New member. Could you help me to type me in?

[hhp]

Well, first of all, hello to everybody; I'm new in here (and sorry if some of my expressions sound strange; I'm not English-speaking).

A book about enneagram has recently come to my hands and I have some doubts that I'd like to resolve. When reading the book I identified myself strongly with type 5, and my mother also identified me as a 5, almost immediately. All the tests I've made say clearly that I'm a 5, but there's still some aspects that don't seem to fit well.

On the one hand, I'm indeed a cold and detached person, that always keeps the distances; I don't like others seeing too much of my inner self. My emotions aren't usually strong, I mean, I don't seem to feel as happy or as sad as other people do. For me it's awkward when I see people crying, and I'm not good at comforting them. I get the impression that people come to me seeking objective opinions rather than warmth or sympathy.
I've got also the compulsion to live as austere as I can, because I see material needs as weaknesses; I don't buy anything that I don't need, and I don't throw away anything that could be useful someday.

But on the other hand, nobody who really knows me would say that I'm passive, quiet or gentle. I've got a quick-temper, I've got problems controlling my anger, and whenever I feel I'm being attacked (and that's often) I react with aggression (unless I feel very insecure and outnumbered). I've had problems with people because of this attitude.
In social groups I usually stay silent or laconic, although that's rather out of boredom or indifference than shyness. But as soon an interesting or polemic topic arises, I tend to strongly defend my opinions. I recognize that I'm pretty dogmatic and intolerant sometimes, and I see things as correct/incorrect as long as they agree with my point of view.
Other thing that makes me doubt I'm a 5 is the fact that I'm not interested in science at all. I absolutely hate maths and everything that has to do with numbers. My natural talents have always been story-writing and drawing; with numbers I'm pretty mediocre, even incompetent.

So, do you think these characteristics are compatible with types 5?, or have I mistyped me?

Thank you very much for reading until here and for your help.

 

[Such Irony]

I think you could be a type 5. Probably a 5 with a strong connection to type 8. Interest in a science and math is one of those stereotypical type 5 things that isn't going to fit all 5s. Plently of 5's have no interest in math/science.

 

[Richardsen]

I guess 5w6 with 8 as your trifix
5s can be quiet aggresive too.

 

[VagrantFarce]

Enneagram tyes aren't going to identify every little behavioural quirk you have, they're only mentioned to help illustrate how the unconscious fixations may express themselves. They certainly don't determine your interests or hobbies, no more than they determine what your friends are like or what colour hair you have.

You sound just like a 5 - you're intellectually competent, you don't ask for much, and you pride yourself for it. However, placing your stakes in the world emotionally feels scary and risky and chaotic - so you stick to your thoughts and ideas, staying on the sidelines instead of finding the strength to fully commit to life. This is step one.

 

[sleuthiness]

sp/so e89? Whether s/he actually does or not, 8s will jump right into how quickly s/he is to temper, whereas 5s (apart from nutso sx/sps) tend not to.

 

[hhp]

Thanks for the answers, that helped me to finally confirm what I suspected.

I think I'll settle with a 5w4 (the descriptions of 5w6 just don't seem so familiar to me). As for the instinctual type, is sexual for sure. Trifix...mmm, probably 5-4-8.
There must be an 8 somewhere in the mix, but I can't be just an 8; I don't fit in the general picture. The problem is that, trying to look back at my reactions in the past, I'm not sure how angry or hostile I really was; maybe more than I think, maybe less? Memories become distorted after a while...

Well, it seems that fixing me wasn't so difficult after all. Trascending the fixation....now that's a different problem.
Just another question: is it really type 5 so uncommon among women? I'm a girl, and I saw somewhere a graphic that showed that 5's were the rarest type among women, although 2's were the rarest among men. Why is that? Different education during childhood?

 

[Elfboy]

Well, first of all, hello to everybody; I'm new in here (and sorry if some of my expressions sound strange; I'm not English-speaking).

A book about enneagram has recently come to my hands and I have some doubts that I'd like to resolve. When reading the book I identified myself strongly with type 5, and my mother also identified me as a 5, almost immediately. All the tests I've made say clearly that I'm a 5, but there's still some aspects that don't seem to fit well.

On the one hand, I'm indeed a cold and detached person, that always keeps the distances; I don't like others seeing too much of my inner self. My emotions aren't usually strong, I mean, I don't seem to feel as happy or as sad as other people do. For me it's awkward when I see people crying, and I'm not good at comforting them. I get the impression that people come to me seeking objective opinions rather than warmth or sympathy.
I've got also the compulsion to live as austere as I can, because I see material needs as weaknesses; I don't buy anything that I don't need, and I don't throw away anything that could be useful someday.

