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  1. #1
    Member JenniferCheck's Avatar
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    Question Dating and having intimate relationships as an attractive ISTP (or ESTP) woman?

    Hey. I know that there are other threads about ISTP women but the ones i found were really old and none of them seemed to be mainly focused on dating as an ISTP or an ESTP woman. They were way too general ("What are ISTP women like?" and et cetera). So i decided to create one.

    I am still quite young (23 years old) but dating seems so... unnatural for my personality. And i kind of feel like I've wasted my teenage and young adult years in a sense because i missed my chance to explore how relationships/intimacy work when i had less responsibility and much more free time back in high school and at the beginning of university. I've almost completed my computer science degree and am probably going to be employed soon so it'd be even harder for me to meet potential partners since I'd be spending a lot of time at work and so on. And i know for sure that i'd never date someone that i go to work with because if we break up i wouldn't want to deal with the potential drama at the workplace.

    ESTP women probably have an easier time with dating overall because of how extroverted they are for the most part. But there's still this emotional detachment that is more or less present in all female thinker types have which throws many men off since we're supposed to be the "sensitive, sweet, emotional and feminine" ones in the relationship. So i was wondering what fellow xSTP women think about this? People that have a good understanding of Jungian typology and/or know xSTP women, especially ISTPs can of course feel free to add to the conversation.

    From one perspective, i like living in the moment and in the sensory world and i am slightly thrill-seeking too so i can be really seductive and fun around people that i really like and know well. But on the other hand my Fe is inferior and i hate social interaction and getting to know people overall. So most people never get to meet the more fun, carefree side of me. And at least ESTP's Fe is their 3rd function so i suppose they have a slightly easier time connecting to people and being emotionally vulnerable, which would make it easier for their wild and sexy Se-ish nature to be brought out so they have the advantage of being capable to potentially be really sexual.

    Not saying that they're promiscuous or whatever, but that maybe they have an easier time connecting to someone enough that they'd be willing to sleep with them and that they probably have an easier time with attracting men through their sexual openness and extroversion. Whereas us ISTPs are for the most part way too aloof and "tough". We're hard to get to know and even harder to be emotionally close to so that sex and romance can follow unless your an ISTP that's into one night stands. It's obviously possible because of our strong Se usage and love for all things sensory but more rare i think because of our Fe inferior. I'm sure that male ISTPs are more into casual sex compared to ISTP women.

    The only people that are truly familiar with the more "fun and wild" side of me are the only female girl friend that i have (i tend to trigger jealousy in and intimidate most women, my friend's an ENTP) and a good ENFP male friend of mine who lives in a different country. It took me my whole life to essentially find 2 people that i can actually call friends although i wouldn't say that I'm awfully close to them either. We usually call/text only about once a week, sometimes once every two weeks. So how could i possibly open up enough to have an intimate and/or romantic relationship with someone? I don't want to dramatize but it seems incredibly far-fetched, almost completely impossible.

    I know that i'm still young and that i have my whole life ahead of me but my personality won't really change overnight, even if i end up becoming more quote-in-qupte mature and slightly more social as i grow older. I don't mean to brag/put myself on a pedestal but objectively speaking, i'm really good looking. My eyes are blue, my hair is jet black. I have a tiny nose, big lips and almond eyes. I essentially look like a stereotypical IG model/bimbo which probably gives me an advantage over other ISTP women because it kind of compensates for my abnormal emotional detachment and my aloofness. But even though men are physically attracted to me, they have no idea how to interact with me.

    Whenever a man starts getting to know me, there's almost always an extreme personality clash. I look like a bimbo so they expect me to be a bimbo too. I'd say that i have a really sophisticated yet sassy, femme fatale-ish clothing style (a.k.a. my attire is much more "feminine" than casual Western woman's) so men always expect me to be very stereotypically feminine too. I'd say that I'm very nerdy and overall knowledgeable in tons of different topics and subjects so i believe that I'd be a good match for "nerdy" and intellectual type of men but they're usually the ones that idiotically write me off as vain and dumb solely based on my physical appearance without ever having talked to me so they never really actually get to know me. Even when i don't have the whole "femme fatale" look on. In high school i used to dress really casually but people always categorized me as the "stupid mean girl" before even meeting me, without even interacting with me because of my looks.

    I suppose that only very masculine men and brave men would be able to be in a relationship with me. On one hand i am somewhat masculine in my thinking and behavior so most people would instinctually suggest that more sensitive and slightly less masculine feeler men would suit me more so that we could balance each other out. But that would be the case only if i felt the need to take the more masculine, agressive role in relationships. I might not be ultra girly, emotional and submissive but I've never felt the need to dominate men either. Having a guy walk around me like a puppy and ordering him around isn't appealing to me. I know that everyone's different and i don't look down upon women that fit this category but it's simply not my thing.

