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  1. #1
    Now with less salt. Methylene's Avatar
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    Disclaimer: How are you doing? Are there any major life events/illnesses/other issues that might be influencing you? Did you write this in one sitting, or have you pondered these issues deeply? Give us a sense of "where you're at" right now.

    I used to type 6w5 3w4 9w1. However, I was typed three years ago, when I wasn't in a very good psychological condition. Now I'm feeling much better, so I feel like something has changed.
    I'm gonna write this in one sitting, since I should be studying.
    Generalities: girl, italian, early twenties, uni chemistry student, INTP. Used to live with a toxic family, but I've moved out a year ago in order to avoid any more conflict and lessened the boundaries, so I'm feeling much better and freer.
    ------------

    1. Establish a "baseline mood"--when you're at home with nothing to do, where are you at mentally and emotionally? What do you notice in yourself? (Note, this is not a mood you inhabit "frequently", but your psychological baseline).
    I don't really know. Since I suffer from a sleeping disorder, I'm at most sleepy and annoyed with that, or bored. Or I just don't feel anything I can recognise, I'm not talking about "calmness", just nothing.

    2. Describe yourself--
    a. What's it like to be you?
    Anxious of other people's motives and my relationship with them, inquisitive, curious about anything new I can try to understand. Mostly, I can't fully experience feelings, unless it's something big or it's fear, sometimes anger.
    b. What have others said about you? I've just been said that I have a big ego once I get accostumed with the people I'm speaking to. "She has a level head", I approach problems from a logical standpoint more than an emotional one. That I can't directly face up my parents about what's wrong, but I think that my mother is too emotionally controlling to do so.
    c. What do you think of yourself? I'm okay with myself right now. I'm working hard on my problems and getting something out of it. I still have deep down a sense of anxiety that's haunting me, but I'm starting to learn to keep it at bay. I'm also starting to feel accomplished. I'm studying something that I like with people that I can look up to and trust, and I'm one of the very few girls in my field.

    3. What are the issues you've dealt with in life? List some recurrent themes, and tell us a little about each one.
    Problems with authority: as a child, I used to be very subdued to authorities, "the teacher's pet". As an adult, I'm having a much more ambivalent relationship with it. I need to understand if they're intellectually valuable or if their reasoning is right. If it's not, I've no problems in challenging it. If it is, I can let them guide me. Same with my peers.
    Examples: organic chem lab. I'm not good at it, and my lab partner was much better than me. "Can you explain to me what's going on? Can you do this calculation for me?", I let him take the lead. I allowed myself not to do my part perfectly or to strive for perfectness.
    Analytical or inorganic chem lab. I'm good at it, I want to strive for perfection, I took the lead because I perceived both my partners as less competent than me. "No, you're using that burette wrong, let me do the titrations, you wash the glassware. Let's do some more misurations or we'll be inaccurate". "What the fuck are you doing, it's completely wrong, let me do this".
    Anxiety: I used to suffer from social anxiety, now I'm much better. From time to time, I still question whether my friends really like me or not, but it's not as invasive as it used to be. I don't like being in places where I don't feel I have an escape way, such in airplanes or lifts.
    Questioning myself and everything I do: I usually question my reasoning and everyone else's, and double check it by absurd. However, in practical matters, this makes me a decent troubleshooter and helps me preparing a "plan B, C, D" and so on.
    Putting myself in trouble just for the sake of it: I think it comes from challenging the authority of my parents, but I still like it and solving the problems I generate myself.
    Procrastinating work: I seem to take more pride in procratinating everything and getting good results at the end of it than having a steady line of work.
    Taking too much pride in my accomplishments: it annoys people.


    4. You're not good at everything--
    a. What personality traits and/or ways of being are impossible for you to adopt?
    Being too much warm with people or interested in small talk. My relationships are usually shallow and exist just for the sake of having somebody with me and not be seen as a weird loner, even if I need a massive amount of time on my own because interactions drain me. My relationships usually lack in intensity. Being completely unflappable.
    b. What are qualities you'd like to have, but can't seem to develop? I'm pretty okay with where I am right now, I wouldn't change anything. Maybe I'd like to feel more intensity in my life.

    5. Why have you left friends and other relationships in the past and/or why have they left you? I was bored with them, or they were bored with me, or they had hurt me somehow. I usually find it hard to leave people, every now and then, maybe even after years, I come back, even if they hurt me.

    6. Which types do you identify with most?
    a. How do you relate to these types?
    b. How do you NOT relate to them?

    7. Which types are least like you?
    a. Why specifically do you not relate to these types?
    b. What points (if any) DO you relate to?

