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Enneagram experts and wannabes, E9s and E7s come hither! TYPE ME!!

What type should I consider?


  • Total voters
    15

MacGuffin

Permabanned
Joined
Apr 19, 2007
Messages
10,710
MBTI Type
xkcd
Enneagram
9w1
Instinctual Variant
sx/sp
Well, I'm a pretty solid Level 4 (with bits of 3), so that might explain it. My suspicion may only apply to level 4 or thereabouts.

Still, annoyance seems like a dulled version of anger, and uneasiness a dulled version of fear. Do you find annoyance / uneasiness to be quite separate? Not as in similar, but rather, does experiencing one tend to be connected to experiencing the other?

Uneasiness leads to annoyance. I still wouldn't categorize it as "fear" though. I'm not afraid of other people, I just don't want to deal with their issues.
 

Lady_X

Well-known member
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i relate so much to your confusion. i think it's possible you and i may just be very strong in both but likely lean a lil further to one than the other...i think for me it's most likely 7 but for you...hmm...i might say 9.
 

Kasper

Diabolical
Joined
May 30, 2008
Messages
11,590
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ENTP
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9w8
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so/sx
I relate strongly to 99% of what you wrote there.

I gotz bad news for ya: you seem to be a lot like me. :hifive:

I instantly related to your posting style when you first joined, you're softer round them edges than most ENTPs but in a way that still seemed unmistakably ENTP, from my perspective you pay more attention to not causing issues which is something most ENTPs don't use too much effort to do. The E9ness makes sense.


Looking at this present info, and your assertion of being w8, I have to go with 9w8. It doesn't completely fit. And when you say "I can [emphasis on CAN] be quite competitive," it's really not relevant to how you are ALL or MOST of the time, which is what matters in determining the main e-type.

I prefer collaboration to competition, with an exception when it's done in the name of fun. I agree that E9 and E8 are rather contradictory in most ways that when one is a wing of the other it can appear disjointed.


I really think the best thing about the enneagram is that it provokes you to think about how your mind works and to work out what drives you.

I totally agree. Which is why it doesn't matter too much which one I am, if there's something relevant in one type that I can learn from then it serves a purpose.


I think you are probably 9w8. Let me explain how I came to this... you are entp, that is pretty much for certain, so let's use it as a base. If you were 7 and entp you'd expect a more frenetic sort of personality but you aren't. You are more laid back, therefore 9.

Hurry up and decide on your dumb type already. : )

I think you're probably right. ENTP E7 is pretty standard so there are many examples of how it plays out, not relating to that is a strong sign that it's not me. Meanwhile I'm being decisively indecisive!


i relate so much to your confusion. i think it's possible you and i may just be very strong in both but likely lean a lil further to one than the other...i think for me it's most likely 7 but for you...hmm...i might say 9.

Both are easily relatable for me, that's for sure. What caused you to pick 7 over 9?
 

redcheerio

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Messages
912
MBTI Type
ENTP
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E9
I instantly related to your posting style when you first joined, you're softer round them edges than most ENTPs but in a way that still seemed unmistakably ENTP, from my perspective you pay more attention to not causing issues which is something most ENTPs don't use too much effort to do. The E9ness makes sense.

Likewise with yours! (but uh, I didn't wanna say anything, cuz I know you're scared of us sx-dom types :shocking: :ninja: :peepwall:)

It's true, I do avoid "causing issues", since I can see exactly what might cause them from a mile away, and find that kind of drama super boring and annoying. I much prefer real discussion, which can include intense disagreement, but only when everyone involved is actually discussing the topic at hand respectfully (or if disrespectfully, at least in a mutually humorous all-in-good-fun way). Thanks for noticing. :biggrin:

I noticed you're good at that, too. :hifive:

And of course, let's not forget our shared addiction to silly smilies....

:happy2: :scruples: :burns:

:hideyhole:

:wubbie: :wizfreak: :rock: :charge:

:banana2:

:encore:


I prefer collaboration to competition, with an exception when it's done in the name of fun. I agree that E9 and E8 are rather contradictory in most ways that when one is a wing of the other it can appear disjointed.

Ditto!
 

Owfin

New member
Joined
Dec 18, 2011
Messages
261
MBTI Type
ISTJ
Enneagram
6w7
Instinctual Variant
sp/sx
Likewise with yours! (but uh, I didn't wanna say anything, cuz I know you're scared of us sx-dom types :shocking: :ninja: :peepwall:)

It's true, I do avoid "causing issues", since I can see exactly what might cause them from a mile away, and find that kind of drama super boring and annoying. I much prefer real discussion, which can include intense disagreement, but only when everyone involved is actually discussing the topic at hand respectfully (or if disrespectfully, at least in a mutually humorous all-in-good-fun way). Thanks for noticing. :biggrin:

I noticed you're good at that, too. :hifive:

And of course, let's not forget our shared addiction to silly smilies....

