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  1. #1
    This is a test. Sil's Avatar
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    I'm interested in getting some perspective on whether or not ESTJ is the best fit for me.

    I've been typed an ESTJ for several years now. I've never connected with any other type over ESTJ, but I've noticed there are a fair amount of discrepancies between ESTJ and me.

    Some of those, granted, come down to me as an individual. Others feel like they may be more type related.


    I relate very strongly to Fi-inferior and Si-descriptions. I also know without a doubt I am an Ne user. But Te feels more like lukewarm water to me. I notice points when I use it, but I wouldn't say it feels like the dominant function in my day-to-day behavior. It feels more like something I fall back on when I need to be serious.

    Regarding behaviors, the primary non-ESTJ things that stand out to me are my interest in ideas over execution (unless execution is swift can can be done in a very short amount of time where the momentum is there) and my struggle to follow through with things. I tend to get obsessed with something just long enough to understand it; once I understand it, I get bored and find it a struggle to stay engaged.

    My life is littered with hobbies I've started, mastered the basics of, and then abandoned in search of something more engaging/interesting.

    I often find the most enjoyment in just understanding how something functions rather than necessarily needing to be able to do it myself.

    Regarding ideas over execution...I've learned this the hard way through my career. It is a legitimate struggle for me to display long-term consistency with something, especially if it devolves into predictable repetition. I started building websites for people a few years ago as a side gig. What I found was that I loved the planning stages and the initial setup, but was desperately terrible at long term admin/maintenance. After setup and launch, my interest would die and people would have to push me to do any sort of consistent maintenance.

    Essentially, I like developing ideas, molding them into something tangible, creating an outline/framework for how it would work, and then moving onto something else.

    I wish I could say things like duty/loyalty/commitment push me to follow through on things I promise to do, but no. Doesn't work that way. It's about as fun as breathing water to work on something I'm not mentally engaged by.

    Granted, that last sentence is probably a universal point. I think most people struggle when they're not engaged by whatever it is they're doing.

    I guess the point is that I feel the things I struggle with aren't the things ESTJs normally struggle with.


    I can't see myself as an introvert. And like I said, I'm fairly certain I use Fi/Si/Ne/Te.

    So my only other option appears to be ENFP.

    Are there any specific questions I could address that would help clarify?

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    Yeah, okay. I guess I will stick with ESTJ.

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    Typing by inferior is a smart way to go, if you've got your type narrowed down to one or two different types. I wouldn't worry about the non-ESTJ-like behavior example you gave. If I am any sort of example of anything at all, it's that not all types fit every stereotype. I know an ISTJ who is very messy and disorganized, for example, but only in things he considers unimportant. He also sometimes gets bored with things and doesn't finish them--I do, too. It might be a lower-Ne thing. The friend I'm using as an example also doesn't give two shits about duty and all that stuff.

    Overall, from what I have seen from you, I have found no reasons to disagree with ESTJ.
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    Quote Originally Posted by 21lux View Post
    Typing by inferior is a smart way to go, if you've got your type narrowed down to one or two different types. I wouldn't worry about the non-ESTJ-like behavior example you gave. If I am any sort of example of anything at all, it's that not all types fit every stereotype. I know an ISTJ who is very messy and disorganized, for example, but only in things he considers unimportant. He also sometimes gets bored with things and doesn't finish them--I do, too. It might be a lower-Ne thing. The friend I'm using as an example also doesn't give two shits about duty and all that stuff.

    Overall, from what I have seen from you, I have found no reasons to disagree with ESTJ.
    Hmmm. I guess the best way to put it is that the differences don't feel as superficial as messy/organized. The kinds of discrepancies I'm trying to explain are a little more complex than that.

    I relate more to common Ne-dom issues, but don't tend to be as Fi heavy as an ENFP.

    I guess cognitively speaking, there's no other option but ESTJ. Maybe ISTJ, but I doubt it. Not an introvert.

    But there are themes that come with being an ESTJ, and I don't feel align with those. For example, being short-term future focused. Every ESTJ I've interacted with works at this time flow.

    By contrast, I work from a 10-20 year perspective. Present and short-term future are barely a blip on the radar except in how they interact with the long future.

