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Okay, I'm seriously reconsidering ESTJ

Thalassa

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EJCC is right...Te for ExTJs is their primary way of seeing the world, it is their lens, it is a functional every-day thing. For ExFPs Te is a creative function, so we tend to use it in a more....interesting....manner. We tend to use Te to act on our Fi values, or to attempt to logically support arguments that were created by Ne/Fi or Se/Fi perceptions and values. It's the reverse with ExTJs. Te is the primary salient point for them, it's not a supporting or creative function.

(angry Fi, not cold Te),

OMGZ THIS. So much this.


I also want to comment on the "looks like" thing...if I typed my favorite ISTJ by what he "looks like" I might call him an ISFP. But he ain't, no, not at all. His image or persona or artistic tastes might suggest that, but just no. No no no no.

I mean, look at Patches. She's an ISTJ. And if I stereotyped her I'd be like "lulz no, you don't look like no ISTJ."

But that's an insanely stupid way to type people, and I personally stand corrected, because I used to do it myself before I properly understood function theory.
 

Elfboy

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maybe I'm a severely disturbed INFP in shadow mode
 

Thalassa

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I'd say more likely an ExFP who doesn't see himself realistically. It would explain why you're so aware of your Te. I'm very doubtful about INFP for you because you're just so freaking inclined to push your Fi values OUTWARD. INFPs tend to be more reserved or subtle somehow until you really cross them on something they find important, then you see more outward expression or drama at that point, but only at that point. You also have a certain detachment/assertive thing going on, which suggests either Ne/Te or Se/Te loop to me.

Honestly, EVERYONE sees that you have Pe/Fi before Te.
 

Seymour

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I'd say more likely an ExFP who doesn't see himself realistically. It would explain why you're so aware of your Te. I'm very doubtful about INFP for you because you're just so freaking inclined to push your Fi values OUTWARD. INFPs tend to be more reserved or subtle somehow until you really cross them on something they find important, then you see more outward expression or drama at that point, but only at that point. You also have a certain detachment/assertive thing going on, which suggests either Ne/Te or Se/Te loop to me.

I agree with Marm. Plus, most introverts do a fair amount of internal processing before expressing ideas externally. Elfboy reminds me much more of my 13 year-old ENFP nephew who will do anything to get a reaction. My nephew will toss ideas out as they occur (no matter how far-fetched), and try to engage others in the brainstorming process. Elfboy's post have the scattered, frenetic feel I associate with extraverts, rather than a considered, measured pace that I associate with introverts.

I also find Elfboy's focus on "bad-assery" and the strong/weak, dominant/submissive, powerful/powerless to be atypical of INFPs (who tend to look for "win/win" solutions to problems). From my perspective, that focus is just buying into an often false dichotomy.

At any rate, Elfboy is far from an ESTJ, and I'd guess ExFP for him as well. I remain a little puzzled as to what he's looking for in many of these threads, other than attention (which he seems all too effective in getting, nonetheless).
 

Elfboy

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I agree with Marm. Plus, most introverts do a fair amount of internal processing before expressing ideas externally. Elfboy reminds me much more of my 13 year-old ENFP nephew who will do anything to get a reaction. My nephew will toss ideas out as they occur (no matter how far-fetched), and try to engage others in the brainstorming process. Elfboy's post have the scattered, frenetic feel I associate with extraverts, rather than a considered, measured pace that I associate with introverts.

I also find Elfboy's focus on "bad-assery" and the strong/weak, dominant/submissive, powerful/powerless to be atypical of INFPs (who tend to look for "win/win" solutions to problems). From my perspective, that focus is just buying into an often false dichotomy.

At any rate, Elfboy is far from an ESTJ, and I'd guess ExFP for him as well. I remain a little puzzled as to what he's looking for in many of these threads, other than attention (which he seems all too effective in getting, nonetheless).

