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INFP or INTP?

Silveresque

Active member
Joined
Jul 28, 2011
Messages
1,169
This time, I'd like to get my type mystery solved once and for all. So anyways, let the typing begin!

Some (hopefully) helpful information to start with:

-I wouldn't say I have a particularly strong sense of right and wrong, since I tend not to believe in absolutes, but unfairness can make me very angry
-I try to detach, look at all sides, and analyze possible outcomes (emotional impact counts) to decide whether an action is right or wrong, but I prefer not to judge people
-I like :hug: on the forum, but irl they make me feel awkward :eeep:
-I like foreign languages, psychology, and math, but I'm terrible at science
-I care a lot about harmony and am very careful not to upset anyone or hurt people's feelings
-I have an INFP 4w5 friend and an INTP 5w4 friend. My INFP friend seems very moody and judgmental compared to me, and my INTP friend is much more intellectual. Neither is particularly like me, though overall I relate much more to my INTP friend
-I can be quite sensitive (though I don't get angry when I'm criticized, I just get embarrassed and feel like an idiot)
-In most cases I prefer efficiency over correctness. I can be a perfectionist sometimes if it's something I really care about, but generally I'm not
-It bothers me when people mispronounce words and I feel like correcting them (though I often don't because I don't want to be annoying)
-I can use Fe, but it takes a lot of energy and focus, so I can't use it very often
-I nearly always value mercy over justice
-I'm very attracted to the idea of humanitarianism

I also very much relate to this recent post by [MENTION=7]Jennifer[/MENTION]:
Fe inferior.

Emotions are indecipherable, hence a bit frightening and to be avoided.

Also, society typically runs off other concerns and while growing up INTPs are often poked and prodded and jammed into the social structure against their will. There can be a fear and resentment there of being controlled in such a fashion, with no way out since one is under the authority of those with different concerns; and having to watch the world consistently run in patterns that seem highly irrational and shallow, and finding few people to connect with.

There can be intense feelings of alientation, loneliness, and frustration with life. Some just get bitter.

I've been thinking lately about how much of social interaction is just required ritual, and that really bothers me. Socialization is filled with people asking questions to be polite and friendly when they don't actually care about hearing the answer. These social norms are made up of shallow rules and regulations, and if you don't follow them you risk sounding rude or cold. It bothers me that these social norms essentially force me to choose between being inauthentic and disrupting social harmony.

Another thing that bothers me is that people can never truly understand how I feel and think on the inside. People only know what I show on the outside, and I'm not very good at representing my true self. I kind of wish Vulcan mind melds or a similar form of telepathy existed so that people could share their inner worlds and truly connect beyond a surface level.


Anyways, I'm sure this doesn't give the whole picture, it's just a list of things I happened to think of at the moment, so please ask questions.
 
A

Anew Leaf

Guest
INFP because we need our numbers to grow and since we cannot inbreed we have to convert from without.

We're kind of like werewolves and vampires.

Welcome! Have some jello!
 

Silveresque

Active member
Joined
Jul 28, 2011
Messages
1,169
INFP because we need our numbers to grow and since we cannot inbreed we have to convert from without.

We're kind of like werewolves and vampires.

Welcome! Have some jello!

Mmmm, jello! That'll go great with my stash of pudding. :)
 

erm

Permabanned
Joined
Jun 19, 2007
Messages
1,652
MBTI Type
INFP
Enneagram
5
Quick run down:-

-I wouldn't say I have a particularly strong sense of right and wrong, since I tend not to believe in absolutes, but unfairness can make me very angry

First part suggests INFP, last clause suggests INTP.

Honestly INFPs tend to have weaker senses of right and wrong. That goes against the stereotype, I know, but it's because they tend to compulsively analyse and doubt in this area, whereas INTPs tend to compulsively analyse elsewhere. Yes, INTPs are more likely to say there is no right and wrong in this sense, or generally be much more apathetic to the concept intellectually, but their actions will tend to be based on a much more stable foundation of "right and wrong" they inevitably rely on regardless. INFPs will usually keep smashing that foundation compulsively, especially the more intellectually prone or detached INFPs.

