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[ISTJ] ISTJs are they all in the can for Mc Cain?

Cimarron

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I'm ISTJ, but i'll vote for obama if i have a chance... :D
Right, which goes with what many people have pointed out: that for ISTJs (and any SJs), your political/cultural climate has a strong effect on your personal political ideas. Put negatively, you could say that we are more likely to conform to our own society's main values and ideas.

For example, I wouldn't be surprised (but don't know from experience) if a lot of ISTJs in mainly-liberal California cities and Northeast U.S. cities hold liberal views.
 
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dnivera

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It depends on upbringing.

ISxJ will tend to cling to what was already established. (That's a generalization but if we're going to discuss type influences on political leanings, then that's what we're discussing.)

If ISxJ grew up with more "liberal" thought processes, then that's what they'll go with.

Agreed.

If only blue/liberal were mainstream...then we would have so many SJs on our side, because they conform like sheep.
 

Frankie_Lee

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I grew up in a pretty moderate (blue leaning) state, Minnesota. My parents made a point to never talk politics in front of me. I think my dad leans Republican, but I can't be sure...My point being, I don't think my environment predisposed me very strongly to make me lean either way. I ended up pretty staunchly Libertarian. I'm skeptical about all government, and I especially hate social conservatism. Srsly, just let the gays marry. ;)
 

Cimarron

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Cool. It looks like most ISTJs are kind of predisposed to be Fiscally Conservative, careful with our money. That was one of our values before it was ever a Political Stance. :yes: In that sense, I guess most ISTJs either tend Republican or Libertarian, or whatever party is perceived to be fiscally conservative.
 
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I grew up in a pretty moderate (blue leaning) state, Minnesota. My parents made a point to never talk politics in front of me. I think my dad leans Republican, but I can't be sure...My point being, I don't think my environment predisposed me very strongly to make me lean either way.

Actually that means your environment predisposed you to being socially liberal since 1. Minnesota is socially liberal and 2. your parents obviously didn't encourage anything to the contrary.
 

Frankie_Lee

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Actually that means your environment predisposed you to being socially liberal since 1. Minnesota is socially liberal and 2. your parents obviously didn't encourage anything to the contrary.

Yes true, but it just seems like the influences weren't as strong as most people would experience. Everybody says "you're just a democrat/republican because your parents are" but I have no idea what my parents are, so I thought I was special for a minute. And I grew up in an urban area so even more unconscious reason for me to be liberal.
 

hermeticdancer

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Mostly my turning away from the Republican party has to do with their pro-war, pro-military stance. I understand we do need military, and defense, but I am anti-war.

I don't think it's possible to "win the war" when you can't even define what winning means, or keep making up arbitrary definitions along the way, and rationalizations. Even with good justification, war is bad, and should be ended as soon as possible.

I think we should break up with Iraq! And let go of trying to fix everything in the middle east, unless we seriously want to end up destroying ourselves in the process, it's the healthy thing to do.
Some people still need to let go of the idea of winning a war... ahemm Mc Cain...

From a conservative stand point, you would think ISTJ's would be against war for some obvious reasons that don't include feeling, its pretty expensive and costs a lot, of lives, time, money...

A good wesite is antiwar.com. It's not pro Obama, or Mc Cain.I like to listen to their radio programs.
 

ptgatsby

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Cool. It looks like most ISTJs are kind of predisposed to be Fiscally Conservative, careful with our money. That was one of our values before it was ever a Political Stance. :yes: In that sense, I guess most ISTJs either tend Republican or Libertarian, or whatever party is perceived to be fiscally conservative.

I'd think most SJs will have a bias towards conservatism (as will all Js, actually). But generally as an ideology, not automatically as a party. That means that even with the bias (which is only a bias), the expression of it can be very different.

What the OP is describing is better measured by 'social dominance' (SDO), least as it relates to Republicans rather than conservatism (at this point, I only consider libertarians to be conservatives, just without the social institution part of it). It sounds like the boyfriend ranks extremely high on that scale.

To generalise though, there is a bias towards conservatism in Js. Some Js will care about being fiscally responsible, and some won't, meaning that the reasons why they tend that way aren't universal. In the present day, republicans tend to be much higher on the SDO and that doesn't directly translate into conservatism.

IOW, the support for Bush probably has nothing to do with being a conservative. It's a different preference that matters!
 

Jack Flak

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pt: Yes, and it's the Good Old Clinton days they want. Also, SJs are imperceptive (By definition) so they don't realize Clinton wasn't in charge of their bank account.
 

ptgatsby

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Also, SJs are imperceptive (By definition)

:facepalm:

Anyway, there are a lot of different points of view on voting, and a lot of different reasons for the underlying tendencies. I don't believe it is the SJ in particular that would measure the OP's boyfriend's willingness to vote neo-con. More likely to be dominantly T, if anything, then S for the anti-liberal portion and J for the pro-conservative portion. Combined, T and J for SDO, and maybe STJ for any right wing authority preferences.

