ESFJ or ENFJ: There can be only one. . .

[Edgar]

I'm pretty damn sure you're ESFJ.

Grad school. I rarely have a free hour anymore. I am just tired and pissy and often lonely.

I've noticed that when Sensors are stressed or frustrated with life, they start to think they are N.

Shit, I wouldn't be surprised if half the people on this board claiming to be NFs are actually SFs.

 

[Glycerine]

i have to disagree with this. i think ENFJs are excellent at thinking inside the box in a way that is greater than the box itself. NFP is more likely to just ditch the box, whereas NFJ changes the box to suit their needs. of course, maybe we are saying the same thing in different ways.



lol. alternatively phrased, it's just Ne and F. something ESFJs and ENFPs have in common is that we can convince pretty much anyone of anything because Ne generates infinite ways of looking at things while F allows us to easily connect with the other person. you'll notice though that ENFP convinces more through the idea itself whereas ESFJ does it through the social connection. not that either way is right or wrong, or better or worse.

i know an ENFJ and ESFJ both very well, as well as a few not so well, and one difference i've seen play out between ESFJ and ENFJ is a greater attentiveness to small detail in ESFJ and a greater attentiveness to environmental stuff in ENFJ. ENFJ seems to get quickly bored with minutiae and willing to disregard it, whereas ESFJ might get bored too but is more willing to see the importance of it and stick with it. ENFJs can have very impressive startling tert Se, though. ENFJs also seem stuck up sometimes (no offense ENFJs). but i mean, there is somewhat of a tangible removal, while ESFJ seems very there, more down to earth. ESFJs generally seem more bubbly/optimistic though can present more as worry on the outside, whereas ENFJs can experience more inner storms but are less likely to express them. ESFJs are more likely to be intolerant of people being assholes. ENFJs is more likely to be curious why people are being assholes. ENFJ is more of a natural leader but ESFJ has a better sense of what should be done next.

i hope my theory-confirmed-by-real-life generalizations are helpful

You suck big time




















jk.

I see that difference between my dad and I. I come off semi-arrogant and stand-off-ish at first until people get to know me but my father is typically really friendly (and in some ways, much more tactful). I am like a cat while he's like a dog. I agree with all of your observations.

 

[pure_mercury]

I'm pretty damn sure you're ESFJ.



I've noticed that when Sensors are stressed or frustrated with life, they start to think they are N.

Shit, I wouldn't be surprised if half the people on this board claiming to be NFs are actually SFs.

Yeah, but I got that strong N test result while doing the orientation thing at a nice hotel on the beach in Ventura. I was super-excited to be starting school then.

 

[Edgar]

Yeah, but I got that strong N test result while doing the orientation thing at a nice hotel on the beach in Ventura. I was super-excited to be starting school then.

Yeah, well, you're still an ESFJ (NTTAWWT)

Btw, I'm pretty sure I warned you about the school. But nobody ever listens to me when it comes to that crap.

 

[Glycerine]

Yeah, but I got that strong N test result while doing the orientation thing at a nice hotel on the beach in Ventura. I was super-excited to be starting school then.

Who do you tend to relate to more: ESFJs or ENFJs? My dad and I are really similar in some ways but seem to be from completely different planets in other areas.

 

[Eric B]

I am always taking care of people, physically and emotionally.

Well, NFJ's could be like that. that would be the common Fe.
I mean, do you maintain a prolonged interest in personality theory as the tool to help others?

I really just liked personality tests, and I wanted to know more about myself and others.

That could be an NF reason, but then just about any type could feel that way.

I have sanguine, choleric, and melancholic moments often. Almost never phlegmatic, though.

I think that face is more melacholic than choleric. Don't my eyes look a little sad and longing? Anyway, ESTJ is a definite no.

Well, you look pretty, I could say, serious in that picture. That could be either Melancholy or Choleric. Both are "directive", or task focused, which often tends to more seriousness. Since the Choleric is extroverted, he is usually the one who looks more serious or angry, and takes on that reputation. The Melancholy is less expressive, and may not show as much emotion on his face.

ESFJ is a combination of Sanguine and Melancholy, however, though the Melancholy is not in the social area and doesn't cover that sort of expressiveness, however, it is just as serious (SJ-Guardian). Facial expression would be more the surface social area, however.

ENFJ I have determined to be a combination of Choleric and either Phlegmatic, or a new temperament called Supine. Phlegmatics in that area are very diplomatic, while Supines are more dependent, and Melancholies are independent.

So would you say that look naturally characterizes your emotion or the way you present yourself to others a lot of the time, or again, was it just something else?

