populist + Reichsbürger) - The party used to stretch from just conservative to pretty far right when it was founded but has since moved continuously futher to the right and now is a mix of the generally disgruntled, fascist wannabe-revolutionaries and tin-foil hat wearing QAnon worshippers. Parts of the party are officially under observation by the secret service for anti-constitutional activities (aka trying to overthrow the German state and potential terrorist activities)

So according to the meme chart, CSU looks like the neo-nazis and Putinists you mentioned but CSU is aligned with CDU and Herbert Reul in the above news who complains about possible far-right government protests belongs to the CDU party. I've always thought race-supremacists, neo-nazis and skinheads to be more like ISTPs, because they are more criminally-inclined. They would fall under soccer hooligans and the prince on the meme chart (quite close to the FDP btw.)

Then why was Die-Linke pro-Russian and not the FDP?


Again, the CSU is neither neo-nazi nor Putinist. They are middle class conservative and very much defenders of the current system. They have nothing in common with hooligans or the prince.
I'd rather leave MBTI out of this but neonazis do tend to have a criminal record. Yes. And there is an overlap with hooligans in real life, but not in the Cartesian system you posted (note how your meme places neo-nazis and hooligans on opposite ends of the aurthoritarian axis? That's bullshit because while neonazis tend to strive for an extremely authoritarian state akin to the Third Reich their methods of getting there are anarchist (i.e. beating up leftists and foreigners with a baseball bat or comitting terrorists attacks on synagogues, etc).
The FDP on the other hand couldn't be further away from hooligans. Yes, they favor civil liberties and a small government and are the closest thing we have to Libertarians, but they tend to be very bourgeouis higher income people, higher education and higher social status with a nice house and a nice car. They are not anarchists, they just want to be left alone making money. They definitely don't want to overthrow the system, just make it even more comfortable for rich people (and they are fine with LGBTQ rights and climate action and all that as long as it doesn't impact their balance sheet). They probably love the business opportunities that an oligarchy like Russia offers but wouldn't like the lack of civil liberties.

The Linke is pro-Russian for two main reasons a) They are traditionally a party of the East and the people of the East grew up viewing America as the bad guys and the Soviet Union and their big brother. They learned Russian at school and have closer cultural links to Eastern Europe. b) As a far-left party they are basically anti-capitalist and as such anti-American. Russia is the prime enemy of the US so going by that alone they tend to favor Russia. They usually know that Russia is an oppressive dictatorship but prefer to turn a blind eye or engage in whataboutism whenever Russia is criticized.


All that being said, all the above mentioned parties with the acception of the AfD (and maybe small parts within the Linke) are working within the constitution, support liberal democracy and want to defend Germany and German interests (they just have different visions of what that means). They are all mostly moderates by American standards. It's only the political extremes (and mostly the AfD) that actually have wet dreams of the downfall of the entire country and a blood-soaked revolution. Only they ally with Putin.

Now, the SPD is a special case in that it is above suspicion of actually liking Putin and his political system but have close historical ties to Russia because of their long tradition as a workers party (which implied being a bit more neutral and trying to act as brokers and negotiators during the cold war). Many in the party had long closed their eyes to what was actually going on in Russia until it was too late. They believed Russia could be a friend because they wanted to believe that. Schroeder himself once called Putin a "flawless democrat". Russia's actions of the last few months came as a shock to many of them.
 
Last edited:

JAVO

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No one really knows the details of what's going on with the shelling and damage at the nuclear power plant which shall not be pronounced, but one thing seems to be clear: they're playing Russian roulette (the irony!) with the world's health, and that of many generations to come.

