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ENTP or INTP? The Eternal Dilemma

Emperor Enigma

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In conversation with others, do you often find yourself saying, "that might also be taken to mean _______..." in reference to something the other person says, or are you more likely to simply think of the alternative meaning but keep it to yourself?

Also, do you display a really strong talent for clever word play and a quick wit that is easy to tap into most of the time, or is your word play/witty response something that might occur to you later and you only wish you'd thought of it during the conversation?

I think an INTP is likely to be slightly more reserved, perhaps often thinking of a million clever or intelligent things they could've said but didn't during a conversation, whereas an ENTP might be more likely to have that arsenal of words ready to go, on the spot.

1.) Actually, I just did that today. A friend of mine (incidentally, who I suspect is also an ENTP) was telling me about a news article and I responded with, "Well, that's interesting. But have you looked at it from the perspective...".

2.) I struggled with witty comebacks a lot in middle school, especially during my confrontations with bullies. I remember frequently having those moments of "Oh! I could have said that!", I still have them but with a decreased frequency. Argue with me online, and I will retaliate with a clever comeback in a matter of seconds. For some reason, I'm marginally slower in real life. Right now, I definitely have a penchant for witty banter and clever word play. But some of that gets wasted because I'm socially anxious. I also seem to have a split personality. One day, I'm enthusiastic, playful, humorous and witty. The next day, I'm cold, emotionless, reserved and sarcastic.

I think my parents might have an inadvertent influence on my doubt regarding my type. Around them, I'm a total introvert because of the discrepancies in our lifestyles, thoughts, opinions, etc. This may have caused me to over-develop my Ti as a late teenager (15-18). In their absence, even though I'm still somewhat introverted because of my social anxiety, I'm definitely using Ne. I also use more Ne than Ti when I'm browsing on the internet. And yet, the INTP set of functions aligns more reasonably with the Beebe's model of cognitive functions.
 

Doctor Cringelord

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Interesting.

I don't know many ENTPs in "real" life. I'm pretty sure my sister dated one. He was very nerdy, but in an outgoing, life of the party way. I picture him being the leader of his nerd pack in high school, perhaps being friends with some of the more popular students as well, but I didn't know him in high school so I can't really say accurately, but that's pretty much what he was like as an adult. I'd say ENTPs are like INTPs with a thicker skin, but it actually seems they can be more sensitive (noticeably sensitive, at least).
 

Doctor Cringelord

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If I think of a witty comeback or something else to say, I often keep it to myself unless I'm in the right company. I have a knack for occasionally offending people when that wasn't my intent.
 

Emperor Enigma

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My father often says that I'm emotional, but I don't know a damn about feelings. Just a random observation that came to mind.
 

valaki

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When I research, I just absorb the information and compare it with the storehouse of information entrenched in my mind and other bits of data that randomly come to my mind. I keep making comparison of different contexts, investigating for relationships, patterns and interconnections. If I see A and B, I think about how they can be related via C and D. Don't know if that makes sense. I do get approached for my ideas and insights, but I don't identify myself in the process of brainstorming. I'm more into looking for patterns and doing lots of research. Supposedly Ne generates ideas and looks for patterns, alternative scenarios and double meanings. I do the latter very well, but I'm not so proficient in the former.

Sounds like you're doing Ne when researching.

If you generate alternative scenarios, that's Ne. You already said you look for patterns so that's sorted too. So did you mean you don't generate "ideas"? What do you mean by "ideas"?


I think an INTP is likely to be slightly more reserved, perhaps often thinking of a million clever or intelligent things they could've said but didn't during a conversation, whereas an ENTP might be more likely to have that arsenal of words ready to go, on the spot.