-I try to detach, look at all sides, and analyze possible outcomes (emotional impact counts) to decide whether an action is right or wrong, but I prefer not to judge people

Almost essential to being INFP, but INTPs can do this a lot too.

-I like :hug: on the forum, but irl they make me feel awkward :eeep:

Doesn't differentiate

-I like foreign languages, psychology, and math, but I'm terrible at science

Doesn't differentiate.

-I care a lot about harmony and am very careful not to upset anyone or hurt people's feelings

Suggests INFP

In general they analyse and focus on feelings a lot more than INTPs. INTPs can do it too, though.

-I have an INFP 4w5 friend and an INTP 5w4 friend. My INFP friend seems very moody and judgmental compared to me, and my INTP friend is much more intellectual. Neither is particularly like me, though overall I relate much more to my INTP friend

Doesn't differentiate, unless you clarify why you relate to the INTP more. It could be for reasons unrelated to type, for example.

-I can be quite sensitive (though I don't get angry when I'm criticized, I just get embarrassed and feel like an idiot)

Doesn't differentiate

-In most cases I prefer efficiency over correctness. I can be a perfectionist sometimes if it's something I really care about, but generally I'm not

Doesn't differentiate

-It bothers me when people mispronounce words and I feel like correcting them (though I often don't because I don't want to be annoying)

Suggests INTP

I have no idea why this is the case, INTPs just seem to do this a lot more than INFPs. INTPs greater focus on systems and their consistency, perhaps.

-I can use Fe, but it takes a lot of energy and focus, so I can't use it very often

Depends what you mean. INFPs, on average, find it harder to use Fe than INTPs, but both types find it difficult.

-I nearly always value mercy over justice

Suggests INFP

Feeling over Thinking. Feelers tend to be more consequentialist, Thinkers more deontological. It's a vague tendency, but it's there. It's related to Thinkers valuing consistency more than Feelers, on average, and Feelers greater focus on feelings and emotions (which are very consequential in nature).

Another example is one's general reactions to hypocrisy. Feelers, on average, will care less about it as it is a deontological concept, based on consistency.

-I'm very attracted to the idea of humanitarianism

Doesn't really differentiate without clarification.

I also very much relate to this recent post by Jennifer

Suggests INTP, unless you ignore the line regarding emotions, in which case it doesn't differentiate.

I've been thinking lately about how much of social interaction is just required ritual, and that really bothers me. Socialization is filled with people asking questions to be polite and friendly when they don't actually care about hearing the answer. These social norms are made up of shallow rules and regulations, and if you don't follow them you risk sounding rude or cold. It bothers me that these social norms essentially force me to choose between being inauthentic and disrupting social harmony.

Doesn't differentiate

Another thing that bothers me is that people can never truly understand how I feel and think on the inside. People only know what I show on the outside, and I'm not very good at representing my true self. I kind of wish Vulcan mind melds or a similar form of telepathy existed so that people could share their inner worlds and truly connect beyond a surface level.

I'm gonna say it doesn't differentiate. Personally I think it suggests INTP, since they seem to dislike isolation more than INFPs, on average, but many would say INFPs long for that deeper intimacy, whereas INTPs long for the realistic forms of intimacy. Both caring a lot less about missing the other type of intimacy.

Overall, if I had to guess from this, INFP 5. The 5 makes you look a lot like an INTP, but it doesn't actually make you more INTP. It's an external appearance thing.

Question: When you find yourself in a detached state of mind, do you find you consciously activate it on some level? Put another way, do you deliberately try to do it?

I ask because INFPs tend to do it deliberately and more consciously, whereas INTPs tend to do it much more instinctively or naturally. It's quite possible for an INFP to detach as much, or more so, than an INTP, though it's a lot rarer than vice versa.

That was the main reason I decided on INFP 6w5 for myself. I detach and rationalise more than the average INTP, dare I say, but the motivation to do so comes from Fi.
 

Silveresque

Active member
Joined
Jul 28, 2011
Messages
1,169
-I have an INFP 4w5 friend and an INTP 5w4 friend. My INFP friend seems very moody and judgmental compared to me, and my INTP friend is much more intellectual. Neither is particularly like me, though overall I relate much more to my INTP friend
Doesn't differentiate, unless you clarify why you relate to the INTP more. It could be for reasons unrelated to type, for example.