 

yeghor

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He's also a staunch conservative of the law and order variety and I have never heard anyone compare him to George Soros. That sounds like utter bullshit. So I googled "Herbert Reul Soros" and couldn't find anything either. Not sure where that comparison is coming from, it seems completely unmotivated to me.
On twitter comments for that tweet.
as anybody with a brain forsee that the far-right (mainly the AfD) will highjack this topic and try to use it for political gain. That's just common sense because they have done that with every single crises in the last few years. And why wouldn't they. That's the legitimate right of the opposition. The problem is that when the far-right protest, they don't just write letters to the editor or go on peaceful demonstrations. They write death threats and rape threats to polticians, journalists and scientists. They physically threaten and beat up journalists trying to cover their demonstrations. They tried to storm the parliamentary building. There already was an assassination of a minor local politician.
That's right wing populism for AfD. Legit protests are too. If illegal actions were linked to AfD, they would've shut down the party already and arrested its leaders.

The people that think Germany should support Putin
the people who think climate change isn't real or not a really problem
the people who think Covid is fake or not a real problem
the people who think vaccinations are useless or even dangerous
the people who think refugees shouldn't receive help or are dangerous
the people who have a problem with LGBTQ people
the people who have a problem with supporting minorities of any kind
the people who support Trump or even believe in QAnon ...
Those ^ are usually from the libertarian right (i.e. lower right quadrant on meme compass) and to my understanding are xSTPs. They have distrust of the establishment and the government. Btw the party compass was unfortunately prepared with authoritarianism at the bottom, whereas the meme chart with authoritarianism on top. If I tilt it horizontally to make it compatible with the meme chart, it looks like this, do you think the placements are still correct? If they are, parties in the libertarian right are B90/Grüne and FDP.

1660963561865.png

... there is a huge overlap. It's always the same people. What gets their blood boiling changes from season to season, but it's the same people. The AfD feeds on them. So does, in part, the far-left. They take partially justified discontent and offer fake simplistic solutions.
^Populism.

It is reaonable to assume that the usual suspects will yet again protest, yet again become violent and yet again dream of overthrowing the government, install an authoritarian regime and execute the current government. I'm not making this up. There is a long paper trail of police and court records. This is a known fact. There are elements, a small minority of the population, who want to overthrown not just the current government but the entire state and install a new state and kill their political opponents. This is a simple fact. It is also a known fact that they try to and partially succeed in recruiting relatively normal average citizens during times of crises because they offer a way to vent both justified and unjustified frustrations. What Reul is saying, and I agree with him, is that this will likely happen yet again this winter when people suffer from higher energy prices. The reason for these higher energy prices, by the way, is a political decision by Russia, not Germany.

I'll get to party politics in the next post. This one is getting too long already.
Again, this^ doesn't sound like the upper right quadrant, they are authoritarian but are lawful and operate within the bounds of the system, they may be getting votes from Neo-nazis and skinheads (far lower right quadrant) and sort because the latter probably cannot form a legal party on their own.

The placement of the parties in the Cartesian system is correct. The parliamentary distribution also looks right but a bit irritating because it has swapped left and right. The party descriptions however are far off:
Obviously attributing MBTI types to parties is a bit silly, but let's have a look at this anyway.
^Note that there was a mismatch in vertical axis placement by default. I tilted it to make it compatible with the meme chart.

The SPD (Social Democrats) are historically the party of the working class but have lost their audience over time. Not sure what type they'd be, but IXXJ sounds weird. definitely not INTJ or ISTJ, maybe XSFJ. They are the elderly lady volunteering at the soup kitchen or your colleague from the works council who trains the childrens soccer team and volunteers at the local firefighters.
^They are the ISxJs.

The Greens are also hard to place but I'm not sure where you're getting "hard working immigrant" (who is in a different quadrant altogether). They tend to be be the choice of urban and educated people though.
^See the titled chart above. Your definition sounds like The Berliner, student, left-wing NPC and the European, which would place them on the lower (libertarian) left quadrant, meaning their placement on the party compass must be wrong and should move to the left somewhat. That places them closer to xxFPs.

The FDP is socially and economicall liberal but mainly a "down with taxes, down with welfare" party and thinly veiled lobby group for higher income groups. XNTJ perhaps.
Similarly if they were closer to xNTJs, I would expect them to be Bavarian Supremacist on the meme chart. That would mean their placement on the party chart should move a bit up to the authoritarian/regulatory side (upper right quadrant).