My INTP friend always has an arsenal of words ready to go. The way he explained it it's all organized for him in his mind through associations somehow so it's easy for him to do that... He can write a crazy and long poem anytime you ask. I did wonder if he was ENTP but he identified a lot more with the description of Ti leading Ne than with Ne leading Ti. (OK this was socionics but the wikisocion descriptions of NeTi / TiNe functions in ILE/LII profiles seem to be pretty well correlating with the MBTI version I think)


2.) I struggled with witty comebacks a lot in middle school, especially during my confrontations with bullies. I remember frequently having those moments of "Oh! I could have said that!", I still have them but with a decreased frequency. Argue with me online, and I will retaliate with a clever comeback in a matter of seconds. For some reason, I'm marginally slower in real life. Right now, I definitely have a penchant for witty banter and clever word play. But some of that gets wasted because I'm socially anxious. I also seem to have a split personality. One day, I'm enthusiastic, playful, humorous and witty. The next day, I'm cold, emotionless, reserved and sarcastic.

That inconsistency makes you EP temperament in socionics :)


I think my parents might have an inadvertent influence on my doubt regarding my type. Around them, I'm a total introvert because of the discrepancies in our lifestyles, thoughts, opinions, etc. This may have caused me to over-develop my Ti as a late teenager (15-18). In their absence, even though I'm still somewhat introverted because of my social anxiety, I'm definitely using Ne. I also use more Ne than Ti when I'm browsing on the internet. And yet, the INTP set of functions aligns more reasonably with the Beebe's model of cognitive functions.

Beebe is just one model... and it's very fine distinctions sometimes; I could also argue for my inferior being in the tertiary position and vice versa
 

valaki

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[MENTION=20464]MasterOfAwesome[/MENTION]

Also, earlier, were you trying to say that you are perfectly able to come up with crazy ideas, without any effort, just not practical ideas unless you are given information?
 

Doctor Cringelord

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My father often says that I'm emotional, but I don't know a damn about feelings. Just a random observation that came to mind.

Well, the feeling functions aren't exactly synonymous with emotion.

I might catch some flak for saying this, but I believe emotion can be attached to all of the functions in some form.

Granted, people with dominant and auxiliary feeling functions do seem to have a better grasp and understanding of the emotions of themselves and others.
 

Emperor Enigma

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Alright, here are two questionnaires that I've attempted.

1. Is there anything that may affect the way you answer the questions? For example, a stressful time, mental illness, medications, special life circumstances? Other useful information includes sex, age, and current state of mind.


Nope. Male, 17, Calm.

2. Study these two images here and here. Which one do you prefer and why? How would you describe it?

http://farm7.staticflickr.com/6005/6...c083ea9f_m.jpg
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8287/7...4da6df716d.jpg

Definitely the second picture. There's nothing appealing about the first one. Why would I appreciate a picture of someone eating? Besides, the second one looks intriguing.

3. Please describe yourself as a person if you were to introduce yourself to someone else like in a cover letter. What kind of person are you and why?

Hmmmm... I don't know how to answer this question concisely. If I were to use a set of adjectives or comments, they would be :- eccentric, independent, innovative, rebellious, optimistic, rational, playfully annoying/mischievous, dynamic, absent-minded, theoretical, thirsty for adventure and fun, imaginative, lazily ambitious.
I'm a person who desires fame, knowledge, celebrity, global recognition and a heartfelt yearning for leaving an impact on the world or making a change before my perpetual departure. Maybe, this is because I understand the boundless extent of my potential and I want the whole world to apprehend it.

4. What kind of person would you LIKE to be? Why? What kind of person would you NOT want to be? Why?

In general, I like what I am right now. But I do wish I was more socially adept and productive. My social skills are terrible, if not nonexistent. I would not want to be an average person with an average life and average interests. I would hate to be narrow-minded and obedient. I'm proud of the fact that I think for myself, make my own decisions, defy authority when needed and take an unconventional approach to day-to-day banalities.

5. Do you think there are any differences to how you described yourself and how people actually perceive you? How do you think others would describe you? If there are any discrepancies between these two that are you are aware of; do you know why exactly that is?

I think a lot of people (excluding my friends) perceive me a quiet and aloof individual. This, probably, being because of my social anxiety and self-consciousness. For example, I have two exhibits to my personality, the first one being my default one in stressful or uncomfortable situations.

Persona A - Recluse, Dreamy, Socially Awkward, Passive, Terse, Apathetic, Negatively Sarcastic, Narcissistic.
Persona B - Hilarious, Witty, Arrogant, Argumentative, Positively Sarcastic, Fun, Imaginative, Spontaneous.


