The Untyped

[VagrantFarce]

3. I act like a P because I'm not work-obsessed and I love to joke around. I'm pretty casual about things and I can block out and ignore unpleasantness. I don't take care of things I know I need to take care of (I'll pay bills late, forget to call people I know I need to call...). I'm also pretty good at thinking on my feet and improvising solutions. At my old job, I was considered the most adaptable, least by-the-book of the managers. I didn't aim for that; I actually had a lot of respect for the rules. I just had a more flexible approach, where the work product mattered more than the process.

I think like a J because I want everything to be a certain way, and I find comfort in structure. I like to go to the same restaurants, order the same foods, go for the same walk, etc... I even watch the same movies over and over. I'm absolutely the most predictable person on Earth. Also, I'm very decisive - I like choosing something and closing the door on other options. I have an opinion on almost everything, and I share it easily. I have very specific ways that some things have to be done.

OK, so you're a J that spaces out every now and then. And list-making is so painfully Si.

ESTJ
ISTJ
ISFJ
ESFJ

Assuming that what you said about outer structure is true (meaning you prefer Te over Fe)...

ESTJ
ISTJ

And that Ne is "fun for a while" (indicating that you find it second nature, meaning it suits your tertiary rather than inferior)...

ESTJ

Either that, or a severly maladjusted NP.

 

[JustHer]

And list-making is so painfully Si.

That depends on whether she sticks to the lists or just makes them to organize her thoughts! Big difference there.

 

[Tyrant]

I would wager list-making is so Ti.

 

[BlackCat]

I would wager list-making is so Ti.

Everything you post confuses people because it's all about socionics. lol

I am getting Se from her (socionics wise) I'd say beta. ISTj.

 

[brainheart]

I think any type can make lists, as justxher mentions, it all depends on what you do with those lists, and how frequent it is. For example, I can get list psycho sometimes when I get pissed about how much I suck at wasting my time and forgetting things and I'm hoping to turn over a new leaf, but it never lasts. Never.

Holy moly does all of this sound like my in-laws or what, Ruthie! They are both SJs and it can drive me bonkers. 'Olive Garden again for your birthday? Really? Exact same thanksgiving dinner for the fortieth time, and you still honestly love it?'

No offense or anything. It's kind of cute, in a way. I just don't get it because it's like the polar opposite of me.

But it also makes me think Si dom for you, like you were saying, because I think those with Si as a secondary function like a bit more variety.

All of the lists, timing yourself, etc, seems pretty seriously Te to me. My ISFJ mother-in-law, on the other hand, is exceptional at making quilts, doing puzzles, which I see as more Ti-oriented activity.

You know, ISTJs also see tradition and family and the social group as being important, so that could be why I was thinking Fe. My ISTJ dad, when he was angry with me, used to talk about how selfish I was, how I always put myself first. But he definitely has that tertiary Fi- getting angry when my mom makes something he doesn't like to eat for dinner, hiding out by himself in his office, getting defensive when people disagree with him, etc.

 

[Ruthie]

OK, so you're a J that spaces out every now and then. And list-making is so painfully Si.

ESTJ
ISTJ
ISFJ
ESFJ

Assuming that what you said about outer structure is true (meaning you prefer Te over Fe)...

ESTJ
ISTJ

And that Ne is "fun for a while" (indicating that you find it second nature, meaning it suits your tertiary rather than inferior)...

ESTJ

Either that, or a severly maladjusted NP.

Interesting. I agree with most of this, except I really seriously doubt the ESTJ for 2 reasons. First, I'm just not an extrovert, no matter how the functions break down. Second, I think Si is probably my top function, certainly higher than Te. That might account for the daydreaming and the "living in my head" aspect.

And yeah, I mentioned the list-making because it seemed like a very Si thing to do.

Thanks, VagrantFarce.

 

[Ruthie]

Ok yeah, you're starting to sound more ISFJ than anything. "I just want today to be like yesterday" is very Si.

Do you show strong Fe? Do you feel a recurring desire to organize others into situations that will help them? Is a strong sense of community values and social support net important to you?

Community values and a social support net are extremely important to me in theory, but I'm not a great personal catalyst for them. I work in politics, and I'm a populist, communitarian Democrat, so I spend a lot of time thinking about (and arguing about) why those values are important. But when you bring it down to the level of interpersonal relationships rather than ideals, I'm just not as good at showing warmth or empathy. I don't come across as cold or anything, but as I said before, I usually meet a person's problem with a plan of action or objective advice and not with the sometimes necessary shoulder to cry on.

 

[VagrantFarce]

First, I'm just not an extrovert, no matter how the functions break down.

Even though the function breakdown determines whether you're an Introvert or Extravert?

Just an extra tip: make sure you're not confusing the need for outer structure with the need for inner structure (i.e. the difference between Te and Ti). Te types want their environment controlled, whereas Ti want things to make sense in their head. Te types control their environment by imposing structure on it, Ti types control their environment (if at all) by simply withdrawing to a place that they're comfortable with.

 

[Ruthie]

I don't approve of the typing methodology people use here. I believe these questions and your answers to them will shed some light on what your type is:

Describe your relationships with other people.