I really just like to learn. I can detect patterns within interpersonal relationships, but I am just as likely to find out things about someone just for the sake of knowing more. That makes me feel closer to others.

That kind of sounds like Fe+N. It could be Ni, or it could even Ne (tertiary), so I'm not really sure there.

I have nostalgia for things and people from my past, but not historical nostalgia. I am interested in learning about the past, but I wouldn't want to go back there for an extended period of time.

I guess that does sound like Si, and in a more mature position like auxiliary ("parent"). It's about learning more than playing. Tertiary is the "child", position, so for me, it's more "play", or "relief" than serious.

 

[Glycerine]

Well, I can really see as an intellectually minded ESFJ based on the vibe and the content of your posts. ESFJ males can sure as hell be directive and very "in charge" when they need to be. To me, they seem like softer ESTJs especially with the male gender component or they come off as very metrosexual, effeminate.

 

[pure_mercury]

Yeah, well, you're still an ESFJ (NTTAWWT)

Btw, I'm pretty sure I warned you about the school. But nobody ever listens to me when it comes to that crap.

This is business school, not law school. I took the tour of Pepperdine's law school today, though, and I sat in for a class. It was way more fun than b-school classes, IMHO.

 

[pure_mercury]

Who do you tend to relate to more: ESFJs or ENFJs? My dad and I are really similar in some ways but seem to be from completely different planets in other areas.

A lot of people with superficial knowledge of MBTI think I am an ENFJ ("this is totally you!"), but MBTI-savvy people seem to say ESFJ more. I honestly don't try to type people that much. I will ask if they have taken one and what they got, but I don't go around saying, "This is you!" I pick up the tendencies, though.

 

[pure_mercury]

Well, NFJ's could be like that. that would be the common Fe.
I mean, do you maintain a prolonged interest in personality theory as the tool to help others?

It's more of catering to people's physical, emotional, or social needs.

That could be an NF reason, but then just about any type could feel that way.

Fair enough.

Well, you look pretty, I could say, serious in that picture. That could be either Melancholy or Choleric. Both are "directive", or task focused, which often tends to more seriousness. Since the Choleric is extroverted, he is usually the one who looks more serious or angry, and takes on that reputation. The Melancholy is less expressive, and may not show as much emotion on his face.

I think I am very sanguinely extroverted, but internally melancholic (sometimes). I listened to "The Tracks of My Tears" the other day, and I really relate to that feeling.

ESFJ is a combination of Sanguine and Melancholy, however, though the Melancholy is not in the social area and doesn't cover that sort of expressiveness, however, it is just as serious (SJ-Guardian). Facial expression would be more the surface social area, however.

If I were to rank my humors, it would be

1. Sanguine
2a. Melancholic
2b. Choleric
4. Phlegmatic

And "supine" sounds like something I am not. I am outgoing, emotional, analytical, generally happy, but intense and given to bouts of depression/the blues.

ENFJ I have determined to be a combination of Choleric and either Phlegmatic, or a new temperament called Supine. Phlegmatics in that area are very diplomatic, while Supines are more dependent, and Melancholies are independent.

This is beyond me right here, but I would want to read more.

So would you say that look naturally characterizes your emotion or the way you present yourself to others a lot of the time, or again, was it just something else?

I think I look better in pics like that when I am not smiling. LOL

That kind of sounds like Fe+N. It could be Ni, or it could even Ne (tertiary), so I'm not really sure there.

OK.

I guess that does sound like Si, and in a more mature position like auxiliary ("parent"). It's about learning more than playing. Tertiary is the "child", position, so for me, it's more "play", or "relief" than serious.

Interesting.

 

[pure_mercury]

Well, I can really see as an intellectually minded ESFJ based on the vibe and the content of your posts. ESFJ males can sure as hell be directive and very "in charge" when they need to be. To me, they seem like softer ESTJs especially with the male gender component or they come off as very metrosexual, effeminate.

I don't feel very ESTJ. And I have some metrosexual tendencies, but some dudely ones, too. And the strong, heart-on-the-sleeve emotionality, too.

 

[IZthe411]

I am not really moody in that regard. One of my biggest pet peeves is when people take out their bad moods on others. My dad used to do that a lot, and it was one of the few things that really got me angry with him. I take cruelty and lack of regard from others personally, though. If you had done something to hurt me or someone I care about (intentionally or through negligence), that would put me in a bad mood toward you for a while. I am fairly comfortable with conflict, though. I hate allowing things to linger and fester, so I would probably just confront you with my feelings and why exactly I was hurt.

