[INTP] INTPs and narcissism

[Peter Deadpan]

Okay. Peace out everyone, cuz clearly people aren't understanding the level of detachment I have from this individual and are reading into it waaaaay too much.

 

[Abendrot]

I can sympathise, and not to invalidate what you have gone through. But a healthy dose of narcissism is necessary in everybody (we don't want people to walk all over us). Ni-doms are the most gullible type so....

So to paint someone as narcissistic would require the person to be an extreme case. And sure enough, that person's environment and childhood must have led him to be the way he is today.

Compensatory Narcissistic

• seeks to create an illusion of superiority and to build up an image of high self-worth
• has disturbances in the capacity for empathy
• strives for recognition and prestige to compensate for the lack of a feeling of self-worth
• may acquire a deprecatory attitude in which the achievements of others are ridiculed and degraded
• has persistent aspirations for glory and status
• has a tendency to exaggerate and boast
• is sensitive to how others react to him or her, watches and listens carefully for critical judgement, and feels slighted by disapproval
• is prone to feel shamed and humiliated and especially hyper-anxious and vulnerable to the judgements of others
• covers up a sense of inadequacy and deficiency with pseudo-arrogance and pseudo-grandiosity
• has a tendency to periodic hypochondria
• alternates between feelings of emptiness and deadness and states of excitement and excess energy
• entertains fantasies of greatness, constantly striving for perfection, genius, or stardom
• has a history of searching for an idealised partner and has an intense need for affirmation and confirmation in relationships
• frequently entertains a wishful, exaggerated, and unrealistic concept of himself or herself which he or she can't possibly measure up to
• produces (too quickly) work not up to the level of his or her abilities because of an overwhelmingly strong need for the immediate gratification of success
• is touchy, quick to take offence at the slightest provocation, continually anticipating attack and danger, reacting with anger and fantasies of revenge when he or she feels frustrated in his or her need for constant admiration
• is self-conscious, due to a dependence on approval from others
• suffers regularly from repetitive oscillations of self-esteem
• seeks to undo feelings of inadequacy by forcing everyone's attention and admiration upon himself or herself
• may react with self-contempt and depression to the lack of fulfilment of his or her grandiose expectations

Now for ENFP and being Paranoid

• suspects, without sufficient basis, that others are exploiting, harming, or deceiving him or her
• is preoccupied with unjustified doubts about the loyalty or trustworthiness of friends or associates
• is reluctant to confide in others because of unwarranted fear that the information will be used maliciously against him or her
• reads hidden demeaning or threatening meanings into benign remarks or events
• persistently bears grudges, i.e., is unforgiving of insults , injuries, or slights perceives attacks on his or her character or reputation that are not apparent to others and is quick to react angrily or to counterattack
• has recurrent suspicions, without justification, regarding fidelity of spouse or sexual partner

But wait! there is more (cue advert) to ENFP and vigilant, hence them being like Scorpios

• Vigilant-style individuals possess a resilient independence. They keep their own counsel, they require no outside reassurance or advice, they make decisions easily, and they can take care of themselves.
• They are careful in their dealings with others, preferring to size up a person before entering into a relationship.
• They are good listeners, with an ear for subtlety, tone, and multiple levels of communication.
• Individuals with Vigilant style are feisty and do not hesitate to stand up for themselves, especially when they are under attack.
• They take criticism very seriously, without becoming intimidated.
• They place a high premium on fidelity and loyalty. They work hard to earn it, and they never take it for granted.

Mirrors my experience when it comes to the ENFP. It's tiring. They seem to be prone to be having 3 children with different partners by the time they are 30 and had them when they were extremely young. Paranoia just means to me, that they keep getting themselves in a mess and then blames others for it.

Did I just judge them?

To outsiders, INTJs may appear to project an aura of "definiteness", of self-confidence. This self-confidence, sometimes mistaken for simple arrogance by the less decisive, is actually of a very specific rather than a general nature; its source lies in the specialized knowledge systems that most INTJs start building at an early age. When it comes to their own areas of expertise -- and INTJs can have several -- they will be able to tell you almost immediately whether or not they can help you, and if so, how. INTJs know what they know, and perhaps still more importantly, they know what they don't know.