    I guess it's possible I'm over thinking it, but the differences have been a snag for at least a year now.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sil View Post
    Hmmm. I guess the best way to put it is that the differences don't feel as superficial as messy/organized. The kinds of discrepancies I'm trying to explain are a little more complex than that.

    I relate more to common Ne-dom issues, but don't tend to be as Fi heavy as an ENFP.

    I guess cognitively speaking, there's no other option but ESTJ. Maybe ISTJ, but I doubt it. Not an introvert.

    But there are themes that come with being an ESTJ, and I don't feel align with those. For example, being short-term future focused. Every ESTJ I've interacted with works at this time flow.

    By contrast, I work from a 10-20 year perspective. Present and short-term future are barely a blip on the radar except in how they interact with the long future.

    I guess it's possible I'm over thinking it, but the differences have been a snag for at least a year now.
    Oh, I wouldn't worry about themes. I don't align with pretty much any ISFJ theme, especially when it comes to Fe.

    Only other type I could maybe think of is ENTJ--still Te dom, but with 10-20 year planning, almost sounds like Ni (though that is a superficial observation based on that fact alone). What aspects of Ni and Si do you feel you relate (or don't relate) to?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sil
    I relate very strongly to Fi-inferior and Si-descriptions. I also know without a doubt I am an Ne user. But Te feels more like lukewarm water to me. I notice points when I use it, but I wouldn't say it feels like the dominant function in my day-to-day behavior. It feels more like something I fall back on when I need to be serious.
    Was going to suggest possibly ENFP but I think this rules that out - an ENFP has inferior Si and auxiliary Fi, as you know, so if you can relate strongly to inferior Fi and higher Si that would rule out ENFP.

    Maybe you just have a strong tertiary Ne. You might be in an Te-Ne loop, not saying you are but that's one thing that can make it harder to type yourself.
    Strychnine is all-natural,
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sil View Post
    I've been typed an ESTJ for several years now. I've never connected with any other type over ESTJ, but I've noticed there are a fair amount of discrepancies between ESTJ and me.
    What parts of ESTJ *do* you relate to most? (descriptions, letters, whatever works for you)

    I think 21lux makes a good point that we should not expect all parts of a type to fit us. They are generalizations after all. That said, you say it seems the discrepancies are with deeper parts.

    As for questions ...
    1) Do you make decisions based more on logic, ideas, and principles or on feelings, people, and social context?
    2) Do you take in information more through past personal experience, specific facts, and repetition or through new associations, connecting patterns, and broader context?

    And how strongly do you feel these distinctions? If you can, give us a percentage for how much you think you do these. For example, 75% logic and 25% feelings.
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  8. #8
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    I've posted excerpts of Was That Really Me?

    The bolded are things that apply to me. The italics are comments on sections.

    Section for Ne-doms:

    ENTPs and ENFPs have a passion for new ideas and especially enjoy the pursuit of possibilities in the world.They prefer what might be to what is, approach the outer world with trust and optimism, and see the environment as welcoming, safe, and exhilarating.They are bored by facts, details, and repetitive activities, especially those that are irrelevant to their current interests.However, an incoming fact may stimulate their intuition and lead to new theories or models.

    I am constantly cooking up new ideas. I tend to find more pleasure in just ruminating on the idea than actually acting it out-- although there is a crossroads point where I get pissed for not being proactive. Thinking about things for too long without ever acting on anything gets me really restless.

    I would consider myself a realistic optimist. Most people I know reject that and just call me a realist.

    I'm not bored by facts and details if they are interesting or add to my knowledge. I'd be bored if I don't see how they are relevant/applicable to the big picture.


    They may therefore ignore sensory data that might portend danger or take risks that others might avoid. As a rule, new challenges are more appealing to them than what is known and verified.They have an uncanny instinct for spotting trends and future developments, often before others are even mildly aware of them. Some may, in fact, predict future programs or outcomes and be told they are really “out in left field.” Months, sometimes years, later they may see those ideas come into their own.

    Bolded is truth. This is a large part of why many things are unfinished. I mentally finish them first, and then find myself too bored to follow through on the task.

