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Ayn Rand

What Personality Type is Ayn Rand?

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  • Total voters
    9

Mal12345

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I couldn't find an Ayn Rand typing thread so I'm starting one. Keep in mind that comments about Ayn Rand being evil or whatever are off-topic.

It is commonly thought that Rand was an INTJ. After all, even her closest followers called her Mrs. Logic. Unfortunately, I don't see logic as being necessarily associated with a particular type. Developing a philosophical system is not relevant to the INTJ type.

I have read biographies of Ayn Rand and read most of her books. So my evidence comes from reading about Rand. Read Socionics Types: IEI-INFp

"[T]hey sometimes can be prophetic, prescient, and profound in their visions, and sometimes reflect a far more rebellious, aggressive, or outspoken demeanor."
Ayn Rand was a visionary. INTJs are not visionaries. She rebelled against the mainstream of thought.

"Often IEIs exhibit a dreamy and gentle demeanor. They can come across as fickle, indecisive and vapid, and their fantasies can be often esoteric; they often may seem idealistic and focused on unrealistic or other-worldly utopias."
Her ideals and ideas are often considered to be unrealistic because she dreamed of an ideal capitalistic utopian world.

"IEIs typically have richly developed mental landscapes. They are highly attuned to trends, patterns, and conceptual connections of past behaviors, experiences, relationships, and their role in the world." She drew connections between trends/patterns and philosophical concepts. Her political writings show all of these inclinations. She drew connections between past conditions into the present, and then into the future.

Which Subtype? Intuitive versus Ethical. Most likely she was the Intuitive subtype.
Socionics Types: IEI-INFp Subtypes

"The intuitive subtype appears as a calm, tactful, languid and diffident individual."
That sounds like Howard Roark and John Galt.


"He seems torn from reality, inert and poorly adapted to life."
Ayn Rand never learned how to drive a car. She let her cats claw up her furniture.

"Usually does not aspire to leadership and finds it difficult and tiring to handle organizational functions." Yes, which is why she allowed Nathaniel Branden to make all the calls, although he had to pass them through her first.

"Gravitates more towards intellectual sphere of activity than towards hands-on management and production." Right.

"Exhibits tolerance towards the flaws and weaknesses of others." Yes. However, those "others" had to show some kind of outstanding achievements in order for her to forgive their flaws and weaknesses.

"Does not break immediately those relationships that have been exhausted for he grows used to people." This is true to an extent. But she would immediately break relationships with those she felt had betrayed her trust.

"IEIs often have a keen interest in interpreting their surroundings in terms of logical categories." This is probably one reason some think she was an INTJ. But that is just the Ti-tertiary of the INFJ.

One thing that's always bothered me about the INTJ call is the V.I. aspect: Rand's large eyes. INTJs just don't have eyes that large.
 

Mal12345

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Tertiary Temptation in INFJ | Stellar Maze
'[M]agic happens when an INFJ chooses to express themselves through an extraverted feeling medium. This would be writing, image-making, music, and in short, anything that is artistic. Conversely, the moment the INFJ starts thinking, “Hey, maybe I could systematize these abstruse thoughts into a closed system or philosophy of some sort”, they are on the road to ruin.'

That is Ayn Rand's life in a nutshell. She started out as an author who knew how to attract an audience (Fe-aux) with her unusual writing.

Then came “Hey, maybe I could systematize these abstruse thoughts [from her novels, Mal] into a closed system or philosophy of some sort.” And that's exactly what she did, the product becoming known as "Objectivism." And it certainly was the 'road to ruin' due to the interpersonal conflicts that came later. She broke with her long-time lover Nathaniel Branden, with her long-time confidant Barbara Branden, and with a host of other members of her movement. In Ti fashion, she simply broke with them and, for the most part, simply forgot about them. Her philosophy led to the ruination of her marriage. After the death of her husband, she was alone.
 

Mal12345

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She was not a feeler. Barely a writer. What type is that?