INTJs are perfectionists, with a seemingly endless capacity for improving upon anything that takes their interest. What prevents them from becoming chronically bogged down in this pursuit of perfection is the pragmatism so characteristic of the type: INTJs apply (often ruthlessly) the criterion "Does it work?" to everything from their own research efforts to the prevailing social norms. This in turn produces an unusual independence of mind, freeing the INTJ from the constraints of authority, convention, or sentiment for its own sake.

INTJs are known as the "Systems Builders" of the types, perhaps in part because they possess the unusual trait combination of imagination and reliability. Whatever system an INTJ happens to be working on is for them the equivalent of a moral cause to an INFJ; both perfectionism and disregard for authority may come into play, as INTJs can be unsparing of both themselves and the others on the project. Anyone considered to be "slacking," including superiors, will lose their respect -- and will generally be made aware of this; INTJs have also been known to take it upon themselves to implement critical decisions without consulting their supervisors or co-workers. On the other hand, they do tend to be scrupulous and even-handed about recognizing the individual contributions that have gone into a project, and have a gift for seizing opportunities which others might not even notice.

In the broadest terms, what INTJs "do" tends to be what they "know". Typical INTJ career choices are in the sciences and engineering, but they can be found wherever a combination of intellect and incisiveness are required (e.g., law, some areas of academia). INTJs can rise to management positions when they are willing to invest time in marketing their abilities as well as enhancing them, and (whether for the sake of ambition or the desire for privacy) many also find it useful to learn to simulate some degree of surface conformism in order to mask their inherent unconventionality.

Personal relationships, particularly romantic ones, can be the INTJ's Achilles heel. While they are capable of caring deeply for others (usually a select few), and are willing to spend a great deal of time and effort on a relationship, the knowledge and self-confidence that make them so successful in other areas can suddenly abandon or mislead them in interpersonal situations.

This happens in part because many INTJs do not readily grasp the social rituals; for instance, they tend to have little patience and less understanding of such things as small talk and flirtation (which most types consider half the fun of a relationship). To complicate matters, INTJs are usually extremely private people, and can often be naturally impassive as well, which makes them easy to misread and misunderstand. Perhaps the most fundamental problem, however, is that INTJs really want people to make sense. This sometimes results in a peculiar naivete', paralleling that of many Fs -- only instead of expecting inexhaustible affection and empathy from a romantic relationship, the INTJ will expect inexhaustible reasonability and directness.

Probably the strongest INTJ assets in the interpersonal area are their intuitive abilities and their willingness to "work at" a relationship. Although as Ts they do not always have the kind of natural empathy that many Fs do, the Intuitive function can often act as a good substitute by synthesizing the probable meanings behind such things as tone of voice, turn of phrase, and facial expression. This ability can then be honed and directed by consistent, repeated efforts to understand and support those they care about, and those relationships which ultimately do become established with an INTJ tend to be characterized by their robustness, stability, and good communications.

A reason as to why INTPs can be confused with INTJs because of them being extremely private, but INTJs aren't the Solitary type, that's different. And I know INTPs don't need more nonsense (Narcissism) associated with them. When life is already difficult enough for them.

The most common complaint I get is, I need to read between the lines, but I'm not people focused. So my intuition means nothing when it comes to people. And systems when it comes to the INFJ.