    I'm not sure about ignoring sensory data. I don't see why that shouldn't be taken into consideration as part of the larger picture.

    Trends-- if I know enough about the field I see trends coming. If I don't know anything about the field (or I'm not interested in it), then no.


    Their enthusiasm for a current project can be so compelling that they may be oblivious to time and energy limitations, often ignoring their own and others’ needs to take breaks from the activity for food and rest. At an extreme, they may become so physically run down that they are forced to stop their work or risk serious illness.

    Nope. None of this. I'm a hardcore sp-dom, so I'm very aware of my physical state. Aware =/= overly concerned with or focused on. I'm not stockpiling medicines in my non-existent medicine cabinet.

    I am just very in tune with my physical self. I know what the feeling of "all systems functioning" is and I know when that's not happening.


    Interacting with other people and having opportunities to use their creativity in a flexible, open, exciting environment form the basis of what energizes Extraverted Intuitive types in the workplace. Whereas their Introverted Intuitive colleagues (INTJs and INFJs) want the highest degree of freedom to use their creativity in working independently, ENTPs and ENFPs want that same freedom to use their creativity in interaction with or as applied to other people.

    I like working with people more than not. I like work environments that offer me the opportunity to be both analytical and creative; to troubleshoot problems and then create solutions. Especially the underlined. I love nothing more than being tasked with a challenge others haven't yet found a solution to and trying to make an answer of my own.


    Extraverted Intuitive types report varying degrees of concern about whether others see them as having substance, stability, and depth.They can therefore overdo attention to facts or be somewhat defensive about their knowledge and use of facts and details.

    No. I never worry about whether or not others thing I have substance or depth. I'm not especially concerned with whether or not people perceive me as unique, individual, different, original, etc.

    I'm not defensive about facts either. Facts are facts...they didn't come from me and they won't change even if I'm not there, so I don't see the point getting worked up about them.

    I would rather be seen as capable, strong, competent, reliable, and a defender.


    An ENTP lawyer acknowledged that she often feels unprepared with data to support her legal arguments, so she makes sure she has at least a few facts she can bring forth at appropriate moments to convince others of her thoroughness. An ENFP teacher says she always overprepares for lectures, bringing enough material to fill twice the amount of time she actually has to present.

    I prefer to over-prepare than under prepare. Better to inundate someone with information than be caught with your pants down not knowing your stuff.

    I don't use facts as a means of convincing others of my own competence. It's more about proving the competency of the point I'm making.


    When a strongly held value or principle is involved, ENTPs and ENFPs will carefully collect important facts and details. However, people who disagree with their viewpoints may accuse them of overvaluing certain facts, which in turn may lead the ENTPs or ENFPs to doubt their own perceptions and judgments.

    The bolded can be true. When something is not right, I look to myself first to find the mistake.

    If I find I wasn't the one at fault, I default back to neutral.


    Less mature Extraverted Intuitive types may sometimes present themselves as “experts” about some factual area, eager to educate others about it.This can prove embarrassing if they try to impress a true authority in a particular field.

    No to this, although I've found I tend to speak authoritatively on subjects I know little about, sometimes making people think I know much more than I actually do. But if I meet someone who knows more than I do, I immediately take a learner position in the conversation. I don't try to impress people whose knowledge clearly outstrips my own in a particular field.



    An ENFP aptly described this when he said, “I think of myself as a high-stimulus person, and I enjoy having many things on the go at once. My ‘issue’ is knowing where to draw the line between so much to do that it becomes impossible and ‘just enough’ to keep the challenges interesting and attainable.” Both ENFPs and ENTPs mention taking on too much, but ENFPs seem particularly distressed by this tendency, often attributing it to their poor time management. Said one ENFP,“Too often, it is me not allowing enough time to finish a task or not leaving early enough to be on time.”

    Yes to everything. It's not as frequent as it used to be (I've curbed this habit with practice and vigilance), but my natural inclination is to take on a thousand projects and underestimate the amount of work each requires. Only to overwhelm myself.

    An important and frequent trigger for inferior Introverted Sensing is having to deal with a lot of details or attend to practical matters for long periods with no breaks. This is an especially effective provocation if the Extraverted Intuitive type’s efforts meet with failure.

