Aye(!) need some help finding my Ennea Type

[Boogie man]

G'day everyone,

I hate to tell you this, but I find myself unable to type my Enneagram type accurately. And I could use an outsiders' perspective.

The Enneagram isn't something new to me; in fact, I own a copy of Personality Types from R&H by which I would type myself as a 4. While I relate quite a deal to this type, I just cant find my peace of mind typing as a 4. It doesn't seem to hit home quite hard enough.

Anyway, I'mma going to start answering this neat lil' questionnaire I found (credit to Sanjuro).
(answers in the quotes)

Describe yourself--
What's it like to be you?

Great I suppose, and awful at the same time?
I struggle a great deal with 'finding myself', and I have been since as far back as I can remember. Always looking for some idea and archetype that could represent me, in order to finally understand myself. No wonder I eventually found the enneagram.
Apart from that I'm quite sociable, friendly, funny, doubtful and volatile. With a big "I don't give a f**k" -air about me; I don't do shame.

What have others said about you?

People tend to complement me on my looks (yeah baby!), me being sociable (with anyone -and that for my age!-), my warm and gregarious energy and my take-charge ability in dire times.
On the other side of the coin, people have told me that I can be very hesitating, nonchalant, unpredictable and that they have a hard time reading me.

What do you think of yourself?

Pretty much the sum of the answers above. Though I hate how self-conscious I can get. I'm always aware of the public's eye, as if I'm constantly needing to be more, better, ...

What are the issues you've dealt with in life? List some recurrent themes, and tell us a little about each one.

Hmm, let's see..
One of the biggest issues I've struggled with might actually seem like the stupidest one; I still can't let go of the feelings I had (have?) for a girl I went to school with for over 6 years. Mainly because she made it clear to me that the feelings weren't one sided, but I just couldn't accept her affection towards me. I felt that whatever she might've been feeling at the time, was only towards her interpretation of my projection of my image. And thus, not real enough. So freakin' lame.
Throughout highschool (in my country from age 12 - 18) I struggled quite a bit with social anxiety, even though I love letting go and doing whatever I feel like doing. It felt so stifling, I didn't want to be stuck with it for the rest of my life. So I became angry, at society for making me self-conscious (hey, I never claimed to be very rational at highschool age), and at myself for allowing this to happen. And so I forced myself to reach out to people and be more assertive, which payed off nicely. I'm back to being the self-conscious but social anxiety free person I was before highschool.
The last struggle is/has been work/school. I hate it. Just can't (won't?) do it. And I'm still figuring out a way to maintain comfort with the least amount of social slavery committed. I don't know why I feel this way, but it's something every cell in my body works against.

You're not good at everything--
What personality traits and/or ways of being are impossible for you to adopt?

Frankly, I feel as if most if not all of em are doable for me. There isn't one I couldn't ever adopt.
Except for maybe, hmm, 'selling out'? Whatever that means. It's very subjective isn't it? For me, 'selling out' means going against the nature of your being. I don't think I would feel fine selling mortgages to folks, though I don't think it's impossible for me. Never say never

What are qualities you'd like to have, but can't seem to develop?

Ha! Great question Dedication, discipline, the ability to put aside the 'mood of the moment'.

Why have you left friends and other relationships in the past and/or why have they left you?

Boredom mainly, if I'm not passionately into you, then we're not going anywhere. No matter how polite I'm being.
That and friends who are too scared to stand up for/against you are no good friends, so fck em.

Which types do you identify with most?

4, 6, 7 mainly.

How do you relate to these types?

4; the longing, the idealization of ideals (lol?), the feeling like I'm unworthy of love (yay...), the self-consciousness, the need to discover myself
6; the doubt, the sociability, the volatility (same for 4 really), the hesitation
7; the sense for adventure, love fun (but who doesn't?), the need for distractions, the shamelessness, the high self-esteem (though it tends to plummet deep from time to time)
And probably some more I forgot...

How do you NOT relate to them?