    I'm gonna merge these questions, because right now I don't really know.
    Type 1: I do have some perfection strives, but it usually is only if I feel competent in that feel. If I don't, I'm gonna let go and focus on other things, because I feel like I have tons of things to do. I don't act in name of a higher mean, just logical correctness.
    Type 2: I do enjoy helping my friends from time to time, but it usually is giving advice or my analysis of the situation, I wouldn't say it's a vital need in my life, but when it happens, I'm okay with it.
    Type 3: As I said, I take pride in my accomplishments, but I'm not a really hard worker. I tend to procrastinate, do everything at the last minute, and somehow get out of it. But I feel like I do need some kind of admiration in my life, or I would be just one of the others. It can be from my father, though, he's an NTJ with 6 3 and 8 somewhere in his tritype who always gained success and admiration for his accomplishments, and he's always pushed me to be like him.
    Type 4: It's something that I don't like admitting, but I also take pride in being special. For example, I take a lot of pride in being the only girl in my course who's taking up physical/theoratical/computational chemistry as a master's degree. So a part of me is extremely proud of always having challenged the stereotypes that are placed upon girls, from a very young age. I've always been into masculine activities, even if my appeareance is rather feminine, since I was in elementary school. I'd get annoyed if anybody tried to pressure me in a role I didn't want. But I don't strive for authenticity, nor I enjoy looking at a "poetic meaning" in life. I'm rather melancholic when it comes to certain memories, though.
    Type 5: I can see a lot of me in the descriptions, even if I'm pretty sure it's not my main type. Also, INTP, so it's easy to fall in the trap. It's true, I like to analyse the world from the safe, quiet place in my own mind, and try to remove any emotional contamination as much as I can. But I think I'm more reactive, especially when I feel something as false/logically wrong. I'm not that reclusive, I often speak about my problems in real life acting like they're not a big deal, or just a joke to tell in front of a beer. I do need people in my life, but just as a background noise.
    Type 6: It's the one I can see myself the most, even if most descriptions are just awful. I think I've answered the most about it in other answers. I think I could easily be counterphobic more than phobic. Also, I don't have this loyalty strive, I easily change based on what I perceive to be trustworthy, usually in an intellectual meaning.
    Type 7: I have to keep my options always open, I don't like closure, and I need to be free from any other judgement, expetations or whatever. I'm responsible for my conclusions, even if I doubt them, and I prefer to fully experience them than being said "don't, trust me, it's like this, period".
    Type 8: I think I've answered this when I spoke about my relationship with authority. I'm not that much intimidating, but it's also because I'm short and slim, I don't see it being possible with my physical appearance. I don't like being controlled, but if I have an authority figure who's doing the same as I would, I can go with it. If it's not, I'm willing to take control of my actions and the ones of other people.
    Type 9: This one's weird. I used to avoid conflict at all costs, in fact I had 9w1 in my tritype, but now I don't know anymore. I guess I still do, mostly with my parents because discussing with them if impossible, but right now I'm much more reactive. I still try to maintain peace and usually be a pacemaker within the group, but it's not anymore something I need to do at all costs. I experience anger and indignation, sometimes very deeply, and I'm much more reactive than other 9w1 fixers I've known. I still don't like conflict, but I can discuss more veehementely. I'm much less subdued to people and going with the flow than I originally was.

    8. They claim enneagram type is a hidden love need. What are your attitudes toward finding love? I'm starting to be more cynical about it. Also, I find it extremely hard to fall in love if there's not some kind of struggle I have to face. But I used to idealize my previous SO so much that I couldn't escape when it got toxic. A part of me would like to settle down and feel at peace, completely calm, with anybody.

    9. What is the message your superego tells you?

    Consider a time when you felt poorly about yourself--this means your ego (i.e. YOU) is receiving negative feedback from your superego. Write a conversation between the two of them--what is your superego telling you about how to be? (Note: this obviously is very personal and may be better done privately. Report your findings).

    It's usually a struggle between "you shouldn't feel anxious or doubt that, those are the logical reasons you should be fine" and "but I do still feel like it and I can't do anything about it"


    For the following, rank the issues in the order they apply and give a brief description of why and how you relate.

    10. Determine your ego ideal--the way you strive to be and want others to perceive you. (Note, you may be consciously aware of failing at this, and you will be hard on yourself if you do. If someone else tells you you're NOT this way, it may make you feel hurt, violated, or angry.)
    Logically impartial. Good at what I do. Also, I'd get frustrated if people would question my accomplishments or my work.

    Which of the following ideals resonate with you the most, and why? Rank them.