INFJ the Sensitive and Avoidant

• Individuals with the Sensitive personality style prefer the known to the unknown. They are comfortable with, even inspired by, habit, repetition, and routine.
• Sensitive individuals care deeply about what other people think of them
• They behave with deliberate discretion in their dealings with others. They do not make hasty judgements or jump in before they know what is appropriate
• Socially they take care to maintain a courteous, self-restrained demeanour
• They function best in scripted settings, vocationally and socially: when they know precisely what is expected of them, how they are supposed to relate to others, and what they are expected to say
• Sensitive men and women are not quick to share their innermost thoughts and feelings with others, even those they know well

• avoids occupational activities that involve significant interpersonal contact, because of fears of criticism, disapproval, or rejection
• is unwilling to get involved with people unless certain of being liked
• shows restraint within intimate relationships because of the fear of being shamed or ridiculed
• is preoccupied with being criticised or rejected in social situations
• is inhibited in new interpersonal situations because of feelings of inadequacy
• views self as socially inept, personally unappealing, or inferior to others
• is unusually reluctant to take personal risks or to engage in any new activities because they may prove embarrassing

So it is easy to see, now, why INFJs and ENFPs are good matches and why statistics backs it up.

ESTPs and Self-Confident

• Self-Confident individuals believe in themselves and in their abilities. They have no doubt that they are unique and special and that there is a reason for their being on this planet
• They expect others to treat them well at all times
• Self-Confident people are unabashedly open about their aspirations and possibilities
• They are able to take advantage of the strengths and abilities of other people in order to achieve their goals, and they are shrewd in their dealings with others
• They are able competitors, they love getting to the top, and they enjoy staying there
• They identify with people of high rank and status
• Self-Confident individuals are able to visualise themselves as the hero, the star, the best in their role, or the most accomplished in their field
• These individuals have a keen awareness of their thoughts and feelings and their overall inner state of being
• People with the Self-Confident personality style accept compliments, praise, and admiration gracefully and with self-possession

ESTPs and Narcissistic

• has a grandiose sense of self-importance (e.g., exaggerates achievements and talents, expects to be recognized as superior without commensurate achievements)
• is preoccupied with fantasies of unlimited success, power, brilliance, beauty, or ideal love
• believes that he or she is "special" and unique and can only be understood by, or should associate with, other special or high-status people (or institutions)
• requires excessive admiration
• has a sense of entitlement, i.e., unreasonable expectations of especially favorable treatment or automatic compliance with his or her expectations
• is interpersonally exploitative, i.e., takes advantage of others to achieve his or her own ends
• lacks empathy: is unwilling to recognize or identify with the feelings and needs of others
• is often envious of others or believes that others are envious of him or her
• shows arrogant, haughty behaviors or attitudes

INTJs and Idiosyncratic

• Idiosyncratic individuals are tuned in to and sustained by their own feelings and belief systems, whether or not others accept or understand their particular worldview or approach to life
• They are self-directed and independent, requiring few close relationships
• Oblivious to convention, Idiosyncratic individuals create interesting, unusual, often eccentric lifestyles
• Open to anything, they are interested in the occult, the extrasensory, and the supernatural
• They are drawn to abstract and speculative thinking
• Though they are inner-directed and follow their own hearts and minds, Idiosyncratic men and women are keen observers of others, particularly sensitive to how other people react to them

INTJs and Schizotypal

• ideas of reference (excluding delusions of reference)
• odd beliefs or magical thinking that influences behaviour and is inconsistent with sub cultural norms (e.g., superstitiousness, belief in clairvoyance, telepathy, or "sixth sense"; in children and adolescents, bizarre fantasies or preoccupations)
• unusual perceptual experiences, including bodily illusions
• odd thinking and speech (e.g., vague, circumstantial, metaphorical, over elaborate, or stereotyped)
• suspiciousness or paranoid ideation
• inappropriate or constricted affect
• behaviour or appearance that is odd, eccentric, or peculiar
• lack of close friends or confidants other than first-degree relatives
• excessive social anxiety that does not diminish with familiarity and tends to be associated with paranoid fears rather than negative judgements about self

Interesting stuff, even if it has little bearing to the topic at hand.
What source did you gather this from?

 

[chubber]

Interesting stuff, even if it doesn't have any bearing to the topic at hand.
What source did you gather this from?