    I'm pretty sure this would piss me off; I don't mind being in the thick of it, but it has to be in short, momentous bursts. If it lasted longer than a few days I'd say fuck it and take a break.


    Many young male and female ENTPs and ENFPs report becoming uncharacteristically quiet and reserved when they are out of character and find this in marked contrast to their usual openness and sociability. Like other young Extraverted types, they do not seem to find anything positive in moving to this Introverted approach, but are rather puzzled and surprised by it. “I become very quiet and reserved,” said an ENTP young man, “and I don’t talk to people like I normally do.” An ENFP young woman said, “Sometimes I withdraw from everyone, sit alone for hours, and just think. Let stuff stew in my head alone.”

    Not sure about this. I don't stew on things alone for hours in my head.

    If I am particularly comfortable, I will get very quiet and minimalist in my behavior. I tend to get this way with people I feel very comfortable with; I'll go from being talkative to lapsing into long silences where I am lost in thought about other things. Or just living in the moment.

    It's not often, but it happens.

    Eh, I doubt this is what the author was talking about but whatever.


    When effective dominant Introverted Sensing types describe the nuances of their internal sensory experiences, one can marvel at the exquisite, evocative images that emerge. When an Extraverted Intuitive type in the grip of inferior Introverted Sensing focuses on inner sensations and internal experiences, it often translates into exaggerated concern about physical “symptoms,” whose diagnostic meaning is always dire and extreme. In the grip of their inferior function, ENTPs and ENFPs frequently over-interpret real or imagined bodily sensations as indicative of illness.

    I'm a fucking badass at that bolded. All else does not apply.






    Section describing inferior Fi:


    One of the manifestations of any inferior function is diminished effectiveness in the use of the developed dominant function. For Extraverted Thinking types, there may be a loss of ability to think logically and take effective action, or an inability to recognize the relevance of logic in a situation. One ESTJ said, I bounce from task to task with no results. I have internal arguments with myself, but I can't come to any conclusion. And an ENTJ observed, The feeling that I am unappreciated becomes the central thing, and I can't consider anything else. An ENTJ said that she becomes disorganized and loses things. I'm late to meetings and miss deadlines, and I focus on non-priority activities and tasks. I procrastinate and do only what is due immediately. Others report being unable to think, having tunnel vision, and being easily fatigued at work. What they normally do very easily requires great effort. An ESTJ described being unable to organize the structure for a work assignment. An ENTJ felt powerless to influence future events significantly. Another reported that, when under great stress, he would lose the capacity for verbal expression and would have difficulty getting his words out. In general, there is an uncharacteristic reduction in productive work accompanied by a feeling of failure.

    In the initial stages of the process, ESTJs may lose access to their auxiliary Sensing, while ENTJs may lose access to their auxiliary Intuition. They seem to function only from the neck up, as one ENTJ described it, operating entirely out of their heads. This results in an exaggeration of their Thinking, which they and others experience as the excesses of their natural approach. It is an example of how a dominant process operates
    without the balancing effects of the auxiliary. As dominant and auxiliary functions continue to recede into the background, the qualities of inferior Introverted Feeling become manifested in hypersensitivity to inner states, outbursts of emotion, and a fear of feeling. For ESTJs, tertiary Intuition appears in the form of negative possibilities, and ENTJs tertiary Sensing emerges in the form of undeniable facts both serving to confirm their inner turmoil and fears of being unappreciated and unworthy. The comparison between dominant and inferior Introverted Feeling is shown in Table 2.

    Operating entirely out of my head. I know when I'm exhausted and at the end of my rope, I go into what I casually call "machine mode," where almost everything about my personality gets stripped away and I just become a human doing. It's an odd experience...emotions are gone, there's no room for others or an interest in anything except doing the steps needed to complete the task.

    Once the task is done I go back to myself. But while I'm in that mode of living I'm essentially a non-being. I don't mind it. It's like running on safe start. Life isn't as vivid, but things get done when they need to get done.