The reason to segment them is because, as people have noted in the thread, it isn't a single faceted issue. It's only when the tendencies combine together that it becomes strongly expressed as a result of underlying preferences.

That means that not even a majority of SJs would fall into these categories, just enough to be statistically significant - more than the general population.
 

Cimarron

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Good points to think about all around. I've heard about studies that "showed" that the brains of "liberals" and "conservatives" use different parts when thinking about politics, and I thought it might be J vs. P at its root.

I had a thought specifically about this thread topic earlier in the day, but I can't remember what it was...
 

hermeticdancer

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I tested myself online.

results:

Your true political self:
You are a

Social Moderate
(55% permissive)

and an...

Economic Liberal
(35% permissive)

You are best described as a:

Centrist


You exhibit a very well-developed sense of Right and Wrong and believe in economic fairness. loc: (18, -57)
modscore: (21, 33)
raw: (2531)

A link to the test itself:

OkCupid.com: The Politics Test - Online Dating Test
 

hermeticdancer

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an unscientific voluntary internet poll about MBTI and political affiliation...here are some from the types ive seen here. Interesting though about ISTJ and being split.

Also look at the difference between ENFP and ESFP. ESFP are the most conservative.

ISTJ

We had 103 ISTJs volunteer their political affiliation. The breakdown is as follows:

1. Republican - 29% (30/103)
2. Democrat - 29% (30/103)
3. Not Political - 13% (13/103)
4. Middle of the Road - 9% (9/103)
5. Other - 7% (7/103)
6. Liberal - 5% (5/103)
7. Conservative - 4% (4/103)
8. Libertarian - 2% (2/103)

INTP

We had 46 INTPs volunteer their political affiliation. The breakdown is as follows:

1. Republican - 26% (12/46)
2. Democrat - 26% (12/46)
3. Not Political - 15% (7/46)
4. Middle of the Road - 13% (6/46)
5. Liberal - 13% (6/46)
6. Conservative - 4% (2/46)
7. Other - 2% (1/46)
8. Libertarian - 0% (0/46)

ISTP

We had 34 ISTPs volunteer their political affiliation. The breakdown is as follows:

1. Middle of the Road - 24% (8/34)
2. Republican - 21% (7/34)
3. Democrat - 21% (7/34)
4. Not Political - 12% (4/34)
5. Liberal - 9% (3/34)
6. Conservative - 3% (1/34)
7. Other - 3% (1/34)
8. Libertarian - 0% (0/34)
ENFP

We had 130 ENFPs volunteer their political affiliation. The breakdown is as follows:

1. Democrat - 27% (35/130)
2. Republican - 19% (25/130)
3. Liberal - 16% (21/130)
4. Not Political - 10% (13/130)
5. Middle of the Road - 8% (11/130)
6. Other - 8% (11/130)
7. Conservative - 7% (9/130)
8. Libertarian - 5% (6/130)

ESFP

We had 67 ESFPs volunteer their political affiliation. The breakdown is as follows:

1. Republican - 34% (23/67)
2. Not Political - 19% (13/67)
3. Democrat - 13% (9/67)
4. Middle of the Road - 12% (8/67)
5. Conservative - 10% (7/67)
6. Liberal - 7% (5/67)
7. Other - 3% (2/67)
8. Libertarian - 0% (0/67)

http://www.personalitypage.com/political_affil.html
 

Cimarron

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Well the other main candidate is running on a theme of "Change". Did he expect to win SJ votes with that kind of slogan? :jew:
 

Roheline

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To return to the OP, I'm in a somewhat similar situation as an INFP dating an ESTJ (don't ask me how that happened), so I can relate to this. I am madly in love with him and wouldn't change him for anything, but I still get slightly frustrated at times. It doesn't help that he's a good deal older so we're in some ways seeing the world from the vantage of different generations.

The strangest part for me is how when it comes to certain issues I (supposedly the emotion-driven, idealistic type) am almost more rational than he is (the rational thinking judging type)! I am at least willing to consider that the other side might be just as valid as mine and that our differences might lie in upbringing and our ways of interpreting information, but for him there's always a right and a wrong, usually already decided in his mind.

The result of this is that I have spent the last 6 months (about as long as I've known him) in a state of serious ideological turmoil questioning what I was raised to believe (thanks to him), which he thinks is attributable to my lack of religious direction and "grounding" in the "right" beliefs! What I'm wondering is whether this crusade to improve me will always exist or if it's possible for SJ's to accept another's differences.
 
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