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[MBTI General] ISTJs Explained By ISTJs: Post your questions here!

Gerbah

New member
Joined
Oct 6, 2009
Messages
433
MBTI Type
ISTJ
Enneagram
5w4
How do you handle rebellion against the institution with which you align yourself?

(i.e. a new employee trying to undo your workplace's current political structure in order to establish a more relaxed, informal atmosphere?)

I would need to know more about the whole context to know if this is the right thing to do in the long-term. If you are a new employee then you probably don't have the power base and influence to have enough of a following to implement the change.

Also, as a more open-ended question:

How do view/handle rebellion/rebelliousness?

It depends on if the reasons for rebellion are rational or not. If I think it's a necessary and correct response to the situation, then I would rebel.
 

IZthe411

Carerra Lu
Joined
Jul 19, 2009
Messages
2,585
MBTI Type
INTJ
You sounded too intuitive. "I envision how events will develop." That's Ni, not Si. I hardly believe you are an ISTJ, because of how articulate you are. Usually INTJs know they are INTJs.

That's Ne.
 

IZthe411

Carerra Lu
Joined
Jul 19, 2009
Messages
2,585
MBTI Type
INTJ
I would need to know more about the whole context to know if this is the right thing to do in the long-term. If you are a new employee then you probably don't have the power base and influence to have enough of a following to implement the change.



It depends on if the reasons for rebellion are rational or not. If I think it's a necessary and correct response to the situation, then I would rebel.

In that specific example, I'd join them right along.

I'm more about the reasons. If it's for something that I think is beneficial, then go for it. But if it's just about you, then I'd have a problem.

Rebellion is necessary sometimes. There's a right and a wrong way to do it, though.
 

Donna Cecilia

L'anima non dimora
Joined
Mar 19, 2010
Messages
1,219
MBTI Type
INTJ
Enneagram
1w9
You sounded too intuitive. "I envision how events will develop." That's Ni, not Si. I hardly believe you are an ISTJ, because of how articulate you are. Usually INTJs know they are INTJs.

I know. But, being mentally and/or emotionally unhealthy (as I have been for this time) leads to a wrong perception of yourself.

Now I know which are my real strengths and weaknesses.
 

Aleksei

Yeah, I can fly.
Joined
Mar 10, 2010
Messages
3,626
MBTI Type
ENTJ
Enneagram
7w6
Instinctual Variant
sx/sp
That's Ne.
Ne envisions possibilities about how events could unfold. Ne users rarely state with complete certainty that an event will unfold in a certain way -- unless they're stuck in a Ne-Je loop, in which case they make one pronouncement with absolute certainty, and a minute later state the opposite with equal certainty. :laugh:
 

IZthe411

Carerra Lu
Joined
Jul 19, 2009
Messages
2,585
MBTI Type
INTJ
Ne envisions possibilities about how events could unfold. Ne users rarely state with complete certainty that an event will unfold in a certain way -- unless they're stuck in a Ne-Je loop, in which case they make one pronouncement with absolute certainty, and a minute later state the opposite with equal certainty. :laugh:

Quote:
Originally Posted by raz
You sounded too intuitive. "I envision how events will develop." That's Ni, not Si. I hardly believe you are an ISTJ, because of how articulate you are. Usually INTJs know they are INTJs.

That's Ne.

So are you getting stuck on the 'will' in his statement? Otherwise your definition of Ne fits what he said.

Thanks.
 

Donna Cecilia

L'anima non dimora
Joined
Mar 19, 2010
Messages
1,219
MBTI Type
INTJ
Enneagram
1w9
Both Ni and Ne are future-focused.

Ni is about certainity (how things will be), while Ne is about possibilities (how things could, or are likely to, be).

I choose the first approach.
 

Aleksei

Yeah, I can fly.
Joined
Mar 10, 2010
Messages
3,626
MBTI Type
ENTJ
Enneagram
7w6
Instinctual Variant
sx/sp
So are you getting stuck on the 'will' in his statement? Otherwise your definition of Ne fits what he said.



Thanks.
The "will" part of that statement is important, as it is essentially the single most noticeable distinction between Ni and Ne. From what I know of her, Cecilia tends to dislike brainstorming, which means she's either an Ni user, or has a very weak inferior Ne. The latter doesn't fit the above statement.
 

coconut

New member
Joined
Jul 11, 2010
Messages
136
MBTI Type
INTJ
"iNfluence", yes. Maybe being here has hepled me to get back into my healthy self.

