[SJ] Are SJs afraid of change?

[Yosako]

I wear the same color shirt (white), the same color tie (red) and the same color pants (dark grey) to work every day (even on our Friday "casual" day, which I posted in another thread).

While you do that, I question why men adopted the so-called "full suit" and wear it ad nauseam.

 

[INTJ123]

I dated an SJ once and things were going great until we threw a joint party at his house. We moved all the furniture to one of the bedrooms. The next morning, he got called into work very early and I stayed behind and slept. When I woke I thought he would be so tired when he came back, so to be nice, I decided to clean the place and put everything back. Big big big mistake.

I am not a sensor. I never noticed where the stupid little end tables went. Or what side the rocking chair was on. (In my house, the furniture is so fluid. I push the sofa out of the way to clean and just leave it in that new place all the time. It doesn't matter because it's still there...) Anyway, I just did the best I could, putting things where I thought they were before. When he came home, I was all excited and cooking for him. He took one look at the place and BLEW UP at me. I have never been screamed at like that before or since.

Being the aggressive woman that I am, my first instinct is always to strike back, but in this case I was so taken aback - I just sat there stunned while he screamed that I was trying to control him and that I was usurping his life, or some such bullcrap. That I had no right to come into his house and change the way he lives. Was what I did really that horrible?

honestly this is what pisses me off about SJ's, they get pissed off and bitch at you over something insignificant. I mean as an intj, in that situation I would just be like, hell yea I don't have to do the work of cleaning up the party mess and I got food waiting for me, and if I noticed things where they wern't before, I would just move it back, it's still less work for me in the end, and I would appreciate that. It just seems stupid and counterproductive to bitch and cry about it, and become even hateful over it, a complete waste of time and energy. I had similar even more ridiculous experiences with my old SJ boss, too stupid to even mention.

 

[wildcat]

Watching and reading many posts made by SJ I have come to conclusion that SJs have this fear but for many cases the word fear is probably too strong. Especially if we are talking about very small things.

So, why you try to avod changes ?
I presume that it has something to do with Si.


Nothing of this is actually unknown. But in what I am actually interested in is how big this changes have to be that you sense them.
I am talking about two cases.
1.Changes in arrangement of objects.
2.Changes in the ways how system(s) work.


What kind of changes you find annoying?
How often you are afraid that you will not be flexibile enough?
How calming for you is that you can visualize the actual change/problem?



Also I am interested in what SJs think about idea of rearranging the entire system and what SJs think about crashing it completly? (So that the better one can be formed).

Feel free to take term "system" in the way you find the most suitable for explaining your interests.

There exists two kinds of change.
2. The change from the bottom to the top. It is called revolution.
1. The change from the top to the bottom. It is called autocracy.

Order does not change direction.
Direction does not change order.

Revolution does not order.
Autocracy does not change.

 

[countrygirl]

I dated an SJ once and things were going great until we threw a joint party at his house. We moved all the furniture to one of the bedrooms. The next morning, he got called into work very early and I stayed behind and slept. When I woke I thought he would be so tired when he came back, so to be nice, I decided to clean the place and put everything back. Big big big mistake.

I am not a sensor. I never noticed where the stupid little end tables went. Or what side the rocking chair was on. (In my house, the furniture is so fluid. I push the sofa out of the way to clean and just leave it in that new place all the time. It doesn't matter because it's still there...) Anyway, I just did the best I could, putting things where I thought they were before. When he came home, I was all excited and cooking for him. He took one look at the place and BLEW UP at me. I have never been screamed at like that before or since.

Being the aggressive woman that I am, my first instinct is always to strike back, but in this case I was so taken aback - I just sat there stunned while he screamed that I was trying to control him and that I was usurping his life, or some such bullcrap. That I had no right to come into his house and change the way he lives. Was what I did really that horrible?

That person had issues. He just happened to be an SJ.

 

[Biaxident]

That person had issues. He just happened to be an SJ.

