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[ESFJ] telling a thick ESFJ to fuck off nicely

girlnamedbless

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Actually... no.

(That's why I am having some trouble understanding your interpretations of people's behavior!)

The girls that Sona is talking about were all Ps who couldn't make up their minds, obviously.
 

runvardh

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The girls that Sona is talking about were all Ps who couldn't make up their minds, obviously.

Or girls who test guys with it. Thankfully I'm not into those girls.
 

prplchknz

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To put nicely the girl I'm talking about is ugly so even if I were attracted to girls I wouldn't be attracted to her. Honestly, I think she should get a sex change she might be attractive if she was a dude.

That's not fair, she has huge boobs going for her.
 

JivinJeffJones

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OP: have you considered responding physically? I was once slapped by a girl for unintentionally violating her boundaries (wasn't hitting on her, just got too close too quickly while goofing around) and I got the message pretty quickly. She apologized for it later but I don't think I came within 10 feet of her after that, not because I was scared of another slap but rather because I was playing it safe with her boundaries. Or you could straight out punch her in the nose.

Re Sona: honestly I don't think what he's saying is so very ridiculous. He is just playing the game by the rules as he's discovered them to be, as ISTJs do. And (as has been mentioned elsewhere) girls may sometimes like to be absolved of responsibility for sex which they desire, especially girls from conservative backgrounds, I suspect. Obviously this does not mean that all girls who say "no" really mean "yes", though I'm pretty sure that all girls who say "fuck off" really mean "fuck off".

And there is the very real possibility of the odd very shy girl who says "no" meaning "no" but just doesn't have the will to make it stick. I was talking to a girl once who occasionally had sex with guys she didn't want to have sex with simply because she was too depressed and had too low self-esteem to sustain opposition to their advances. She figured "I'll just let them do it quickly and get it over with and then they'll leave me alone." I think she felt that it was probably somehow her fault that she'd gotten into the situation in the first place. Which is an exceptional reason to treat "no" as "no" in all cases. But otoh aren't "safety words" invented so that people can say variations of "no" before and during sex without actually meaning "no"? Isn't the very need for safety words an indication that verbal signals are not always intended to be taken at face value in this area, and that there is occasionally a desire for them not to be taken at face value?

Just because it's a somewhat repulsive thought that "no" could be interpreted as "yes please" when it comes to sex, doesn't mean that it is never the case. So long as Sona is very, very, very careful in playing the game, since just one wrong case of interpretation would result in rape, with all its implications. I personally think it's a pretty huge risk to take, and doesn't justify the reward.
 

Totenkindly

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To put nicely the girl I'm talking about is ugly so even if I were attracted to girls I wouldn't be attracted to her. Honestly, I think she should get a sex change she might be attractive if she was a dude. That's not fair, she has huge boobs going for her.

A dude with big boobs? :huh:

Oh, you mean Bob....!

fight.jpg


(Can she sing like Meatloaf too? Being able to sing like Meatloaf has really paid off for that little troll Jack Black, perhaps it would expand her options as well...)

I was talking to a girl once who occasionally had sex with guys she didn't want to have sex with simply because she was too depressed and had too low self-esteem to sustain opposition to their advances. She figured "I'll just let them do it quickly and get it over with and then they'll leave me alone." I think she felt that it was probably somehow her fault that she'd gotten into the situation in the first place.

:cry:

Sigh.
 

Cindyrella

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No, Sona has relations with women he doesn't know. That's his problem. And that's why he believes women who show their desire so directly are sluts. When you're in a relationship with someone long enough, you learn their quirks. A woman might say no, and then be convinced otherwise. She might initiate intimacy. She might say no and tease her SO because it makes for a more playful mood.

But when you don't know the girl and you're trying to get into her pants, the boundaries are going to be much more unclear. I think I know what irks me the most about Sona's comments. He's making women sound like silly little playthings who are easily influenced and should fit into a certain mold. And if they don't do what you want (or how you think they should), they're either slutty or just need convincing.
 

prplchknz

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OP: have you considered responding physically? I was once slapped by a girl for unintentionally violating her boundaries (wasn't hitting on her, just got too close too quickly while goofing around) and I got the message pretty quickly. She apologized for it later but I don't think I came within 10 feet of her after that, not because I was scared of another slap but rather because I was playing it safe with her boundaries. Or you could straight out punch her in the nose.

I've beaten the hell out of her before, this was after I told her don't touch me or please stop and she did anyways. and It's wasn't of those "stop" and then giggle things it was on of those "I Don't like that" "I'm not attracted to you", stop touching me" "please stop touching me their" "WOULD" *hit* "YOU" *punch* PLEASE *kick* GET *hit* YOUR *slap* FUCKING *punch* HANDS OFF OF ME YOU BITCH." of course she takes that as an invitation for who knows what.

