hel's enneagram, again

[magpie]

Here's an enneagram poll. I'm interested in what type you think I am and why, if you want to share. Thanks.

 

[fetus]

These polls are all the rage now! Have I started a trend?

I do not think you are a 9, that's all I can say. You just seem too bold and forward to be a 9 (not that 9's can't be bold). You seem very moralistic and firm which leads me to believe a 1 fix, probably 1w2. Your heart fix is 4, I think. Head fix...I don't know. Honestly I don't know you extremely well so it's hard to get a read on you.

 

[magpie]

These polls are all the rage now! Have I started a trend?

I do not think you are a 9, that's all I can say. You just seem too bold and forward to be a 9 (not that 9's can't be bold). You seem very moralistic and firm which leads me to believe a 1 fix, probably 1w2. Your heart fix is 4, I think. Head fix...I don't know. Honestly I don't know you extremely well so it's hard to get a read on you.

You did start a trend. Thanks for the reply.

 

[Smilephantomhive]

I really have no clue.

 

[Yama]

4w5, 6w5, 1w9?? I am trying.

 

[Stephano]

I've read somewhere that people who can't figure out their type are often 6s. Maybe there's something to this claim since many descriptions have an SJ bias.

The Enneagram Blogspot: Type 6: Security-Seeker

Sixes are full of contradictions. They can be dependent on others, yet value their independence. They want to be trusted and to trust others, yet constantly test others to allay their own suspicions. They want the protection of authority, yet fear it. They are obedient yet, disobedient; fearful of aggression, yet sometimes highly aggressive themselves. They search for security, yet feel insecure. They are likable and endearing, yet can be mean and hateful. They are reassured by traditional values, yet may subvert those values. They want to escape punishment, yet may bring it on themselves. Sixes are full of contradictions because anxiety makes them ricochet from one psychological state to another. And in response to anxiety, Sixes look to structures, beliefs, allies, and authorities to put their anxiety to rest.

 

[magpie]

I've read somewhere that people who can't figure out their type are often 6s. Maybe there's something to this claim since many descriptions have an SJ bias.

The Enneagram Blogspot: Type 6: Security-Seeker

I'm actually caught between 4 and 6 right now. I was perfectly happy calling myself a 4 for a long time. I'm going through a weird time right now though and am not sure if that's a good reason to change my type, or if it will turn out that I was actually one or the other all along. Which is why I'm looking for perceptions. Also, I thought it would be interesting.

There are things I don't relate to in both descriptions. For 4, I don't relate to constructing an image or creating a persona. I don't seek to enhance my own negative moods, and I'm not looking for a rescuer in the form of a lover. Or one at all. For 6, I'm not loyal to people and I don't really form close bonds easily or very much at all. I don't think I'm looking for all dangers in a situation and arming myself against them. I don't tend to feel like a victim and I'm not that politically motivated.

 

[senza tema]

Hel, I don't know you well enough to suggest an enneagram type for you but I do want to say that as a 4, I don't relate to constructing an image or persona either. I always felt that my persona was amorphous if not non-existent; that I was bad at presenting myself because my self didn't really have firm outlines or boundaries or anything. That's kind of why I typed as a 9 for such a long time.

As a 7-fixed 4 I also tend not to amplify negative emotions as much as some of the e4 descriptions suggest. Poetry is other people's sadness, not my own (that sounds horrifically unempathetic but ... yeah.)

 

[magpie]

Hel, I don't know you well enough to suggest an enneagram type for you but I do want to say that as a 4, I don't relate to constructing an image or persona either. I always felt that my persona was amorphous if not non-existent; that I was bad at presenting myself because my self didn't really have firm outlines or boundaries or anything. That's kind of why I typed as a 9 for such a long time.

As a 7-fixed 4 I also tend not to amplify negative emotions as much as some of the e4 descriptions suggest. Poetry is other people's sadness, not my own (that sounds horrifically unempathetic but ... yeah.)

This is interesting. Thank you.

I'll just remove my listed enneagram again and maybe I'll know in a while.

 

[Duffy]

There are things I don't relate to in both descriptions. For 4, I don't relate to constructing an image or creating a persona. I don't seek to enhance my own negative moods, and I'm not looking for a rescuer in the form of a lover. Or one at all. For 6, I'm not loyal to people and I don't really form close bonds easily or very much at all. I don't think I'm looking for all dangers in a situation and arming myself against them. I don't tend to feel like a victim and I'm not that politically motivated.

