It's been a year and I'm still stuck.

[luxmare]

Alright. I've been holding off on posting to a forum for a while now, since I'm a relatively private person, but over a year of self-reflection and searching and studying as left me in a rut, and I'm afraid I need some help. My previous draft was accidentally deleted, so I'm attempting to type this out all over again, and I'm pretty tired at the moment—please forgive me if there are mistakes here and there.

To briefly restate what I had written before: I'd tested as INFP, INFJ, and sometimes ISFP on various cognitive functions tests. After deciding to try self-reflection instead of relying on online tests, I've been trying to understand the functions. However, the more I try to wrap my head around them, the more puzzled I seem to get. I'd be much obliged if someone would help me identify the functions I use, as well as my MBTI type. I'm going to list some behavioral traits of mine down, which may or may not be relevant:

• My friends' well-being and happiness are of utmost priority. I could extend this to family and strangers, but I feel it's strongest with my friends. I have an extreme concern (perhaps even a fear) of being selfish and a burden to others, to the point where I actively avoid attracting any sort of attention to myself. I avoid presenting my personal achievements, I avoid expressing my emotions when I'm upset or depressed, and I try to avoid even just speaking in general. To be honest, I rarely ever speak unless someone else initiates conversation, because I feel like a burden otherwise. It's irrational, and very difficult to explain precisely through words, but the essence of it is this: if I were to be a burden to others, it would make them unhappy; so, to maintain their happiness, I hold back part of myself. However, I don't expect the same from others. In fact, I encourage them to express themselves freely and come to me with their emotional problems, because I want to support them the best I can. In this world of despair and unhappiness, I want them to be happy, and I see my purpose in life being to brighten the lives of others, if even just a little. This is what I believe to be either an unhealthy form of Fe, or a form of Fi in which my friends' happiness is what I value most, and I've had a lot of difficulty determining which.
• I firmly believe in individuality and independence—simply put, I have no desire to be controlled, and I have no desire to control or impose on others. People's jobs, choices of clothing, choice of friends—they should be determined by the heart of the individual, regardless of what others will think.
• I love collecting! All the possibilities, the knowledge that your collection will never be the same as someone else's—all of this makes the act of collecting very appealing to me. In fact, I loved playing Pokemon when I was younger for that very reason. When it comes to casual games, I'm also a huge fan of rhythm games (pretty devoted Love Live! player )! As for more serious gaming, Kingdom Hearts and FF are some of my absolute favorites. Wonderful storylines, characters, and gameplay.
• Currently, I'm in love with atmospheric music. Like this, for example: https://soundcloud.com/lilu-chan/nagi-no-asukara-ost-2-27-and?in=yurebe/sets/tk-flowering It sounds just beautiful, almost as if you can close your eyes and be transported to another world.
• I'm not all for thrills and exciting experiences. I've never been on a roller coaster, and honestly, I don't ever really plan on it. However, I do enjoy the occasional thrill, as long as it isn't too extreme.
• I draw digitally as a hobby, and I also create graphics. However, I don't usually draw using real-life references. Rather, I draw to express the feelings that I'm feeling at that moment, so the images are derived solely from my imagination. I'd imagine that's N > S, though feel free to express your thoughts.
• I'm always contemplating ideas in my head, constantly. And the ideas vary quite a bit. Most times, I wonder about my purpose in life, my reason for being here, if there even is one (I may possibly have slight existential depression), sometimes I play out potential conversations in my head. Heck, just a few days ago, I was getting deep about the purpose of religion while washing dishes.
• I mostly operate on a schedule. I eat at certain times, I do certain chores at certain times, and I get pretty upset if that routine is disturbed.
• I organize for efficiency, with as little clutter as possible. I only have two bookmarks on my browser, and it's been that way for as long as I can remember. When it comes to possessions, I'm very (perhaps too excessively) eager to get rid of unnecessary items as soon as possible, as I feel they only take up space.

I'm afraid I'm running out of time, so I think I'll stop here. If you'd like to know anything else, ask away! Help would be much appreciated !

And ah, I should probably mention that I'm only 15 years old, but I hope that doesn't stop you! Especially since I'm aware that most of the users here are much older than I am...

 

[PeaceBaby]

Welcome to the forum! fwiw I'm leaning to Fi, but get involved here at the forum, read through some threads and try to identify what POV you more readily "get" and find yourself nodding your head at.

 

[luxmare]

Okay, so after resting up and rereading my post, I see that I've made some errors here and there. A lot of thoughts also came rushing into my head earlier this morning, so I may as well add some more info and clear some things up, with the important things bolded as before:

I believe I worded the second bullet a bit too strongly. To be honest, I was actually thinking of my mother when I wrote that, since she's very pushy and forces me to do things for the sake of image, reputation, and things of that nature. For example, when we head out somewhere, she always insists on wearing clothing that will impress people, which I personally can't care less about. She's also constantly pushing me to go into the medical field and become a surgeon, saying it'll bring me lots of wealth and prestige—which, again, I'm not too concerned with. It also bothers me how she's seemingly trying to control my actions, rather than leave me to do my own thing. I'm not entirely sure as to whether this is relevant to MBTI or not, since I don't think anyone likes being controlled in such a manner, but I do think there's a clear difference in functions here. It could be that her Se or Fe are clashing with some of my own functions, though I'm not too sure. Anyhow, I'm not nearly as obsessed with the idea of independence as I seem in the original post. Anyone have any thoughts?