4; I'm not all that aware of my emotionality, nor am I burdened by shame or self-loathing, I look too upbeat and approachable (for how much that accounts to typing anyone)
6; no worst-case scenario thinking, no panicking, no ask-a-friend, no trust issues
7; not assertive enough, too hesitating, too reflective

Which types are least like you?

1, 5

Why specifically do you not relate to these types?

They're too cold and calculated. Do not relate one bit to that.
And type 1 is way too self-controlled. I like to let go, especially on the anger part -> I need to let it all out.

What points (if any) DO you relate to?

1; the sense for idealism, the self-righteousness (though I hate it in others -the irony)
5; I like being knowledgeable and capable

They claim enneagram type is a hidden love need. What are your attitudes toward finding love?

I either fall in love instantly, or I don't. Love on first sight. But then...
I tend to hesitate and doubt, I try to get their attention by being.. more me to them than to others, by being more intense. Not easy though, the self-consciousness kicks in real hard here.
And I don't get over past loves. Ever. For better and worse.

What is the message your superego tells you?

<< You have all these dreams, these ideal - you -'s, and yet here you sit, doing nothing at all about them. You're not capable enough, you never will be and you know it. You're not.. enough.>>

Determine your ego ideal--the way you strive to be and want others to perceive you. (Note, you may be consciously aware of failing at this, and you will be hard on yourself if you do. If someone else tells you you're NOT this way, it may make you feel hurt, violated, or angry.)

Which of the following ideals resonate with you the most, and why? Rank them.

1- to be loving and benevolent
2- to be powerful, strong, unassailable.
3- to be accomplished and successful
4- to be sensitive, original, unique, and creative
5- to be knowledgeable
6- to be a lovable person
7- to be "okay", having it together
8- to be devoted and loyal to a person or cause
9- to strive to become/behave like a good person

Why to be loving and benevolent? Because it comes from a strong place; from a warm, open and generous heart that isn't afraid of getting rejected. A powerful philanthropist.
It's what I'm striving to be.

Determine your "felt sense" of life. To do this it may help to look at how you perceive events. Another way to do this is to look back at your childhood and think of all the things your parents did to you. How did you/do you feel about these events?

- I feel imperfect, not (good) enough
- I've been sensitive to rejection

Core fears. You may have been aware of these fears even as a very small child, before anyone did anything to influence it. You'd be mortified to be in this position or have others perceive you this way.

- Rejection, being needy, and not being loved
- Failure

Ha! It's sounds like I'm afraid of not being liked. That's not quite the case. I only care about rejection etc. with those I'm interested in - in more than just 'casual'. Anyone else can dislike me, or even hate me, I won't care. Though they usually don't

There.
Done.
Phew, that took a while.

 

[Southern Kross]

Sounds like 7w6 to me. Maybe So/Sx.

You're not a Kiwi, are you?

 

[Kullervo]

Sounds like 7w6 to me. Maybe So/Sx.

You're not a Kiwi, are you?

"G'day" is about as stereotypically Australian an expression as there is...

 

[Southern Kross]

"G'day" is about as stereotypically Australian an expression as there is...

And NZ.

"Aye" is more Kiwi, anyway.

 

[Kullervo]

And NZ.

"Aye" is more Kiwi, anyway.

I have never had anyone say "G'day" to me except when i've visited Australia or talked to Australian expats. As for "Aye", even in the South where Scottish influence is high, I have only heard it very occasionally, generally from guys from farming backgrounds who speak in quite a different way to me.

Anyway I am diverting the thread, sorry OP.

 

[Boogie man]

Sounds like 7w6 to me. Maybe So/Sx.

You're not a Kiwi, are you?

Haha, no I'm not Kiwi or Australian.
I'm Belgian and English isn't my native tongue so I just use whatever sounds good to me in the moment. I love variety.

About the 7w6 suggestion, could you explain why? I've considered it before but I seem to be too hesitating & self-conscious to be one.

 

[Qloshae]

The Enneagram isn't something new to me; in fact, I own a copy of Personality Types from R&H by which I would type myself as a 4. While I relate quite a deal to this type, I just cant find my peace of mind typing as a 4. It doesn't seem to hit home quite hard enough.