It's not just a loyalty to people. I'd say it's an attachment object relations style that makes up the bulk of the type pattern. A similarity I've noticed between 6s and 4s is the idealization tendencies. I know a 6 that does this sorta worshiping of other people and ideas. This person has a tendency to bring people up, but when the person or idea lets them down, they start to tear it apart. They can be inclusive or discriminating because of this.

In terms of the 4s construction of persona, I've noticed a dichotomy there, something like meaningful/not meaningful, or, interesting/bland. Some 4s can be very dry, sorta the embodiment of the minimalism/nihilism/void. It could be the influence from the 5 wing, as there's more of a withholding element in the fixation. There's actually a great example of the 5 fixation in a documentary I saw recently on Netflix. It's about the life and work of a photographer (Vivian Maier). I can see a lot of her patterns in myself. I recommend if you're interested in that sorta thing.

And regarding your type, I don't know, but I've seen you type as 146.... I think this combination is very critical of self and others

 

[fetus]

Maybe you are a core 1...

 

[magpie]

It's occurred to me that I should offer to allow people to get to know me at this point, to aid in the process of typology? Though I thought I was already very open and overshare-y on this site. And thus easy to get to know. Really I'm just offering because 21lux offered in his type me thread and he seems like a good model for appropriate behavior in "type me" related areas.

Also, I don't think I'm a core 1, but it's been suggested before.

 

[Yama]

It's occurred to me that I should offer to allow people to get to know me at this point, to aid in the process of typology? Though I thought I was already very open and overshare-y on this site. And thus easy to get to know. Really I'm just offering because 21lux offered in his type me thread and he seems like a good model for appropriate behavior in "type me" related areas.

Also, I don't think I'm a core 1, but it's been suggested before.

I'm not sure I could see 1 core for you, but it's definitely present in your tritype. I think deciding between 4 or 6 core is the hardest part here... Though I feel like I don't understand 4 enough to tell you if you're a 4 core. I definitely see 6 influence though. Hmm, just to decide whether it's the core or not...

 

[magpie]

Tell me about socionics [MENTION=9627]Xann[/MENTION]. Eh?

 

[Starry]

Enneagram Central - Subtype Four Self Preservation

The fundamental question of a Self-Preservation 4 is being: how to be, and more radically, whether to be or not to be.

 

[magpie]

Is hel a 4 or a 6, pt ii. Aka why do I feel like a 4 sometimes and a 6 at other times?

I don't know if I'm motivated by sadness or fear. I notice myself switching between phobic and counterphobic but I also have an obvious obsession with identity. I can't tell if any of the above is naturally me or if it's due to life developments, or if there's even a difference between naturally you and life developments. Or if there's even such a thing as naturally you.

Apologies for bringing this up again. I feel like people are probably sick of discussing this. I'm actually going to fill out a questionnaire this time though, so that might help people who said they had no idea or don't know me well enough to be able to type me.

Questionnaire

What's making you unsure of your type? What research have you already done to determine type?

I can't tell if I'm enneagram 4 or 6. I've researched both. I think I switch back and forth between the two, if that's possible.

1. Establish a "baseline mood"--when you're at home with nothing to do, where are you at mentally and emotionally? What do you notice in yourself? (Note, this is not a mood you inhabit "frequently", but your psychological baseline).

I don't know what a psychological baseline is. When I'm at home with nothing to do I'm either content and happy to rest and spend time working on my own projects, or I'm jumping out of my skin with boredom and irritation at having nothing stimulating to do.

2. Describe yourself--
a. What's it like to be you?

Hard to answer this with any objectivity, though I suppose that's the point. Still, I feel really uncomfortable trying to answer this as all I know is being myself. I think you'd have to be me to know what it's like to be me.

b. What have others said about you?

A lot. The answer to this is very vast. Very vast. This is why I usually don't do questionnaires - I'm horrible at not evading questions.

c. What do you think of yourself?

Um? I think I'm determined, that I somehow have managed to remain idiotically idealistic, that I'm reserved, serious, playful, and somehow both pigheaded and uncertain.

3. What are the issues you've dealt with in life? List some recurrent themes, and tell us a little about each one.

Illness, loss of freedom, fear, forgetting.

4. You're not good at everything--
a. What personality traits and/or ways of being are impossible for you to adopt?

I can be outgoing but I've never been very good at socializing. I actually hold back my true opinion way more than it probably seems like, but I still don't think tact is a strong point for me.

b. What are qualities you'd like to have, but can't seem to develop?