I went to see a friend who knows this girl aswell, and my friend conviently pointed out to this girl anything means yes to her. You tell the girl (not my friend) something bluntly like lets say no you can't come over I'm fixing to leave, she'd probably show up at your door in the next 15 minutes. Or ask where your going refuse to quit calling and bugging you until she has all the details and meets you their.

One more month. one more month. then back to Chicago 10 hours from her. So I'm hoping I can avoid her for a month, but she just got a car so I dunno. I panicked when I found out. which is when I sought advice on how to deal with her. If she comes by during the day I can hide until she goes away but if either of my parents are home they'll invite her in.
 

cafe

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Do your parents know that she is touching your boobs and bum and won't stop even when you tell her to stop and hit her? I would not let someone in my house that was doing that to one of my kids.
 

prplchknz

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I don't tell my mom things because she'll either with some very bizzare logic make it my fault. Or will want to talk. I wouldn't mind talking if she'd listen and wouldn't act like everyone in the world thinks the same as her.

My dad I'm sure wouldn't care as it has nothing to do with him directly.
 

cafe

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I don't tell my mom things because she'll either with some very bizzare logic make it my fault. Or will want to talk. I wouldn't mind talking if she'd listen and wouldn't act like everyone in the world thinks the same as her.

My dad I'm sure wouldn't care as it has nothing to do with him directly.
Well that stinks! I'm sorry.

I got mad when something like that (though milder, I think) was happening to my daughter at school, but she didn't want me to go in and say anything. I didn't think it was right she have to tolerate that kind of treatment from a girl when the school would be all over it if it was a boy doing that to her.
 

JivinJeffJones

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I don't tell my mom things because she'll either with some very bizzare logic make it my fault. Or will want to talk. I wouldn't mind talking if she'd listen and wouldn't act like everyone in the world thinks the same as her.

My dad I'm sure wouldn't care as it has nothing to do with him directly.

It's still worth a try. You might be surprised. I find it very difficult to believe that any parents would take such overt sexual harassment of their child lightly. You'd probably be better off asking each of your parents for advice separately, since that would make it less likely for your dad to take the passive route. Of course, chances are they won't have much advice to give you, but even if this is the case it then allows you to tell them you don't want her in the house. Also, make it especially clear to them that you don't want them giving her your address in Chicago.
 

runvardh

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Also, make it especially clear to them that you don't want them giving her your address in Chicago.

Ouch, yeah. Last thing you need is her driving those 10 hours and showing up on your doorstep one day while you're with someone.
 

Totenkindly

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Ouch, yeah. Last thing you need is her driving those 10 hours and showing up on your doorstep one day while you're with someone.

<COFFEE SNORT THROUGH NOSE>

All I can think of is Kevin Kline furiously peering through the large glass windows at Jamie Lee and John Cleese going to town...
 

dissolved girl

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Apologies to the OP for yet again giving Sona a little more attention but his little comment made me laugh:
If I was a female I'd be classed as a slut.

*stands on soap box and adjusts hair*

It's interesting that you feel you'd only be classed as a 'slut' if you were female. We obviously come from different parts of the country... or something. I'll hold back from expanding on my opinion as this kind of thing I've thought about far too much and I doubt you've seriously considered how a sentence like that might appear (unless you're some kind of subtle troll... my assumption is that you're unaware). Hopefully I don't sound arrogant saying that, I'm sure you've considered plenty of things I haven't. Not to mention the difference of perspective. Yet I still want someone to blame... I ask myself...do I blame the individual or do I blame society as a whole? It's a little bit chicken and egg really.

*steps down, stumbles slightly (probably the vodka). Considers moving the soap box from her room as it's cluttering up the place slightly*

To OP: It sounds awful what's going on with you right now. I really hope it gets sorted out, and fast.
 

Siúil a Rúin

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Any advice on how to say I don't like you. you're annoying and have no personal space. and her getting the message. I've tried, but I suck at telling people what exactly I think of them. It comes out either to nice and they love me and think I'm the greatest or overly bitchy.
It does sound like you are going to have to be really direct with this person. Some ways to make it less personal than "I don't like you" is to say things like "Don't touch me. You make me uncomfortable, and I don't want to be around you. Go find someone else who likes it. I don't." Any or all of that might help.

Sorry your parents aren't supportive. If she does come over, you could lock yourself in the bathroom and take a nice long bubble bath. Tell everyone you weren't feeling well, which is the truth.
 
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