6. What in life do you find to be of importance? Why? If you are unsure you can always take the Value Test and post the results here. Do note that it helps if you narrow it down to 20 or ideally 10 values as suggested at stage 2.

Acknowledgement, Accomplishment, Knowledge, Fun, Courage, Independence.

7. How do you react to new situations in your life? Can you describe an event in your life where you were in an unknown situation? How did you deal with it?

Optimistically. I'm the guy who refuses to judge the situation and says, "Just wait and see what happens, then you have all the right to judge. Just enjoy, jeez." This is also paradoxical because I have a hard time not noticing errors and criticizing people... internally.
I'm objective about my past, realistic-optimistic about my present, and very optimistic about my future.

8. Please describe yourself when you are in a stressful situation. How do you act and why? Real life experiences are welcome.

I lose my ability to think. I become infuriated with the world. It's terrible. My brain transforms into a void, I lose my linguistic faculties, and I change into a distressed and grumpy guy who wants to be alone. As of yet, despite numerous attempts, I have been unsuccessful in deducing the reasons behind these egregious mental assaults.
Concisely, my life feels like hell on earth. And I become even lazier.

9. Please describe yourself when you are in an enjoyable situation. How do you act and why? Real life experiences are welcome.

I become impulsive, enthusiastic, indulgent, crazy and may even start living in the moment, abandoning my future or past problems and worries. I just... enjoy.

10. Describe your relationship to socialization. How do you perceive one-on-one interaction? How do you perceive group interaction?

I prefer group interaction to one-on-one interaction. But I also dislike them because my views and thoughts are rarely considered in group discussions. If considered, they are likely to be rejected. Sometimes, I even feel invisible in group interactions. For some reason, I feel uncomfortable and anxious during one-on-one conversations. I only prefer one-on-one interaction when I'm talking to an interesting individual or talking about something interesting. But I absolutely detest group interaction when the participants are people I find myself disliking or considering boring and uninteresting.

11. Describe your relationship to society. What are the elements of it you hold important or unimportant (e.g. social norms, values, customs, traditions)? How do you see people as a whole?

I have a rebellious edge. I'm willing to question society whenever I get the opportunity. But on the other hand, it's also nice to analyze whether your thoughts are in accordance with the perception of society. I'm actually even prone to going along with whatever the majority thinks. Sometimes, I can even act pro-society and sneer at the skeptical lone wolf who keeps to himself. I would occasionally even use society to my advantage, utilizing the power of the majority. I dislike traditions, norms, customs etc. I don't see why one needs to do something the same way every single time. Isn't that what Einstein calls insanity?

12. Describe your relationship to authority. How do you perceive authority? What does it mean to you, and how do you deal with it?

Fairly indifferent. They are not necessarily superior to me, and so they do not have the prerogative to control me. Although, by principal, I guess I am anti-authority due to my tendency to question authority figures.

13. Describe your relationship to order and chaos. What do order and chaos mean to you? How do they manifest in your daily life?

I'm a True Neutral, if that's of any relevance. I'm definitely chaotic. I find that order has a debilitating effect on me. It restricts and deteriorates me and my sense of confidence. However, I do value order in the form of peace and tranquility.

14. What is it that you fear in life? Why? How does this fear manifest to you both in how you think and how you act?

Lizards (they are basically minuscule dinosaurs, I fear them). Heights. But I don't think they matter. I don't really think I fear anything else. When I'm not depressed or anxious, I'm pretty optimistic and intrepid.

15. What is it that you desire in life? What do you strive to achieve? Why? Where do you think these drives and desires stem from or are inspired by?

I've already answered these questions, I think. I did not realize there was a specific set of questions for them.

16. a) What activities energize you most? b) What activities drain you most? Why?

a) Having fun, browsing the internet, discovering and exploring, learning something new, reading or watching fiction, discussing my interests and ideas with friends, introspecting, being independent, winning an argument.

b) Being bored, taking orders and commands, following rules and regulations, being told to do something, talking to people that do not interest me.

