ISxJ?

[Golden_Cherry]

The reason I feel I'm having such difficulty deciding whether I am ISTJ or ISFJ is because when I'm not living in my head, I seem to behave more like an ISFJ whether I like it or not, but I don't know if this is due to low confidence or Fe. I am rather sensitive to criticisms about my work or if I make a mistake. I can easily get depressed due to feelings of inadequacy and embarrassment. When I'm fond of someone (particularly an authority), their opinion of me is very important and I hate upsetting them or making a poor impression. My feelings also tend to be more subdued rather than come out in dramatic outbursts. I hate expressing what I'm feeling, but sometimes it shows on my face or unbidden tears will come on. When someone is emotionally hurt or a victim, I will do things for them to cheer them up or will want to comfort them (even if I'm not that great at it). I'm more likely to be constructive and help people than look down on them in an arrogant way. I don't like receiving too much recognition or "mushy" affection, and I don't like being called "sweet", even though it happens. I also have a moral tone when I speak, although it surprises me and REALLY bothers me when this comes out because it happens without thinking and gets in the way of what I truly believe intellectually. I do not like working in groups because I hate accomodating other people when I have a certain way I want to do things, but will do so anyway to avoid conflict. I actually get really annoyed by talking to other people, and I don't have a need to make friends or fit in. I also have a "live and let live" type of mindset, but personally I don't try to stand out and sometimes I act like I don't think this way. At work, I don't usually think about the customer at all and just do what the rules say instead of trying to make a compromise or even caring about their issues. I feel that I use Te more than I use Ti and am all about the need to be accurate and understand the objective truth of the matter, but my feelings sometimes get in the way, and when I act like myself, I don't feel like it aligns with who I am internally. I connect my mind with my identity, not my outward behavior. For example, confrontation makes me extremely uneasy, but if someone says something logically inconsistent or there is a flaw in their reasoning or facts, I feel a strong need to challenge them. I try to focus on thinking rather than feeling because it seems more relevant most of the time and I value it more. I am drained by using either one too much, but I feel more comfortable when I am discussing thoughts and am being impersonal. My dilemma is that what is natural for me does not seem to be what is most comfortable. What are some differences between ISTJs and ISFJs to help me figure out which one I am?

 

[Evo]

ISTJ:

· Reserved
· Controlled
· Self-motivated
· Deliberate
· Realistic
· Practical
· Detail-oriented
· Traditional
· Logical
· Objective
· Pragmatic
· Levelheaded
· Orderly
· Responsible
· Methodical
· Hardworking



ISFJ:

· Reserved
· Unassuming
· Thoughtful
· Calm
· Practical
· Traditional
· Observant
· Factual
· Devoted
· Caring
· Kind
· Principled
· Organized
· Methodical
· Dedicated
· Persistent

My dilemma is that what is natural for me does not seem to be what is most comfortable.

Even after reading you full post, I do not understand this. Can you explain some more?

Also there's this you could try too: http://www.typologycentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=24627

 

[Cimarron]

When you enter an environment or situation, and try to "make sense" of what's going on, do you look at the things, guidelines, locations, amounts, or do you take stock of who's who and how to navigate in this new group of people, knowing that finding a place in this new crowd will be vital to working together / understanding it? Of course both will be important in a new setting, but maybe one is easier for you / feels less like pulling teeth?

Regarding that what is easier for you is not necessarily the way you like to be/do things, sometimes this is a product of culture or environment. For example, if you live in a culture that highly values affection, hugging, smiling, it sets the tone on what is "normal". Or if you're a woman and people expect women to be soft, sensitive creatures, but it's not natural for you to be that way, it creates a tension between your natural mode and the culture's expectations of you which can be uncomfortable... Just some examples.

 

[Golden_Cherry]

Even after reading you full post, I do not understand this. Can you explain some more?

Hmm, I'll try. I just meant that it seems like my internal self is battling with my external self. I am a people-pleaser and say things motivated by feeling, but I feel these kinds things I can't control (they're my immediate reaction), yet the fact that I do them bothers me. When I am alone, I'm detached from everyone else's feelings and can be in the realm of pure thought. When I am anonymous, I don't have to worry about others' reactions and can be myself and express the raw, intellectual content of what I want to say without emotional influences on my thinking. I don't give people's feelings a second thought on the internet most of the time, but at the same time it is not myself (how I actually behave in person). Sometimes what I think contradicts what I say/do when I'm confronted with reality and human subjectivity kicks in. For example, I come across as more morally judgmental than I actually am because my emotions have been activated by a situation where someone needs to make a moral decision. If their decision is not the same as what mine would be, I will speak out due to that uncomfortable feeling, even if logically I can understand that there are many ways the situation could be looked at etc. I won't think they are wrong, but I will feel and act on it even as I remind myself of this. This is what I hate the most about myself. I always feel a sense of remorse about it. I also don't know if the reason I dislike confrontation is because I'm afraid of the other person disliking/challenging me and having MY feelings hurt, not the other person's.

 

[Evo]

Hmm, I'll try. I just meant that it seems like my internal self is battling with my external self. I am a people-pleaser and say things motivated by feeling, but I feel these kinds things I can't control (they're my immediate reaction), yet the fact that I do them bothers me. When I am alone, I'm detached from everyone else's feelings and can be in the realm of pure thought. When I am anonymous, I don't have to worry about others' reactions and can be myself and express the raw, intellectual content of what I want to say without emotional influences on my thinking. I don't give people's feelings a second thought on the internet most of the time, but at the same time it is not myself (how I actually behave in person). Sometimes what I think contradicts what I say/do when I'm confronted with reality and human subjectivity kicks in. For example, I come across as more morally judgmental than I actually am because my emotions have been activated by a situation where someone needs to make a moral decision. If their decision is not the same as what mine would be, I will speak out due to that uncomfortable feeling, even if logically I can understand that there are many ways the situation could be looked at etc. I won't think they are wrong, but I will feel and act on it even as I remind myself of this. This is what I hate the most about myself. I always feel a sense of remorse about it. I also don't know if the reason I dislike confrontation is because I'm afraid of the other person disliking/challenging me and having MY feelings hurt, not the other person's.

This just sounds like enneagram one. And it does sound like you could be using Fe. My ISFJ friend says that he can be much more detached when he's alone. And that is the time he likes to use Ti. He uses his Ti alot. I would try to see which one of those you relate to more, Ti or Te. Cause your thinking function, whether it's extroverted or introverted, still seems highly used, either way.

 

[Golden_Cherry]

Interesting. I wonder, then, if enneagram 1's idealism in my case is associated with an Fi that makes a lot of thinking-oriented subjective value judgments ("people should justify their decisions/beliefs logically with objective evidence, people should be fair, people should be consistent"). I am more likely to take that kind of approach than argue from an ethical perspective (I try to avoid doing that despite if I am bothered, and when I slip up I feel I've let myself down), although I realize either way no one has any responsibility to do anything I think they should or want them to do. That could be what is causing me this sense of disharmony. That is one possibility, or I could be consciously attempting to suppress my Fe in favor of thinking-oriented ideals and idolizing thinking types. I'm confused by my thinking function as well, because I seem to strongly prefer Te to Ti, since I trust it more to be correct, but then I don't know how to explain my apparently Fe-like behavior.