    11. Determine your "felt sense" of life. To do this it may help to look at how you perceive events. Another way to do this is to look back at your childhood and think of all the things your parents did to you. How did you/do you feel about these events?

    Here are some common "felt senses" of life:




    12. Core fears. You may have been aware of these fears even as a very small child, before anyone did anything to influence it. You'd be mortified to be in this position or have others perceive you this way.

    Discuss which fears have played the greatest role in your life:





    Self-Preservation (Need to protect and preserve)
    1. Do you tend to save money and are cautious about spending it?
    Kinda, I'm decent at managing my resources, but I usually don't leave space for savings, just for being able to buy what I need.
    2. Are you security oriented? Ready to protect yourself, those close to you and your resources? yup
    3. Are you fairly consistent? Like things known and regular? No big changes? it depends. I can either get anxious about changes or embrace them as a new adventure.
    4. Do you dislike taking big risks unless it's a "sure" thing? yep. That's why I develop multiple plans, so I don't take risks in case the risky thing I did went wrong.
    5. Are you fairly private? Not revealing too much to strangers? nah
    6. Do you tend to be introverted? not so pathologically as I usually was, but overall I think I still lay on the introverted side.
    7. Do you understand money? Securities? Investments? my father has tried to teach me it when I was younger, but I had gotten bored. I do have the very basics though.
    8. Do you tend to plan for the future? Ready for emergencies? a lot
    9. Are you concerned about health? Safety? Comfort? Home? Hearth? health- I almost died a year ago, so I've become more anxious about it. Other things, not too much. I just care about the essentials.
    10. Are you worried about what may go wrong? Tend to imagine worse case scenarios? a lot
    11. Do you like things spelled out? Details? Exact information? Guarantees? yes
    12. In relationships do you take care of others financially? yes, I did. My ex was sx/so, he was extremely poor at managing his money, so I helped him, even financially.


    Social (Need for Social Validation) - Can show up with strong focus on groups, organizations, family, world, friends, your surroundings, your social image
    1. Do you need or really like social validation?
    deep down, yes
    2. Is social image important to you? deep down, yes again
    3. Do you have desires/fantasies of being rewarded in a social or public arena? LOL YES, at times
    4. Do you think about your affect on others, groups, organizations, and the world? at times, not very often, and usually after it's happened.
    5. Is it very important to you to look good in public, groups, work, and the world? Is name recognition important, either yours or others? yep
    6. Are you upset if you don't get enough validation, reward for the hard and creative work you do in a social context or for a social cause? not that much, but I would like it
    7. Are you involved in groups, organizations and team oriented activities? no, I work on my own
    8. Is belonging to special groups or being a leader of a group important to you? kinda
    9. Are you strongly upset if you feel not included or rejected by a group or family or not invited to a social event? deep down, yes
    10. Do you make your money through your association with groups affecting a large number of people? no, but I use my group to get more knowledge, or explainations for things I don't understand
    11. Do you get really upset if you make a social faux pas? Do you think about and plan out how you will be or present yourself in public? yes
    12. Are you the social instigator and connector in your family? no, I got out from that mess my family is. I can be in my group, even if I'm often not there because I don't feel like doing it.


    Relationship (Need for 1 to 1 or Relationship Closeness)
    1. Do you define yourself through a romantic or close partnership? Is closeness with another person of paramount importance?
    no
    2. Do you like intense energy, particularly in relating to people? Are you energized when you have a revealing conversation or engagement with another, particularly a special other? I like when it happens, but I don't actively look for it
    3. Do you tend to focus more attention on close relationships than money? no
    4. Does money relate to how a partner will see you more than security for yourself? no
    5. Are money and resources less for self and more to please an intimate other? no
    6. Does your attention go more to how well you relate to a partner or potential partner than to other concerns? kinda?
    7. Would others describe you as dramatic? Do you like to go deep with things? kind of, because the rare times it happens, I go deep. I wish it was more.
    8. Do you tend to be in the moment and not think as much about the future or your future security? no
    9. Do you have an urge to merge? Do you "lose yourself" with an important other at times? it happened two times in my entire life, when I was so in love I had lost any sign of rationality.
    10. Do you like risk taking? New experiences? Tend to get bored without enough stimulation particularly in the area of relationships?risk taking: yes, if I have a plan be which makes it not a risk. But I do enjoy that adrenaline rush. New experiences, it depends, already spoken about that. Boredom, it happens a lot, but with a SO I can accept the lack of stimulations, it means we've settled down after the honeymoon phase.
    11. Are you focused more on connection with another and forget your own priorities? mostly no, but it's happened when I had fallen in love
    12. Do you focus a lot on sexuality, romantic fantasies or mystical spiritual experiences? no, except for romantic fantasies, I still do have them, I focus on them just for fun, then reject them as bs that's never going to happen. Except that at times they lead me to doing big gestures, such as taking a night train, do 500kms just to make a surprise to my SO.
    I don't think that it's so personal
    Anymore
    I don't think that it's irreversible
    Anymore
    Sometimes I feel like I'm a sentimental trooper.