Well you have the F part covered.
Your response reminds me of a closeworker I now consider a friend. He's an ENFJ. I'd have to be in actual interaction to give you my take on your N/S function, though.

 

[Edgar]

This is business school, not law school. I took the tour of Pepperdine's law school today, though, and I sat in for a class. It was way more fun than b-school classes, IMHO.

Huh... who would have thought there was shit worse than law school.

Well I've learned something today.

 

[Eric B]

It's more of catering to people's physical, emotional, or social needs.

I think I am very sanguinely extroverted, but internally melancholic (sometimes). I listened to "The Tracks of My Tears" the other day, and I really relate to that feeling.

If I were to rank my humors, it would be

1. Sanguine
2a. Melancholic
2b. Choleric
4. Phlegmatic

And "supine" sounds like something I am not. I am outgoing, emotional, analytical, generally happy, but intense and given to bouts of depression/the blues.

Well, I guess all that sounds like ESFJ.

ENFJ I have determined to be a combination of Choleric and either Phlegmatic, or a new temperament called Supine. Phlegmatics in that area are very diplomatic, while Supines are more dependent, and Melancholies are independent.
This is beyond me right here, but I would want to read more.

Here's the idea in a list of tables and images. (Both the five temperament system, and how I believe it corresponds to type). There are also links if you want the complete discussions on it.
Type Ideas

I think I look better in pics like that when I am not smiling. LOL

OK. Is that a male thing? (Since male F's are said to often want to put on a tougher image or whatever). I don't seem to know a lot of male Sanguines, so that further makes the stereotypical Sanguine "smiles and friendliness" seem more associated with females.

 

[pure_mercury]

Well, I guess all that sounds like ESFJ.

Here's the idea in a list of tables and images. (Both the five temperament system, and how I believe it corresponds to type). There are also links if you want the complete discussions on it.
Type Ideas



OK. Is that a male thing? (Since male F's are said to often want to put on a tougher image or whatever). I don't seem to know a lot of male Sanguines, so that further makes the stereotypical Sanguine "smiles and friendliness" seem more associated with females.

I wasn't consciously thinking about my facial expression then. That is just how I looked in the bathroom that day. I try not to pose/smile/gesticulate much when taking pics I would use as an avatar.

 

[OrangeAppled]

Do you see yourself perceiving more with a SiNe or NiSe combo? What is your understanding of these functions and how do you relate them to yourself?

Being that you are Fe-dom, your aux and tert functions are both percieving, so it's not surprising you find confusion as to whether you are "S" or "N".

From what I see in your posts, you display SiNe. You like to explore some external ideas & may delve into tangents in conversations (Ne), but internally you're focused on what you know (Si). The focus is to gather info to recall it later, which is where the idea of focusing on the "past" comes from regarding Si. Knowing stuff about people makes you feel closer to them, maybe because it's solid info to review later and keep you connected in their absence, or it helps you see how to meet their needs (?). In that sense, Si is supporting your Fe, which is the role your Pi function would play, a supporting one. Tertiary Ne may connect these ideas so that you can make predictions about people - your friend likes XYZ, so he may also like ABC, which you see a connection between. All of these functions working together make ESFJs seem thoughtful, kind and personally invested, because they seem to grasp people in a very detailed way that shows itself in small, everyday actions.

NeSi likes info for the sake of info also, but very different kinds of info to be used in a different way.

I really just like to learn. I can detect patterns within interpersonal relationships, but I am just as likely to find out things about someone just for the sake of knowing more. That makes me feel closer to others.

 

[pure_mercury]

Do you see yourself perceiving more with a SiNe or NiSe combo? What is your understanding of these functions and how do you relate them to yourself?

Being that you are Fe-dom, your aux and tert functions are both percieving, so it's not surprising you find confusion as to whether you are "S" or "N".

From what I see in your posts, you display SiNe. You like to explore some external ideas & may delve into tangents in conversations (Ne), but internally you're focused on what you know (Si). The focus is to gather info to recall it later, which is where the idea of focusing on the "past" comes from regarding Si. Knowing stuff about people makes you feel closer to them, maybe because it's solid info to review later and keep you connected in their absence, or it helps you see how to meet their needs (?). In that sense, Si is supporting your Fe, which is the role your Pi function would play, a supporting one. Tertiary Ne may connect these ideas so that you can make predictions about people - your friend likes XYZ, so he may also like ABC, which you see a connection between. All of these functions working together make ESFJs seem thoughtful, kind and personally invested, because they seem to grasp people in a very detailed way that shows itself in small, everyday actions.

NeSi likes info for the sake of info also, but very different kinds of info to be used in a different way.

Yeah, no idea.