But on the other hand, nobody who really knows me would say that I'm passive, quiet or gentle. I've got a quick-temper, I've got problems controlling my anger, and whenever I feel I'm being attacked (and that's often) I react with aggression (unless I feel very insecure and outnumbered). I've had problems with people because of this attitude.
In social groups I usually stay silent or laconic, although that's rather out of boredom or indifference than shyness. But as soon an interesting or polemic topic arises, I tend to strongly defend my opinions. I recognize that I'm pretty dogmatic and intolerant sometimes, and I see things as correct/incorrect as long as they agree with my point of view.
Other thing that makes me doubt I'm a 5 is the fact that I'm not interested in science at all. I absolutely hate maths and everything that has to do with numbers. My natural talents have always been story-writing and drawing; with numbers I'm pretty mediocre, even incompetent.

So, do you think these characteristics are compatible with types 5?, or have I mistyped me?

Thank you very much for reading until here and for your help.

you sound like a Self Preservation 8 or 5 (can't tell your wing or second strongest instinct) but I'll have to read more of your posts to be more certain

 

[Richardsen]

Thanks for the answers, that helped me to finally confirm what I suspected.

I think I'll settle with a 5w4 (the descriptions of 5w6 just don't seem so familiar to me). As for the instinctual type, is sexual for sure. Trifix...mmm, probably 5-4-8.

I saw a lot of counterphobic 6 in your first post...
Sx 5w6 are the most commonly mistyped as 5w4

 

[hhp]

I saw a lot of counterphobic 6 in your first post...
Sx 5w6 are the most commonly mistyped as 5w4

Oh. Then I'm not sure...What are the major differences between 5w6 and 5w4?

And another question: Is it possible for somebody to be permanently in the middle of a line instead of being in one point? Or the person only moves along a line in certain situations, when stressed or secure?

 

[VagrantFarce]

Oh. Then I'm not sure...What are the major differences between 5w6 and 5w4?

And another question: Is it possible for somebody to be permanently in the middle of a line instead of being in one point? Or the person only moves along a line in certain situations, when stressed or secure?

My honest opinion: the wings are far too arbitrary to take seriously (they're only derived from how the types sit in relation to each other on the enneagram shape itself), so don't get caught up in them too much.

 

[Asterion]

As a 5, I feel emotions quite strongly in my solitude. It's when I'm around others that those feelings are suppressed out of fear of getting too involved and becoming vulnerable to other people, it's only when familiar with people that I open up more and become lively. I know some 5s that seem completely robotic, their voice is monotonous, their speech so formal and to the point as to hide themselves. Other fives hide behind passivity, they might smile slightly, try to be nice and polite until they feel safe enough to let other people into their lives.

From the looks of it, the other half of yourself that you describe is your behavior in a safe environment, with a select few friends or family that you feel comfortable to be with you can be more like an 8, showing more aggression and being more confident.

The rarity of type 5 women and type 2 men could be due to mistypes, but I have no idea how they gathered those statistics.

And another question: Is it possible for somebody to be permanently in the middle of a line instead of being in one point? Or the person only moves along a line in certain situations, when stressed or secure?

Such a 5 question, exploring the systems limits are we?

Everyone has a little bit of each type within themselves. All of the 'types' are all just habits, patterns that we follow, something that drives us to behave in certain ways. There is generally one habit that we are fixated on that hinders us the most. In this way the types are fixed into place as points on the Enneagram. For five, they have a habit of sitting back and observing to defend themselves, but it's not only 5s that will do this, a person of any type can sit back and observe, the difference is that type 5 is more fixated on it, it's their default mode of behavior.

Within each type there are psychological levels of health that manifest in different ways often resembling other types on the Enneagram. Your level of psychological health is dynamic, so like you said, it will change when stressed or secure.


I think this details it perfectly:
http://www.enneagraminstitute.com/intro.asp

 

[hhp]

As a 5, I feel emotions quite strongly in my solitude. It's when I'm around others that those feelings are suppressed out of fear of getting too involved and becoming vulnerable to other people

I used to be more like that in my teenage years; I mean, being capable of strong feelings, at least when I was alone. But I'm afraid that with the passing of years, I've become more and more alienated from emotions.
When I've got a problem, it goes directly to my head, and I can get very frustrated or worried or even obsessed with that problem, but it works only at a rational level; as long as I think about it, I don't feel it.
Also, the things that most disrupt me are rather theoretical: things that challenge or destroy my vision of the world. I don't get so much involved with more down-to-earth problems (relationships and the like).

