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Am I 478 or 487 ?

tony_goth

Pseudo-delusional Rebel
Joined
Sep 18, 2018
Messages
225
MBTI Type
ENFJ
Enneagram
487
Instinctual Variant
sx
I think I'm ENFJ-4sx.

I think I'm barely EFJ, but an extreme N.

I hesitate between 478 and 487.


I think, I'm more 7-ish because :

- I'm extremely affectionate with some people, but not in order to please people, just to show I love them
- I'm able to kiss a woman for hours (I mean real hours), I actually did it already
- I like to troll with offensive jokes, but in a friendly way (you won't see these kind of jokes here because they'd be against the rules)
- I may show extreme happiness in face of the most beautiful things
- I like to show off sincere unpopular opinions, with a hidden intention for having fun
- I may act like Mother Theresa : I'm not a social worker, I work for my side for spiritual and tribal reasons
- I like to make the people I love/like happy, because I think they deserve it
- I really can't stand melancholic states despite of being E4.
- I often indulge to risky behaviours when I'm bored
- I think the most beautiful things are sacred
- I like to tell some extremely beautiful women they're beautiful, not to date them, but because I think their beauty should be praised
- I'm very accessible ; you want to talk to me in private, you can, even if you're a political enemy, as long you're not in my blacklist
- I'm not a hard worker at the office, I tend to socialize with my colleagues too much



I think, I'm more 8-ish because :

- I'm not a tough guy, but not a Care Bear either. I have to defend my interests, sometimes in a pushy manner, because it's something everyone does and should do.
- I think like a politician, i.e. it's a cultural battlefield
- I think everyone sees his interests first, and saying "my interests comes after someone else's interest" is inherently hypocritical
- I like criminal science
- I often think "you might be weak, but not a coward"
- I think laws and other "protections of the weak" are an illusion, Darwin is always right at some point
- I can't stand people who're unable to speak clearly
- I think respect is deserved for moral value, and not essentially for having social ranks ; it happens I may have more respect for an Amazon's picker than Jeff Bezos himself though I don't think the latter is a bad guy.
- I think the respect I give to people who don't deserve it is essentially stolen
- I think you can say "I have this virtue" if you do have it, otherwise it's stolen valor
- Some people think I'm aggressive, others don't ; actually I just speak in a loud and undiplomatic way
- I'll give you a fish, then I'll teach you fishing ; a teacher's mission is done when you don't need him anymore
- Punching or insulting me is way less grave than lying to me
- I don't think I'm thinking, or maybe I think too fast to know I'm thinking
- I don't highlight people, I evaluate them ; I'm friendly with most people, but my acutal friendship has to be deserved
- Though I give most people a chance, nobody is in my blacklist for no reason, and the main reason is "betrayal"
- Though I give the chance to many people/informations/things to be evaluated, I evaluate them quickly and those which happen to be selected are rare
- I'm able to look serious while telling people unusual ideas
- I think many people are friendly to naive people (including myself sometimes) in order to take advantage of them
- I think people who say "I'm non-violent" or "I'm not aggressive" are likely to lie about it.
- I have an agenda of defending oppressed people, but I hate the fact I can't do anything ; moral justice is really an obsession to me
- I often feel inferior in a clinically obsessive way, and sometimes I'd like to settle my scores, but I don't, because it's rationally the worst idea possible ; anyway everyone who deserves to pay will eventually pay.


...

Or, maybe I just didn't understand reasonably the tritype thing.
 

RadicalDoubt

Alongside Questionable Clarity
Joined
Jun 27, 2017
Messages
1,848
MBTI Type
TiSi
Enneagram
9w1
Instinctual Variant
sp/so
I hesitate to type you as either of these, as much of what you've written here don't apply to either enneagram type much. From this, I think it might be worth looking into 6w7 as a type (maybe not as a core, but I see more 6 and 3 influence than I do 4 or 7 in a fix sort of way), maybe 638 or 648 if you are very confident in the 4. I'm not 100% sure though, this does not provide a lot of relevant information to work off of, I figured I'd give input anyways though.

I think, I'm more 7-ish because :

- I'm extremely affectionate with some people, but not in order to please people, just to show I love them
- I'm able to kiss a woman for hours (I mean real hours), I actually did it already
- I like to troll with offensive jokes, but in a friendly way (you won't see these kind of jokes here because they'd be against the rules)
- I may show extreme happiness in face of the most beautiful things
- I like to make the people I love/like happy, because I think they deserve it
- I like to show off sincere unpopular opinions, with a hidden intention for having fun
- I think the most beautiful things are sacred
- I like to tell some extremely beautiful women they're beautiful, not to date them, but because I think their beauty should be praised
- I'm very accessible ; you want to talk to me in private, you can, even if you're a political enemy, as long you're not in my blacklist
- I'm not a hard worker at the office, I tend to socialize with my colleagues too much
Specifically, all of the above are not enneagram related and especially not 7 related. What I've bolded could potentially be attributed to high grade feeling and extroversion, as high level of expression and affection are common among such types. Trolling also tends to be a Fe-ish behavior, though again, not exclusive to it.