I also forgot to mention in the original post, but my main issue seems to be the distinction of Fe vs. Fi. The way I see my potential Fi manifest is through my view of people, and not necessarily through values or behavior. Instead of seeing people as groups, as I imagine Fe would, I see each person within the group as a unique individual—each with their own emotions, experiences, and thoughts—and I acknowledge that we each have our differences in opinion and whatnot. However, this is where I get a little caught up: from my understanding, Fi states that everyone should stick to their guns and be themselves, even if it should cause conflict with other group members. In contrast, Fe states that people should conform and make some sacrifices, so that the group can come to an agreement and be in harmony. However, my view is as follows: People shouldn't necessarily have to conform to anything. As long it doesn't cause harm to others, people should be allowed to be their individual selves. Of course, if they do cause harm in some way, they should try to consider those around them and alter their behavior accordingly, but I don't think anything as important as someone's personal views or values should be changed. Personally, what's most important is acting with tact—taking others' feelings into consideration. If it does no emotional harm, I'd say feel free!

As for Fe, I'll list some more miscellaneous things down since I remembered them this morning—emotionally, I'm usually very expressive. The degree of expression depends on who I'm with, of course. However, this only applies when I feel positive emotions. When I'm happy or excited, it's pretty visible. However, when I'm sad or upset, I do my best to hide it. This is sort of an extension to what I wrote in the previous paragraph—discussing my negative emotions with people would probably bring others down as well (I assume this because when others are sad, it affects my emotions pretty heavily also), and I'd hate to ruin others' happy moods. Now that I think it over, all of this does feel very Fe-like, but discussion is always welcome!

And another thing regarding Fe: I've always somehow felt very moved by large groups of people acting in unison. For example, an entire audience cheering together at a large concert or sports event. The idea that everyone is feeling the same emotions together, regardless of gender, race, or age—the idea that we're all acting together as humans, without any boundaries between us—sometimes it overwhelms me to tears. Would this possibly be an example of Fe?

Alright, moving on from Feeling. I'd like to also discuss something else that struck me this morning, which I think is pretty significant: After thinking everything over and reflecting, I can't help but feel like a Dominant Perceiver—perhaps an Intuitive Perceiver. Out of all of the 8 functions, the Intuitive and Feeling functions were the ones that I felt were most developed (not too certain about which ones, though). After pacing around and reflecting on it a bit more, I came to the realization that as much as I enjoy spending time with others, it's not where I gain the most satisfaction in my life. I realize that for the 16 or so hours that I'm awake every day, I spend most of my time in my head, with my ideas and thoughts—and that's where I feel most satisfied. I have friends that participate in group calls on Skype for several hours every day, and I only recently realized that I would never be capable of such a thing. I join every once in a while, stay for about an hour at most, and leave to do my own thing—play video games (usually story- or character-driven), write, or do things that stimulate my mind creatively or meaningfully. And, it's obvious, but I've also read that Dominant Judging types tend to be a little more "judging" toward the world—not necessarily in a bad way, but they have a certain way they'd like something to be, or they have some internal ideal that they "judge" the world with. This can also mean that they're more opinionated in certain circumstances, though that's disputable. However, it's different for me. Perceptions come before judgments, and there are times when perceiving the world is the only thing I'm doing at the moment, without any judgments at all. I feel this is why it's particularly difficult for me to form opinions on most things; I can easily understand or perceive the opinions of both sides, even without them expressing arguments. They don't have to back up their views with any information—it's almost as if I can shift my perspective completely, allowing me to understand their emotions and arguments intuitively, and feel them as my own emotions and arguments. Of course, I'm not always completely accurate—I know intuition isn't as magical and supernatural as some claim it to be—but it's something that happens, and I can understand why people would think of it that way.

I'll add in one more thing before I wrap this up: sometimes, with people who are close to me, I feel as if I can see deeply into their personality, and perceive things that they themselves may not even know. I know, it sounds pretty arrogant, but I honestly do feel that way. I have a friend, and over the years, I feel as if she's changing into someone she's not. She's made new friends, whom I also know fairly well, and I can see many of their values reflected in her. They're fairly older than her, and I get the feeling that she's subconsciously trying to change because she respects them, and wants to fit in with them. She's never approached me with the topic, and I don't plan on approaching her with it either, but I do sense it. This resonance also happens when I hear someone say something, and I can immediately understand the underlying meaning or purpose behind it. For example, the other day, I heard my mother giving my sister a lot of compliments out of the blue, like, "You're so beautiful!" or "You're so smart!". Now, up until a couple of years ago, they never had the best relationship—my mother would get frustrated often and mistreat my sister often. So when I heard those compliments, I could feel her immense sense of guilt in those words, and I somehow knew she was trying to deal with that guilt by becoming closer to her and renewing their relation.