This is kinda funny, look at this one (one of the first things he said was regarding always feeling different):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z1zu9yh0C9U

However, I recommend what Mario said (who is a type 8 and an Enneagram teacher), the wings add an unnecessary complexity - at least start by just finding the core type. I myself don't even believe in the wings anymore (tho I recognize that a 5 could move more towards 4 or 6).

The main thing about the Enneagram is that you don't have to fit any type perfectly, it is about which one you generally use, the Enneagram is a map.
I am sure you know that already so I'll leave it at that.

What I myself did was to look at each type, research them and write down or at least think of why I can't be that type.

Once you eliminate the impossible, whatever remains, no matter how improbable, must be the truth.

Social Style
EnneagramWork - Defense Systems

 

[kyuuei]

I suck at typing people--but you're definitely not an 8 if that helps at all.

 

[Boogie man]

This is kinda funny, look at this one (one of the first things he said was regarding always feeling different):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z1zu9yh0C9U

However, I recommend what Mario said (who is a type 8 and an Enneagram teacher), the wings add an unnecessary complexity - at least start by just finding the core type. I myself don't even believe in the wings anymore (tho I recognize that a 5 could move more towards 4 or 6).

The main thing about the Enneagram is that you don't have to fit any type perfectly, it is about which one you generally use, the Enneagram is a map.
I am sure you know that already so I'll leave it at that.

What I myself did was to look at each type, research them and write down or at least think of why I can't be that type.


Social Style
EnneagramWork - Defense Systems

Yeah, the wings are secondary to the core type. I definitely agree with that. Though, from what I've observed, there is some merit to them. They give the dominant type an extra flavor, a different style in dealing with problems. But then, there isn't much to support the theory that type 5 has to have either 4 or 6 as a wing, and no other. So yeah, I'm not going to base my typing on a wing. Core type comes first.

Whenever I try narrowing down my type, I find myself either with too many remaining, or with none remaining at all. My criteria are either too vague or too narrow Though it seems the remaining ones tend to be 4 and 7. The sad and the happy style. Sometimes another type comes along, depending on which criteria I'm focusing on the most.
If bi-type existed, instead of tritype, 4-7 I'd be But then I still wouldn't know the underlying dominant strategy

I suck at typing people--but you're definitely not an 8 if that helps at all.

Well, you don't suck at knowing whether I would be an 8 or not, cause you're right on the money!

 

[Qloshae]

Well, you don't suck at knowing whether I would be an 8 or not, cause you're right on the money!

Why don't we start here to check your view and understanding of the Enneagram - why are you not an 8?

 

[kyuuei]

Well, you don't suck at knowing whether I would be an 8 or not, cause you're right on the money!

One down, 7 to go!

 

[Haven]

You didn't say much about about being a 2, but this bit:

1- to be loving and benevolent

Why to be loving and benevolent? Because it comes from a strong place; from a warm, open and generous heart that isn't afraid of getting rejected. A powerful philanthropist.

Sounds a lot like a 2, probably 2w3

 

[Boogie man]

Why don't we start here to check your view and understanding of the Enneagram - why are you not an 8?

All right. I'm not an 8 because I really don't feel the need to control my environment as much; I'm more of a laisser-faire kind of guy, I don't seem to possess the 8's control issues.
I'm not all that confrontational either, though it does seem impossible for me to back down in interpersonal conflict. My first instinct to problems is not to face them head-on, but rather to avoid them altogether if possible. If not, I'll still try to go for the path of least resistance. I will get impatient and frustrated if these alternatives don't work.
Type 8 also seems to have some issues trusting others when it comes to anything that could expose their weaknesses. I don't seem to have any problem with either trust or showing weakness. Even if I'm not flaunting my flaws everywhere, ask and I'll probably be willing to share. (If I can think of any )
Overall, I'd rather have someone else take the lead while I'll see how I can fill in the gaps in his/her tactics.