Why would it be considered not to be on topic of this thread? Narcissistic vs Compensatory Narcissistic was defined. The belief of narcissism with INTPs addressed. The difference between INTJs and INTPs defined. Alternative Ne-types and their traits described and their association with INFs. I would think it is all relevant and I feel that not enough has been said. But ok.

 

[Abendrot]

Why would it be considered not to be on topic of this thread? Narcissistic vs Compensatory Narcissistic was defined. The belief of narcissism with INTPs addressed. The difference between INTJs and INTPs defined. Alternative Ne-types and their traits described and their association with INFs. I would think it is all relevant and I feel that not enough has been said. But ok.

Some of it is relevant, a lot of it isn't. Anyhow, where can I read more?
You also mention that Ni-doms are the most gullible. I don't exactly disagree. What's your reasoning?

 

[Siúil a Rúin]

Sociopaths are a lot more common than people think. Sociopathy/Psychopathy is certainly not synonymous with being some sort of potential serial killer or rapist. It seems like you are overreacting. Or am I missing something here?

This is now a debate about the correct definition of sociopathy.

Read more on the Three Ingredients for Psychopathy

...Fallon says the orbital cortex puts a brake on another part of the brain called the amygdala, which is involved with aggression and appetites. But in some people, there's an imbalance — the orbital cortex isn't doing its job — perhaps because the person had a brain injury or was born that way.

He looked at 12 genes related to aggression and violence and zeroed in on the MAO-A gene (monoamine oxidase A). This gene, which has been the target of considerable research, is also known as the "warrior gene" because it regulates serotonin in the brain. Serotonin affects your mood — think Prozac — and many scientists believe that if you have a certain version of the warrior gene, your brain won't respond to the calming effects of serotonin.

Diane (Fallon's wife) probably does not need to worry, according to scientists who study this area. They believe that brain patterns and genetic makeup are not enough to make anyone a psychopath. You need a third ingredient: abuse or violence in one's childhood.

The third ingredient is violence in childhood because the formal definition of psychopathy/sociopathy involves violent behaviors.

There is a way people informally call Fallon a sociopath because he has the brain structure and DNA predisposition towards violence. He is not categorized as a sociopath because he didn't have the third ingredient - a violent childhood. If you are defining it based on only the first two ingredients, then that is not the formal definition used in the field of psychology and will result in miscommunication about the topic.

more at LiveScience

Psychopaths make up about 1 percent of the general population and as much as 25 percent of male offenders in federal correctional settings, according to the researchers. Psychopaths are typically profoundly selfish and lack emotion. "In lay terms, psychopaths seem to have little or no 'conscience,'" write the researchers in a study published online in the journal Legal and Criminological Psychology.

Psychopaths are also known for being cunning and manipulative, and they make for perilous interview subjects, according to Michael Woodworth, one of the authors and a psychologist who studies psychopathy at the University of British Columbia, who joined the discussion by phone. [Criminal Minds Are Different From Yours] "It is unbelievable," Woodworth said. "You can spend two or three hours and come out feeling like you are hypnotized."

 

[dippy]

Some of the most kindhearted, insightful people I've known were INTPs.
Armchair diagnoses are dangerous and unproductive. Guy you dated may very well be a narcissist, but neither of you have the qualifications to make that call.

And type has precious little to do with mental illnesses/personality disorders of any sort. Correlation does not imply causation. These things may manifest externally in subtly different ways based on someone's temperament, but at the end of the day, there's no evidence to suggest that one has anything to do with the other. Assume otherwise, and you'll miss out on potentially fulfilling bonds with INTPs you may encounter in the future. But ey, more friends for me, then.


In short, all that can really be surmised is that you probably dated an emotionally stunted asshole of some kind - clinical terminology aside. Don't keep trying to categorize. Learn from it - try to identify toxic behavior patterns before you become emotionally invested - and move forward with your life.

Good luck

Yeah defo, no way am I gonna see all INTPs in this way but I just wondered if it was something that INTPs have experienced before (being called a narcissist).

