My friend may not be ESFJ - possibly type 8

[HongDou]

So I have this friend who's been neighbors with my family friends for the past 7 years, and probably two years ago I had her take the MBTI/Enneagram tests. She got ESFJ 1w2 sx/so which was a really unique typing but it made enough sense for me to see it. later i laid out the 1 description for her but she said it didn't sound like her at all - she was particularly averse to the word "perfect" which probably wasn't the best word to use. But she came to visit this summer and I started wondering whether she may be an 1 or not from the conversations we had (and consequently, probably not ESFJ either).

Here are some of her stand-out qualities:

- once she makes a plan she's going to make sure it happens, she hates when people flake out or get in the way
- personable, friendly, energetic, big presence (I'm 100% sure she's an extrovert and she knows it too)
- she's perfectly fine with instigating fights, if someone hits her she'll with hitting back twice as hard even if she knows it's petty
- likes relationship stability, she's been with her boyfriend for 3 years and if they ever broke up she says she still would rather be with one stable person rather than trying out a variety of people
- really driven, wants to make something of herself since her parents were really strict with her about money
- can't stand laziness or sensitivity in other people, hates when people need their own special accommodations
- hates when people cut or get cut slack
- loves to try new things - food, outdoor activities, games, etc
- enjoys engaging her childlike side, playing imaginary or video games or hide & seek and such
- doesn't like talking about social issues with others when she knows she'll disagree with them (she's openly stated she likes things like stereotypes), she'd rather people just let her be rather than try to persuade her to believe something else because she knows she'll get mad otherwise
- she'd rather "let love happen" rather than search for it
- she likes to do nice gestures for others, she cooked for my family when she was staying with us and she likes to make arts & crafts for her loved ones, she and her boyfriend send long love letter texts to each other every night before bed
- has a physically abusive relationship with her father but does NOT want other people getting involved, she punched her now ex-friend in the face for calling the police on her parents after she vented to her about them
- likes partying and going crazy with others (she enjoys ding-dong-ditching and TPing others houses and other kinds of button pushing)
- mildly concerned about facebook likes
- as one of my family friends once said "she SCREAMS HER PROBLEMS TO THE HEAVENS!"
- she said she's more extroverted but doesn't really care for the limelight, while her boyfriend is socially introverted but LOVES attention
- at the end of her senior year she went up to everyone she hated and told them why they were awful

hmm that's all i can think of right now @EJCC i'd appreciate your thoughts especially since if she's a possible 8 she's probably on the ESTx axis

[EJCC]

TBH she sounds more cp6w7 than 8, to me. Mostly because of this:

- doesn't like talking about social issues with others when she knows she'll disagree with them (she's openly stated she likes things like stereotypes), she'd rather people just let her be rather than try to persuade her to believe something else because she knows she'll get mad otherwise

I'm not sure if I can imagine an 8 using that logic ("I won't talk to this person about a thing I care about, because I don't want to get mad"). I think one of my roommates is an 8, and her logic is usually "If this person needs to feel my rage, then they will feel it". Not that she can't/won't hold her anger in, sometimes, but that she has absolutely NO shame about her anger.

I could probably(?) see her being an 8-fix, but not core 8. Also 3-fix and sp-last. No idea about MBTI, except that she seems VERY extroverted.

[HongDou]

TBH she sounds more cp6w7 than 8, to me. Mostly because of this:

I'm not sure if I can imagine an 8 using that logic ("I won't talk to this person about a thing I care about, because I don't want to get mad").

Oooh, interesting! I never considered cp6w7 before, but now that you brought it up I could totally see it. I'll have to think about it more. But what you said is true, because the reason she subdues that anger in the first place is she doesn't want it to undermine her relationships. I actually linked her the 8 profile before this thread she said it sounded right but then probably a lot of cp6w7s relate to 8 in some way. I definitely think though she has 8 influence even if it's just a fix although it can be hard to tell with a cp6. It's like having a heavy wing in a different triad and trying to figure out whether it's your fix or just your wing type.

I think one of my roommates is an 8, and her logic is usually "If this person needs to feel my rage, then they will feel it". Not that she can't/won't hold her anger in, sometimes, but that she has absolutely NO shame about her anger.

Hmm, but this is also pretty true for her too. Among our friends we all openly define her as the angriest one most in touch with her rage and she wears it like a badge haha. I don't know if she is aware of when others need to feel her rage but she has no problem making it known to them. One time when our INFJ friend (self identifies as 2w3 but it seems off to me) was on his way to clean the neighbors' pool she decided it'd be a fun prank to hide in a bush and pop out to scare him. When it happened he jumped and took a step back, and for the record he has a history of being a little oversensitive in the moment, then got angry at her and decided to go up to her and decided to smack her arm or something. When he stormed off she followed him saying it was a joke and she was sorry, but when he slammed the door on her fingers (she's the pitcher for her softball team) that's when she let the anger out. She got upset and yelled at him saying that it was a joke and he didn't have any common sense doing what he did, and when he retorted that he had more common sense than she did she check-punched him in the face.