    6w5 - 3w4 - 9w8 so/sp
    RLUEI
    Chaotic neutral.
    LII-Ne.

  2. #2
    Now with less salt. Methylene's Avatar
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    Random material I'm going through.
    Counterphobic sixes:


    Tritype 369:


    There seem to be very few descriptions about 469s.
    I don't think that it's so personal
    Anymore
    I don't think that it's irreversible
    Anymore
    Sometimes I feel like I'm a sentimental trooper.

    6w5 - 3w4 - 9w8 so/sp
    RLUEI
    Chaotic neutral.
    LII-Ne.

  3. #3
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    469 is called "the seeker" because they are trying to look for the answers and figure out their identity.

    @Tater is an ISTP 9w8 6w5 4w5 SX/SO

    I could buy "triple bonding" for you. 639. You seem to value trying to connect with others... Come off fairly warm but still distant because you are INTP after all. Highlander is an INTJ version of 639. T versions of this often don't come off super warm and fuzzy but on some level, you can tell that still value bonding with others as a way of comfort and familiarity.
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  4. #4
    Now with less salt. Methylene's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Consilience View Post
    469 is called "the seeker" because they are trying to look for the answers and figure out their identity.

    @Tater is an ISTP 9w8 6w5 4w5 SX/SO

    I could buy "triple bonding" for you. 639. You seem to value trying to connect with others... Come off fairly warm but still distant because you are INTP after all. Highlander is an INTJ version of 639. T versions of this often don't come off super warm and fuzzy but on some level, you can tell that still value bonding with others as a way of comfort and familiarity.
    Based on those definitions, both 469 and 369 are possible. However, e4 is a reclusive type, so I'm skeptical in putting it as a main fix.
    I do place a great value in bonding, and I think the definition "warm, yet distant" is really accurate. NTs usually are more aloof than me, but it's also true that they are usually either sx or sp. So that's were the word "bonding" becomes confusing. It is in a sx way? Or just social? Or is it defined by the instinct?
    But the reason I'm so warm and fuzzy with people is because I think that if I let myself be as distant as I would, I would end up alone. It's being so reactive to the events that I can't explain. But maybe it's a 6 thing, which is the only type I'm sure of.

    369 is also supposed to be the most common tritype, so it's not impossible I am one. The problem is that I'm starting to doubt that 9 fix. 9w1 is usually the most common gut type for NPs, so I had initially thought it had to be the one. But I've noticed I'm more reactive and warm than that.

    So, could you explain to me how do 9w8 and type 4 show in a Ti-dom such as @Tater? If you don't want to it's fine, of course.

    Enneagram has always been confusing to me because it has a lot of variables involved, and I've never found a good way to unify them in a coherent model.
    I don't think that it's so personal
    Anymore
    I don't think that it's irreversible
    Anymore
    Sometimes I feel like I'm a sentimental trooper.

    6w5 - 3w4 - 9w8 so/sp
    RLUEI
    Chaotic neutral.
    LII-Ne.

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by Methylene View Post
    Based on those definitions, both 469 and 369 are possible. However, e4 is a reclusive type, so I'm skeptical in putting it as a main fix.
    I do place a great value in bonding, and I think the definition "warm, yet distant" is really accurate. NTs usually are more aloof than me, but it's also true that they are usually either sx or sp. So that's were the word "bonding" becomes confusing. It is in a sx way? Or just social? Or is it defined by the instinct?
    But the reason I'm so warm and fuzzy with people is because I think that if I let myself be as distant as I would, I would end up alone. It's being so reactive to the events that I can't explain. But maybe it's a 6 thing, which is the only type I'm sure of.

    369 is also supposed to be the most common tritype, so it's not impossible I am one. The problem is that I'm starting to doubt that 9 fix. 9w1 is usually the most common gut type for NPs, so I had initially thought it had to be the one. But I've noticed I'm more reactive and warm than that.

    So, could you explain to me how do 9w8 and type 4 show in a Ti-dom such as @Tater? If you don't want to it's fine, of course.