:happy2: :scruples: :burns:

:hideyhole:

:wubbie: :wizfreak: :rock: :charge:

:banana2:

:encore:

:horor:
 

Kasper

Diabolical
Joined
May 30, 2008
Messages
11,590
MBTI Type
ENTP
Enneagram
9w8
Instinctual Variant
so/sx
Likewise with yours! (but uh, I didn't wanna say anything, cuz I know you're scared of us sx-dom types :shocking: :ninja: :peepwall:)

It's cause of the skin-wearing :( I am not a Kasper suit for a Sx dom :dont:

It's true, I do avoid "causing issues", since I can see exactly what might cause them from a mile away, and find that kind of drama super boring and annoying. I much prefer real discussion, which can include intense disagreement, but only when everyone involved is actually discussing the topic at hand respectfully (or if disrespectfully, at least in a mutually humorous all-in-good-fun way). Thanks for noticing. :biggrin:

AMEN! That's exactly it! Debating is totally fun, but if someone considers it arguing their perspective bothers me and all the fun gets sucked out and I move on to being all worried about them getting upset on top of losing my excitement at having what I considered a rousing debate ended!

My INFJ sis is the worst for it, me and my ESFJ mum hit a topic from two different views more often than not and get great enjoyment out of discussing our pov's to better understand a bigger picture, but after a while of listening my sis will pipe up with a "can you two please stop arguing already?!" which causes me and mum to break stride with a "huh? We're not arguing, whatchoo talking 'bout?". But it's all over at that point cause mum gets agro at my sister for misunderstanding our intent, and I get all bothered by the fact that she thinks we were arguing and is upset with it, plus bothered at my mum getting agro, so sit there all :(

This is the reason I am very careful about who I debate with, even though it is such a natural and enjoyable thing for me to do.


And of course, let's not forget our shared addiction to silly smilies....

:D That was the first thing that stood out about you and tasted familiar!



:yes:
 

PeaceBaby

reborn
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IMO, there are two aspects of being 9 that should expressly resonate for you if you are a 9.

1.) The sense of feeling compelled to establish peace in your environment and

2.) "numbing out" when that's not happening, even if you don't want to.

Explain to me how you relate to these two qualities, pretty-please?
 

Kasper

Diabolical
Joined
May 30, 2008
Messages
11,590
MBTI Type
ENTP
Enneagram
9w8
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so/sx
IMO, there are two aspects of being 9 that should expressly resonate for you if you are a 9.

1.) The sense of feeling compelled to establish peace in your environment and

In terms of inner peace: I somewhat struggle with figuring out what that means to me, as it has a strong association with E9 I don't know where confirmation bias starts and ends. It's not something I've thought about before so whatever the case it's not a conscious and named thought to seek it. This does not mean it's not important to me, I just can't figure out what importance I place on it.

In terms of outer peace: If I am able to compel change and create peace I will, if I am not I will leave. I want everyone to get along but know that is not realistic, so if people choose to be disharmonious I do not want to be around it.

With either: Give me an option to pick between "fun" and "peace" and I'll pick fun every time but if you give me the option of one and not the other such as "fun and chaotic/disharmony" or "peace and boring/static" I'll chose the latter. Boredom isn't something I have an issue with, I simply have a preference for fun, disharmony is something I have an issue with.


2.) "numbing out" when that's not happening, even if you don't want to.

Explain to me how you relate to these two qualities, pretty-please?

Numbing out however is something I strongly relate to, I've always done that whenever something I don't want to deal with crops up, rather than facing it like a responsible grownd-up person would, or distracting myself with action like an E7 would, I numb myself, shut out the world and think irrelevant happy thoughts, kinda like the kid who covers his eyes and says "you can't see me cause I can't see you".

This kind of avoidance of reality ultimately creates more problems which is why I'm very aware of my inclination for this behaviour. I want things to go away without me having to look at them. That's not the way life works.

This has always been my reaction to unpleasantness. When I'm in a good space, and it doesn't seem overwhelming and/or I feel supported I can be very proactive in seeking the change I want, but if I'm stressed and feel overwhelmed prepare for me to disappear into a cocoon with a unaffected smile on my face. Even if facing reality is a simple thing and I know that understanding the worst case scenario will at the least relieve the stress of wondering what may happen, I'll still avoid and stick to being numb. And kick myself even as I'm continuing to do it.
 

Kasper

Diabolical
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Messages
11,590
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Enneagram
9w8
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so/sx
Social Nines: One Happy Family (Ichazo's "Participation") said:
Social Nines seek a sense of well being through social connection and friendship. People of this variant may often not seem like Nines because they are usually more outgoing, active, and involved in their world. There is more warmth and affection expressed by Nines of this variant. They tend to be idealistic and are often supportive of causes, acting as the "social glue" in many organizations and groups. But even in the midst of social activity, Social Nines remain strangely unaware of and unaffected by the problems of others. They are drawn to situations in which they feel they can belong, but they also internally hold themselves apart—usually by emotionally distancing themselves from others while maintaining an outward friendliness.