Possibly another point for 6w7, but when we were talking this summer she told me she started letting her rage loose back in middle school in her math class. A group of kids would make comments about how she was stupid because she didn't know the stuff they did, and eventually towards the end of the year she stood up and started yelling at them all for a solid 30 minutes or something. Apparently the teacher and the rest of the class had to leave the room or something lol. She told me then that's when she started to love flexing her anger muscles and putting people in their place.

Also 3-fix and sp-last.

What pointed you to 3-fix? I could see her on the 2/3 axis.

No idea about MBTI, except that she seems VERY extroverted.

With MBTI I'm pretty sure she's ESxx at the very least. Sometimes I think she could be Se-oriented but she's also so organized and bent on planning and control and stuff she seems like a clear-cut J going by the plain 4 letter theory. Maybe she actually is ESFJ huh? A counterphobic 6w7 ESFJ sounds very interesting but hey she's interesting as a person so it might fit.

[HongDou]

@Showbread (ESFJ) or @Hard (ExFJ and gut triad) if you guys could maybe offer some insight that'd be great.

@Kas and @Kyubey too just because hehe.

[Kyubey]

Perhaps she could be an ESFP who's really in touch with her tertiary Te? Some of the points sounded really Se and Fi. I don't normally associate a lot of "J" with ESFP but cp6w7 sounds slightly more ESFP to me. She doesn't seem very ESTP in the points mentioned. Perhaps the anger explosions are Te with some Se impulse?
Assuming she's around 20 she could be more in touch with her Te at this point in her life which is why she might give off an 8 or TJ feel.
Also some Fi with going up to people and telling them why they were awful.
My guess is ESFP but I could definitely see ESxJ as well.
For enneagram, I thought of 7w6 rather than 6w7. I just felt more 7 than 6...

For comparisons she reminds me a lot of an ENTJ friend of mine but you did mention you were sure she was an ESxx type.
I have an ESFJ friend who would never go up to people and tell them why she hated them or punch a friend for calling the police on her dad unless a lot of other people were doing it. She's really concerned on how she looks to others and doesn't go on anger outbursts in public but mainly complains about it later with several of her close friends. Not that she doesn't have any independence whatsoever, she is just heavily influenced by those around her. While I noticed Fe users tend to have well developed Fi and vice versa, I think she prefers Fi>Fe. I also couldn't find many Si examples.

I'll try to find more examples later but that's the only one coming to mind right now.

Edit: Ahhh never mind she could definitely be an ESTP as well.

[Kas]

I could actually see the 1, but in a tritype and not as a core. Maybe not perfectionist but...

once she makes a plan she's going to make sure it happens, she hates when people flake out or get in the way

it sounds pretty 1 maybe a bit 3

I agree that 6w7 sounds likely. 6w7 can appear similar to 8s as you wrote- straight-forward and strong. Part of this descriptons sounds like a more extroverted and social version of my ESTJ friend who is 613 and I think they could have same tritype. So I think your friend may be a 613 or 631 (rather the second). I can see some 2 behaviour but maybe it's 2 as a wing...

Oh and if it's about MBTI I think ESFJ is most likely. She sounds like J type and Fe user.

[burymecloser]

TBH she sounds more cp6w7 than 8, to me

I hadn't thought of that, but it makes a lot of sense.

Perhaps she could be an ESFP who's really in touch with her tertiary Te? Some of the points sounded really Se and Fi.

+1, this was my thinking, too. Your friend doesn't sound like a Fe-dom.

Oh and if it's about MBTI I think ESFJ is most likely. She sounds like J type and Fe user.

???
She sounds very Fi/Te to me. Fe-doms care what others think, agonize over offending people, and are seldom rude to anyone but their closest acquaintances and worst enemies.

- she's perfectly fine with instigating fights, if someone hits her she'll with hitting back twice as hard even if she knows it's petty
- can't stand laziness or sensitivity in other people, hates when people need their own special accommodations
- hates when people cut or get cut slack
- doesn't like talking about social issues with others when she knows she'll disagree with them (she's openly stated she likes things like stereotypes), she'd rather people just let her be rather than try to persuade her to believe something else because she knows she'll get mad otherwise
- as one of my family friends once said "she SCREAMS HER PROBLEMS TO THE HEAVENS!"
- at the end of her senior year she went up to everyone she hated and told them why they were awful

That seems very Fi to me, I think your friend is an ESFP.

[senza tema]

This description sounds like @Codex to me ... ESTJ, unsure about enneatype.

Actually, could apply to my mom too, who is an ESTJ 2w1.

[Hard]

ESFJ sounds accurate. Insofar as I don't see any reasons to disagree with that assessment.

She is not an 8, there's just no way. I see her as either a 3w4, or a 6w7. I'm not entirely sure which and based off this I don't think I could sort it out. Though I lean to 6w7 a bit more since she doesn't seem to thrive or need much attention in the way 3's do. Further, I don't get much of an image conscious vibe from what you wrote.

[Hard]

She sounds very Fi/Te to me. Fe-doms care what others think, agonize over offending people, and are seldom rude to anyone but their closest acquaintances and worst enemies.

This is an Fe stereotype. I can see her as an Fe dom. Te is possible, but less likely based off what I read.

Fe doms can be VERY rude, trust me. I am one.