    Von Franz (1971) captures all three aspects of inferior Introverted Feeling (hypersensitivity to inner states, outbursts of emotion, and fear of feeling) in the following statement, which also describes the all-or-none, often one-sided expression of inferior Introverted Feeling in Extraverted Thinking types:

    Table 2
    Dominant and Inferior Expressions of Introverted Feeling
    As Dominant Function of As Inferior Function of

    The hidden introverted feeling of the extraverted thinking type establishes strong invisible loyalties. Such people are among the most faithful of all friends, even though they may only write at Christmas. They are absolutely faithful in their feelings, but one has to move towards it to get to know of its existence. . . . [But] unconscious and undeveloped feeling is barbaric and absolute, and therefore sometimes hidden destructive fanaticism suddenly bursts out of the extraverted thinking type. (p. 40)


    ISFPs and INFPs
    � Inner harmony
    � Economy of emotional expression
    � Acceptance of feeling as non-logical

    ESTJs and ENTJs
    � Hypersensitivity to inner states
    � Outbursts of emotion
    � Fear of feeling


    Hypersensitivity to Inner States

    Effective dominant Introverted Feeling types use a finely developed awareness of their inner values as a reliable guide for judging themselves and others. In the grip of inferior Introverted Feeling, Extraverted Thinking types become hypersensitive to their own and others emotions, often misinterpreting comments from others as personal criticism. In their dominant approach, they typically interpret objectively offered criticism by respected colleagues as an appropriate means to promote excellence. In the grip of their inferior Introverted Feeling, they may easily take offense and overreact to such criticism.

    Unaware of the Extraverted Thinking persons vulnerable altered condition, however, colleagues, family members, and friends may communicate criticism as directly as usual. Even mild negative comments may provoke hurt feelings when the Extraverted Thinking type is in this state. ESTJs and ENTJs report having difficulty acknowledging, even to themselves, but particularly to the person who has helped bring about the situation, that their feelings have been hurt. They may lash out at others instead, as the examples below illustrate. I feel that I am being criticized unfairly, said an ESTJ. I blame others for my own faults and find fault with others over nothing. I become demanding because I am in a panic about possibly missing deadlines. I watch the clock. I think lots of negative thoughts, put myself down, and feel that others dislike and reject me. My self-esteem about my abilities gets lower and lower. Note the illogical progression of his thoughts. I think I'm pretty confident about my abilities as a trainer, said an ENTJ. But when I've worked very hard preparing for a training session and am especially tired out, I am plagued with the thought that the trainees don't like me, that they like my colleagues better, especially if the colleague I'm teaching with is a Feeling type.

    I relate to the spiraling non-logic thought. Not the way it is described above, though. I don't lash out at others-- almost never. I also don't blame others. I am the first to blame myself when something goes wrong-- I review and see what aspects of a situation I had control over and how I could have influenced the outcome. I don't worry about things I can't control.

    So blaming others and lashing out isn't something I do.

    When I suffer the spiraling non-logic thought process, I'm very aware of it. I tend to indulge it and take it to ridiculous extremes that highlight how nonsensical the thought is. I was worried about moving without a job to a new town awhile back, so I went through the extreme "what ifs" in my head until I reached a "worst-worst outcome" scenario that was so crazy that it became hilarious. I'm not usually governed by the non-logical spiraling thought process just because it's a habit to recognize it for what it is any play it out in my head so that it no longer has any power.

    Also, fwiw, my logic and my emotions are constantly observing one another rather than feeding into one another. I observe my emotions at a distance more often than not.


    Another ENTJ described feeling like a victim persecuted, unappreciated, and used. I don't see things clearly and I can't seem to think. I take things personally and am hypersensitive. I will say something without thinking, then become defensive and feel threatened.
    An ESTJ made this observation: I find myself taking a martyr role, alone and unloved, totally unappreciated. Then I shut down. An ENTJ described being particularly sensitive to any signs of being excluded from important roles. When that happens, I feel that my contributions are not being valued. And another ENTJ described feeling isolated or excluded and having a sense that people don't respect me, especially people I respect.

    Nah. Not really. Worst thing that happens is I occasionally get into moods where I remember everyone is really a self-centered prick and you have to look out for yourself first if you want to get by okay.