Since Social Nines tend to be affable and cheerful and enjoy having different experiences, they can resemble Sevens. They also tend to be more task-oriented: they enjoy working on projects and being involved in meaningful activities with others, so they can also resemble Threes. Unlike Threes, however, Social Nines have difficulty sustaining efforts on their own behalf. They do not easily pursue their own goals and tend to get sidetracked by social interactions and others' needs and agendas.

Well now this is interesting. Interesting in a very whoa that sounds familiar kinda way.

So I'm rather comfortable with wearing my 9w8 suit, it fits in ways that E7 never did, that always had a pretty superficial kind of fit to it while E9 resinates on a deeper level. But straight off I was unsure of my instincts again, one of the main reason I went with Sp/So for E7 was because it is the most withdrawn type for that Enneagram which for a type that is OUT THERE I needed to be in order to be comfortable trying it on.

I pretty sure I'm not a Sx dom but anything else could, maybe, potentially be possible.

On combination E-type and instinct tests I score as Sx/Sp/So, on ones that show instinct by type I will score as E7 Sp (sometimes So) or E9 Sx. On instinct tests I score as strongly Sp followed later by So/Sx.

So now I'm all like *throws hands in the air*
 

Fluxkom

New member
Joined
Apr 7, 2009
Messages
205
MBTI Type
ENTP
Enneagram
7w6
Instinctual Variant
so/sx
Ok, so I saw this topic like 6 hours ago and started reading it and then reading some more and watching your vid and some of the videos linked and oh boy can I relate to all of that.

In fact I'm in a very similar spot as you are.
My 7 and 9 traits always come very close when I do the Enneagramm with 8 being the runner up and all the stuff that you write about being relaxed and inactive resemble so hard, that it almost hurts to read this.

As you I haven't really figured out what type I'm really am, as I have both tendencies to 7 and 9 and can't nail it down.

I'm going to watch those 1 hour long videos on 7 and 9 that have been posted earlier this evening and get back to this thread eventually when I have some more insight.

Sorry, this is probably not really useful to you, but it sure as hell is for me, so thanks for starting!
 

Kasper

Diabolical
Joined
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Messages
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so/sx
Ok, so I saw this topic like 6 hours ago and started reading it and then reading some more and watching your vid and some of the videos linked and oh boy can I relate to all of that.

In fact I'm in a very similar spot as you are.
My 7 and 9 traits always come very close when I do the Enneagramm with 8 being the runner up and all the stuff that you write about being relaxed and inactive resemble so hard, that it almost hurts to read this.

As you I haven't really figured out what type I'm really am, as I have both tendencies to 7 and 9 and can't nail it down.

I'm going to watch those 1 hour long videos on 7 and 9 that have been posted earlier this evening and get back to this thread eventually when I have some more insight.

Sorry, this is probably not really useful to you, but it sure as hell is for me, so thanks for starting!

Coolness.

I took Udogs advice and tried E9 on for size seeing how I could fit with other self-typed 9s and ultimately I have figured out that even though many E7s are ENTPs and I can relate to them on a number of levels, the way that I can relate to E9s, who are by and large not ENTPs, is a lot more raw and hits on deeper (unspoken) motivations of mine while the way I relate to ENTP E7s is no different to how I relate to ENTP E3s, or E8s, or E6s etc. The more time that goes on the less I'm able to consider E7 as a serious option for my primary Etype. Naturally leaving options open is part of both ENTP and E9 so being decisive here is tough for me but I'll cringe, be brave and say E9 is where it's at. [that is quite seriously very difficult for me to commit to, even though I know it's honest]

E7 for me is half who I want to be, and half mistaken identity by E9 projection of happy-go-lucky as an avoidance of anything heavy tactic.

What I found most helpful, which may help you, was:

  • Putting it out there, feedback is something I need in order to be able to clarify my thoughts on things, ultimately I'm the only one who will make a decision, but I can be influenced relatively easily to consider different pov's, and I find that helpful. On that note, feel free to use this thread for your own purposes.

  • Interacting with other self-typed ENTP E9s, there's no guarantee anyone is correctly typed but interacting with someone who identifies the same way, which is non-stereotypical, was helpful to see aspects that may or may not be related to being an E9. With one ENTP E9 in particular it was like I was talking to myself, only I was a nearly married chick living in Texas who can grow my own vegetables =/

  • Noting how I did and did not identify with other ENTPs. Here I've identified with many ENTPs in how they view life and problems, but with the exception of Redcheerio, normally not how they express themselves. I care entirely too much with upsetting or offending someone, and not because I care about their feelings as much as I care about not causing conflict. When I do occasionally post something that I know someone may be offended by it is not uncommon for me to avoid the place where I have posted it for days dreading a hostile response. I will quite literally avoid an entire forum if I suspect someone may post something hostile in response to something I've said. This is so very much not normal for an ENTP.