    I probably need to be with someone that can stimulate me intellectually (which is a hard task to begin with) and someone that's masculine enough so that their manliness won't be threatened by my presence, mind and behavior. And these types of super masculine men usually seek ultra-feminine women. So they'd need to be also looking for a smart and intellectually stimulating partner specifically. It'd be relatively hard to find a man with these three traits alone. What about physical appearance and social status?

    I am not a vain woman, it's not like i'll turn down a man unless they look like a Calvin Klein model and a they're a fortune 500 CEO. And once again, i really don't want to sound like an asshole but i'm very attractive and once i start working my salary would be somewhat high. So i wouldn't really want to settle someone who's objectively ugly and still lives in their mom's basement. I expect to date someone who's at least average-looking and has their own job, place, car and fits all of the categories i already talked about above (masculine but not intimidated by women that aren't overly-feminine, someone who's looking for an intellectually stimulating partner). I suppose you can already tell why finding a partner would be incredibly hard for me.

    Older men (10-15 or even 20 years older) are fine in my book so maybe it'd be better for me to give it a try with someone older. But even then, the idea of me being affectionate and emotionally vulnerable with someone sounds comedic. After i graduated high school i made a promise to myself to at least try to be more open-minded as far as dating and social interaction overall goes. But I'm still the highly emotionally detached, asocial and slightly misanthropic person that i've always been. I don't think that i'll be ever able to completely change. And if i need to be honest, i'm slightly worried that i'll end up being alone forever. I am honestly somewhat fine with it because i've always been a lone wolf and i have a preference for being on my own. But there's still a part of me that longs for a potential connection with someone anyways. And it's really conflicting. The world of dating and socializing has always been a mystery to me.
    Last edited by JenniferCheck; 08-06-2020 at 05:28 PM.

  2. #2
    Administrator highlander's Avatar
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    I'm bumping this thread because it got stuck in a moderation queue so it doesn't get lost
    Likes JenniferCheck, Starry liked this post

  3. #3
    Member JenniferCheck's Avatar
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    I apologize for all of the typos. Some of these sentences make me sound like an illiterate idiot, lol. To be fair, i am not a native English speaker but still.

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    Terpsichore Abcdenfp's Avatar
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    I have so many thoughts on this I need to organize them. So I will circle back to this.
    I will say that acknowledging that this is an area you struggle with but desire to make adjustments to is a good start at this .
    I also think it is very normal for ISTPs in general to not have relationships as the focus in their early years that comes with development and maturity.
    It is good to be the lone wolf it's a part of who you are ferociously independent and self sufficient but even a wolf needs a comrade.
    take a look at the two friends you have , what aspects of their personalities allows you to drop your guard and let them see a different side to you.
    without question I find ISTPs both males and females like their partners to be attractive , so it's not unusual for you to have their high on your list.
    some men don't like over emotional women, not all men like the dramatics and flare.
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  5. #5
    ϚᗩᑎᑕTᑌᗩᖇY Luminous's Avatar
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    I guess we need a thread for "unattractive" ISTP women too.
    There is a crack in everything
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  6. #6
    Member JenniferCheck's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Luminous View Post
    I guess we need a thread for "unattractive" ISTP women too.
    LOL i specifically mentioned attractive because women that look a certain way tend to be boxed into a stupid category (bimbo/vain bitch and etc.) by society which obviously doesn't sit well with ISTP/ESTP and overall thinker type women because people's idea of who we might be personality-wise has nothing to do with reality/what we're actually like which makes dating automatically even harder for us since we tend to attract people that assume we're going to be stupid and/or overly feminine and not people that would actually match us.
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  7. #7
    Member JenniferCheck's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Abcdenfp View Post
    I have so many thoughts on this I need to organize them. So I will circle back to this.
    I will say that acknowledging that this is an area you struggle with but desire to make adjustments to is a good start at this .
    I also think it is very normal for ISTPs in general to not have relationships as the focus in their early years that comes with development and maturity.
    It is good to be the lone wolf it's a part of who you are ferociously independent and self sufficient but even a wolf needs a comrade.
    take a look at the two friends you have , what aspects of their personalities allows you to drop your guard and let them see a different side to you.
    without question I find ISTPs both males and females like their partners to be attractive , so it's not unusual for you to have their high on your list.
    some men don't like over emotional women, not all men like the dramatics and flare.
    Yeah, i get it. It's really frustrating because the men that i tend to attract prefer these type of women and i feel extremely incompatible with everyone. As far as what traits my friends have that make me open up - they're simply intelligent and open-minded. When they met me they didn't assume that i was a massive bitch simply because i was aloof and not very talkative which is usually what people think of me before even getting to know me. They respected my boundaries and didn't expect me to open up immediately. You'd be surprised by how rare that is to find in people. They're also very knowledgeable and i can discuss tons of different things with them which is something that i always seek in relationships (both platonic and romantic ones).