    Enneagram has always been confusing to me because it has a lot of variables involved, and I've never found a good way to unify them in a coherent model.
    As a Ti dom, he places a significant importance on making sure that the definitions have consistency in a given framework but there's an emphasis on self-expression and individuality... with a noted emotional heaviness.

    I would say 469s are fairly social because they are still seeking answers from outside sources (triple doubting tritype).
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  6. #6
    ฬᎥɬⲥhฯ ฬ๏ოᥑռ Luminous's Avatar
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    I think 369 tritype, not 4 instead of 3. You don't have the active individuation going on. And you don't seem that reactive or withdrawn. Guessing so/sp for instinctual stacking.
    ✦ᏖᏒᎥᎮ ค ℓιɬɬℓɛ Ꮭıɠɧɬ ʄคŋɬคʂɬıƈ✦ -: ✦ :- ƒ O ᖇ G E ᗪ I ᑎ ƒ I ᖇ E ❋-: ✦ :-★・゚ᴅᴏɴ'ᴛ ・゚ ꜰᴇᴇᴅ ・゚ ᴛʜᴇ ・゚ᴇᴇʟꜱ・゚★
    * ・゚ ・゚ * ⊱9w1✶S✶2w1✶X✶5w6⊰ * ・゚ ・゚ *
    ✦Շђєяє คяє ๓σяє тнιηﻭѕ ιη нєανєη αη∂ єαятн Շђαη คяє ∂яєαмт σƒ ιη уσυя ρнιℓσѕσρну.✦
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  7. #7
    Now with less salt. Methylene's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Luminous View Post
    I think 369 tritype, not 4 instead of 3. You don't have the active individuation going on. And you don't seem that reactive or withdrawn. Guessing so/sp for instinctual stacking.
    Just to double check the only missing part. Why e9 instead of e8?
    I don't think that it's so personal
    Anymore
    I don't think that it's irreversible
    Anymore
    Sometimes I feel like I'm a sentimental trooper.

    6w5 - 3w4 - 9w8 so/sp
    RLUEI
    Chaotic neutral.
    LII-Ne.

  8. #8
    ฬᎥɬⲥhฯ ฬ๏ოᥑռ Luminous's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Methylene View Post
    Just to double check the only missing part. Why e9 instead of e8?
    Your gut seems more balanced than 1 or 8. You're not overbearingly one way or another... not tightly IT must be this way! like a 1, and not a steamroller where you force it to be what you want and don't let the world affect you. You don't seem put off by being somewhat vulnerable, saying that you do share problems like they aren't a big deal, and you aren't overly concerned with being strong and in control.
    ✦ᏖᏒᎥᎮ ค ℓιɬɬℓɛ Ꮭıɠɧɬ ʄคŋɬคʂɬıƈ✦ -: ✦ :- ƒ O ᖇ G E ᗪ I ᑎ ƒ I ᖇ E ❋-: ✦ :-★・゚ᴅᴏɴ'ᴛ ・゚ ꜰᴇᴇᴅ ・゚ ᴛʜᴇ ・゚ᴇᴇʟꜱ・゚★
    * ・゚ ・゚ * ⊱9w1✶S✶2w1✶X✶5w6⊰ * ・゚ ・゚ *
    ✦Շђєяє คяє ๓σяє тнιηﻭѕ ιη нєανєη αη∂ єαятн Շђαη คяє ∂яєαмт σƒ ιη уσυя ρнιℓσѕσρну.✦
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  9. #9
    Now with less salt. Methylene's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Luminous View Post
    Your gut seems more balanced than 1 or 8. You're not overbearingly one way or another... not tightly IT must be this way! like a 1, and not a steamroller where you force it to be what you want and don't let the world affect you. You don't seem put off by being somewhat vulnerable, saying that you do share problems like they aren't a big deal, and you aren't overly concerned with being strong and in control.
    So 9w1?
    That's true, I think I listed the traits that would either apply for either e1 or e8 as a wing, but I think it gets confused by my Ti need for logical correctness and understanding.
    I have to say that all the common leitmotifs in my life apply almost exclusively to e6, so, without an external outlook, it's hard to distinguish the differences.
    Regarding that, I think I tend to bounce back and forth from phobic and counterphobic. It's true that I share an enormous amount of anxiety, but, regarding some fields, I had no problems in acting reactively. I had even considered 6w7, but I think it's more of my cp tendencies speaking.
    I don't think that it's so personal
    Anymore
    I don't think that it's irreversible
    Anymore
    Sometimes I feel like I'm a sentimental trooper.

    6w5 - 3w4 - 9w8 so/sp
    RLUEI
    Chaotic neutral.
    LII-Ne.

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