    In a variation on this theme, some ESTJs and ENTJs describe situations in which they effectively apply their usual action-oriented, logical problem solving. But later (perhaps even years later), if they are in a vulnerable state, they will recall a specific incident and beat themselves up for not being conscious of other peoples feelings. One ESTJ recalled thinking, Why did I say that to Ellen at that party five years ago? How stupid and insensitive of me!
    Some Extraverted Thinking types are painfully aware of the dilemma they face in dealing with relationship issues within a task-oriented setting. Focusing on others feelings inhibits their ability to take effective Thinking action, though it prevents negative feedback from others about their lack of caring concern.

    I do this on occasion, but more as a way to keep myself humble. It helps to reflect on personal screw ups every once in awhile.


    Outbursts of Emotion

    Effective dominant Introverted Feeling types show an economy of emotional expression. They are typically quite selective and discriminating in revealing their deepest and most cherished values and feelings. Extraverted Thinking types in the grip of inferior Introverted Feeling lack control and discrimination when expressing their inner emotional states. However, their fear of having others witness their rejected, irrational selves strongly motivates them to stay in control if at all possible. They especially worry about losing control in public, particularly at work. Avoiding a public display often results in an even stronger outburst of affect at home, directed at family members, since the emotions have to be released somewhere. An ENTJ said, I feel lost and out of control. I know I am not myself, but I can't help it. I don't want company or to be touched. I want to be
    left alone and I want to escape. I will get a headache or shoulder ache and feel really tense. I feel like crying but try to hide it. I hide my feelings inside and push them down, and then become angry, depressed, and withdrawn, recalled an ESTJ.

    Absolutely to the bolded.

    Getting emotional with others doesn't resolve anything, so it's never a good idea. If I'm upset I figure my shit out on my own time in private.

    This drives my confirmed Fe using friends fucking nuts.


    Both ESTJs and ENTJs report sometimes feeling suddenly tearful for no apparent reason, and crying in private. However, if the worst happens and they lose control, they may explode in public. This may begin as expressions of intense anger about others incompetence but may quickly evolve into tearful recriminations about a lack of appreciation and recognition.
    In recalling one such incident, an ESTJ said, I am normally not an emotional person; at least I don't show my emotions. I am a very steady person externally. My outburst was quite unlike me. One ESTJ said she is more emotional and not calm I'm irritable, can easily snap at people. Another ESTJ woman commented, I get so emotional I can't stand myself.

    Yup. I'll get pissed about something and then add something to the effect of I don't know why I fucking bother to be of help. Fun times.



    Fear of Feeling

    Talking about innermost values, feelings, and concerns is quite difficult even for dominant Introverted Feeling types. Jung (1976a) observed that the very fact that thoughts can generally be expressed more intelligibly than feelings demands a more than ordinary descriptive or artistic ability before the real wealth of this feeling can be even approximately presented or communicated to the world (p. 388).

    Effective dominant Introverted Feeling types accept the nuances of feeling they experience as natural and welcome evidence of their own inner complexity. But feelings and emotions intruding into the consciousness of an Extraverted Thinking type who is in the grip of inferior Introverted Feeling are experienced as so alien and overwhelming that
    they are inexpressible.
    From a Thinking point of view, the eruption of illogical, uncontrolled, and disorderly feelings is like being at the mercy of strange and overwhelming forces that threaten a persons equilibrium, if not his or her whole existence. As a result, Extraverted Thinking types are rarely able to communicate their distress to others, often maintaining their typical controlled demeanor while fearing that they will lose control of their emotions. In extreme instances, they may be terrified that they are going crazy.

    Bolded, absolutely. I've realized ultimately you can't really share a feeling. So you're stuck with it by yourself. Words don't do strong feelings justice.


    To fend off the feared result, initial attempts involve maintaining cool and detached effectiveness and objectivity. Casual observers will not detect the intense inner battle for control. More careful observation, however, may reveal uncharacteristic silence, withdrawal, moodiness, or flat and depressed affect. Men and women of both types typically report becoming uncharacteristically quiet and withdrawn. An ESTJ described feeling a swirling in the pit of my stomach and a desperate attempt to figure out why and to define my reaction logically.

    Yup. All true.