  8. #8
    ϚᗩᑎᑕTᑌᗩᖇY Luminous's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JenniferCheck View Post
    LOL i specifically mentioned attractive because women that look a certain way tend to be boxed into a stupid category (bimbo/vain bitch and etc.) by society which obviously doesn't sit well with ISTP/ESTP and overall thinker type women because people's idea of who we might be personality-wise has nothing to do with reality/what we're actually like which makes dating automatically even harder for us since we tend to attract people that assume we're going to be stupid and/or overly feminine and not people that would actually match us.
    You're assuming that female Fs aren't as smart as you, don't have their own issues in relationships, and there's a huge difference between mentioning you're attractive and saying that wars have been fought over your looks (the latter comes off as being arrogant and vain). I am an F dom, and I'm also extremely intelligent, though some people assume otherwise because I am F dom, and do have a sense of humor and playfulness.
    There is a crack in everything
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  9. #9
    Member JenniferCheck's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Luminous View Post
    You're assuming that female Fs aren't as smart as you, don't have their own issues in relationships, and there's a huge difference between mentioning you're attractive and saying that wars have been fought over your looks. I am an F dom, and I'm also extremely intelligent, though some people assume otherwise because I am F dom, and do have a sense of humor and playfulness.
    I am absolutely not saying that F types aren't smart. That'd be just as idiotic as people saying that intuitives are always more intelligent than sensors. I don't even know what this thread has to do with intelligence per se to begin with. And of course that everyone has personal issues. Just saying that women and overall people with a feeling function high up in their function stack (a.k.a. feelers) tend to have an easier time being emotionally vulnerable, especially if they're Fe-doms or auxiliaries. And i made this thread about ISTP/ESTP women specifically because we're one of the least stereotypically "feminine" types out there and there's always been a social expectation for women to be more caring and/or emotional compared to men which doesn't usually fit the description of who we are personality-wise, at least not for the most part. Ergo, in many cases we have even more hardships when it comes to dating/socializing compared to the average woman (75% of women are feelers) since we are often perceived as "different" in a bad way by society. And this forum was created so that people can talk about typology and discuss the differences/similarities between the different types as well as the common hardships of the different types. I don't know who has perceived you as unintelligent because you're an F-dom of some sort but this isn't what I'm doing so you can feel free to stop projecting. Also, did i ever say anything that could be possibly paraphrased as something between the lines of "wars have been fought over my looks"? I don't think so. I apologize for not being faux-humble enough for your taste. I've always had a preference for being blunt, honest and saying it like it is. And I'm simply sharing my personal experiences. It's not meant to be an attack on you or anyone else. Aside from the obvious passive-agressiveness, I'm not sure about what you could possibly contribute to this thread.
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  10. #10
    ϚᗩᑎᑕTᑌᗩᖇY Luminous's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JenniferCheck View Post
    I am absolutely not saying that F types aren't smart. That'd be just as idiotic as people saying that intuitives are always more intelligent than sensors. I don't even know what this thread has to do with intelligence. And of course that everyone has personal issues. Just saying that women and overall people with a feeling function high up in their function stack (a.k.a. feelers) tend to have an easier time being emotionally vulnerable, especially if they're Fe-doms or auxiliaries. And i made this thread about ISTP/ESTP women specifically because we're one of the least stereotypically "feminine" types out there and there's always been a social expectation for women to be more caring and/or emotional compared to men which doesn't usually fit the description of who we are personality-wise, at least not for the most part. Ergo, in many cases we have even more hardships when it comes to dating/socializing compared to the average woman (75% of women are feelers) since we are often perceived as "different" in a bad way by society. And this forum was created so that people can talk about typology and discuss the differences/similarities between the different types as well as the common hardships of the different types. I don't know who has perceived you as unintelligent because you're an F-dom of some sort but this isn't what I'm doing so you can feel free to stop projecting. Also, did i ever say anything that could be possibly paraphrased as something between the lines of "wars have been fought over my looks"? I don't think so. I apologize for not being faux-humble enough for your taste. I've always had a preference for being blunt, honest and saying it like it is. And I'm simply sharing my personal experiences. It's not meant to be an attack on you or anyone else. Aside from the obvious passive-agressiveness, I'm not sure about what you could possibly contribute to this thread.
    Your attitude is off-putting, which might be good feedback for you, since you have issues relating to other people. If you're not interested in that feedback, I will gladly exit the thread.
    There is a crack in everything
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