17. Why do you want to know your type? What type do you think you are? Why this/these type(s)? Is there a type that appeals to you, to your self-perception, that you would like to be? Why? If you know your enneagram, please post this here. If you have done any online function tests such as the Keys2Cognition, it helps if you post these results here as well.

I've questioned and doubted my type for far too long. I think I'm a definite xNTP. Self-discovery, research, identification. ENTP, INTP, ENTJ (because they actually get stuff done and have a massive amount of self-confidence).

The results I have hitherto gotten in descending order of frequency (with the first two being equal and arranged alphabetically)-
ENTP, INTP, ENFP, ISTP, INFP, ESTP, INTJ, ISTJ

Ne >= Ti > Ni >>> Fe = Fi > Si >> Se > Te

18. Finally, is there something else you find to be of importance you want to add about yourself you think might be of relevance when helping to type you?

I have a plethora of things to add. I would write them, if I had the patience and fortitude. In fact, such an activity would probably induce me to write a novel. Besides, I'm a novice at organizing my thoughts. By the way, I consistently used to test as an ISTJ at a time when I had hit the rock-bottom of depression. I'm also extremely nostalgic. That's all.

1. Click on this link: Flickr: Explore! Look at the random photo for about 30 seconds. Copy and paste it here, and write about your impression of it.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/damianw...ore-2014-01-04

I'm instantly reminded of Sherlock Holmes, followed by the Great Depression, Black & White films, Charlie Chaplin, Marlon Brando and Johnny Walker because of the hat. Since I see a bridge, water and the title (London Reflection), I start thinking about River Thames. That's all.

2. You are with a group of people in a car, heading to a different town to see your favourite band/artist/musician. Suddenly, the car breaks down for an unknown reason in the middle of nowhere. What are your initial thoughts? What are your outward reactions?

I'm curious. Something has happened. A monotonous long drive to the concert would have left me feeling slightly frustrated (unless I had my cellphone or laptop). Throughout the journey, I was preoccupied with thoughts revolving around my expectation of the concert and its attractions, occasionally to be drifted by something interesting along the road. Anyway, back to the question. My outward reaction would be a formal sigh of annoyance, just to show that I care. I would certainly question the people about the problem, get the answer, perfunctorily consider it and look for something to occupy myself.

3. You somehow make it to the concert. The driver wants to go to the afterparty that was announced (and assure you they won't drink so they can drive back later). How do you feel about this party? What do you do?

Alright. My internal and external reaction would depend on how good the concert was. If it was bad, I might attend the party just to get the enjoyment I deserve for being patient about the earlier problem. If it was great, I might be in an optimistic mood. So, I'll probably attend the party. If it was neither good nor bad, I'll view the party as an unnecessary extension. Besides, I have this tendency where whenever I watch a show or some movie, I retreat to the internet and research about it and see how other people found it. For example, after watching The Wolf of Wall Street recently, I immediately attacked IMDb and Rotten Tomatoes and ascertained how my opinion of the movie pitted against the general opinion. Speaking of this, I also like listening to the crowd while watching a football match or any show. If someone makes a joke, I'm more interested in the audience's reaction rather than my reaction. Sometimes, it even influences me. I use crowd reactions, applause, cheers, boos to determine how good something is.

4. On the drive back, your friends are talking. A friend makes a claim that clashes with your current beliefs. What is your inward reaction? What do you outwardly say?

Depends on what kind of belief it is. Normally, I would riposte with a pseudo-sarcastic remark or brush it away with a joke, followed by an argument if the friend in question persists on spreading his claim. I might also consider the claim in silence and even start doubting my own belief. I would probably ask him why he made that claim, if he hasn't explained it already.

5. What would you do if you actually saw/experienced something that clashes with your previous beliefs, experiences, and habits?

What I do best. Research. Everything has an explanation (except intuition and rules).

6. What are some of your most important values? How did you come about determining them? How can they change?

I'm not really high on values. I find them inflexible and restrictive. But I do admire courage, optimism, independence, freedom of speech and wisdom/intelligence.

7. a) What about your personality most distinguishes you from everyone else? b) If you could change one thing about you personality, what would it be? Why?

I answered a similar question in the previous questionnaire.

