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[ESTP] Being an Asian ESTP

The_Liquid_Laser

Glowy Goopy Goodness
Joined
Jul 11, 2007
Messages
3,376
MBTI Type
ENTP
I don't see a problem with attaching a "cultural personality" to a country.

See, the national personality is not derived directly as the "sum of its parts" where "parts" = individuals.

What contributes to national personality is its actual history, its past and current interactions with other nations and how it fits into the larger world culture/economy, its own economic and political systems, the religious faiths that are prominent, its view and support of science/tech, etc.

Those are the "components" of the national personality, and individuals regardless of type might influence these things over time but usually are forced to conform to some degree.

I'd essentially agree to this. Furthermore I would add that I think certain personality traits are socially reinforced as either "good" or "bad" depending on the culture. For example I would see introversion as positively reinforced in Japan while extraversion is positively reinforced in Italy. This doesn't mean that the percentages of introverts or extraverts are significantly different in either country, but it might mean that extraverts are encouraged to be more subdued in Japan while introverts are encouraged to be more outgoing in Italy.

I would say over the last 50-75 years in the US alone we have see a gradual shift from SJ behavior/attitudes to SP attitudes.

I'd actually say the opposite. The western frontier is an SP ideal. It represents freedom and a lack of order. Furthermore during WWII American soldiers were praised for their ability to improvise and get equipment repaired quickly on the move instead of waiting for things to be done in an official procedure. These are SP traits, and Americans stood out from Europeans because of these traits. Now that there is no more land (on Earth) to explore and conquer, and our current states are all largely industrialized I think the SP dream has essentially dried up. Furthermore having the most wealth and military power has driven the US towards more conservative SJ behavior so that we will preserve what we have.

What would you ENTPs do without straw men?

What would you INTJ's do if you had to actually explain yourselves instead of making blanket statements which are meaningless without further elaboration? ;)
 

Nocapszy

no clinkz 'til brooklyn
Joined
Jun 29, 2007
Messages
4,517
MBTI Type
ENTP
ENFPs are way too nice and cuddly to do that.
ESFPs are even less likely, but she did it. Not all ENFPs (I know... my brother is a good example among a few others) would have a problem stuffing a squirrel into a bee-hive or tying a cat to the roof of a car on a whim, despite what you'd like to think about your nature.

Just look at Michael Scott from the office. He's an amazingly self-centered, narcissistic, but still caring person. He's an ENFP.
 

Nocapszy

no clinkz 'til brooklyn
Joined
Jun 29, 2007
Messages
4,517
MBTI Type
ENTP
Probably not an N. I find it very hard to visualize. In art class, I can only draw still life.

Well, I can't draw anything at all. Doesn't make me more N or S. One class doesn't prove anything.
 

hungrypossum

New member
Joined
Feb 1, 2008
Messages
109
MBTI Type
ESFP
Sure type me I have no idea what I am. My INFP friend insists I'm an ENFP.
 

Mycroft

The elder Holmes
Joined
Jun 7, 2007
Messages
1,068
MBTI Type
INTP
Enneagram
5w6
Instinctual Variant
so/sp
What would you INTJ's do if you had to actually explain yourselves instead of making blanket statements which are meaningless without further elaboration? ;)

Objectively, culture is behavioral adaptations to a region. Historically human mobility was limited, hence various cultures arose in relative isolation. In modern times, the "region" has become the planet and local-area adaptations are being combined or pared accordingly.

People tend to think of their area's historical culture as not a system of adaptations but rather a unique spirit that sets their "in-group" apart from the "them" of the world. A cursory flip through a newspaper will provide many examples of the problems this presents in modern times.

Regardless of what "cultural" ideals any given country or region pays lip service to, walk into an office and you're going to find EPs running sales, IJs handling planning and administration, and EJs largely filling the ranks of management.

To cite a specific example, while Japan does tend to pay greater lip service to introvert-friendly ways of thinking (as CzeCze points out), in any public school it's still the same hand-raising, oral reporting, 40-kids-stuffed-into-a-room environment you'd find in America or Italy.

I suppose, if you were looking for a snappy one-liner, you could say that "culture" is the ideals a group of people pay lip service to, regardless of the reality.
 

ygolo

My termites win
Joined
Aug 6, 2007
Messages
5,988
It's not MBTI but there were some differences supposedly between U.S. and Finish small bussiness owners.

KIMMO HYRSKY AND MIKA TUUNANEN
Innovativeness and Risk-taking Propensity: A Cross-Cultural Study of Finnish and U.S. Entrepreneurs and Small Business Owners

ABSTRACT
The present study centers on innovativeness and risk-taking. These two personality traits are among the most distinctive entrepreneurial characteristics. They provide a good starting point for a comparison
of entrepreneurial behaviour between Finnish and U.S. entrepreneurs and small business owners. The Carland Entrepreneurship Index (CEI) was employed to measure the varying degrees of innovativeness
and risk-taking displayed by Finnish and U.S. entrepreneurs and small business owners. The Americans (N=456) had greater risk-taking propensity than the Finns (N=434) who tended to be more conservative and risk-averse. Americans also exhibited slightly higher levels of innovation. Regarding gender, in the combined Finnish and U.S. sample, females had higher levels of innovation preference than the males. Meanwhile, male respondents scored significantly higher on risk-taking. In both countries respondents with detailed business plans had much higher risk-taking propensity and preference
for innovation than those with no detailed plans. Finally, profit and growth oriented informants in both countries scored higher on both scales compared to those oriented to earning family income.

http://lta.hse.fi/1999/3/lta_1999_03_a2.pdf(A pdf--you are warned)

The t-tests on the innovation metric they were using showed significant differences for Finish and U.S. founders. Also, the t-tests on the risk-taking scores showed significant differences between U.S. and Finish small business owners in general.