- I may act like Mother Theresa : I'm not a social worker, I work for my side for spiritual and tribal reasons
- I often indulge to risky behaviours when I'm bored
These could be enneagram or mbti related, but do not have enough information to make a lot of correlation. Tribal reasons sounds as though you could potentially possess the social instinct (ie. if you are confident in sx dominance, maybe consider sx/so)

- I really can't stand melancholic states despite of being E4.
This statement strongly indicates that you are not a 4 core, though might possess it as a fix.

I think, I'm more 8-ish because :
- I like criminal science
- I can't stand people who're unable to speak clearly
- I'll give you a fish, then I'll teach you fishing ; a teacher's mission is done when you don't need him anymore
- Though I give most people a chance, nobody is in my blacklist for no reason, and the main reason is "betrayal"
- I'm able to look serious while telling people unusual ideas
- I think respect is deserved for moral value, and not essentially for having social ranks ; it happens I may have more respect for an Amazon's picker than Jeff Bezos himself though I don't think the latter is a bad guy.
None of these are related much to the enneagram and/or are common person things

- I think like a politician, i.e. it's a cultural battlefield
- I often feel inferior in a clinically obsessive way, and sometimes I'd like to settle my scores, but I don't, because it's rationally the worst idea possible ; anyway everyone who deserves to pay will eventually pay.
This could potentially be enneagram 3, but part of it I might not attribute to enneagram, especially if clinical obsession with these things is a huge aspect of your thinking style.

- I often think "you might be weak, but not a coward"
- I think many people are friendly to naive people (including myself sometimes) in order to take advantage of them
- I'm not a tough guy, but not a Care Bear either. I have to defend my interests, sometimes in a pushy manner, because it's something everyone does and should do.
This sounds very (cp)6 actually.

- I think everyone sees his interests first, and saying "my interests comes after someone else's interest" is inherently hypocritical
- I think laws and other "protections of the weak" are an illusion, Darwin is always right at some point
- I think the respect I give to people who don't deserve it is essentially stolen
- I think you can say "I have this virtue" if you do have it, otherwise it's stolen valor
- Some people think I'm aggressive, others don't ; actually I just speak in a loud and undiplomatic way
- Punching or insulting me is way less grave than lying to me
- I don't think I'm thinking, or maybe I think too fast to know I'm thinking
- I don't highlight people, I evaluate them ; I'm friendly with most people, but my acutal friendship has to be deserved
- Though I give the chance to many people/informations/things to be evaluated, I evaluate them quickly and those which happen to be selected are rare
- I think people who say "I'm non-violent" or "I'm not aggressive" are likely to lie about it.
- I have an agenda of defending oppressed people, but I hate the fact I can't do anything ; moral justice is really an obsession to me
This also sounds 6 > 8, however I do think you're probably right about having an 8 fix going off these alone.
 

HongDou

navigating
Joined
Nov 23, 2012
Messages
5,191
MBTI Type
ENFP
Enneagram
6w7
Instinctual Variant
so/sx
Or, maybe I just didn't understand reasonably the tritype thing.

Not to ruin the whole point of the thread, but I feel like, while tritype is useful, the order of the secondary types is pretty negligible. If you're set on being a type 4 with 7 as your head and 8 as your gut fixations, then that's pretty much all you need to know without splitting hairs.

Then again, this may be hypocritical of me to say, because I do relate to 2w3 and 7w6 a lot more strongly than 9w1 lol. But I also flip between identifying as an ESFJ 2w3 and an ENFP 7w6 a lot. I feel like a lot of self-identification depends on where you're at in the moment. Sometimes it is hard to find a definitive answer, or there may never be one really. That may not be a satisfying answer to some looking to find a place for themselves within the system, but for me I've come to see type more as an avenue that facilitates introspection and reflection so I'm now more comfortable with the lack of a solid answer. We are always changing, so there will always be new things to discover about ourselves.

FWIW I also agree with [MENTION=34313]RadicalDoubt[/MENTION] that a lot of what's stated isn't super specific to 7 or 8. I think what you should be exploring more is what unnerves you, what strikes fear in you? It's hard because a lot of the Enneagram fears are very basic human fears (fear of not being loved, fear of not being in control, etc). So another way to think about it is, in your case, how you process restlessness/anxiety and how you process anger. That's why I don't identify with 9 in my tritype as much, because I don't feel as preoccupied processing my anger as much as I do with processing my need for validations to my identity and the lengths I go to keep myself mentally stimulated.
 

tony_goth

Pseudo-delusional Rebel
Joined
Sep 18, 2018
Messages
225
MBTI Type
ENFJ
Enneagram
487
Instinctual Variant
sx
So another way to think about it is, in your case, how you process restlessness/anxiety and how you process anger.

I think I don't have the same EType definitions. I think restlessness/anxiety is an "sx" thing as opposed to "sp".

Personally, I think of ETypes with 468/135/279 and 459/126/378 groups. The first meaning degrees of optimism (feeling of others' accuracy) and the latter meaning degrees of confidence (feeling of own accuracy).
 

tony_goth

Pseudo-delusional Rebel
Joined
Sep 18, 2018
Messages
225
MBTI Type
ENFJ
Enneagram
487
Instinctual Variant
sx
Oh... I decided it was 487. Thank you all the posters above for helping me.

I'm more 8-ish than 7-ish, because I'm not the type of guy who likes to take things lightly.
 
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