[INTJ] Is it normal...

[Megatron]

Is it normal for an INTJ to pick a fight and want the other person to argue back?

Particularly in a romantic relationship.

I have a bad habit of wanting to do this when my significant other is acting weak minded, too passive or lacking a backbone.

I want them to stand up to me because it bothers me that they'll just stand there and take it. I want someone who will defend themselves. Not just to me, but to things in life in general.

I only do this when I've been with that person a long time and also when I feel like I'm losing them- like them fighting back means they still care? And to be completely honest, it is also becuase the idea of a semi heated arguement like that could lead to make-up angry sex.. that sounds like a good time to me..

By the way, I'm fully aware this is not exactly a nice thing to do to someone. That's why I want to talk about it, to see if this is a habit that is common among INTJs or if I'm just a desperate asshole lol. Or if you think this habit is nothing like an INTJ (I still question my type from time to time)

 

[ceecee]

I've done it but I don't really do it anymore. It's usually ineffective and I'm an e8, it's not easy for one of us to resist the pull of demanding to know if someone is going to just sit there take it and not fight back. The other reason I don't do it is that it's a waste of time and nothing I'm going to say will change a mind. Sure, people have come to me later on and said I was right. That feels mostly irritating because they didn't listen to begin with. I would prefer they just not speak about it. So yes I think it's pretty normal.

 

[Amargith]

My INTJ partner doesnt do that, but Im pretty sure he knows that that would have be very counterproductive, especially with me. I've seen him do it in business settings though, and yes, it is hard for him to be patient with others, and not push on that, especially when he sees things falling apart.

With me, he tends to follow my cues on how to deal with me falling apart, or just leave me be, trusting that I'll figure it out. He says he does that because he *knows* from past experience that pressure isn't my friend, and that his way of doing things just doesn't work for me, so he just tries to be there for me while I figure out how things work for me

Similarly, I tend to be supportive of him doing things his own way, but when those rare moments where he doesn't know what to do or feels overwhelmed, I'll often offer a plethora of options I see. If he doesn't catch himself after that, I'll start making decisions and pointing out the structure I'm going to use to fix it for him. That usually helps him to jumpstart his own process and take over.

When it comes to emotional stuff - and I start to feel disconnected and like I'm losing him - I'll point out the issue, tell him that I love him, and explain what I need from him and what my views on the issues are. Then I leave him alone for a week to process, before I follow up. I've found that if I push in a similar fashion on that area without giving him time to think about things and come to term with things, it's like getting blood from a stone and it makes him defensive, even more stuck in analysis paralysis, and in even more need of time alone to process.


We do pick fights with each other, but typically they're 'performance pieces', where it's a bunch of banter about stuff we're both very secure about, and can just generate a massive amount of giggles and word play. Sometimes, it ventures into frustration territory, because it's easier to say stuff when you're joking about, but, we only go there when we're joking, instead of plain angry (to avoid any damage and fallout). The mock-angry shit is only in safe areas. From the joking then follows serious conversation to resolve the issue and discuss it properly.

Ironically, the only time he does pick a fight is when I hesitantly ask for his help with a project that's in his area of expertise. Due to my high perfectionism for aesthetics (and my quirky way of doing shit), and his impatience for mentoring people, it tends to turn into a screaming match of frustration. Most of the frustration from both of us is at the project not cooperating but, because you're working so closely together, the other person kinda gets caught in that anger, which then leads to butthurt feelings and escalations.

...so we stopped doing that

Personally, I also pick fights when reality isn't cooperating with me and making me doubt myself. When he then comes home and notices said 'reality' not being in place, and comments on it (and is hiding frustration bout it not being 'in order'), I can be to be...explosive, which I usually end up apologising for in the same breath

 

[INTJMom]

Is it normal for an INTJ to pick a fight and want the other person to argue back?

Particularly in a romantic relationship.

I have a bad habit of wanting to do this when my significant other is acting weak minded, too passive or lacking a backbone.