The Linke is definitely not the same as Children of Greta (once again different quadrant!). On the contrary, they have an awkward relationship with climate action and climate protesters (who tend to vote the Greens if anything). They see themself as defender of lower income people against the burden that comes with energy transition (and all the other challenges of our time). They also try to compete with the far-right over frustrated voters and often awkwardly agree with the other extreme of the political spectrum on quite a few issues (which is what the last cartoon is referring to).
Again, that would mean their placement on the party chart is a bit off. Currently their spot is closer to The Marxist theorist and the Berliner. They might be an xxFJ type of welfare/social state party, and maybe they should be a bit higher up on the upper left quadrant. If AfD is xSTJs, that would make sense that they agree on some issues if Linke is xxFJ.

The CSU is neither neo-nazi nor Putinist (maybe you are confusing them with the AfD)- they are a special case in that they have been governing Bavaria and only Bavaria since the dawn of the republic. They are a political mixed bag. Generally socially conservative but much less extreme than the AfD (or the American GOP) and actually in favor of Covid measures and climate action. They can be either to the right or the left of the CDU depending on the issue at hand but have been historically the most conservative party that is still plainly democratic and "working within rather than against the system".
The Neo-Nazi and Putinist meme comes from the meme chart for their spot on the party chart, either they are misplaced on the party chart or the Neo-Nazis are actually misplaced on the meme chart. As I said, what you mean by Neo-Nazis are actually on the far right of the libertarian/anarchist spectrum. They want to teardown the system so that they can act criminally without repercussions. People are mistaking upper right quadrant for Neo-Nazism yet parties in the upper right quadrant (including AfD) still wants to act within the bounds of the system. If the don't they should be somewhere on the lower quadrants.

AfD - (Right-wing populist + Reichsbürger) - The party used to stretch from just conservative to pretty far right when it was founded but has since moved continuously futher to the right and now is a mix of the generally disgruntled, fascist wannabe-revolutionaries and tin-foil hat wearing QAnon worshippers. Parts of the party are officially under observation by the secret service for anti-constitutional activities (aka trying to overthrow the German state and potential terrorist activities)
If that's so they may actually have shifted to the lower quadrants, scheming to take over the system thru illegal means.

Again, the CSU is neither neo-nazi nor Putinist. They are middle class conservative and very much defenders of the current system. They have nothing in common with hooligans or the prince.
That means the placement of Neo-Nazis on the meme chart is wrong and should be moved to the lower right quadrant. Meaning that, if AfD is correctly placed on the party chart, they cannot be Neo-Nazis either (though they may be getting votes from them due to lack of libertarian right party options).

I'd rather leave MBTI out of this but neonazis do tend to have a criminal record. Yes. And there is an overlap with hooligans in real life, but not in the Cartesian system you posted (note how your meme places neo-nazis and hooligans on opposite ends of the aurthoritarian axis? That's bullshit because while neonazis tend to strive for an extremely authoritarian state akin to the Third Reich their methods of getting there are anarchist (i.e. beating up leftists and foreigners with a baseball bat or comitting terrorists attacks on synagogues, etc).
Agreed. The meme chart should move them to far lower right quadrant, i.e. ISTPs most likely. However that would also mean AfD cannot be Neo-Nazis. What about Putinists on the meme chart though, could they be misplaced as well?

The FDP on the other hand couldn't be further away from hooligans. Yes, they favor civil liberties and a small government and are the closest thing we have to Libertarians, but they tend to be very bourgeouis higher income people, higher education and higher social status with a nice house and a nice car. They are not anarchists, they just want to be left alone making money. They definitely don't want to overthrow the system, just make it even more comfortable for rich people (and they are fine with LGBTQ rights and climate action and all that as long as it doesn't impact their balance sheet). They probably love the business opportunities that an oligarchy like Russia offers but wouldn't like the lack of civil liberties.
Sounds like ENTJs, that would move them slightly higher to the bottom of the upper right quadrant on the party chart, corresponds to the Bavarian supremacist on the meme chart.