 

[AutumnReverie]

I don't mind change, I just don't like change for the sake of changing (without a purpose). If something works for me, I like it, and there's no problem with continuing to do it that way...I'll stick to that way until it no longer works. Even at restaurants, I'll usually order the same thing (my favorite dish) every time because I know that I enjoy it and I don't want to risk spending a good amount of money on a meal I end up disliking. However if they took that dish off the menu, I wouldn't throw a fit, I would just try out something else until I found a new favorite. Then I would continue ordering *that* dish every time I go there.

 

[NewEra]

honestly this is what pisses me off about SJ's, they get pissed off and bitch at you over something insignificant. I mean as an intj, in that situation I would just be like, hell yea I don't have to do the work of cleaning up the party mess and I got food waiting for me, and if I noticed things where they wern't before, I would just move it back, it's still less work for me in the end, and I would appreciate that. It just seems stupid and counterproductive to bitch and cry about it, and become even hateful over it, a complete waste of time and energy. I had similar even more ridiculous experiences with my old SJ boss, too stupid to even mention.

Way to generalize, this is definitely not an SJ thing.

I don't mind change, I just don't like change for the sake of changing (without a purpose). If something works for me, I like it, and there's no problem with continuing to do it that way...I'll stick to that way until it no longer works. Even at restaurants, I'll usually order the same thing (my favorite dish) every time because I know that I enjoy it and I don't want to risk spending a good amount of money on a meal I end up disliking. However if they took that dish off the menu, I wouldn't throw a fit, I would just try out something else until I found a new favorite. Then I would continue ordering *that* dish every time I go there.

Bingo.

 

[INTJ123]

Way to generalize, this is definitely not an SJ thing.



Bingo.

*moves your keyboard 5 inches to the left* *waits for reaction* yes there is no purpose for this change, but it's silly to get upset over something this insignificant.

yea I did generalize and I realize this level of severity doesn't apply to all SJ's but generally speaking, the SJ is the most likely type to react negatively to change. I saw some posts about how they eventually come to appreciate the change after getting used to it and realizing it's a change for the better, but how often do you guys admit to it and even give praise of it? Usually on the surface all you express is the distaste for change, just because it's change, and rarely do you give praise for it even when it's for the better, even though it's obvious that you do like it.

 

[ayoitsStepho]

gah, try being an ISFJ child and moving 12 times [thats included to puerto rico and different states]
aye...my childhood was screwed in that point. From the way i see it, ISFJ's need that comfort in knowing that things will be the same. they know what will happen and such. but we have to realise things will almost never go the way we plan.
seriously, i've given up on really trying to plan how my day will go because i know it never goes as i expect. plus moving all the time really screwed with my head when it comes to comfort and confidence...but i've tried to grow from that.
x/

 

[Snow Turtle]

*moves your keyboard 5 inches to the left* *waits for reaction* yes there is no purpose for this change, but it's silly to get upset over something this insignificant.

yea I did generalize and I realize this level of severity doesn't apply to all SJ's but generally speaking, the SJ is the most likely type to react negatively to change. I saw some posts about how they eventually come to appreciate the change after getting used to it and realizing it's a change for the better, but how often do you guys admit to it and even give praise of it? Usually on the surface all you express is the distaste for change, just because it's change, and rarely do you give praise for it even when it's for the better, even though it's obvious that you do like it.

This applies to Ni as well as Si users. Most people in the world prefer their internal world to stay relatively consistent and comforting, it's not an SJ thing to be rigid. To make a claim that lots SJs do this, therefore it's an SJ trait is just wrong since it's just a shallow understanding of things.

Change for the sake of change is irritating because it requires one to re-learn everything, so if it's not necessary then we'll stick to one method unless it's proven that the alternative system is much more effective. If you can't really prove a system is decent then well you can't really blame other people for not wanting to jump into the darkness and follow suit.

SJs aren't necessary against change. They are against pointless changes that have significant impact on their way of living. Moving a keyboard is not significant, no SJs are going to rant about it so it's kind of moot point pushing that example forward as something minor.

There's also the issue of one thing being insignificant to one person, but that doesn't necessarily hold true for the other person. It's like the tidy person who comes in and cleans up the messy persons room, it just causes more problem because some people know where their things are in a messy room.

 

[Jaguar]

*moves your keyboard 5 inches to the left* *waits for reaction* yes there is no purpose for this change, but it's silly to get upset over something this insignificant.