I want them to stand up to me because it bothers me that they'll just stand there and take it. I want someone who will defend themselves. Not just to me, but to things in life in general.

I only do this when I've been with that person a long time and also when I feel like I'm losing them- like them fighting back means they still care? And to be completely honest, it is also becuase the idea of a semi heated arguement like that could lead to make-up angry sex.. that sounds like a good time to me..

By the way, I'm fully aware this is not exactly a nice thing to do to someone. That's why I want to talk about it, to see if this is a habit that is common among INTJs or if I'm just a desperate asshole lol. Or if you think this habit is nothing like an INTJ (I still question my type from time to time)

I'm wondering if this might have more to do with your enneagram?
I don't like conflict and avoid it at all cost.

An INFP I know has told me she would like her ISTJ husband to "fight" for her more.

 

[helbert]

Sorry I'm late but this is interesting to me...

In past relationships this has caused problems for me. When I was 17 and less mature I dated an extremely turbulent and emotionally unstable dude (was not aware until we started dating...) and I would pick fights a lot because I thought it was fun, but it really upset him. One time I admitted to him that I just wanted to argue for the sake of it and he was genuinely so astounded that I'm pretty sure he almost broke up with me right then, calling me "super fucked up." I just ignored his emotions all the time anyway because they were so nonsensical to me, so that was just one more of his blow-ups to shrug off. Unsurprisingly, we broke up after two months (in a fantastical way, I may add, that consisted of him sobbing and falling to his knees under a street lamp in an empty parking lot and me struggling to stifle my laughter).

Only later when I reflected back on the relationship I realized how mean I was for that.

My longest and most recent relationship was with an ISFJ, and he was so passive that I would yell at him and become extremely agitated when he wouldn't stand up for himself. He would say "well I just see the logic in what you're saying" and I would say that he wasn't getting the point. I would question how he would react in other, more serious situations where standing up for yourself would be necessary; I don't think I ever actually saw him in one. One time he debated with me about something trivial (I think it was about the way people choose to spend their money) and I was being stubborn and he insulted me, and it made me so happy. I don't care about being called pretentious or stubborn or argumentative because it's true. I thought I had made a breakthrough, but alas, it was a rare occurrence - I wished he was more argumentative and feisty with me. That lasted a year, until I couldn't stand how passive and overbearing and honestly boring he was anymore, and broke up with him kind of insensitively.

I've become really exasperated with relationships and trying to figure out how to act correctly with another person, and haven't dated anyone for almost two years. I did have a casual "relationship" with a guy when I studied abroad recently who is an INTP. That's probably the most ease I've had being with someone, because he was resilient enough to put up with my insults and insulted me back, and argued with me not for the sake of arguing but would genuinely offer other points of view. He was stable and calm but also exciting and fun. We had great, stimulating conversations and I could tell he really liked me for my mind. We got along quite well. I think it's a matter of finding the "perfect" person who meets your objective criteria and trying over and over again to learn how to best interact intimately with people.

 

[Blacksheep2017]

This is me with my ISTJ husband. Though it's actually something I'm trying to change because though it's natural for me to go there, I also see how messed up it can be. I've said some pretty hurtful things to my husband in hopes of getting a response out of him and he just tells me that he doesn't take anything personally. Though the relationship can lack the energy and dominance I sometimes want from him, he is loyal as hell to me despite this odd behavior. I think he balances out my eccentric side pretty well and when I come down from my bursts of aggressive energy, I find myself remorseful.

 

[kotoshinohaisha]

Geez
XD i actually do this..

I fight someone for fun.. Like it would be better if he'll fight back because that's where the fun starts.. XD

But i guess there's some people who doesn't wanna argue.

Got an experience with an intp.. I think his enneagram is 9.. Because he never fight with me... I'm so sad..

Like whenever he does try, he always let me win.. It's so frustrating.. T.T

 

[strugglingpanda]

Is it normal for an INTJ to have a problem finding life goals?