8. How do you treat hunches or gut feelings? In what situations are they most often triggered?

I trust them. I find them curious and intriguing. Ironically, they're usually triggered conspicuously when I'm in the process of making a big decision. However, I'm too indecisive. I place a greater reliance on information and research. I need to take in every perspective before making a decision. For some reason, intuition usually prevails in the end.

9. a) What activities energize you most? b) What activities drain you most? Why?

Done.

10. What do you repress about your outward behavior or internal thought process when around others? Why?

I only repress when I'm placed in an awkward circumstance or in an undesirable situation. That's when I repress almost everything about myself, which makes me seem like an introvert. Oh, and I'm definitely the epitome of an introvert in the presence of my parents. Normally, I'm quite open, even to strangers (I'll venture to say that I'm more likely to reveal my interests to a stranger than a friend, like I'm doing right now).

Finally, a statement or two or more of caution. My interests and preferences and their explanations and reasons are so changeable and capricious that the above questions are promptly rendered fairly inadequate. Today, I might answer these questions like I have right now. Tomorrow, I might answer these questions differently. I might have the same hobbies for seven years, but for different reasons every year. Tell me about an unknown TV show that is unanimously liked and I'll become obsessed about it in a couple of days. There are so many attributes about my personality that they cannot be encapsulated in writing. I can write a 2000 page novel autobiography and you still will only know 75% of me. But as much as I enjoy talking or writing about myself, I lack the patience and diligence to do that in the first place.That's why, I want you to ask me your own questions.

Now, attack me with your typology meters, ye veterans of TypoC!
 

Emperor Enigma

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entp > intp

Not that I doubt your judgement (in fact, I'm willing to take your word for it), but can you please elaborate? I want to know how you arrived at the conclusion and how you analyzed my questionnaire to do so, if it's not strenuous. Thanks, by the way. In fact, I'm inviting anyone to analyze my latest questionnaire. Please? I'm curious to see the process behind your analysis.
 

valaki

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Not that I doubt your judgement (in fact, I'm willing to take your word for it), but can you please elaborate? I want to know how you arrived at the conclusion and how you analyzed my questionnaire to do so, if it's not strenuous. Thanks, by the way. In fact, I'm inviting anyone to analyze my latest questionnaire. Please? I'm curious to see the process behind your analysis.

Oh you don't have to view me as the infallible typing expert. :p

Anyway, here's a bit more details for you :)... what I really meant was if there were these two choices only, then it seems entp over intp :)

There were things like this in your questionnaire that to me sound E > I: "I only repress when I'm placed in an awkward circumstance or in an undesirable situation. That's when I repress almost everything about myself, which makes me seem like an introvert."

"a) Having fun, browsing the internet, discovering and exploring, learning something new, reading or watching fiction, discussing my interests and ideas with friends, introspecting, being independent, winning an argument."

This is also more Ne-ish than Ti-ish IMO. Though it doesn't have to be Ne, but if it's already established that you have strong Ne then that's what it is. :)

"I need to take in every perspective before making a decision. For some reason, intuition usually prevails in the end"

This as well, seems irrational-dom and yeah sure, intuitive as well :D

I did also try to look for some signs of dominant Ti but I didn't really find any...

Btw this is interesting: "For some reason, I feel uncomfortable and anxious during one-on-one conversations." ...Any idea why?
 

Emperor Enigma

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Oh you don't have to view me as the infallible typing expert. :p

Anyway, here's a bit more details for you :)... what I really meant was if there were these two choices only, then it seems entp over intp :)

There were things like this in your questionnaire that to me sound E > I: "I only repress when I'm placed in an awkward circumstance or in an undesirable situation. That's when I repress almost everything about myself, which makes me seem like an introvert."

"a) Having fun, browsing the internet, discovering and exploring, learning something new, reading or watching fiction, discussing my interests and ideas with friends, introspecting, being independent, winning an argument."

This is also more Ne-ish than Ti-ish IMO. Though it doesn't have to be Ne, but if it's already established that you have strong Ne then that's what it is. :)

"I need to take in every perspective before making a decision. For some reason, intuition usually prevails in the end"

This as well, seems irrational-dom and yeah sure, intuitive as well :D

I did also try to look for some signs of dominant Ti but I didn't really find any...

