Entp/infjGal
New member
- Joined
- Mar 27, 2016
- Messages
- 96
- MBTI Type
- ENFP
- Enneagram
- 6w5
Hello all. I'm new here. I joined because I cannot decide on my type and need help from others.
I have figured out very clearly that I prefer Ti-Fe rather than Fi-Te. That's pretty clear. Also, because of the strong tension between Ti and Fe priorities ever since my teen years, (I am 32) I can tell that neither of the two is supressed (my inferior) in me. I know therefore that the Ti-Fe is my middle stack in my type "sandwich" ie second and third functions.
What I CANNOT for the life of me figure out is which of the two perceptive stacks (Ni-Se/Ne-Si) I prefer, mostly because I feel like I am equally poor at both Sensory processes (Si;Se) and CANNOT understand just what either of the intuitive functions actually are on their own. It is extremely easy to tell intuition from sensation when sensation is your WEAKEST psychological tool/function. But I cannot decide between Ni and Ne because I don't know what each actually is in practice. I cannot label the process my mind uses as either one because I don't know what is genuinely distinct about each in how it actually shows up in a person's mind, which examples I can relate to. Most examples of both seem to be things I do. On the other hand, I have seen examples for both I found completely weird and could not relate to at all.
I used to be confused about whether I was Infj or enfp because besides the complete confidence that I am an intuitive, I was equally sure for the longest time that I was nf/catalyst. Those were the two things I was immediately and consistently sure of from the very first day I discovered this whole mbti/Jung business some years back.
But after finally coming to an understanding of exactly what thing Ti and Te are and then slowly figuring out what thing Fi and Fe are, I ruled out ENFP. No way I use Te....scratch that, of course I have to to live in this world. But I am the absolute worst organiser of non-human resources you can find if what you want is efficiency and that kind of thing has NEVER appealed to me my whole life.
On the other hand, logical SELF-consistency of any conceptual model/system I am dealing with is exactly what I have always meant whenever I told someone that a certain claim/concept was obviously false and this looong before I knew anything about psychological types. Noticing plot holes in the story I am being fed in a theory/movie/book, iso what I do. This is something I quite enjoy actually. Of course I do consider how it matches up tomexternal evidence, but it's not so much about testing a rule or measuring the theory or whatever. I just want the story/theory to explain the facts (external evidence) in a logically self-consistent way without "cheating", IE without making logical back flips or hoops when that explanation meets evidence that is not consistent with it. Generally, even if the theory cannot be empirically tested, I am generally satisfied if it can explain the given facts self-consistently. For this reason, it is extremely disappointing to me to discover plot-holes in movies, because it kind of ruins the larger story for me.
In all my debates, all my criticisms, and all my mental rejections of certain claims, it has always been this thing, which I came to understand later is actually the thing mbti people label introverted thinking, that was responsible. To me, until then, I had assumed it was simply logic....universal to all human beings! All those people I secretly labeled intellectually dishonest or deliberately self-deceiving, I now realize, I labelled them in my mind under the assumption that extreme discomfort with glaring internal inconsistencies (logical/conceptual) was a universal human trait and decided that people who were comfortable with it were extremely dishonest human beings (or...maybe a bit slow) who simply didn't care if something was true or not. Just whether they liked it (wanted it to be true) or not. I know better now.
But I am very slow in understanding Ne as opposed to Ni or viceversa. I still don't know what Si is exactly though I know exactly which people are SJs, especially STJS...they are the people I'm constantly getting in some kind of trouble with! I used to think they were mean and petty and sadistic. Again, I know better now. But I don't know what Si is in terms of actual experiential practical examples (in myself) that I can label. So while I can sort of tell who is using it, I know it from a very external perspective. I don't actually know what the thing is experientially. I can't tell when I am using it. Se I do know. I also know I am very poor at it. Can't run or do sports to save my life! Always missing huge pieces of information in my immediate environment...I just don't look/notice.
Like I said before, that I am intuitive is the single most sure thing I know in this whole affair! I am the kid who went home without a sweater every other day because I had no idea where I had placed it; was always getting called out by teachers for being "elsewhere" dreaming. I still struggle with chores or repetitive tasks or even non-repetitive administrative tasks like filling forms. That I am intuitive is beyond doubt. The thing is which kind of intuitive I am. I hope somehow someone can help me.
What makes me doubt infj?