What aspects of your life do you believe are the most important and why? For example, your faith, your interests/hobbies, your friends, etc.

What are your hobbies/interests and why do you enjoy them?

This should be interesting... I'm curious to see how this adds up...

Relationships: I'm very different with family and non-family. I'm absolutely loyal to family. I enjoy spending time with them and feel completely comfortable around them. I always answer when they call.

Non-family is different. I make friends pretty easily, but have a hard time keeping them because I do dodge their calls and cancel plans with them. [fun example: as I was typing this paragraph, my boyfriend called and I blew him off]. For a very long time, I can be pretty indifferent to people. Nothing but time can warm me up. So, if a friend/boyfriend can deal with my fickleness and slight avoidance for a long time, they win me over and have me on their side forever.

In romantic relationships, I've always said I'd be much more in love after 20 years of marriage than I ever could be just starting out. Romance doesn't hold a lot of magic for me - and I've never felt the "falling in love" emotion, at least in the way others describe it. Love for me is something that just has to grow with time - someone who sticks around through thick and thin, someone who I have memories of shared experiences, etc...

I do consider my faith to be very important to me, but I haven't actually gone to church regularly since I was 8 years old (I'm 30 now). I was raised Baptist, went through the requisite teenage agnosticism, and spent most of my 20s in seeker mode. I tried out some of the more liberal churches but found them a little too wishy-washy for me (I wanted a church, not a community service group). I guess I'm still in seeker mode, but I'm strongly considering converting to Catholicism because I like the combination of social justice and high personal moral standards.

I pretty much eat, sleep, and breathe politics. I love every aspect of it, from the inside-the-beltway stuff to the idealistic (but gratingly self-righteous) grassroots-y side. I love American history, I'm big on holidays and love all the festive ritual type stuff, love old movies (have a soft-spot for Frank Capra flicks), and I love baseball, especially my Baltimore Orioles.

I love playing around with anything that can be categorized - I own marketing books, college guides, baby names books, and other random books of lists. Sometimes, I'll set up weird little cross-discipline research projects for myself, like the time I tried to figure out a correlation between most popular baby names and favored political candidates by state (trying to test whether there are some names that are favored by Democrats/Republicans). I love demographics in general, and enjoy coming up with elaborate stereotypes like that.

I also love trivia, and once or twice a month, I'll do the trivia nights at a bar. I love to go for long walks or long drives, because that gives me a chance to zone out and daydream. When I do either one of those, the outside world barely registers.

I guess one commonality with a lot of the things I like is that I like Old Things. Aside from the American history and the old movies, I have my house decorated with old furniture and use old Life magazines as wall decorations. I have a soft spot for senior citizens, and I've been called an "Old Soul" by one of my friends. But I don't always act old - I have a very playful side. It snowed the other day, and instead of shoveling it, or digging out my car, I had fun throwing snowballs. I love playing softball in the spring/summer, I love roller coasters, I joke around constantly, and my favorite pair of shoes are a beat up pair of sneakers.

Does that help?

EDIT: a few more things occurred to me that might be relevant...

-I love playing board games; mostly of the Taboo, Scattergories variety. (Si?)
-I love debating. I have some pretty quirky views that I've developed, and I love just having a beer and arguing them for fun.
-I dropped out of high school when I was 16, but even that wasn't particularly rebellious. Mostly, I just stayed around the house playing ping-pong, and ended up graduating college on time anyway. I didn't really get into any kind of trouble, and it didn't really hurt me in any way.

 

[Ruthie]

Everything you post confuses people because it's all about socionics. lol

I am getting Se from her (socionics wise) I'd say beta. ISTj.

I don't really know socionics... can you elaborate on the beta ISTj?

 

[Ruthie]

I agree that predictability and planning are two totally different things. Predictability is a comfort zone of this is my home, my job, my friends, and nothing out of the ordinary is going to happen unless I want it to (ha ha). I too have a predictability comfort zone, especially after the haphazard quality of my extreme youth.

Planning is something more active and structured, and it takes more energy from me.

This isn't surprising marmalade... we may be opposite types, but we seem to have a lot in common.

Are you still thinking about starting your own thread, like the "type me as a kid" thread?

 

[Ruthie]

I think any type can make lists, as justxher mentions, it all depends on what you do with those lists, and how frequent it is. For example, I can get list psycho sometimes when I get pissed about how much I suck at wasting my time and forgetting things and I'm hoping to turn over a new leaf, but it never lasts. Never.

Holy moly does all of this sound like my in-laws or what, Ruthie! They are both SJs and it can drive me bonkers. 'Olive Garden again for your birthday? Really? Exact same thanksgiving dinner for the fortieth time, and you still honestly love it?'

No offense or anything. It's kind of cute, in a way. I just don't get it because it's like the polar opposite of me.

No offense taken. I'm well aware of how boring I am, and it's kind of a running joke with my friends and family. Maybe we should swap families...

But it also makes me think Si dom for you, like you were saying, because I think those with Si as a secondary function like a bit more variety.