The Linke is pro-Russian for two main reasons a) They are traditionally a party of the East and the people of the East grew up viewing America as the bad guys and the Soviet Union and their big brother. They learned Russian at school and have closer cultural links to Eastern Europe. b) As a far-left party they are basically anti-capitalist and as such anti-American. Russia is the prime enemy of the US so going by that alone they tend to favor Russia. They usually know that Russia is an oppressive dictatorship but prefer to turn a blind eye or engage in whataboutism whenever Russia is criticized.
They may have roots in the Eastern/Soviet Germany. Sounds like ExFJ. Are they into social welfare state?

All that being said, all the above mentioned parties with the acception of the AfD (and maybe small parts within the Linke) are working within the constitution, support liberal democracy and want to defend Germany and German interests (they just have different visions of what that means). They are all mostly moderates by American standards. It's only the political extremes (and mostly the AfD) that actually have wet dreams of the downfall of the entire country and a blood-soaked revolution. Only they ally with Putin.
Those extremists are actually people of the lower right quadrant that cannot find any other option for political representation as their ideologies wouldn't be allowed to exist legally within the system. Probably ISTPs. That's what I've been suspecting all along. I am wondering if Hitler himself was an ISTP to begin with and turned Germany into a criminal (unlawful) organization with his charm and killed any dissenters who didn't submit to his rule. That would make him the Prince on the meme chart.

Now, the SPD is a special case in that it is above suspicion of actually liking Putin and his political system but have close historical ties to Russia because of their long tradition as a workers party (which implied being a bit more neutral and trying to act as brokers and negotiators during the cold war). Many in the party had long closed their eyes to what was actually going on in Russia until it was too late. They believed Russia could be a friend because they wanted to believe that. Schroeder himself once called Putin a "flawless democrat". Russia's actions of the last few months came as a shock to many of them.
I think Putin might also be an ESTJ, which would mean TJ oriented political parties would feel affinity to him, but CDU and CSU don't, maybe due to religious differences, Russians being Orthodox.

Thanks for the detailed response.
 

yeghor

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No one really knows the details of what's going on with the shelling and damage at the nuclear power plant which shall not be pronounced, but one thing seems to be clear: they're playing Russian roulette (the irony!) with the world's health, and that of many generations to come.

It should be easy to identify who is attacking the plant using satellite imaging and the sort.
 

yeghor

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https://readovka.world/news/108216

First, the journalist (Alina Lipp), who had been covering the events in Donbas for her fellow countrymen for six months and had advocated a Russian Special Military Operation, had her bank account shut down, effectively stealing her savings. After that, her father's bank account was also blocked, and a criminal case was opened against Alina, she has been facing three years in prison in her homeland for writing and speaking about Donbas and the Special Military Operation.

When Readovka did the interview with Alina, she talked a bit about her mother, Petra Baas, who stayed in Germany. But now she (her mother) had to leave as well, because one day she was no longer able to pay with her card and withdraw money – her bank account was frozen, and then she began receiving threats of arrest. Alina had to temporarily cease activity on her Telegram channel, where Germans learn the truth about the events in Ukraine. Fortunately, her mother is already in Russia, in safety, where she is not in any danger.

Although I don't support Russian invasion of Ukraine, what disturbs me is the blatant and systemmatic censorship, ostracization and demeriting applied to anyone reporting material contrary to the Western MSM rhetoric. That's a very distinct red flag for me that some kind of counter/covert (NATO) operation is going on to manage the public opinion and perception and there's more to it than meets the eye, but some powers don't want the public to see into that.

German journalist Aline Lipp threatened with 3 years prison sentence by the German court (also about Spanish journalist Lui Sivaya who was doxxed for her contrarian views)

More on Alina Lipp

Alina Lipp's mother Petra Bass had to flee to Russia from Germany when bank accounts were blocked
 

Red Herring

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§140 of the German penal code states:

Section 140
Rewarding and approval of offences

Whoever

1. rewards or

2. approves of publicly, in a meeting or by disseminating material (section 11 (3)) in a manner which is suitable for causing a disturbance of the public peace

one of the unlawful acts
referred to in section 138 (1) nos. 2 to 4 and no. 5 last alternative and in section 126 (1) or an unlawful act under section 176 (3), sections 176a and 176b, under section 177 (4) to (8) or section 178 after it has been committed or culpably attempted incurs a penalty of imprisonment for a term not exceeding three years or a fine.