I know he suffers from Aspergers, not sure if that has anything to do with narcissism tho...
Thanks for the response!
Dippy

 

[dippy]

It's interesting that you bring this up, because just the other day a man I know told me that he is not only an INTP, but also a sociopath. Yes, this came up in casual conversation as if we were discussing the weather. I got to thinking about the functions and the Ti-dom definitely made sense to me as many functioning sociopaths are very intelligent and seemingly introverted as they hide themselves from the world in a masked fashion. At first though, I couldn't understand Fe being a function for him at all since he doesn't relate to the feelings of others, but then I juxtaposed that with Fi and it makes total sense because Fi is all about morals and what is right and wrong to an individual. Sociopaths naturally lack a moral compass, so Fi wouldn't even be a thing for them. But Fe on the other hand, even if it is learned would be necessary for a functioning sociopath and is something that they use regularly, albeit in a manipulative and weak fashion, but it is there. I haven't given much thought to Ni vs Ne, but I would have figured Se to be of more importance to a sociopath because of it's likelihood vs Si to seek out thrilling experiences so that throws me off a bit, but it makes sense that he would be perceiving over judging as he likes to live for the moment by his own admission.

Side note: Given my understanding of and fascination with sociopathy, I wasn't frightened in the slightest by him admitting this to me. Rather, it just piqued my curiosities. I'm looking forward to speaking with him more as I think it's a rare opportunity, and I'm in no danger given the situation and the fact that I am not naive to the charm and manipulative nature of such folks.

Hmm...interesting. What you mentioned about Ti made a lot of sense. Haha, in popular culture you hear a lot about sociopaths being the quiet type and very reserved... maybe all introverts are sociopaths!
Dippy

 

[dippy]

He sounds like a piece of work. I don't understand how you ended up marrying him in the first place. Anyhow, I'm not sure if it really is closer to Fi than Fe. My stepmother probably has NPD, and it's very interesting how she thinks. In her case it's not so much that she is concerned with her version of right and wrong; rather, she thinks that what makes her happy makes everyone else happy and what upsets her upsets everyone else. She reacts in a very Fe "social norm policing" manner to something that upsets her in a self-centric Fi way. It has the worst aspects of both Fi and Fe.

That sounds like unhealthy Fe. A part of it sounds like a person with Fe Dom or Sec, but thinking that it works for everyone is a bit too far fetched. As someone with Fe, I cater to other people's needs and I don't care most of the time whether it works for me. How other people feel is my main priority.

 

[dippy]

I'm not sure what in particular you want us to talk about. I do know INTPs that have an approach to life that's too one-sided can be very difficult to deal with, regardless of age. (I like to think I'm better, but who knows. )

I will say that whenever I hear someone talk about how bad past relationships were, there's a part of me that is very skeptical. This might make me look like an asshole, and if you feel this way about my response, feel free to think that. It's just that, unless something truly horrendous happened, like rape or domestic abuse (and these things are not often talked about for reasons that definitely make sense to me, so for all I know they could apply in this situation), I always have an awareness that I'm only hearing one side of the story. I don't know what else happened. Of course if a relationship ended badly, there's often a tendency to think the worst of the other person. But is that always true? I have to wonder. I've been guilty of it myself until I've stepped back and tried to look at things objectively, and then realized that I wasn't perfect in that situation, either. I get the feeling most people don't get that far (but maybe I'm wrong).

I think when two people are at odds with each other and I only hear one side of it, that naturally causes me to think that I don't have the whole picture. I've gotten into disputes with people, for instance, where the temptation to make myself the victim and the other person the villain is quite strong, if I'm being honest with myself, I have to admit that I did things that made the situation get worse instead of better. That doesn't necessarily mean I suddenly have positive feelings about the other person, but at the very least that awareness can give me an understanding of how to avoid those situations in the future, even if I don't become best friends with the other.