Kindness.

5. Why have you left friends and other relationships in the past and/or why have they left you?

I just leave and move on. It's what I do. I have to have change, I can't stick around. I usually don't say good bye.

6. Which types do you identify with most?

4 and 6.

a. How do you relate to these types?

I relate to the basic fear of 4: having no identity or personal significance. For 6, I relate to oscillating between rebellious and defiant and cautious and indecisive. In essence, 4 is who am I? and 6 is whom do I trust?

b. How do you NOT relate to them?

I'm not loyal. I don't enjoy feeling bad or try to cultivate negative moods. I want to be free and I want to get rid of bad emotions.

7. Which types are least like you?

Type 2.

a. Why specifically do you not relate to these types?

I'm not caring enough. I'm no good at expressing love.

b. What points (if any) DO you relate to?

I still want to be loved, but I think that's true of any type.

8. They claim enneagram type is a hidden love need. What are your attitudes toward finding love?

I don't do romance or sex or anything like that. I like to meet people, especially interesting people. I'm not looking for something too deep though.

9. What is the message your superego tells you?

Consider a time when you felt poorly about yourself--this means your ego (i.e. YOU) is receiving negative feedback from your superego. Write a conversation between the two of them--what is your superego telling you about how to be? (Note: this obviously is very personal and may be better done privately. Report your findings).

My superego would tell me I'm full of myself, pathetic, worthless, that I overreact, that I don't deserve to have feelings, and that I'm just a weak baby who isn't strong enough. This sounds worse typed out than it does in my head.

For the following, rank the issues in the order they apply and give a brief description of why and how you relate.

10. Determine your ego ideal--the way you strive to be and want others to perceive you. (Note, you may be consciously aware of failing at this, and you will be hard on yourself if you do. If someone else tells you you're NOT this way, it may make you feel hurt, violated, or angry.)

Which of the following ideals resonate with you the most, and why? Rank them.

1. to strive to become/behave like a good person
2. to be loving and benevolent
3. to be a loveable person
4. to be powerful, strong, unassailable.
5. to be sensitive, original, unique, and creative
6. to be knowlegeable
7. to be devoted and loyal to a person or cause
8. to be "okay", having it together
9. to be accomplished and successful

11. Determine your "felt sense" of life. To do this it may help to look at how you perceive events. Another way to do this is to look back at your childhood and think of all the things your parents did to you. How did you/do you feel about these events?

Here are some common "felt senses" of life:

1. I'm outside the natural unfoldment of things
2. I have a sense of being unimportant, insignificant, and underving of attention
3. I feel imperfect, not (good) enough
4. I have been abandoned and I am inherently flawed
5. I feel isolated, cut off, and ultimately separate
6. I have felt weak and/or vulnerable to attack
7. People have wronged and messed with me
8. I must do everything to maintain my world
9. I've had a sense of being rejectible

12. Core fears. You may have been aware of these fears even as a very small child, before anyone did anything to influence it. You'd be mortified to be in this position or have others perceive you this way.

Discuss which fears have played the greatest role in your life:

1. Something is basically wrong with me--I'm not good enough
2. A lot--everything and everyone to one degree or another. It's very generalized.
3. Weak and not being on top of things
4. Creating conflict by making myself or my needs too obvious
5. Rejection, being needy, and not being loved
6. Failure
7. Being abandoned, sadness, feeling lost
8. Entanglements and losing what I have
9. Boredom, grunt work, and being exposed as a charlatan

 

[senza tema]

95% sure you're 4w5 sp/sx. The dauntless subtype.

 

[senza tema]

FWIW I identify with so much of what you've said here. (Ignore type in my profile right now ... That's my shadow self)

 

[magpie]

FWIW I identify with so much of what you've said here. (Ignore type in my profile right now ... That's my shadow self)

Haha! I thought something was a little off with your self-typing right now...

 

[fetus]

Just read your questionnaire, and I am now more certain of your type.

I think you are a 4w5 sp/sx. Your cautious and indecisive flipping could be a result of the self-preservational instinct conflicting with the more intense sexual auxiliary. I might even venture to say that your 1 fix is stronger than your 6 fix. I think I'll say 4w5-1w9-6w5.

Oh, and this isn't Enneagram, but I am now 99% sure you are a clear IxFP.