- posting things because I feel like it
- intellectual stimulation (not always the)
- legitimately wanting to solve the problem in the OP (but getting sidetracked by Ne craziness)
- self expression
the attention is something of a result of my personality. my self expression and things I feel like posting tend to be shocking and dramatic. for instance, it creates a buzz in a whores/prostitutes page when you say that they should all be stoned to death and are filthy scum. such topics tend to get a lot of views and comments, aka a lot of attention. the attention is a side benefit, not a goal
 

Thalassa

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- posting things because I feel like it
- intellectual stimulation (not always the)
- legitimately wanting to solve the problem in the OP (but getting sidetracked by Ne craziness)
- self expression
the attention is something of a result of my personality. my self expression and things I feel like posting tend to be shocking and dramatic. for instance, it creates a buzz in a whores/prostitutes page when you say that they should all be stoned to death and are filthy scum. such topics tend to get a lot of views and comments, aka a lot of attention. the attention is a side benefit, not a goal

Extroverts tend to want to exchange energy with others and get bored, depressed, or stagnate without this exchange. So extroversion would most easily explain this tendency you have. Also, Ne doms often say things like "I wonder what would happen if I did...xyz." Se doms also tend to want action and/or interaction.

Have you heard that ExxP is the "get things going" interaction style?
 

Elfboy

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Extroverts tend to want to exchange energy with others and get bored, depressed, or stagnate without this exchange. So extroversion would most easily explain this tendency you have. Also, Ne doms often say things like "I wonder what would happen if I did...xyz." Se doms also tend to want action and/or interaction.

Have you heard that ExxP is the "get things going" interaction style?

you have me pegged well with this comment.
yes, I'd rather be "In Charge" or "Chart the Course" but I realize that neither of these fit me at all naturally lol. I tend to get the energy going in a room and then everyone joins in and I'm like "ugh, they're stupid. I'm leaving". it might be dancing at a school dance filled with phobic, conscientious people, starting a riot (I haven't done this before, but I easily could), giving a single performance and leaving, or making an outrageous comment/action that stimulates people to act or at least reconsider things. once my job is done though, I don't want to stay around because everyone else is doing it. in the past, I was more bipolar about it, for instance, dancing at a school dance and saying something like "get that filthy hand off of me!" when a girl would try to join in. now I'm more polite about it and just leave. most people want to fit in and be social, I am the opposite. if I agree with everyone else, there is nothing to do unless I join them and conform to all of their social norms.

Edit: to be perfectly honest, this tendency has probably done me more harm than good. I'm sure there is some kind of enjoyment in being part of a group and actually being relatable, but my ego prevents me from doing either. on the inside, I just wish I could have one person in my life to snuggle with and shower with affection. maybe I need to get off my high horse and actually spend some time with people without being so repulsed by stupidity and common behavior?
 

Thalassa

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you have me pegged well with this comment.
yes, I'd rather be "In Charge" or "Chart the Course" but I realize that neither of these fit me at all naturally lol. I tend to get the energy going in a room and then everyone joins in and I'm like "ugh, they're stupid. I'm leaving". it might be dancing at a school dance filled with phobic, conscientious people, starting a riot (I haven't done this before, but I easily could), giving a single performance and leaving, or making an outrageous comment/action that stimulates people to act or at least reconsider things. once my job is done though, I don't want to stay around because everyone else is doing it. in the past, I was more bipolar about it, for instance, dancing at a school dance and saying something like "get that filthy hand off of me!" when a girl would try to join in. now I'm more polite about it and just leave. most people want to fit in and be social, I am the opposite. if I agree with everyone else, there is nothing to do unless I join them and conform to all of their social norms.

Yeah I accepted ExxP after a process of elimination: I'm not energetic enough to be In Charge, I'm not patient or strategic enough to Chart the Course, I'm not Behind the Scenes enough to be Behind the Scenes...so apparently I get things going.

I thought for a long time that the "right" way to be was IxxJ, and I felt very guilty for not being an IxxJ.

It's pretty liberating to realize that it's okay to be who you are, bro. What you are is good enough. There is no "right" way to be (though there may be healthier versions of what you are).
 

Elfboy

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Yeah I accepted ExxP after a process of elimination: I'm not energetic enough to be In Charge, I'm not patient or strategic enough to Chart the Course, I'm not Behind the Scenes enough to be Behind the Scenes...so apparently I get things going.