These are the biggest reasons I can think of atm.

One down, 7 to go!

Hells yeah!

You didn't say much about about being a 2, but this bit:



Sounds a lot like a 2, probably 2w3

Yes, I thought of that too while I was writing that.
The reason I didn't mention type 2 was because I think the chance of me being type 2 is quite small as I am more consciously self-centered -for better and worse- than I am altruistic.
Especially when I feel like I'm going to a less healthy place, instead of trying harder for others, like type 2, I focus more and more on how I am experiencing my problems.

 

[Qloshae]

All right. I'm not an 8 because I really don't feel the need to control my environment as much; I'm more of a laisser-faire kind of guy, I don't seem to possess the 8's control issues.
I'm not all that confrontational either, though it does seem impossible for me to back down in interpersonal conflict. My first instinct to problems is not to face them head-on, but rather to avoid them altogether if possible. If not, I'll still try to go for the path of least resistance. I will get impatient and frustrated if these alternatives don't work.
Type 8 also seems to have some issues trusting others when it comes to anything that could expose their weaknesses. I don't seem to have any problem with either trust or showing weakness. Even if I'm not flaunting my flaws everywhere, ask and I'll probably be willing to share. (If I can think of any )
Overall, I'd rather have someone else take the lead while I'll see how I can fill in the gaps in his/her tactics.

These are the biggest reasons I can think of atm.

Well, unlike what some sources say, type 8s are not controlling, they seek to be self-controlling.
A type 8 is that person you may have spent annoying for an entire day and they kept holding in their anger at you until they finally couldn't anymore.
A type 8 explained it as "to become angry is to lose control, therefor we try not to".
When unhealthy they become more paranoid and revenge seeking and also likely controlling (honestly tho, I think unhealthy type 1s are the most controlling as they will burn you alive if you don't follow their exact view of how to do something).

In contrast, me as a withdrawn type for example when my friends made a joke that gave me a deep sense of shame, I left early and didn't talk to them for some time.
My natural reaction is to disappear when things get tough.
8s in contrast... I mean, when we were in Falun in the winter a few years back, a friend of mine got driven over in the hill as people were sliding down and got knocked out. Everyone froze and became shocked except my type 8 friend who instead started directing people to do different tasks. At their best, 8s make extremely good leaders I'd say, in a very self-controlled way. 8s are good in crisis situations I suppose where things happen fast as they feel a deep need to not lose control.

Generally tho it seems like you know what you are talking about, not like some who think certain types are better than others.
What you described seemed to be withdrawn or generally one of the conflict avoidant types, which is 2, 7 and 9: Enneagram Harmonics
Possibly also withdrawn: Social Style
Withdrawn types are known to physically and/or emotionally withdraw which if you identify with you'd probably feel a certain degree of belonging with that category.

Enneagram leans a lot on the person in question tho, but you don't really strike me as a type 4, tho I have had a generally bad experience with type 4s so I wouldn't draw any conclusions based on that.

Maybe you should write up which of each category you agree with the most,
Heart, Head, Gut
Reactive, Positive Outlook, Competency Harmonic
Assertive, Compliant, Withdrawn

As you identify with the MBTI type of ENFP, type 7 wouldn't be far off as type 7s avoid pain by filling their life with a large variety of experiences.
Then again, I put as much faith in MBTI as in Astrology, but what makes you identify with ENFP may still be what makes you a 7.

 

[Boogie man]

Well, unlike what some sources say, type 8s are not controlling, they seek to be self-controlling.
A type 8 is that person you may have spent annoying for an entire day and they kept holding in their anger at you until they finally couldn't anymore.
A type 8 explained it as "to become angry is to lose control, therefor we try not to".
When unhealthy they become more paranoid and revenge seeking and also likely controlling (honestly tho, I think unhealthy type 1s are the most controlling as they will burn you alive if you don't follow their exact view of how to do something).