Based on these reflections so far, I'm leaning toward something like Ni-Fe, which would imply INFJ, but feel free to discuss and comment! And [MENTION=5999]PeaceBaby[/MENTION], thank you for the reply! I'll be sure to browse through the forums some more.

 

[RobinSkye]

ISFJ, or possibly a really unusual INFJ.

 

[Mal12345]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Self-defeating_personality_disorder

Self-defeating personality disorder is:

A) A pervasive pattern of self-defeating behavior, beginning by early adulthood and present in a variety of contexts. The person may often avoid or undermine pleasurable experiences, be drawn to situations or relationships in which they will suffer, and prevent others from helping them, as indicated by at least five of the following:

chooses people and situations that lead to disappointment, failure, or mistreatment even when better options are clearly available

rejects or renders ineffective the attempts of others to help them

following positive personal events (e.g., new achievement), responds with depression, guilt, or a behavior that produces pain (e.g., an accident)

incites angry or rejecting responses from others and then feels hurt, defeated, or humiliated (e.g., makes fun of spouse in public, provoking an angry retort, then feels devastated)

rejects opportunities for pleasure, or is reluctant to acknowledge enjoying themself (despite having adequate social skills and the capacity for pleasure)

fails to accomplish tasks crucial to their personal objectives despite demonstrated ability to do so, e.g., helps fellow students write papers, but is unable to write their own

is uninterested in or rejects people who consistently treat them well

engages in excessive self-sacrifice that is unsolicited by the intended recipients of the sacrifice

B) The behaviors in A do not occur exclusively in response to, or in anticipation of, being physically, sexually, or psychologically abused.
C) The behaviors in A do not occur only when the person is depressed.

 

[Mal12345]

ISFJ, or possibly a really unusual INFJ.

"Perceptions come before judgments, and there are times when perceiving the world is the only thing I'm doing at the moment, without any judgments at all." Try INFP.

 

[luxmare]

ISFJ, or possibly a really unusual INFJ.

"Perceptions come before judgments, and there are times when perceiving the world is the only thing I'm doing at the moment, without any judgments at all." Try INFP.

May I ask why both of you think that? Some elaboration would be appreciated. And [MENTION=13589]Mal12345[/MENTION] , I searched up some information on SDPD, but I don't really identify with most of the symptoms. Thank you, though.

By the by, I should mention that while I'm still fairly new to Enneagram theory, I'd say I'm a 459, and though I'm not too confident, it might affect things a bit.

 

[Mal12345]

May I ask why both of you think that? Some elaboration would be appreciated. And [MENTION=13589]Mal12345[/MENTION] , I searched up some information on SDPD, but I don't really identify with most of the symptoms. Thank you, though.

By the by, I should mention that while I'm still fairly new to Enneagram theory, I'd say I'm a 459, and though I'm not too confident, it might affect things a bit.

It's true that this paragraph from your op...

"My friends' well-being and happiness are of utmost priority. I could extend this to family and strangers, but I feel it's strongest with my friends. I have an extreme concern (perhaps even a fear) of being selfish and a burden to others, to the point where I actively avoid attracting any sort of attention to myself. I avoid presenting my personal achievements, I avoid expressing my emotions when I'm upset or depressed, and I try to avoid even just speaking in general. To be honest, I rarely ever speak unless someone else initiates conversation, because I feel like a burden otherwise. It's irrational, and very difficult to explain precisely through words, but the essence of it is this: if I were to be a burden to others, it would make them unhappy; so, to maintain their happiness, I hold back part of myself. However, I don't expect the same from others. In fact, I encourage them to express themselves freely and come to me with their emotional problems, because I want to support them the best I can. In this world of despair and unhappiness, I want them to be happy, and I see my purpose in life being to brighten the lives of others, if even just a little. This is what I believe to be either an unhealthy form of Fe, or a form of Fi in which my friends' happiness is what I value most, and I've had a lot of difficulty determining which."

...doesn't contain within it all the traits of the Self-Defeating Personality Disorder. But it looked promising. And I am a firm believer in focusing on things that need to be worked on, such as anxiety disorders and the like, versus spending all one's time researching these four letters.

- - - Updated - - -

May I ask why both of you think that? Some elaboration would be appreciated. And [MENTION=13589]Mal12345[/MENTION] , I searched up some information on SDPD, but I don't really identify with most of the symptoms. Thank you, though.

By the by, I should mention that while I'm still fairly new to Enneagram theory, I'd say I'm a 459, and though I'm not too confident, it might affect things a bit.

459 and 549 are the most common tritypes for the INTP type. I'm not saying it's true for you, only that it's probably true statistically speaking.