Btw this is interesting: "For some reason, I feel uncomfortable and anxious during one-on-one conversations." ...Any idea why?

I don't really know. I suppose it's because one-on-one conversations are more intense? I find it extremely difficult to make eye contact in such situations. I love one-on-one conversations when we're walking while talking, with our bodies facing towards a common destination, instead of being mutually opposite. Walking stimulates my mind and makes conversation easier. Walking or couching. Definite no to sitting, unless I'm browsing the internet. But I still prefer browsing the internet on my bed, laying down.
 

Emperor Enigma

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By the way, here's a peculiarity of mine.
I have noticed that in social situations, I find it hard to tune people out, unless the situation is terribly boring (this happens almost always in high school, though). This mostly happens whenever I'm being socially anxious or self-conscious. I try to withdraw into my own world, but my brain keeps switching me back to the external world. I want to listen to my own thoughts, but I can't help listening to what the people in my vicinity are saying, especially if I know them. For example, yesterday, I was in a party where I was anxious and did not want people to see or talk to me. Therefore, I tried to get lost in my thoughts in order to tune them out and not worry about them, but I could not do it. I had to see what was going on, even if I wasn't necessarily interested. Even if I'm silent by virtue of my social anxiety, I'm processing the external world in my mind. I also don't last long in isolation (unless there's internet or I'm home), no matter how much I lust for it. In the aforementioned situation, when I did finally escape the party and entered solitude for a while, I felt relieved but I also felt unsatisfied. I felt as if I was missing something (or everything). I went back after three minutes. Then I escaped again after another few minutes. This cycle continued until the party ended or we started playing soccer. I was one of the last to leave.

My narcissistic idealistic dreams often center around me being the center of attention. But when time calls for it, I withdraw and go invisible because I'm afraid of messing up or embarrassing myself or god knows what. Funny, I entertain the idea of being the center of attention when I'm alone.
 

Emperor Enigma

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Keys 2 Cognition
Cognitive Process Level of Development (Preference, Skill and Frequency of Use)
extraverted Sensing (Se) ************** (14.4)
unused
introverted Sensing (Si) ******************** (20.5)
limited use
extraverted Intuiting (Ne) *********************************************** (47.9)
excellent use
introverted Intuiting (Ni) ***************************************** (41.4)
excellent use
extraverted Thinking (Te) ***************** (17.2)
limited use
introverted Thinking (Ti) ********************************************* (45.9)
excellent use
extraverted Feeling (Fe) **************************** (28.7)
average use
introverted Feeling (Fi) ************************ (24.4)
average use
Summary Analysis of Profile
By focusing on the strongest configuration of cognitive processes, your pattern of responses most closely matches individuals of this type: INTP

Lead (Dominant) Process
Introverted Thinking (Ti): Gaining leverage (influence) using a framework. Detaching to study a situation from different angles and fit it to a theory, framework or principle. Checking for accuracy. Using leverage to solve the problem.

Support (Auxilliary) Process
Extraverted Intuiting (Ne): Exploring the emerging patterns. Wondering about patterns of interaction across various situations. Checking what hypotheses and meanings fit best. Trusting what emerges as you shift a situation’s dynamics.

If these cognitive processes don't fit well then consider these types: ENTP, or INFP

PersonalityCafe
The first two depend on whether I'm introverted or extroverted (Ni > Ne when I, Ne > Ni when E), and I'm not sure about that.
Ne = Ni > Ti > Fi > Fe > Si > Te > Se

Most Likely: ENTP/INFJ
or Second Possibility: INFJ/ENTP
or Third Possibility: INTP

SimilarMinds
Te (Extroverted Thinking) (40%)
your valuation of / adherence to logic of external systems / hierarchies / methods

Ti (Introverted Thinking) (85%)
your valuation of / adherence to your own internally devised logic/rational

Ne (Extroverted Intuition) (75%)
your valuation of / tendency towards free association and creating with external stimuli

Ni (Introverted Intuition) (95%)
your valuation of / tendency towards internal/original free association and creativity