I thought for a long time that the "right" way to be was IxxJ, and I felt very guilty for not being an IxxJ.

It's pretty liberating to realize that it's okay to be who you are, bro. What you are is good enough. There is no "right" way to be (though there may be healthier versions of what you are).

omg, I did too! I hate being an extrovert, but I'm a flamboyant, outspoken, theatrical ENFP and that's just who I am. I feel your pain :hug::hug::hug:
 

Thalassa

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omg, I did too! I hate being an extrovert, but I'm a flamboyant, outspoken, theatrical ENFP and that's just who I am. I feel your pain :hug::hug::hug:

:hug: :hug: :hug:

It's from a lifetime probably of people telling you to calm down, shut up, or control yourself. I think that's the deal in my case. Or was. Now I don't care.

And funnily enough, I was CRAZIER when I thought being the opposite of me was right. I went from one extreme to the other, including trying to change myself for a couple of years, and being entirely miserable in attempts to repress myself or make myself something I'm not, I have found a balance.
 

Elfboy

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:hug: :hug: :hug:

It's from a lifetime probably of people telling you to calm down, shut up, or control yourself. I think that's the deal in my case. Or was. Now I don't care.

And funnily enough, I was CRAZIER when I thought being the opposite of me was right. I went from one extreme to the other, including trying to change myself for a couple of years, and being entirely miserable in attempts to repress myself or make myself something I'm not, I have found a balance.

it's not because other people told me to calm down or shut up (I'm actually quite naturally calm), I just have always idolized INFPs and INTJs. it's probably from too much anime. Anime idolizes INJs and IFPs and makes Es and Ss look like neanderthals while the Is and Ns are deep, intelligent and heroic
 

Thalassa

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it's not because other people told me to calm down or shut up (I'm actually quite naturally calm), I just have always idolized INFPs and INTJs. it's probably from too much anime. Anime idolizes INJs and IFPs and makes Es and Ss look like neanderthals while the Is and Ns are deep, intelligent and heroic

Then I'd definitely go for Narcissistic rather than Histrionic for you.

That's cool, though, whatever it takes to accept your type is a good type with positive attributes, just like every other type...that works. :yes:

In fact, the more I learned about Jungian personality theory the more and more I realize how much I like my own type and don't want to be like others.
 

Nicodemus

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maybe I need to get off my high horse and actually spend some time with people without being so repulsed by stupidity and common behavior?
Is it possible that you fear commonness because deep down, in spite of the ideal you hold of yourself, you actually feel ordinary?
 

Elfboy

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Is it possible that you fear commonness because deep down, in spite of the ideal you hold of yourself, you actually feel ordinary?

I fear becoming ordinary, but good question
 

Orangey

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it's not because other people told me to calm down or shut up (I'm actually quite naturally calm), I just have always idolized INFPs and INTJs. it's probably from too much anime. Anime idolizes INJs and IFPs and makes Es and Ss look like neanderthals while the Is and Ns are deep, intelligent and heroic

Are you kidding? ISTJs and ISFJs are given excellent treatment in anime. I'd agree for ESxPs, perhaps, but they're about it. All ENxx and ISxP types are treated well, too.
 

Viridian

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I fear becoming ordinary, but good question

What do you see as "ordinary"?

Also, that would seem to support the idea that you're an image triad type - to know what is extraordinary, one must be attuned to what is ordinary; quite the paradox, no? :D
 

Elfboy

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Are you kidding? ISTJs and ISFJs are given excellent treatment in anime. I'd agree for ESxPs, perhaps, but they're about it. All ENxx and ISxP types are treated well, too.

I think you're right, ISs are usually treated pretty well, but I disagree on ENXX. ENPs are treated like shit in most anime lol. one thing we can agree on, anime LOVES INTJs. having an anime without a cool INTJ is like having a sewing circle without an ESFJ
 

Elfboy

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What do you see as "ordinary"?

Also, that would seem to support the idea that you're an image triad type - to know what is extraordinary, one must be attuned to what is ordinary; quite the paradox, no? :D

sports, gossip, trying to be relatable. in fact, it's completely irrational, but internally I sort of view any kind of social interaction for it's own sake as ordinary/tepid
 
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