  • These sites that were linked in E7 or E9 for the fears and desires at both healthy and unhealthy levels. I cannot honestly identify with E7 on anything but a surface level, so while my behaviour may look the same, it's not caused but the same motivators.

  • Plus of course, trying it on for size as in reading E9 descriptions and seeing it as reading a description of me and seeing how I could fit, and interacting and relating with others as a self-identified E9.
 

PeaceBaby

reborn
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In terms of inner peace: I somewhat struggle with figuring out what that means to me, as it has a strong association with E9 I don't know where confirmation bias starts and ends. It's not something I've thought about before so whatever the case it's not a conscious and named thought to seek it. This does not mean it's not important to me, I just can't figure out what importance I place on it.

In terms of outer peace: If I am able to compel change and create peace I will, if I am not I will leave. I want everyone to get along but know that is not realistic, so if people choose to be disharmonious I do not want to be around it.

With either: Give me an option to pick between "fun" and "peace" and I'll pick fun every time but if you give me the option of one and not the other such as "fun and chaotic/disharmony" or "peace and boring/static" I'll chose the latter. Boredom isn't something I have an issue with, I simply have a preference for fun, disharmony is something I have an issue with.

Numbing out however is something I strongly relate to, I've always done that whenever something I don't want to deal with crops up, rather than facing it like a responsible grownd-up person would, or distracting myself with action like an E7 would, I numb myself, shut out the world and think irrelevant happy thoughts, kinda like the kid who covers his eyes and says "you can't see me cause I can't see you".

This kind of avoidance of reality ultimately creates more problems which is why I'm very aware of my inclination for this behaviour. I want things to go away without me having to look at them. That's not the way life works.

This has always been my reaction to unpleasantness. When I'm in a good space, and it doesn't seem overwhelming and/or I feel supported I can be very proactive in seeking the change I want, but if I'm stressed and feel overwhelmed prepare for me to disappear into a cocoon with a unaffected smile on my face. Even if facing reality is a simple thing and I know that understanding the worst case scenario will at the least relieve the stress of wondering what may happen, I'll still avoid and stick to being numb. And kick myself even as I'm continuing to do it.

In neither of these responses do you mention anger, yet it is the key to both.

If you were to describe your relationship with anger, what terms would you use?
 

Kasper

Diabolical
Joined
May 30, 2008
Messages
11,590
MBTI Type
ENTP
Enneagram
9w8
Instinctual Variant
so/sx
In neither of these responses do you mention anger, yet it is the key to both.

If you were to describe your relationship with anger, what terms would you use?

AAAAAGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGH! *run*

*ahem* [composure regained] I mean, it is the emotion I am most NOT ok with. I can't handle it in myself and freak out a bit when it happens asking myself how and why and believing that it's not ok or acceptable that I experience it (although I mostly and likely erroneously believe that I don't experience it) and it is the emotion that if shown in others will cause me to never trust you again and get the hell away from you. I have a major issue with anger. Ma-ha-jor. =/ I think it's the thing that has most made me realise the E9 in me. If I could wipe out one emotion in the world, just one out of anything, anger would be it, and for selfish reasons, I can't handle it.

Seeing anger in others causes anxiety in me, and I am not an anxious person. I feel unable to cope with it, overwhelmed, and my instinct is to run if I can, tune out if I can't.
 

Lady_X

Well-known member
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sx/sp
oooh interesting! anger hardly phases me...that's probably a very good differentiation.
 

Fluxkom

New member
Joined
Apr 7, 2009
Messages
205
MBTI Type
ENTP
Enneagram
7w6
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so/sx
Ok, for me it is def. 9w8.

After talking about this alot more with my wife (who is quite experienced with the enneagramm) we had a close look at my test results.

7 and 9 both come up regularly very high above the others, but very close to each other so that there can be no real distinction be made.

In normal situations when everything is running fine I have both the positive traits of the 7 and the 9. Being very fun to be around and just overall awesome.

So we thought about my behaviour when getting pressured and BAM there it was, the typical 9 becoming passive and trying to avoid conflict at all cost.

So that is clear for me now.

Time to recognize that behaviour now and act on it. :)

Now I only need to finally decide if I'm really ENTP or any other EXXP combination :D
 

Kasper

Diabolical
Joined
May 30, 2008
Messages
11,590
MBTI Type
ENTP
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9w8
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so/sx
We for as long as you claim ENTPness, yay for another ENTP E9! xD
 
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