Someone like me who is constantly thinking about what the other person is thinking, during that time when we were close to ending our dating, I was thinking 'hmm maybe there was something that I did wrong?'. Looking back on it now, I really tried to understand him and tried to get him to be honest with me (I will admit when wrong), but he just didn't make anything clear! He seemed like he really didn't care towards the end. I wanted to make it work. I kept catching him out on lies though so I thought 'nah....not having this anymore'.
Dippy

 

[Pionart]

It's interesting that you bring this up, because just the other day a man I know told me that he is not only an INTP, but also a sociopath. Yes, this came up in casual conversation as if we were discussing the weather.

"It's quite sunny today."
"Indeed it is."
"Also, I'm a sociopath."
"...splendid."

lol

There probably is some correlation between personality types and personality disorders, although INTP = Narcissist isn't one that I've come across.

 

[thepink-cloakedninja]

Mental disorders are far too complicated to pin on MBTI.
Mental disorders just have so many different things that cause/contribute to them from problems with one's gut flora to one's childhood. Perhaps there is correlation between certain MBTI types and certain disorders but first of all, correlation doesn't equal causation, and second of all, MBTI isn't nearly as solid as actual psychological models for psychiatric disorders. Entertaining the idea of a causality between MBTI types and mental disorders might be a fun thought experiment, but putting any real weight in it is unwise and sets one up to hold inaccurate stereotypes.

Additionally, narcissism can easily be mistaken for other mood disorders such as bipolar, so unless your INTP has been clinically diagnosed, I would take his words with a grain of salt. I also wouldn't recommend trying to diagnose him, yourself, as people tend to view those in past relationships that ended poorly, in a biased manner.

 

[chubber]

Some of it is relevant, a lot of it isn't. Anyhow, where can I read more?

You will have to search for personality disorders corresponding with Keirsey MBTI types, since Jung developed his Archetypes (just another fancy word for stereo type/grouping of traits) in what was considered back then a mental institution, on "unstable/extreme people". Then developed functions to explain the Archetypes. (multiple sources)

In 1900 Jung began working at the Burghölzli psychiatric hospital in Zürich with Eugen Bleuler. Bleuler was already in communication with the Austrian neurologist Sigmund Freud. Jung's dissertation, published in 1903, was titled On the Psychology and Pathology of So-Called Occult Phenomena. In 1906 he published Studies in Word Association, and later sent a copy of this book to Freud. (wikipedia)

Another source was http://www.humanmetrics.com/personality/<type>

Denying the correlation has it uses, especially when the accused person is at the stake busy being persecuted for perceived "threats", or exorcism, take your pick. But since we aren't in the dark ages any more. No wait I take that back, people still run around accusing people and mob justice etc.

There is a correlation, and those that deny it, are just protecting. NFs (protecting the accused) or SJs (protecting the people). I think SPs are just the executioners/enforcers, while NTs are the theorists, hence they talk but don't do much, variation based on the 4 different types in that group.

You also mention that Ni-doms are the most gullible. I don't exactly disagree. What's your reasoning?

Because of that inferior Se, when it comes to people, INTJs will be gullible, when it comes to systems then it will be the INFJ. Something has to give way, if your good at one thing then the opposite affect happens. It was also explained in the spoiler for INTJs. Hence more relevance of my post, but I guess I'll understand since you are an e8.

 

[Abendrot]

I see. So you wrote most of it yourself instead of deriving it from a specific source.

But since we aren't in the dark ages anymore. No wait I take that back, people still run around accusing people and mob justice etc.

A new Dark Age seems to be on te horizon.

Because of that inferior Se, when it comes to people, INTJs will be gullible, when it comes to systems then it will be the INFJ. Something has to give way, if your good at one thing then the opposite affect happens.

That makes a lot of sense. I've noticed INFJs tend to believe a lot of non-sensical theories. They will probably say in turn that INTJs are clueless about people.

It was also explained in the spoiler for INTJs. Hence more relevance of my post, but I guess I'll understand since you are an e8.

You're really not letting this go.