I started taking MBTI tests six years ago, when I was going through a depressive cycle, which is ending now.

No wonder you sounded so different than the ISTJ I know.

So, you think you might be INTJ? Come, come to the dark side . . .
 

IZthe411

Carerra Lu
Joined
Jul 19, 2009
Messages
2,585
MBTI Type
INTJ
Both Ni and Ne are future-focused.

Ni is about certainity (how things will be), while Ne is about possibilities (how things could, or are likely to, be).

I choose the first approach.


That's perception in general, yes? Ni is internally focused, i.e. making random connections in order to conclude on outcome, while Ne is external. Si's the same way, except it's looking for connections based on past experience, to conclude the outcome.
 

IZthe411

Carerra Lu
Joined
Jul 19, 2009
Messages
2,585
MBTI Type
INTJ
The "will" part of that statement is important, as it is essentially the single most noticeable distinction between Ni and Ne. From what I know of her, Cecilia tends to dislike brainstorming, which means she's either an Ni user, or has a very weak inferior Ne. The latter doesn't fit the above statement.

Really? It's just a written word on a board- how can you conclude on her whole self based on a statement from someone else?
 

Aleksei

Yeah, I can fly.
Joined
Mar 10, 2010
Messages
3,626
MBTI Type
ENTJ
Enneagram
7w6
Instinctual Variant
sx/sp
I've spoken with her at some length through IM.
 

Aleksei

Yeah, I can fly.
Joined
Mar 10, 2010
Messages
3,626
MBTI Type
ENTJ
Enneagram
7w6
Instinctual Variant
sx/sp
That's perception in general, yes? Ni is internally focused, i.e. making random connections in order to conclude on outcome, while Ne is external. Si's the same way, except it's looking for connections based on past experience, to conclude the outcome.
Ni is anything but random. Making connections at random is, itself, an external Ne process. Ni works by delving deep into a given concept or idea to find its hidden meanings, and solve seemingly complex or paradoxical problems through the device of a simple change in perspective. This leads to an idea, a fixation, of how things should be, which leads to an impulse for action to change the environment into that idealized vision.
 

IZthe411

Carerra Lu
Joined
Jul 19, 2009
Messages
2,585
MBTI Type
INTJ
Ni is anything but random. Making connections at random is, itself, an external Ne process. Ni works by delving deep into a given concept or idea to find its hidden meanings, and solve seemingly complex or paradoxical problems through the device of a simple change in perspective. This leads to an idea, a fixation, of how things should be, which leads to an impulse for action to change the environment into that idealized vision.

And how is that possible with Ni? By making connections where there are seemingly none to be made, based on subjective, internal data. That could be considered random.

You are getting stuck on words.
 

Aleksei

Yeah, I can fly.
Joined
Mar 10, 2010
Messages
3,626
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ENTJ
Enneagram
7w6
Instinctual Variant
sx/sp
And how is that possible with Ni? By making connections where there are seemingly none to be made, based on subjective, internal data.
Frankly no one knows how the fuck Ni comes up with the ideas it does -- least of all those who use it. That's the essence of Ni. Ne works more explicitly by finding connections and patterns, but Ni is more about "look at it this way..."
 

LadyJaye

Scream down the boulevard
Joined
Nov 6, 2007
Messages
2,062
MBTI Type
ENFP
Enneagram
7w6
Instinctual Variant
so/sx
Not a question, but a comment. I had a dream last night that Simon LeBon ( from Duran Duran ) was driving me somewhere on a date, and in the dream, I kept thinking, " Man! ISTJ jackpot!" LOL. I was so jazzed. I even woke up in a really good mood.

Thanks ISTJ Army! :wubbie:
 

Noon

New member
Joined
Jul 23, 2010
Messages
790
How did you guys figure out you were ISTJ? How long did it take?
What do you think defines the ISTJ best (the "essence" of ISTJ I guess)?
I'd read a profile but I don't want the stereotypes.
 

d@v3

Perfect Gentleman! =D
Joined
Nov 20, 2008
Messages
2,830
MBTI Type
ISTJ
I found out I was an ISTJ because I randomly decided to take the MBTI test. When I compare my personality to the ISTJ description, it is a very close match. I am punctual and able to keep a level head in pretty tight situations. I am also very good with money and am very keen on deciding whether something is right and wrong.
 
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