All of the lists, timing yourself, etc, seems pretty seriously Te to me. My ISFJ mother-in-law, on the other hand, is exceptional at making quilts, doing puzzles, which I see as more Ti-oriented activity.

You know, ISTJs also see tradition and family and the social group as being important, so that could be why I was thinking Fe. My ISTJ dad, when he was angry with me, used to talk about how selfish I was, how I always put myself first. But he definitely has that tertiary Fi- getting angry when my mom makes something he doesn't like to eat for dinner, hiding out by himself in his office, getting defensive when people disagree with him, etc.

I don't really know - on the T side, I see evidence of both Te and Ti; and on the F side, I see a bit of both Fe and Fi. The main reason I'm leaning T is because I think both the Te and the Ti are a bit stronger than either the Fe or the Fi.

 

[Tyrant]

I don't really know socionics... can you elaborate on the beta ISTj?

Beta is quadrant four types belong to in the socionics system. Quadrant imply all the types in it share the same valued quadrants.

Beta - ISTj (Ti, Se, Fe, Ni), ENFj (Fe, Ni, Ti, Se), INFp (Ni, Fe, Se, Ti), ESTp (Se, Ti, Ni, Fe)

I, myself, would rather type you with socionics in mind because I consider MBTI a poorly defined system fitted with over-generalizations, and is overall lackluster in comparison to socionics. Do you mind?

After reading your answers only once, I'm inclined to agree with BlackCat on you being LSI (ISTj - Ti base with Se, which significantly differs from Se in MBTI, creative). You might be another type, but at the moment, I'd say ISTj. When I have the time, I assure you I'll edit my post, and explain in detail why I hold this position.

 

[Ruthie]

Beta is quadrant four types belong to in the socionics system. Quadrant imply all the types in it share the same valued quadrants.

Beta - ISTj (Ti, Se, Fe, Ni), ENFj (Fe, Ni, Ti, Se), INFp (Ni, Fe, Se, Ti), ESTp (Se, Ti, Ni, Fe)

I, myself, would rather type you with socionics in mind because I consider MBTI a poorly defined system fitted with over-generalizations, and is overall lackluster in comparison to socionics. Do you mind?

After reading your answers only once, I'm inclined to agree with BlackCat on you being LSI (ISTj - Ti base with Se, which significantly differs from Se in MBTI, creative). You might be another type, but at the moment, I'd say ISTj. When I have the time, I assure you I'll edit my post, and explain in detail why I hold this position.

I just took the socionics test (the 4 question version) and it gave me INTj. Question 2 combines "loving systems and theories" with "not liking routine," so it was tough to answer. I do love systems and theories, but I also love routines and predictability. On the other side, I'm terrible with "living in the here and now," which was why I rejected the alternative choice.

 

[simulatedworld]

Community values and a social support net are extremely important to me in theory, but I'm not a great personal catalyst for them. I work in politics, and I'm a populist, communitarian Democrat, so I spend a lot of time thinking about (and arguing about) why those values are important. But when you bring it down to the level of interpersonal relationships rather than ideals, I'm just not as good at showing warmth or empathy. I don't come across as cold or anything, but as I said before, I usually meet a person's problem with a plan of action or objective advice and not with the sometimes necessary shoulder to cry on.

Ok, I'm gonna go with ISTJ then. "I respond with a plan of action and objective advice" is pretty Te.

 

[Thalassa]

This isn't surprising marmalade... we may be opposite types, but we seem to have a lot in common.

Are you still thinking about starting your own thread, like the "type me as a kid" thread?

It may be because we share the same functions in a different order. If I'm INFP and you're ISTJ, for example, I have Fi Ne Si Te, and you have Si Te Fi Ne. Same if I'm an ENFP, just with the identical functions slightly switched.

I honestly don't know if I'm going to start a thead - I'm fairly certain I'm an xNFP though I waffle back and forth on E/I.

 

[NewEra]

Hmm... I read through a big chunk of this thread and I would say that the type I'm leaning towards for you, Ruthie, is... ESTJ.

The reason is that you seem to show quite a few SJ qualities, but not in as much depth as the IxSJs, who tend to breathe Si. One thing I can notice is that you seem to have a very good grasp of Ne. In general, ESTJs have a better grasp of N (and a worse grasp of F) than ISTJs. Many of the things you say are also indicative of Te, which is the dominant function of ESTJs. I do see some Si in there that I relate to as well, but I think the Te overrides that (plus I don't relate to as much of the Te as you seem to). Also the points about E/I that you gave on the first page indicate extroversion.

So yeah I'd say overall, if you asked me to give me ONE type that I think you're most like, I would definitely say ESTJ.

 

[OrangeAppled]

^ I'm thinking eSTJ now also. ISFJs would show more Fe and tend to be more sentimental. Her Ne seems decent also.

 

[Ruthie]

@TheChosenOne, VagrantFarce & OrangeApplied:

I'll keep an open mind about ESTJ since so many people seem to think it fits best, but I can't stress how "in my head" I am most of the time. Also, I personally relate more to Si as a function than Te.

Also - OrangeApplied: I do have a pretty big nostalgia streak, if that counts for sentimentality.

 

[VagrantFarce]

What is your understanding of Ne?