From INFJ vs. INTJ | Stellar Maze -
“INFJs, by contrast, are wet and live in this world of emotion at a very fundamental level. This may cause them more suffering quantitatively because they are always falling in love with the idea of love and dreaming of ideal romantic encounters.”

That is Ayn Rand to a Tee.
 

citizen cane

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The appropriate option is not here. She was clearly a CUNT.




In all seriousness, my guess would be INTJ, or INFJ with the worlds shittiest F. No idea about enneagram.
 

Mal12345

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The appropriate option is not here. She was clearly a CUNT.

Those are my exact thoughts about Hillary Clinton. But - "Keep in mind that comments about Ayn Rand being evil or whatever are off-topic."


In all seriousness, my guess would be INTJ, or INFJ with the worlds shittiest F. No idea about enneagram.

You don't know about Rand's Fe until you've either met her or know someone who has met her and been influenced by the way she drew 20,000 people to her side. And although that's not a lot of people, it's a lot for a relatively unknown author.
 

Mal12345

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And from my personal experience, I've experienced INFJ with a great deal more submerged Fe, so much so that this person completely withdrew into an intellectual shell of Ti-tertiary. Rand was far gone but I don't think she was that far gone.
 

citizen cane

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Bear in mind that sphere of influence is not necessarily indicative of Fe or Fi. And she's hardly unknown. I see inventing random facts to peddle a political agenda is still your thing?
 

Mal12345

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Bear in mind that sphere of influence is not necessarily indicative of Fe or Fi. And she's hardly unknown. I see inventing random facts to peddle a political agenda is still your thing?

I'm not actually addressing the sphere of influence. She had this effect on people she met, something that drew them to her which is definitely Fe-auxiliary at work. She knew how to charm individuals, even if she hit hard in her writing. She charmed the pants right off of Nathaniel Branden. As far as being unknown, I am talking about 1958, not 2017.

As for inventing facts, etc., please stop being silly.
 

Smilephantomhive

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Aww, I came here for the Ayn Rand hate.
 

jixmixfix

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she was a very intelligent billiant woman. She seemed intj to me or entj.
 

Mal12345

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she was a very intelligent billiant woman. She seemed intj to me or entj.

By the way, my essay on why Ayn Rand was an INFJ was accepted for publication in a journal.
 

Julius_Van_Der_Beak

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Ayn Rand actually loved government handouts.
 

Polaris

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Over at a certain Socionics forum, there's a general consensus that she's an SLE, which is almost the opposite of an IEI (and yes , I find it plausible that she's my dual; her personality really appeals to me, although I'm not a fan of her philosophy). If I had to guess her MBTI type, INFJ would not be one of my top picks.
 

Tomb1

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I've got her typed as a 1w9 so/sp. To me she perfectly inhabited the 1w9's rigid and contemptuous gestalt. so/sp even reinforced it. LII works.
 

Mal12345

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Ayn Rand actually loved government handouts.

Old and off-topic. They've been saying that for 30 years or more.

- - - Updated - - -

Over at a certain Socionics forum, there's a general consensus that she's an SLE, which is almost the opposite of an IEI (and yes , I find it plausible that she's my dual; her personality really appeals to me, although I'm not a fan of her philosophy). If I had to guess her MBTI type, INFJ would not be one of my top picks.

Read her biographies and then get back to me.

As for other people's opinions, they don't count because they use group-think to arrive at opinions.
 

yeghor

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Old thread regarding Ayn Rand's type.

I highly doubt that she was an INTJ.

In epistemology, she considered all knowledge to be based on sense perception, the validity of which she considered axiomatic, and reason, which she described as "the faculty that identifies and integrates the material provided by man's senses". She rejected all claims of non-perceptual or a priori knowledge, including "'instinct,' 'intuition,' 'revelation,' or any form of 'just knowing'". In her Introduction to Objectivist Epistemology, Rand presented a theory of concept formation and rejected the analytic–synthetic dichotomy.

^This clearly suggests she was not a dominant intuitive.