Personality-wise, I'm much more like my INTP friend. I'm not really looking at specifics here, I'm just going by the overall picture or vibes. I have an easier time getting along with her. My INFP friend is completely different from me and I have trouble relating to her at all.

I also very much relate to this recent post by Jennifer
Suggests INTP, unless you ignore the line regarding emotions, in which case it doesn't differentiate.

I don't really relate to that line. I don't find emotions particularly scary or alien.

Question: When you find yourself in a detached state of mind, do you find you consciously activate it on some level? Put another way, do you deliberately try to do it?

I ask because INFPs tend to do it deliberately and more consciously, whereas INTPs tend to do it much more instinctively or naturally. It's quite possible for an INFP to detach as much, or more so, than an INTP, though it's a lot rarer than vice versa.

That was the main reason I decided on INFP 6w5 for myself. I detach and rationalise more than the average INTP, dare I say, but the motivation to do so comes from Fi.

It depends on whether or not I have an emotional reaction to begin with. If I do, then I consciously detach. But often I'm already detached and aloof, especially when I've been isolated for too long.
 

JocktheMotie

Habitual Fi LineStepper
Joined
Nov 20, 2008
Messages
8,491
A lot of it has to do with comments I've seen from you [I think I've repped you on one or some of them] involving pacifying fear and worry by expelling it from your mind, whereas a 5 will tend to intellectualize it and compartmentalize in order to maintain control via distance. I specifically enjoyed how you made a blog and had no idea what to do with something that was unquestionably yours, immediately wondering what other people do with theirs and thus, expect out of you :) You seem to have a very highly agreeable, moderating nature about you that would lead one to think 9 over 5 as well.

Keep in mind, 9s can be just as intellectual as 5s but for 5s it's a symptom of a greater fixation rather than a character trait, like it is for others. 9s also tend to be inherently idealistic and holistic while 5s are more cynical and reductionist.
 

Silveresque

Active member
Joined
Jul 28, 2011
Messages
1,169
A lot of it has to do with comments I've seen from you [I think I've repped you on one or some of them] involving pacifying fear and worry by expelling it from your mind, whereas a 5 will tend to intellectualize it and compartmentalize in order to maintain control via distance. I specifically enjoyed how you made a blog and had no idea what to do with something that was unquestionably yours, immediately wondering what other people do with theirs and thus, expect out of you :) You seem to have a very highly agreeable, moderating nature about you that would lead one to think 9 over 5 as well.

Keep in mind, 9s can be just as intellectual as 5s but for 5s it's a symptom of a greater fixation rather than a character trait, like it is for others. 9s also tend to be inherently idealistic and holistic while 5s are more cynical and reductionist.

Funny, I just finished writing another post that demonstrates what you just said here. :laugh:

Anyways, being intellectual isn't my reason for being a 5 (I'm actually not particularly intellectual), it's the isolation. Apparently 9 and recluse don't mix. 5's isolate themselves from people while 9's move toward others. Also, it seems that 9's are pleasant and agreeable to the point where they are focused on others at the expense of their own needs and desires. I'm not particularly other-oriented. My reason for being pleasant and agreeable is because I don't want to upset people and I don't want people to dislike me, which is probably a reason 9 would have as well, but I still don't see myself as being nearly as other-oriented as a 9 would have to be.
 
G

Glycerine

Guest
Nines aren't necessary engaged. Not dictating that you are a specific type but here is some food for thought. Here is an excerpt from http://www.amazon.com/Personality-Types-Using-Enneagram-Self-Discovery/dp/0395798671

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Silveresque

Active member
Joined
Jul 28, 2011
Messages
1,169
This fits me VERY well. :happy0065:

Did you happen to read my post from the "A word for fellow 9's" thread? This made me think of that post.
I'm very good at wasting time (euphemism for "I'm very lazy" :laugh:). Lately it feels like I have to have a ridiculously large chunk of time available before I'll feel comfortable starting a simple task. I'll put something off all day long until the evening when I have several hours of free time, and then it ends up only taking 10 minutes to do. This even applies to recreation. It seems like I can't start an activity that requires time (such as reading, drawing, or watching a movie) unless I have way more time than I actually need, so I'll end up spending most of my time doing simple and easy things like foruming and listening to music. I blame the 9 in my tritype. :doh: Though the 9 does make me less anxious compared to other 5's. I tend not to worry about things that are beyond my control (and I prefer not to worry in general).