I'm also uneasy with intimate conversations. I don't mind talking about general themes, or about my external life (what I did last holydays, what I'm doing now, etc...). But I find questions like "what do you want to do in the future, what are your dreams or your true interests?" too intrusive. It's as if knowledge was power, so the more the others know about me, the weaker I'd be.
Oddly enough, I've got also the strong desire of being noticed, of being truly known by somebody, but at the same time, I prevent it with my actions.

 

[Asterion]

I used to be more like that in my teenage years; I mean, being capable of strong feelings, at least when I was alone. But I'm afraid that with the passing of years, I've become more and more alienated from emotions.
When I've got a problem, it goes directly to my head, and I can get very frustrated or worried or even obsessed with that problem, but it works only at a rational level; as long as I think about it, I don't feel it.
Also, the things that most disrupt me are rather theoretical: things that challenge or destroy my vision of the world. I don't get so much involved with more down-to-earth problems (relationships and the like).

Maybe you should try meditation? One thing that fives always struggle with is stopping their minds from turning, which should free up space for feeling, right? Meditation also helps to actually relax, I've always tried to play games to relax... but I end up focusing on them, trying to win and getting so intense about them that it takes away a lot of energy. I come on here to relax - and end up thinking and thinking and thinking...

I'm also uneasy with intimate conversations. I don't mind talking about general themes, or about my external life (what I did last holydays, what I'm doing now, etc...). But I find questions like "what do you want to do in the future, what are your dreams or your true interests?" too intrusive. It's as if knowledge was power, so the more the others know about me, the weaker I'd be.

Oddly enough, I've got also the strong desire of being noticed, of being truly known by somebody, but at the same time, I prevent it with my actions.

Yeah, I think a lot of 5s get that. From one of Palmer's books, a lot of fives say they like to drop everything and suddenly travel to unfamiliar places and become very extraverted and form all sorts of relationships, practically starting a whole new life. Eventually they get too close and people expect emotional connection and the 5 suddenly disappears and goes home. Funny thing is that even some of the people closest to the five might never know.

And the sadest part is that the five will always keep those people in their heads, every conversation, every feeling will usually visit them in their isolated mind, and they savor and explore every intense morsel of intimacy that was perhaps too much for them to handle at the time. Those people they have connected too often feel that the five doesn't care and has abandoned them (potentially disastrous with 4s, I've certainly had a brief run in), but they will never realize that the 5 has had them in their mind for a long time.

 

[jixmixfix]

Well, first of all, hello to everybody; I'm new in here (and sorry if some of my expressions sound strange; I'm not English-speaking).

A book about enneagram has recently come to my hands and I have some doubts that I'd like to resolve. When reading the book I identified myself strongly with type 5, and my mother also identified me as a 5, almost immediately. All the tests I've made say clearly that I'm a 5, but there's still some aspects that don't seem to fit well.

On the one hand, I'm indeed a cold and detached person, that always keeps the distances; I don't like others seeing too much of my inner self. My emotions aren't usually strong, I mean, I don't seem to feel as happy or as sad as other people do. For me it's awkward when I see people crying, and I'm not good at comforting them. I get the impression that people come to me seeking objective opinions rather than warmth or sympathy.
I've got also the compulsion to live as austere as I can, because I see material needs as weaknesses; I don't buy anything that I don't need, and I don't throw away anything that could be useful someday.

But on the other hand, nobody who really knows me would say that I'm passive, quiet or gentle. I've got a quick-temper, I've got problems controlling my anger, and whenever I feel I'm being attacked (and that's often) I react with aggression (unless I feel very insecure and outnumbered). I've had problems with people because of this attitude.
In social groups I usually stay silent or laconic, although that's rather out of boredom or indifference than shyness. But as soon an interesting or polemic topic arises, I tend to strongly defend my opinions. I recognize that I'm pretty dogmatic and intolerant sometimes, and I see things as correct/incorrect as long as they agree with my point of view.
Other thing that makes me doubt I'm a 5 is the fact that I'm not interested in science at all. I absolutely hate maths and everything that has to do with numbers. My natural talents have always been story-writing and drawing; with numbers I'm pretty mediocre, even incompetent.

So, do you think these characteristics are compatible with types 5?, or have I mistyped me?

Thank you very much for reading until here and for your help.