In contrast, me as a withdrawn type for example when my friends made a joke that gave me a deep sense of shame, I left early and didn't talk to them for some time.
My natural reaction is to disappear when things get tough.
8s in contrast... I mean, when we were in Falun in the winter a few years back, a friend of mine got driven over in the hill as people were sliding down and got knocked out. Everyone froze and became shocked except my type 8 friend who instead started directing people to do different tasks. At their best, 8s make extremely good leaders I'd say, in a very self-controlled way. 8s are good in crisis situations I suppose where things happen fast as they feel a deep need to not lose control.

That makes a lot of sense (about the type 8).
_

Using your examples;
When someone makes a joke at my expense that induces shame in me, I will feel hurt and all, but I'll act as if I'm fine and can laugh about it no problem.
And in crisis situations like the example you used, I would actually react very similar to your 8 friend there. If anything, it's in a crisis that I feel the most alive, the most focused and driven. It's in many other situations where the stakes aren't that high that I'll feel nervous about a problem and that I'd rather avoid it.
Pretty confusing for me

Generally tho it seems like you know what you are talking about, not like some who think certain types are better than others.
What you described seemed to be withdrawn or generally one of the conflict avoidant types, which is 2, 7 and 9: Enneagram Harmonics
Possibly also withdrawn: Social Style
Withdrawn types are known to physically and/or emotionally withdraw which if you identify with you'd probably feel a certain degree of belonging with that category.

Enneagram leans a lot on the person in question tho, but you don't really strike me as a type 4, tho I have had a generally bad experience with type 4s so I wouldn't draw any conclusions based on that.

One of the biggest reasons I can't see myself as a 4 is because I come across as fairly shameless. Whereas 4's tend to have this vibe about them, where every move seems calculated in a way.

Maybe you should write up which of each category you agree with the most,
Heart, Head, Gut
Reactive, Positive Outlook, Competency Harmonic
Assertive, Compliant, Withdrawn

I relate quite a bit to the Heart triad in that I'm constantly comparing myself to others, to see whether I'm doing better/worse. This also ties in to my constant search for my identity, which has been a life-long thing for me.
Though I suspect my type is more likely part of the Head triad, mainly because of how I vibe with others. I tend to approach people with ideas, thoughts and questions, instead of emotion.
It's unlikely I'm part of the Gut triad.

The Competency triad is something I don't relate to at all, it's just not how I approach issues. I tend to either be vague about them and try to give alternatives, or I get very intense and heated and feel the need to confront them, depending on how personal or immediate the problems are to me. If we're talking quantity, then I probably use the Positive Outlook more than the others, though I can't eliminate the Reactive triad just yet.

The social styles are the hardest for me to determine.
I'm probably too laid back about my needs to identify with the Assertive style. In a way, I don't want to come across as too needy.
As for the Compliant style, I don't relate to the whole commitment part, if anything, I can be the opposite.
So I guess this leave the Withdrawn style, where I do have one big reason to identify with it; the reliance on their imagination which I do quite a bit of myself. It's exactly the discrepancy between my imagination and so-called-reality that is really messing with my life atm (work etc.)

As you identify with the MBTI type of ENFP, type 7 wouldn't be far off as type 7s avoid pain by filling their life with a large variety of experiences.
Then again, I put as much faith in MBTI as in Astrology, but what makes you identify with ENFP may still be what makes you a 7.

Yes, I mainly identify as an ENFP because it leads with extraverted intuition, which I relate strongly with. The pattern-seeking, the searching for options and possibilities. It all does sound very 7-ish.

 

[Southern Kross]

Haha, no I'm not Kiwi or Australian.
I'm Belgian and English isn't my native tongue so I just use whatever sounds good to me in the moment. I love variety.

OK

About the 7w6 suggestion, could you explain why? I've considered it before but I seem to be too hesitating & self-conscious to be one.

You could be 6w7 I guess, but that's not the immediate vibe I got. Anyway, 7s can be hesitant and self-conscious too.

There's lots of reasons why I think you are, but this sums it up:

What are qualities you'd like to have, but can't seem to develop?

Ha! Great question Dedication, discipline, the ability to put aside the 'mood of the moment'.