Anyways, about the only big problem I have with 9's is the isolation. But I've read that 9's can take an indifferent and apathetic stance to the world, so perhaps that indifference combined with sloth could lead to becoming a recluse. :thinking:

I'm a recluse because I don't particularly enjoy socializing, and I hate it when people control my time (anger at being controlled could be 5 or 9). Whenever I do find myself in a social situation, I'm very quiet, aloof, and disengaged (again, could be 5 or 9). I don't show it, but I get annoyed when I have to respond in certain ways or ask questions just to seem polite and friendly and keep the conversation going, when I would really much rather be alone in my room where I can be myself. I'm almost beginning to wonder if maintaining friendships is really worth the effort, when all I ever get is shallow interaction and social obligations.

Ugh, enough negativity. I'm not really that cynical. :laugh:
 
G

Glycerine

Guest
9s need for inner peace drives their interactions so either they will tend to fix the environment/people so there's harmony or they will completely disengage in order not to be affected by the chaos.

5s detach out of fear of not meeting social expectations/pressures (incompetence, helpless, incapable). They combat this by trying to gain resources (ex. information) so they will be "prepared". The mind is their line of defense against the unknown.

5s overanalyze while 9s zone out (disengage) when retreating into their minds.
 

Silveresque

Active member
Joined
Jul 28, 2011
Messages
1,169
9s need for inner peace drives their interactions so either they will tend to fix the environment/people so there's harmony or will completely disengage in order not to be affected by the chaos.

5s detach out of fear of not meeting social expectations/pressures (incompetence, helpless, incapable). They combat this by trying to gain resources (ex. information) so they will be "prepared". The mind is their line of defense against the unknown.

5s overanalyze while 9s zone out (disengage).

Interesting. I definitely zone out and stop thinking about all the things I have to do so that I don't get stressed out. And I'm not sure I'm really as mentally engaged as a 5 would be. Lately my thinking seems a bit hazy and unfocused...:shrug:
 
G

Glycerine

Guest
In comparison to my mom (INFP, e9), I (NFJ e5), my mind is constantly analyzing something, I am much more of a worry wort, pessimist, removed from my environment, intense, private, hard to get to know. She's more optimistic, laidback, a bit more receptive, more engaged in the environment (this doesn't mean that she's 100% extrovert by any means.... she engages people but is only close to a select few). I drive her nuts with my overanalytical brain.
 

Vizzy

New member
Joined
Jul 27, 2011
Messages
229
Enneagram
5w4
9s need for inner peace drives their interactions so either they will tend to fix the environment/people so there's harmony or they will completely disengage in order not to be affected by the chaos.

5s detach out of fear of not meeting social expectations/pressures (incompetence, helpless, incapable). They combat this by trying to gain resources (ex. information) so they will be "prepared". The mind is their line of defense against the unknown.

5s overanalyze while 9s zone out (disengage) when retreating into their minds.

Then I'm a 5 for sure, not that I was ever in doubt.

I don't prioritize feelings, but that definitely doesn't mean I block them out. I give everything a lot of mental "air- time" and analyse/mull over them, often trying to figure out "Why?" and get to the bottom of it all. I revel in those moments. Actually, it's meditative for me.

As far as I'm concerned, there's no such thing as being "too stimulated", and I'd never allow myself to get to the point of being "too exhausted" anyway - well, not from thinking, at least.
I also don't relate to the 9's preference to disengage in order not to be affected by chaos. On the contrary, I might try and get closer to the action so I can "get a better view" of what's happening and be "in the know" It doesn't necessarily mean I'll engage.
 