Of course, this doesn't mean anything for individual Finns or Americans. It may also not indicate anything fundamental. But there do seem to be some significant differences in culture here.
 

SahlainAnteth

New member
Joined
Feb 18, 2008
Messages
41
MBTI Type
ISTP
I'm an ASIAN ESTP! And sometimes I laugh to myself merrily about it, for the irony of being born into a society of dominant "I" "S" and "J"s.

Meet my Dad, typical Asian lawyer, working in a prestigious law firm. Typical conversations with him will be "How are your studies girl?" "What are you doing tomorrow?" "Sleep early, or you'll get a tight slap" (Happened to me when I was a kid I got spanked alot :( And yes, he still talks to me like that sometimes! DO IT OR ELSE)

Then there's my Mum, who came from a less educated background from my Dad, where she grew up in a tiny tribal village in Taiwan. Mum's an ESFP I think, and she's always talking about makeup, how to look pretty, and marrying young.

I know what you mean. I have friends from Taiwan, Thailand, Japan, China, Korea... One is from a Japanese-American family. He's an ExFP and has a really hard time communicating with his family (I'm pretty sure his mom is an _NTJ).

One former roommate is from a Japanese-American family and grew up in Japan. Her first year at university in the US she was SO QUIET! I felt like a bull in a china shop in our room--and I'm an introvert. I never really felt like we connected at all while rooming together, but the longer she was there the more she's opened up. Now I'm prepping to be in her wedding soon. :)


This only happened 1 and a half years ago when I moved to Melbourne, where I became a Christian and went to the punkiest church you can find, Planetshakers

Whoo hoo! Yay for cool churches. I love my home church. :party2:
 

SahlainAnteth

New member
Joined
Feb 18, 2008
Messages
41
MBTI Type
ISTP
It's not MBTI but there were some differences supposedly between U.S. and Finish small bussiness owners.



http://lta.hse.fi/1999/3/lta_1999_03_a2.pdf(A pdf--you are warned)

The t-tests on the innovation metric they were using showed significant differences for Finish and U.S. founders. Also, the t-tests on the risk-taking scores showed significant differences between U.S. and Finish small business owners in general.

Of course, this doesn't mean anything for individual Finns or Americans. It may also not indicate anything fundamental. But there do seem to be some significant differences in culture here.


Hmm... that's really interesting. Especially since I was raised in the only place in the US where a significant portion of the population is of Finn descent (my family's English/Prussian-American and not originally from here). I would definitely say that the cultural "attitude"/personality is significantly different here from the rest of the US and has been strongly impacted by the Finn-descended population.
 

walfin

New member
Joined
Jul 16, 2008
Messages
4
MBTI Type
INTP
Yeah. I heard Asians were mostly INTPs.
Where in the STARS did you get that notion?
Now I wonder why I had such a lousy time growing up.

hungrypossum said:
During a social studies test, we were given a cartoon of Singaporeans queueing up to reach a buffet table and asked to comment on the country's cultural identity. Now, in that picture I could see individuals pushing each other to get to the food.

So I wrote that Singaporeans are competitive, and afraid to lose to one another even in trivial matters. I got a big fat C.
It's obvious why you got a C if your teacher was a Singaporean, isn't it? ;)
Humans. Sigh...

To cite a specific example, while Japan does tend to pay greater lip service to introvert-friendly ways of thinking (as CzeCze points out), in any public school it's still the same hand-raising, oral reporting, 40-kids-stuffed-into-a-room environment you'd find in America or Italy.
Somehow I think SJs end up being the majority in most places, whether they're introverted or extraverted.
 

Mondo

Welcome to Sunnyside
Joined
Mar 1, 2008
Messages
1,992
MBTI Type
EsTP
Enneagram
6w7
I know Asians of all types, but the supposed Asian stereotype is IXXJ- quiet conscientious people
 

nomadic

mountain surfing
Joined
Jul 15, 2008
Messages
1,709
MBTI Type
enfp
i started typing not really knowing what's my point or take on this, but since i have a clearer idea now, i think my question is actually how asians of any personality type cope with social pressure or to collective thinking.

im Korean, or Korean American to be specific.

I think there are a lot of cultural differences between different Asian ethnicities. Like I think SE Asians are more chill than most "East Asians".

But I deal with social pressure all the time. Disapproving looks I used to get at work for smoking (in America), social pressure to work harder to make the same grade. Less acceptance of my "quirks" because im far from the typical mainstream view of "William Hung and Tila Tequila" LOL (a korean would never submit to either stereotype or be on TV playing one), bc of my ethnicity The way I deal with that is hey, im a minority in this country, so thats just the way it is. I actually hate having a "minority complex", then again, I generally don't identify with TV and movies in America either. Although discovery channel is pretty cool I must say.

Either way, work life and play life is seperate for me, although occassionally it crosses over, esp. stress relief about similiar situation at work... Thats probably how I been sane for a while.
 

istpunk

New member
Joined
Jan 13, 2008
Messages
68
MBTI Type
istp
ESxP's are great people. If it wasn't for them, the invention of 2-4am at the bars/dance clubs and 50% of alcoholic drinks would not exist.

STDs would decrease dramatically, crime rate going down, etc.
 
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