 

[PalebloodHunter]

If he's going to stalk me for some reason, then telling me he is a sociopath would be an odd choice. We have never met irl. We have one mutual friend who happens to be the boss of the sociopath. He could stalk me either way if he wanted to, but why? Just because he is a sociopath doesn't mean he is a stalker, and "normal" people stalk others all the time.

I'm not some vulnerable little daisy who's saying "smell me, touch me, but don't stomp on me." I also am not the only attractive woman he communicates with. He could target anyone he wants to, but why would he target everyone? Or maybe he has little interest in that anyway and gets his thrills elsewhere, i.e. through day to day manipulations and thrilling physical activities.

There is a lot of stereotyping and ignorant conclusions going on in this thread. Just sayin. I don't think the level of understanding here is very deep amongst all of you, which is fine, but perhaps stepping back a little is necessary.

Sorry to hear you didn't get the response you desired. I may not be an INTP but I got 3 of those bases covered and have good experience with sociopaths . But, how strange for one to admit he is a sociopath. The one I dated always exaggerated about how she cared about people (though she was downright inhumane to her own parents). It's understandable that he has come to the conclusion he is one (someone must have put it through to him), but it's strange he outright told it to you. Did he mention he is trying to change that?

 

[Peter Deadpan]

Sorry to hear you didn't get the response you desired. I may not be an INTP but I got 3 of those bases covered and have good experience with sociopaths . But, how strange for one to admit he is a sociopath. The one I dated always exaggerated about how she cared about people (though she was downright inhumane to her own parents). It's understandable that he has come to the conclusion he is one (someone must have put it through to him), but it's strange he outright told it to you. Did he mention he is trying to change that?

Well as I mentioned, I don't really want to participate in this thread anymore. However, to answer your question, I think I previously stated that he had seen a psychologist. We didn't discuss it much and haven't really even spoken since. As for changing it, there is no changing sociopathy, it just is what it is. I asked him why he told me because he said only 3 others know, and he said he told me because he saw little risk in exposing himself to me because we only have one mutual friend. I'm sure it is exciting to him to expose himself to someone he doesn't know that well and he probably just wanted to see what would happen. I wouldn't read into it too much.

 

[PalebloodHunter]

Well as I mentioned, I don't really want to participate in this thread anymore. However, to answer your question, I think I previously stated that he had seen a psychologist. We didn't discuss it much and haven't really even spoken since. As for changing it, there is no changing sociopathy, it just is what it is. I asked him why he told me because he said only 3 others know, and he said he told me because he saw little risk in exposing himself to me because we only have one mutual friend. I'm sure it is exciting to him to expose himself to someone he doesn't know that well and he probably just wanted to see what would happen. I wouldn't read into it too much.

Yeah that's what I wanted to tell. If he had said he was trying to change, that'd pretty much be BS. There's probably nothing much into that. Also, this whole thing about sociopaths being dangerous is grossly exaggerated. It's like saying all ENTPs are Steve Jobs level mad. Just take sociopaths as a different type altogether with their own layers. It's actually hilarious how helpless they are when they lose their grip on you and you are able to see through their bs.

The case for sociopathy being an INTP thing is interesting though. I would like to say I was an INTP in school. I was very, VERY introverted and always lived in my own head. And yes, I did have intense feeling of narcissism. I felt that everything was around me and it ticked me how reality did not agree with that. In hindsight, of course, at the end of the day I was a weird kid who lived in his own head, judged everyone as inferior and had his own opinion which differed from everyone, hence nobody really liked being around. I grew out of that eventually, but I can see unhealthy INTPs going further down that line. Narcissism clashing with insecurity probably would give rise to sociopathy. The need for someone to say what they've always been saying to themselves in their head. Hence, they act out of character. Act a little eccentric, to get that attention. But, really they are so focussed on their own insecurities that they give little time to grow beyond anything.

That's just pure speculation on my behalf though.

 

[Jetta]

I don't believe there is anything inherently narcissistic about the INTP personality type. Any MB type could be self absorbed and vain for different reasons contingent on other elements of their identity and background.

 

[PumpkinMayCare]

Experience-wise...