For one, the idea of long term planning. Or being very organised. I have general blurry visions about the future. Very general. I tend to know what I will or must do to get to that goal, but to me it's not so much a goal as a picture I see...how to make the picture come true. Also, I here infjs never take as long as i have to settle on a type. For me, until I actually know what the functions are, I can't decide which ones of them I use!
I also became extremely argumentative when I hit my early teens. Everyone who has ever known me for an extended period of time will make a note about how I supposedly "love to argue"...I don't, actually. It's a point of shame for me as it was consistently pointed out in a way that I understood was NOT complimentary even when not intended to be critical...and my, how the girls everybody admired were the opposite (demure, gentle, not strongly opinionated/verbally expressive or even openly emotional)...I now understand those types of girls were dominant Fi users or atleast secondary Fi users or even ISFJs.
What makes me doubt entp? People, people, people and values....they have always been VERY important to me (Which is why I assumed I must be nf)...Then again, so has truth! Another is that I do not consider myself enterpreneual in any pronounced way. I am kind of slow in life actually. And I do not generally feel a twitch to go out and "explore" though when I do, I certainly enjoy the sights. I thought I was introverted because I have very little need to explore my environment. Even in my office, it takes me months after starting before visiting some places in the not so large building. Same thing as my neighbourhood. It takes me forever to get to know my physical environment beyond the most basic (my actual office where I sit or my house where I live).
I know lots of socialization has shaped me....Maybe I am a dysfunctional entp?? Or a dysfunctional infj?? I do not like sitting in an office by myself, but I do not need to seek out the company of others OFTEN, I do seek it but not as much as I see it in others around me. People on the third floor (I'm on 4th) complain that they never get to see me. When I feel comfortable with someone though, I can seek them out. I have a bit of out of mind out of sight problem in the sense that my loved ones always have to look for me (I moved to another country) and they complain a lot. My friends while around, will be entertained somewhat but once they are out of town I tend not to reach out, not out of deliberate choice...I just don't feel/think it until they reach out to me (often complaining!) In fact, reaching out is a very conscious/deliberate effort even when they are near. ..I sort of have to decide to do it, I don't just do it unless we bump into each other on the corridor or something or I genuinely feel that miss you feeling which isn't very often.
Please help me sort this out.
I have figured out very clearly that I prefer Ti-Fe rather than Fi-Te. That's pretty clear. Also, because of the strong tension between Ti and Fe priorities ever since my teen years, (I am 32) I can tell that neither of the two is supressed (my inferior) in me. I know therefore that the Ti-Fe is my middle stack in my type "sandwich" ie second and third functions.
What I CANNOT for the life of me figure out is which of the two perceptive stacks (Ni-Se/Ne-Si) I prefer, mostly because I feel like I am equally poor at both Sensory processes (Si;Se) and CANNOT understand just what either of the intuitive functions actually are on their own. It is extremely easy to tell intuition from sensation when sensation is your WEAKEST psychological tool/function. But I cannot decide between Ni and Ne because I don't know what each actually is in practice. I cannot label the process my mind uses as either one because I don't know what is genuinely distinct about each in how it actually shows up in a person's mind, which examples I can relate to. Most examples of both seem to be things I do. On the other hand, I have seen examples for both I found completely weird and could not relate to at all.
I used to be confused about whether I was Infj or enfp because besides the complete confidence that I am an intuitive, I was equally sure for the longest time that I was nf/catalyst. Those were the two things I was immediately and consistently sure of from the very first day I discovered this whole mbti/Jung business some years back.
But after finally coming to an understanding of exactly what thing Ti and Te are and then slowly figuring out what thing Fi and Fe are, I ruled out ENFP. No way I use Te....scratch that, of course I have to to live in this world. But I am the absolute worst organiser of non-human resources you can find if what you want is efficiency and that kind of thing has NEVER appealed to me my whole life.
On the other hand, logical SELF-consistency of any conceptual model/system I am dealing with is exactly what I have always meant whenever I told someone that a certain claim/concept was obviously false and this looong before I knew anything about psychological types. Noticing plot holes in the story I am being fed in a theory/movie/book, iso what I do. This is something I quite enjoy actually. Of course I do consider how it matches up tomexternal evidence, but it's not so much about testing a rule or measuring the theory or whatever. I just want the story/theory to explain the facts (external evidence) in a logically self-consistent way without "cheating", IE without making logical back flips or hoops when that explanation meets evidence that is not consistent with it. Generally, even if the theory cannot be empirically tested, I am generally satisfied if it can explain the given facts self-consistently. For this reason, it is extremely disappointing to me to discover plot-holes in movies, because it kind of ruins the larger story for me.