Se (Extroverted Sensing) (30%)
your valuation of / tendency to fully experience the world unfiltered, in the moment

Si (Introverted Sensing) (50%)
your valuation of / focus on internal sensations and reliving past moments

Fe (Extroverted Feeling) (40%)
your valuation of / adherence to external morals, ethics, traditions, customs, groups

Fi (Introverted Feeling) (20%)
your valuation of / adherence to the sanctity of your own feelings / ideals / sentiment

//////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////
based on your results your type is likely - unclear

MMDI
INTJ 80
INTP 77
INFJ 76
ENTP 72
INFP 68
ENFP 64
ENTJ 62
ISTP 62
ENFJ 54
ISFP 53
ISTJ 52
ESTJ 48
ISFJ 47
ESTP 40
ESFP 39
ESFJ 35

I'm confused! Am I an ENTP, INTP or peculiar INFJ? My strongest functions are Ne, Ni and Ti.
 

Alea_iacta_est

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[MENTION=20464]MasterOfAwesome[/MENTION]
Well you have two irrational types and one rational type to decide from.

Do you trust in your perceptions of events through intuition more than your reasoning or do you trust more in your reasoning than your perception of events through intuition? Or do you not even know?
 

Emperor Enigma

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[MENTION=20464]MasterOfAwesome[/MENTION]
Well you have two irrational types and one rational type to decide from.

Do you trust in your perceptions of events through intuition more than your reasoning or do you trust more in your reasoning than your perception of events through intuition? Or do you not even know?

I don't know. :shrug:

On second thought, I think I detect a pattern in my thought process. I arrive at a conclusion through intuition, and then I try to reason it out or analyze it. I'm not sure this happens all the time, though.
 

valaki

New member
Joined
Jan 1, 2014
Messages
940
MBTI Type
SeNi
Enneagram
8+7
Instinctual Variant
sx/sp
I don't really know. I suppose it's because one-on-one conversations are more intense? I find it extremely difficult to make eye contact in such situations. I love one-on-one conversations when we're walking while talking, with our bodies facing towards a common destination, instead of being mutually opposite. Walking stimulates my mind and makes conversation easier. Walking or couching. Definite no to sitting, unless I'm browsing the internet. But I still prefer browsing the internet on my bed, laying down.

Doesn't sound (MBTI) type related, this issue about eye contact.


By the way, here's a peculiarity of mine.
I have noticed that in social situations, I find it hard to tune people out, unless the situation is terribly boring (this happens almost always in high school, though). This mostly happens whenever I'm being socially anxious or self-conscious. I try to withdraw into my own world, but my brain keeps switching me back to the external world. I want to listen to my own thoughts, but I can't help listening to what the people in my vicinity are saying, especially if I know them. For example, yesterday, I was in a party where I was anxious and did not want people to see or talk to me. Therefore, I tried to get lost in my thoughts in order to tune them out and not worry about them, but I could not do it. I had to see what was going on, even if I wasn't necessarily interested. Even if I'm silent by virtue of my social anxiety, I'm processing the external world in my mind. I also don't last long in isolation (unless there's internet or I'm home), no matter how much I lust for it. In the aforementioned situation, when I did finally escape the party and entered solitude for a while, I felt relieved but I also felt unsatisfied. I felt as if I was missing something (or everything). I went back after three minutes. Then I escaped again after another few minutes. This cycle continued until the party ended or we started playing soccer. I was one of the last to leave.

My narcissistic idealistic dreams often center around me being the center of attention. But when time calls for it, I withdraw and go invisible because I'm afraid of messing up or embarrassing myself or god knows what. Funny, I entertain the idea of being the center of attention when I'm alone.

This... why do you ever even consider INTP?! You're no INTP ;)

That social anxiety might be fucking up things but you still seem an extravert.


Ne (Extroverted Intuition) (75%)
your valuation of / tendency towards free association and creating with external stimuli

Ni (Introverted Intuition) (95%)
your valuation of / tendency towards internal/original free association and creativity

I'm confused! Am I an ENTP, INTP or peculiar INFJ? My strongest functions are Ne, Ni and Ti.

ENTP I would guess. Why couldn't an ENTP have strong Ni?