    Because the Extraverted Thinking type has few resources for communicating what is going on inside, potential helpers may remain largely unaware of any distress, even when the person is in serious trouble. The despair, sense of isolation, and feeling of worthlessness may become so extreme that the person may become severely depressed, sometimes requiring medication or hospitalization. Acquaintances and colleagues may be surprised to learn that such an episode has occurred because until final control is lost, the ESTJ or ENTJ may appear fairly normal. I'm calm on the outside, in control, very logical, solve problems, yet it ties me up inside, said an ENTJ. This manifestation of the inferior is an exaggeration of the dominant Introverted Feeling types economy of emotional expression.

    Fucking blows when you try to communicate how internally fucked you feel with others. I explain my feelings too calmly and just get shrugs of "you can't feel that way, you aren't even showing it" in response.

    So yeah, definitely relate.


    Two Extraverted Thinking types described their experiences with their inferior functions in these ways after their episodes had run their course:
    I became overly sensitive and tried to cover it with biting sarcasm. My energy was focused inside and I felt shaky. I wanted to be alone. I put on a front of being a strong soldier, but it was really only a protective shell to hide my vulnerability. I was different in being very negative. Everything appeared bleak. I was disoriented and aggressive. I talked to myself more. I got emotional (angry or sad, tearful or despondent). In very bad cases, I even contemplated suicide.

    No. None of this.

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    Quote Originally Posted by estorm View Post
    What parts of ESTJ *do* you relate to most? (descriptions, letters, whatever works for you)

    I think 21lux makes a good point that we should not expect all parts of a type to fit us. They are generalizations after all. That said, you say it seems the discrepancies are with deeper parts.

    As for questions ...
    1) Do you make decisions based more on logic, ideas, and principles or on feelings, people, and social context?
    2) Do you take in information more through past personal experience, specific facts, and repetition or through new associations, connecting patterns, and broader context?

    And how strongly do you feel these distinctions? If you can, give us a percentage for how much you think you do these. For example, 75% logic and 25% feelings.
    Hmm...Inferior function descriptions mostly.

    If I go to this portrait site (yeah I know it's not perfect but I can't think of way to describe what a typical ESTJ is like): Portrait of an ESTJ

    They value competence and efficiency, and like to see quick results for their efforts.

    ESTJs are take-charge people. They have such a clear vision of the way that things should be, that they naturally step into leadership roles. They are self-confident and aggressive. They are extremely talented at devising systems and plans for action, and at being able to see what steps need to be taken to complete a specific task. They can sometimes be very demanding and critical, because they have such strongly held beliefs, and are likely to express themselves without reserve if they feel someone isn't meeting their standards. But at least their expressions can be taken at face-value, because the ESTJ is extremely straight-forward and honest.

    If they neglect their Feeling side, they may have a problem with fulfilling other's needs for intimacy, and may unknowingly hurt people's feelings by applying logic and reason to situations which demand more emotional sensitivity.


    1) Do you make decisions based more on logic, ideas, and principles or on feelings, people, and social context?

    A mixture. Basically whatever combo I need to get the job done.

    If I'm not being self-observant, though, I default to the logic and facts side.

    2) Do you take in information more through past personal experience, specific facts, and repetition or through new associations, connecting patterns, and broader context?

    Past personal experience, facts, connecting patterns, broader context.

    I tend to review facts, correlate facts with personal experiences, and then roll those out against a larger context which I build upon. Most of my larger context building gets done in my spare time when I'm idle.



    I'm a low extrovert but a definite extrovert.
    I'm probably 85% logic when dealing with the external world. Probably 60% when dealing with the internal one.
    Judging, about 80%. I'm more P if I have time to spare.

  10. #10
    This is a test. Sil's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by strychnine View Post
    Was going to suggest possibly ENFP but I think this rules that out - an ENFP has inferior Si and auxiliary Fi, as you know, so if you can relate strongly to inferior Fi and higher Si that would rule out ENFP.

    Maybe you just have a strong tertiary Ne. You might be in an Te-Ne loop, not saying you are but that's one thing that can make it harder to type yourself.
    Never heard of a Te-Ne loop. Was only aware of Si-Fi.

    If a Te-Ne loop manifests in having a lot of Ne, then yeah, that might explain it.
    Likes strychnine liked this post

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