I can relate to alot of what you say I'm a type 5 and I'm not a fan of math homework I prefer dealing with real life problems . I'm pretty aggravated by people at times people tend to disappoint me and it's hard to pin point why but I'm pretty sensitive to negativity so I try to be around positive influences. I also have a short fuse but at the same time I can be very patient so it's a double edged sword there. I think my short fuse has to do with word accuracy I take what people say more seriously than they take themselves sometimes. I remember one of my swimming instructors called me a "lion or sheep" I thought that was pretty funny.

 

[hhp]

Maybe you should try meditation? One thing that fives always struggle with is stopping their minds from turning, which should free up space for feeling, right?

Oh, I've tried sometimes to relax and stop thinking, but it was of no use.
I've found that physical exercise helps me more to disconnect. Either that, or submerging myself into small unimportant things that require nonetheless a lot of concentration (like fixing something which is broken, with lot of small pieces).

I'm pretty aggravated by people at times people tend to disappoint me and it's hard to pin point why but I'm pretty sensitive to negativity so I try to be around positive influences.

I'm often like that. It's not just that certain people disappoint me, but sometimes also the world in general. I mean, I've got low tolerance for things that don't work the way I think they should. Most of the time I can't adapt to changes in society, specially if I see them useless or for the worse; I try to oppose them and live in the past.
In this way I'm a bit like types 1; I really need to cool down and take a more "lasseiz faire" approach to life, like 9's.

 

[Mal12345]

There is nothing in enneagram theory that says you can't move to 8 in a negative way, especially if you are in a socially comfortable or familiar situation. So you might stuff down your anger at total strangers, but someone you've known for years might become a target.

I'm not saying that the enneagram explains everything, but it does explain it in incredible detail.

 

[Savage Idealist]

5w6cp could be a possibility in as much as 5w4; the cp6 is going to make a 5 more prone to assertive and aggressive behaviors and possibly somewhat lest trusting in general; the 4 is going to make the 5 more in touch with their emotion and be somewhat abstract. These desciprtions can describe what I'm trying to say better:

5w4
The difference between the 4 wing and the 6 wing in Fives is like the difference between Art and Science. 4 wing brings an abstract, intuitive cast of thought, as though the Five were thinking in geometric shapes instead of words or realistic images. May be talented artistically and inhabit moods like Fours do. Combine intellectual and emotional imagination. Enjoy the realm of philosophy and beautiful constructs of thought. The marriage of mental perspective and aesthetics is the best of life for them. When more defensive may seem a little ghostly, have a whisper in their voice. Fluctuate between impersonal withdrawal and bursts of friendly caring. Can get floaty and abstract. Act like they're inside a bubble, sometimes with an air of implicit superiority. Cliché of the "absentminded professor" applies especially to Fives with this wing. Environmentally sensitive and subject at times to total overwhelm. Touchy about criticism. Can be slow to recover from traumatic events. Melancholy isolation and bleak existential depression are possible pitfalls.

5w6
The 6 wing brings an orientation to detail and technical knowledge, along with the tendency to think in logical sequence. Especially intellectual, far more analytical than Fives with a 4 wing. Can be loyal friends, offering strong behind-the-scenes support. Kind, patient teachers, skillful experts. May have a sense of mission and work hard. Sometimes project an aura of sensitive nerdiness and have clumsy social skills. When defensive, they can be unnerved by the expectations of others. May like people more but avoid them more. Especially sensitive to social indebtedness. Could have trouble saying "thank you." Fear of taking action, develop "information addiction" instead. Ask lots of questions but don't get around to the decision at hand. When more entranced, they develop a suspicious scrutiny of other people's motives but can also be blind followers. Misanthropic and Scrooge-like when defensive. More able to keep their feelings cut off in a constant way. Can be cold, skeptical, ironic, and disassociated. A Five's 6 wing can be phobic or counterphobic. Counterphobic 6 wing brings courage and antiauthoritarian attitudes. When defensive they may mock authority, or angrily tell others off. Tend to "push the envelope," experiment, find what the limits are.

 

[ICUP]

5w4 possibility.

 

[hhp]

I was more inclined at first towards the 5w4 possibility, but that was rather because of the stereotype of "5w6=science" and "5w4=arts".
But probably cp 5w6 describes me much better.
After all, any enneagram type can be interested in art or literature; not only 4's. And now that I think about it, although I don't like sciences very much and prefer writing, my style of writing is rather cynical and detached. Maybe a 4 wing would bring a more emotional or poetic inclination, which it's not my case.
My sister, for example, is a 4, and I've always found her writing too dramatic and over-the-top, so I suppose it's all about personality clash there.