Just a clarification question. Do you do the bolded a lot? Or the other one (Ni)?
 

Tetris

New member
Joined
Mar 21, 2014
Messages
5
MBTI Type
ENTP
Hey, so I don't know if you will still read this, but I was on more or less the same situation.
I wasn't not sure if i was INTP or ENTP aaand i have an anxiety disorder.
I was super anxious whenever i was around people, and the more i isolated myself the more i got sick. I lived alone around the time and the best solution was to go back living with my parents.
My anxiety is controlled now (the right meds and decent therapy go a long way) and i realize that i get some energy talking to people, discuting ideas, concepts, asking questions and learning new stuff in general.
there is also my learning patern.
i think in a web. i get a new thing look at it in every way and see how it relates to other things. the more i learn, the more conections i make.
i used to think everybody was like that, with sinapses conections and what not, but this is Ne and there is people who have linear though patern (this is a pretty weird concept to me, actually)
Why don't you only take into consideration the times you are relaxed when doing the tests? do you get worse if you're isolated for a long time? i went to anxious to downright paranoia when i stoped leaving home for 2 weeks.
 

nordic

New member
Joined
Mar 13, 2014
Messages
9
MBTI Type
ENTP
The main reason why I doubt I'm an ENTP (or Ne-dom for that matter) is because I do not excel at generating ideas, unless I'm provided with external stimuli. For example, if I'm included in a group of friends responsible for organizing a party and someone asks me, "So, give me some ideas", my mind will go blank. I need some sort of specification because there are so many things that are possible. I can't tell them to arrange for a syndicate of terrorists to barge in and start shooting the balloons and get the DJ to operate a sound system using electromagnetic waves, can I? What kind of ideas do you want? Anything is possible. I need some sort of background. Ask me to supply ideas just like that and I'll fail. Give me just one sentence and I can give you many ideas which will later expand to other ideas.

An ENTP is supposed to be the archetypal idea generator. I'm terrible at coming up with ideas on the spot, unless I'm given enough information. I spend more time researching and looking for patterns then I do brainstorming.

Thought I'd chime in here. What you're describing isn't really idea generation in the realm of the ENTP as I see it. Remember that the ENTP has a dominant Extroverted Intuition function and a secondary Introverted Thinking. I have read Jung since being linked here and he specifically states that Intuition is the cognition that can't be done consciously. What that means is that Ne - or extraverted intuition - can't be forced. It is I should think, by definition, reactionary from outside stimuly.

When someone is asking you to come up with ideas for a party, they are asking you to use your Feeling and Sensing in the form: "What would be fun?" i.e. "What would Feel fun?". Since NT types are not really emotional types and lacking in empathy (Sensing) unless focusing on it specifically, you simply don't have much clue.

On the other hand, ENTP idea generation comes easily in business and shown as being great at seeing strategy and opportunities for growth, because the Extroverted Intuition is excellent at seeing possibilities where others don't see them yet. Remember Jung, Intuition is basically unconscious cognition/understanding, while Thinking might see the same opportunities it takes too long time to analyze everything properly and formulate reasons and systems. The Feeling type is not really useful for this and the Sensing type only sees what is now without seeing potential.

Intuition on the other hand allows you to come with a great 'idea' of a strategy or a possibility, precisely because of external influence. That is extroverted intuition, to quickly grasp the essence of the external world without necessarily being able to completely understand it yet, that is where the Introverted Thinking comes in.

I'll give you two examples. When I first saw Barack Obama a good 1.5 year before he ran for democratic candidate, I instantly knew that here was the next president. I am not a fortune teller of course, but my intuition just told me he was important. Later on I could realize why through thinking about his unique position or characteristics. Another example is Bitcoin, which I very quickly got the intuition/feeling that this was something major. I instantly saw the possibilities where Bitcoin would change banking, taxation and such. This was 5 years or more ago. I didn't act on it, because I hadn't been able to Think it through, which is the major problem with Extroverted Intuition and Perceiving. Even if you get a strong enthusiasm for something, it can be very difficult top follow through.

I hope someone else will give me commentary if I am way of base here.
 
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