Now you are just being a jerk to TCO.

My Dad is probably an SJ. I call him "my rock."
He's my rock because I can count on his unwaivering stability.
He's not a flake who changes his mind every 12 seconds.
Having said that, he's not someone who bitches about little things.
Your keyboard comment doesn't even remotely apply to him.

Is there something in the water?
There is way too much strereotyping going on in this forum in the last 24 hours.
It's like thread, after thread, after thread.

 

[INTJ123]

Now you are just being a jerk to TCO.

My Dad is probably an SJ. I call him "my rock."
He's my rock because I can count on his unwaivering stability.
He's not a flake who changes his mind every 12 seconds.
Having said that, he's not someone who bitches about little things.
Your keyboard comment doesn't even remotely apply to him.

Is there something in the water?
There is way too much strereotyping going on in this forum in the last 24 hours.
It's like thread, after thread, after thread.

wow Jaggy I think this was the least offensive post I've gotten from you. I'm shocked

 

[Jaguar]

wow Jaggy I think this was the least offensive post I've gotten from you. I'm shocked

If you would like me to verbally assault you, I would be more than happy to oblige.

 

[INTJ123]

If you would like me to verbally assault you, I would be more than happy to oblige.

give me a hug lol... somehow I think in your twisted ways you view hugs as evil and verbal assaults as loving. So maybe I should just take your comment as a compliment.

 

[Jaguar]

give me a hug lol... somehow I think in your twisted ways you view hugs as evil and verbal assaults as loving. So maybe I should just take your comment as a compliment.

Hugs are not evil. That's nonsense.

 

[INTJ123]

Hugs are not evil. That's nonsense.

of course it is, so give me one.

 

[Jaguar]

of course it is, so give me one.

 

[Saslou]

Hugs are not evil. That's nonsense.

of course it is, so give me one.

Oh you guys make me chuckle ..

Change .. If someone can explain to me how it is a good thing then i am more than willing to listen and take notes.

I had an excellent team leader at my previous job who taught me to think outside the box. My job required so much change that i stopped fearing it and started embracing it.

I don't mind change to much .. I did emigrate temporarily to another country, i enjoy moving the furniture in the house, If i find a job boring i will apply for another one. It just depends on the circumstances.

Now don't get me wrong, i still have my moments where i like my comforts and with certain things i won't budge/change, such as cake for breakfast is healthy no matter what you say.

 

[Jaguar]

Now don't get me wrong, i still have my moments where i like my comforts and with certain things i won't budge/change, such as cake for breakfast is healthy no matter what you say.

Comforts. My Dad won't budge.
He likes what he likes.

Last night my Dad said he's thinking of getting a "new" car.
I know my Dad so well I couldn't resist needling him.
"So what kind of car are you thinking of getting?"
(As if I didn't already know the answer. )

"Well a Cadillac of course."
"Dad, haven't you ever thought of getting any other car? Something different?"
"No."
"How about the commercials you see on TV, don't any cars grab your eye?"
"I ignore the commercials."

We burst into laughter.

My Dad and I always laugh at ourselves.
If you can't do that, you're a goner.

 

[Saslou]

Comforts. My Dad won't budge.
He likes what he likes.

Last night my Dad said he's thinking of getting a "new" car.
I know my Dad so well I couldn't resist needling him.
"So what kind of car are you thinking of getting?"
(As if I didn't already know the answer. )

"Well a Cadillac of course."
"Dad, haven't you ever thought of getting any other car? Something different?"
"No."
"How about the commercials you see on TV, don't any cars grab your eye?"
"I ignore the commercials."

We burst into laughter.

My Dad and I always laugh at ourselves.
If you can't do that, you're a goner.

Lol.

I had to google image Cadillac's .. Now if he wants to get an Escalade, then he has very good taste.

Predictable is not always a bad thing. Should you ever come into a lot of money, then at least you know what car/truck to buy him. Should you choose to.

Sounds like you both (especially him) have a good sense of humour.

To quote Judi Dench (74 yrs old) - Unless we have a great many laughs and jokes along the way, there's no point at all. I think absurdity and laughter are important.

Smart woman.