Silveresque

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Jul 28, 2011
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I like how this thread was supposed to be about my MBTI type and ended up being about my enneatype. :laugh:

Anyways, I fall on the 9 side when it comes to dealing with stress and anxiety. I'm pretty much always disengaged in order to avoid dealing with stress. And I've never really related to 5's being an observer. I'm only really an observer in the sense that I'm disengaged and not active, but I'm really not a very observant person. I'm often oblivious to what's going on around me, which makes me clumsy. Sometimes I end up walking into things because I'm spaced out and not paying attention. :laugh:

But I don't lose myself in others. I fall on the 5 side when it comes to dealing with others, because I move away from people rather than toward them. So I don't know. I don't fit neatly into either type it seems. :shrug:
 

Viridian

New member
Joined
Dec 30, 2010
Messages
3,036
MBTI Type
IsFJ
Interesting. I definitely zone out and stop thinking about all the things I have to do so that I don't get stressed out. And I'm not sure I'm really as mentally engaged as a 5 would be. Lately my thinking seems a bit hazy and unfocused...:shrug:

Have you been getting enough sleep lately? I've been sleeping a bit late, and that kind of impairs my thinking when I'm trying my best to focus... :sleeping:

Not getting enough sleep can make your mind hazy. Might be worth looking into, I think.

I like how this thread was supposed to be about my MBTI type and ended up being about my enneatype. :laugh:

Anyways, I fall on the 9 side when it comes to dealing with stress and anxiety. I'm pretty much always disengaged in order to avoid dealing with stress. And I've never really related to 5's being an observer. I'm only really an observer in the sense that I'm disengaged and not active, but I'm really not a very observant person. I'm often oblivious to what's going on around me, which makes me clumsy. Sometimes I end up walking into things because I'm spaced out and not paying attention. :laugh:

But I don't lose myself in others. I fall on the 5 side when it comes to dealing with others, because I move away from people rather than toward them. So I don't know. I don't fit neatly into either type it seems. :shrug:

I relate quite a lot to the stuff you write. :shock: Unfortunately, that might mean I can't help you very much, since I can't quite grasp my own type... :doh: I apologize. :sorry:
 

Silveresque

Active member
Joined
Jul 28, 2011
Messages
1,169
Have you been getting enough sleep lately? I've been sleeping a bit late, and that kind of impairs my thinking when I'm trying my best to focus... :sleeping:

Not getting enough sleep can make your mind hazy. Might be worth looking into, I think.

I get plenty of sleep. My thinking isn't quite so hazy right now. I guess I was pretty tired last night. :laugh:

But overall, I still don't feel as mentally engaged as a I would expect a 5 to be. I zone out all the time, and I'm not necessarily analyzing something or thinking about anything in particular. In Spanish class, sometimes I just involuntarily zone out and miss what the teacher's saying, and then as soon as I realize that I'm not paying attention, I try to focus again. It's not like I have ADD or anything, but I'm amazed at how hard it is to pay attention and not drift off sometimes.

I relate quite a lot to the stuff you write. :shock: Unfortunately, that might mean I can't help you very much, since I can't quite grasp my own type... :doh: I apologize. :sorry:

Interesting. Do you relate to moving away from people rather than toward them?
 

Viridian

New member
Joined
Dec 30, 2010
Messages
3,036
MBTI Type
IsFJ
I get plenty of sleep. My thinking isn't quite so hazy right now. I guess I was pretty tired last night. :laugh:

But overall, I still don't feel as mentally engaged as a I would expect a 5 to be. I zone out all the time, and I'm not necessarily analyzing something or thinking about anything in particular. In Spanish class, sometimes I just involuntarily zone out and miss what the teacher's saying, and then as soon as I realize that I'm not paying attention, I try to focus again. It's not like I have ADD or anything, but I'm amazed at how hard it is to pay attention and not drift off sometimes.

Hmmm... That seems to refute my "poor sleep" hypothesis. Keep in mind, though, that 5w4s can be less expressively logical than 5w6s. :yes:

Interesting. Do you relate to moving away from people rather than toward them?

In a way, yes. I feel guilty about the idea of abandoning, rejecting or being cold to people, but I naturally seek very few people to truly engage with. I'm a natural shrinking violet in some ways, but I'm not quite as independent as Five descriptions make 5s out to be.

But enough about me, dang it! Heaven knows my own thread is practically a tumor; I want to keep your turf free from too many Viridianisms. :laugh:
 
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