In ethics, Rand argued for rational and ethical egoism (rational self-interest), as the guiding moral principle. She said the individual should "exist for his own sake, neither sacrificing himself to others nor sacrificing others to himself". She referred to egoism as "the virtue of selfishness" in her book of that title, in which she presented her solution to the is-ought problem by describing a meta-ethical theory that based morality in the needs of "man's survival qua man". She condemned ethical altruism as incompatible with the requirements of human life and happiness, and held that the initiation of force was evil and irrational, writing in Atlas Shrugged that "Force and mind are opposites."

^IxxJs are not egotists but rather conscientous. Conscientousness tones down egotism especially when the individual is introverted. So this does not match with IxxJ typing for her.

Rand's political philosophy emphasized individual rights (including property rights), and she considered laissez-faire capitalism the only moral social system because in her view it was the only system based on the protection of those rights. She opposed statism, which she understood to include theocracy, absolute monarchy, Nazism, fascism, communism, democratic socialism, and dictatorship. Rand believed that natural rights should be protected by a constitutionally limited government. Although her political views are often classified as conservative or libertarian, she preferred the term "radical for capitalism". She worked with conservatives on political projects, but disagreed with them over issues such as religion and ethics. She denounced libertarianism, which she associated with anarchism. She rejected anarchism as a naïve theory based in subjectivism that could only lead to collectivism in practice.

^Statism and other ideologies she cites are collective ideologies, mostly suitable for ExxJs, that means she was not an ExxJ. The thing is IxxJs are still collectivists but at a lesser scale than ExxJs. So this does not match with IxxJ typing for her.

She is rather a masculine individualist, she does not want government to impose rules on her, which suggests a Ti-dom type.

She believed epistemology was a foundational branch of philosophy and considered the advocacy of reason to be the single most significant aspect of her philosophy, stating: "I am not primarily an advocate of capitalism, but of egoism; and I am not primarily an advocate of egoism, but of reason. If one recognizes the supremacy of reason and applies it consistently, all the rest follows."

^She holds reason supreme. Reason as she means is related to thinking function, and not intuition.

Ayn Rand herself rejected the label "feminist" and even went so far as to provocatively declare herself a "male chauvinist." In addition to her philosophical views per se, she had a view of sexual psychology that ascribed distinctive "masculine" and "feminine" attitudes to healthy men and women respectively. She argued that sexually, women should desire to engage in "hero worship," and that this required having at least one man to whom they could each look up.

^That is a hypermasculine (far right) mindset. That kind of mindset is displayed by thinking dominant types.

In conclusion I think Ayn Rand was rather and INTP, enneagram 5w6.

 

yeghor

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Ayn Rand's husband Frank O Connor:

"O'Connor gave up his acting ambitions to support Rand's work. He worked, for a time, on a farm in Tarzana, California, where they both lived, to support them while she wrote and began to gain notice as a philosopher of great renown. O'Connor was said to have enjoyed the change of pace in his life.

Noted author and professor Mimi Gladstein in an interview: "From all accounts, Frank O'Connor was content in this setting, growing flowers, raising peacocks, and developing the land. Rand, who did not drive, preferred urban living." Rand praised O'Connor's devotion to seeing her succeed: "Frank believed in me. He saw who I was and what I would become when no one else did, when we were both young and struggling and had nothing. We have the same sense of life.

O'Connor and Rand moved to New York and he began a career as a talented and rising painter. He was a member from 1955 to 1966 of the Art Students League of New York, according to his obituary in the New York Times. Some of his paintings were featured as covers for Rand's books."

Appearently her husband was a feeler, and in his photos he looks introverted. I am inclined to type him ISFJ. He looks a bit like Bill Nighy.

Frank O Connor Photos and Artwork:




So how about this? :D What do these tell about Rand's type? She seems to like right wing non-conformist and hate left-wing non-conformists?

image-2021-05-28-175605.png


 

Siúil a Rúin

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I think TJ is rather strong component to her. She could be ESTJ though.
 
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