I met more laid-back INTPs who are very capable of handling criticism appropriately. But I met a ton of ENTPs who suffer from an abnormally high sense of self and blatant narcissism. Of course that doesn't mean there aren't any INTPs who suffer from narcissism. Same with other types.

(Here I thought after leaving university today I'm done with psychology for today but I just can't stop right now, can I? Haha. I need to eat something later... seriously.)

From what I learned over the years...

A lot of narcissists - or generally people with cluster B mental disorders - are too absorbed by their diseases, they are an empty shell underneath. So what is there to type?
Nothing... at worst.

If you're lucky you can still follow the cognitive thought process they undergo and are able to type them, although the result of their thought processes are incredibly flawed/screwed due to their mental disorders.

There's one narcissist that's pretty well known on the internet. He's called "Onision". He's a retty average narcissist (yes, I filled out a test for him once when I was bored. And the test results were pretty clear that he must be a narcissist.) He's easy to type though. INFJ.

Okay, I really need to eat something now! Jesus. My obsession with this profession, geesus ...

 

[Bekachu89]

Hey there OP, I am an INFJ and I just recently broke up with my INTP boyfriend of 1 year, I can confirm at least from my experience, that it caused us to fight a lot, he was so selfish, constantly talked about his gym and stared at himself flexing his muscles. He had no ability for empathy-he even ignored me for days when I was very upset my pet died as he didnt know how to deal apparently, but would have been there "If I asked, because hes not a mind reader" lol.
He constantly talked at length only of himself to everyone, never interested in me or what I was doing. Dont think he ever once asked me anything about myself. He had a serious victim mentality...and so ofcourse the breakup is all my fault in his view haha (And no disagreement at work or anywhere else was his fault ever either). I personally wouldnt say its my perfect match, though it was supposed to be and there were a few things we had in common.

 

[Obfuscate]

It's interesting that you bring this up, because just the other day a man I know told me that he is not only an INTP, but also a sociopath. Yes, this came up in casual conversation as if we were discussing the weather. I got to thinking about the functions and the Ti-dom definitely made sense to me as many functioning sociopaths are very intelligent and seemingly introverted as they hide themselves from the world in a masked fashion. At first though, I couldn't understand Fe being a function for him at all since he doesn't relate to the feelings of others, but then I juxtaposed that with Fi and it makes total sense because Fi is all about morals and what is right and wrong to an individual. Sociopaths naturally lack a moral compass, so Fi wouldn't even be a thing for them. But Fe on the other hand, even if it is learned would be necessary for a functioning sociopath and is something that they use regularly, albeit in a manipulative and weak fashion, but it is there. I haven't given much thought to Ni vs Ne, but I would have figured Se to be of more importance to a sociopath because of it's likelihood vs Si to seek out thrilling experiences so that throws me off a bit, but it makes sense that he would be perceiving over judging as he likes to live for the moment by his own admission.

Side note: Given my understanding of and fascination with sociopathy, I wasn't frightened in the slightest by him admitting this to me. Rather, it just piqued my curiosities. I'm looking forward to speaking with him more as I think it's a rare opportunity, and I'm in no danger given the situation and the fact that I am not naive to the charm and manipulative nature of such folks.

not all sociopaths lack a moral compass... there is a spectrum, damn it... =) that is like saying all people with major clinical depression are suicidal; it doesn't refect reality...

as for the op, of course intp's aren't all narcassists, for fucks sake... many intp are actually really insecure... we may look narcissistic at times, but most of us are really sensitive even if we know better than to display that, and prefer to pretend we aren't... grrrr, why would intp traits be tied to that shit? it is clear you (feel that you) have a better understanding of him than the type...

that came across as agressive, but what i mean is regardless of how you classify people, they are all fucking different... saying that intp are narcissists (which you didn't do) is like saying women just like sex and money...

post script:

i hadn't seen how hard you were trying to distance yourself from this subject when i first posted mz. peter.... i merely felt that your summation was dismissive...