A war of aggression (like Russia's attack on Ukraine) is such an unlawful act.

That being said, Alina Lipp isn't really a journalist. She is a German-Russian Telegram, Instagram and Youtube starlet and media activist who is personally close to the Kremlin and has received money from the AfD. She is basically repeating Russian government press statements 1:1. No critical analysis. Literally reporting with a "Z" t-shirt on. A desinformation warrior. She is known to publish completely made up stories (like reporting on a manslaugter that never happened or claiming Scholz was the son of a nazi general who died 14 years before Scholz was born or publish a video that supposedly showed anti-Russian aggression in Germany during the war but was actually filmed in Russia several years back). She has also repeatedly published demonstrably false claims about events of the war in Ukraine.

And just for the record, Germany has loads of public and private independent media and reporting on the Russian side of the conflict is no issue. Criticizing the government is no issue. It happens every day. According to Reporters Without Borders Germany is ranked #16 out of 180 nations in press freedom. Russia, in case you're curious, is ranked #155.
 
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Red Herring

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Here's a Spanish news article on Liu Sibaya listing some of her many, many appearances in mainstream media and quoting her as saying (when asked what she thought about people calling her a "facha" (fascist)): "Y si lo fuera, ¿un facha no se merece respeto? Yo soy liberal, hay gente que lo considera de derechas, y otra de derechas, pero eso no es razón para no tener una relación cordial con todo el mundo en los debates” (And what of I was one- doesn't a fascist deserve respect? I'm liberal, some people think that's rightwing, another rightwinger, but that is no reason not to have a cordial relationship with everybody in a debate).

I also found a German article listing her as one of several pro-Putin influencers in Europe with close ties to Russia and the Kremlin.
 

yeghor

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Here's a Spanish news article on Liu Sibaya listing some of her many, many appearances in mainstream media and quoting her as saying (when asked what she thought about people calling her a "facha" (fascist)): "Y si lo fuera, ¿un facha no se merece respeto? Yo soy liberal, hay gente que lo considera de derechas, y otra de derechas, pero eso no es razón para no tener una relación cordial con todo el mundo en los debates” (And what of I was one- doesn't a fascist deserve respect? I'm liberal, some people think that's rightwing, another rightwinger, but that is no reason not to have a cordial relationship with everybody in a debate).

I also found a German article listing her as one of several pro-Putin influencers in Europe with close ties to Russia and the Kremlin.

I think while far libertarian right is regarded as criminal and primitive, far libertarian left is being given too much leeway under the pretense of feminism and equalization, being considered enlightened/woke (or considers itself as such) whereas they are really like Kettle and Pot. Gina Carano in US also got a similar treatment to Liu Sibaya because she also spoke her mind, she is probably an ESTP btw meaning she leans toward libertarian right as well.

So one should either treat both far-libertarian sides as criminal elements or allow them to speak their mind. Both the EU and US for some reason have become heavily shifted towards this progressive woke/cancel (far libertarian-left) culture, they have started choking out any ideology and opinion distant to their ideology. Putin and Trump are representatives of such ideologies, and their adherents feeling cast out and neglected and voiceless in the public domain.

Powers that be wouldn't allow that to happen in US and EU if it didn't serve their interests somehow, they probably want to undermine the nationalistic elements in those states using the far libertarian/anarchist left while petting their egos that they are doing good for the world or their classes, so that there won't be any resistance to the powers and they can have better control over them. Those powers are basically emasculating/feminizing the US and EU so that they will be docile and easily led. I think those powers call or present themselves as Globalists but I don't think their intentions are benevolent, they seem to be more interested in gaining control over resources and territories.


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