In all my debates, all my criticisms, and all my mental rejections of certain claims, it has always been this thing, which I came to understand later is actually the thing mbti people label introverted thinking, that was responsible. To me, until then, I had assumed it was simply logic....universal to all human beings! All those people I secretly labeled intellectually dishonest or deliberately self-deceiving, I now realize, I labelled them in my mind under the assumption that extreme discomfort with glaring internal inconsistencies (logical/conceptual) was a universal human trait and decided that people who were comfortable with it were extremely dishonest human beings (or...maybe a bit slow) who simply didn't care if something was true or not. Just whether they liked it (wanted it to be true) or not. I know better now.
But I am very slow in understanding Ne as opposed to Ni or viceversa. I still don't know what Si is exactly though I know exactly which people are SJs, especially STJS...they are the people I'm constantly getting in some kind of trouble with! I used to think they were mean and petty and sadistic. Again, I know better now. But I don't know what Si is in terms of actual experiential practical examples (in myself) that I can label. So while I can sort of tell who is using it, I know it from a very external perspective. I don't actually know what the thing is experientially. I can't tell when I am using it. Se I do know. I also know I am very poor at it. Can't run or do sports to save my life! Always missing huge pieces of information in my immediate environment...I just don't look/notice.
Like I said before, that I am intuitive is the single most sure thing I know in this whole affair! I am the kid who went home without a sweater every other day because I had no idea where I had placed it; was always getting called out by teachers for being "elsewhere" dreaming. I still struggle with chores or repetitive tasks or even non-repetitive administrative tasks like filling forms. That I am intuitive is beyond doubt. The thing is which kind of intuitive I am. I hope somehow someone can help me.
What makes me doubt infj?
For one, the idea of long term planning. Or being very organised. I have general blurry visions about the future. Very general. I tend to know what I will or must do to get to that goal, but to me it's not so much a goal as a picture I see...how to make the picture come true. Also, I here infjs never take as long as i have to settle on a type. For me, until I actually know what the functions are, I can't decide which ones of them I use!
I also became extremely argumentative when I hit my early teens. Everyone who has ever known me for an extended period of time will make a note about how I supposedly "love to argue"...I don't, actually. It's a point of shame for me as it was consistently pointed out in a way that I understood was NOT complimentary even when not intended to be critical...and my, how the girls everybody admired were the opposite (demure, gentle, not strongly opinionated/verbally expressive or even openly emotional)...I now understand those types of girls were dominant Fi users or atleast secondary Fi users or even ISFJs.
What makes me doubt entp? People, people, people and values....they have always been VERY important to me (Which is why I assumed I must be nf)...Then again, so has truth! Another is that I do not consider myself enterpreneual in any pronounced way. I am kind of slow in life actually. And I do not generally feel a twitch to go out and "explore" though when I do, I certainly enjoy the sights. I thought I was introverted because I have very little need to explore my environment. Even in my office, it takes me months after starting before visiting some places in the not so large building. Same thing as my neighbourhood. It takes me forever to get to know my physical environment beyond the most basic (my actual office where I sit or my house where I live).
I know lots of socialization has shaped me....Maybe I am a dysfunctional entp?? Or a dysfunctional infj?? I do not like sitting in an office by myself, but I do not need to seek out the company of others OFTEN, I do seek it but not as much as I see it in others around me. People on the third floor (I'm on 4th) complain that they never get to see me. When I feel comfortable with someone though, I can seek them out. I have a bit of out of mind out of sight problem in the sense that my loved ones always have to look for me (I moved to another country) and they complain a lot. My friends while around, will be entertained somewhat but once they are out of town I tend not to reach out, not out of deliberate choice...I just don't feel/think it until they reach out to me (often complaining!) In fact, reaching out is a very conscious/deliberate effort even when they are near. ..I sort of have to decide to do it, I don't just do it unless we bump into each other on the corridor or something or I genuinely feel that miss you feeling which isn't very often.
Please help me sort this out.
Before I used to detest the P/J thing, but actually INFJ's should most of the time score the J one at least slightly in its favor if they're healthy. Although I am skeptical if the INFJ is too J, means they're an unhealthy IP or some EJ type.
