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[MBTI General] Do INTXs have trouble putting thoughts into words?

Mycroft

The elder Holmes
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Actually, somewhat on that note, I'm curious: do INTPs tend to have difficulty putting their thoughts into words? ENTPs seem to have nooooooo problem with this, but I've been chalking it up to the E more than anything else. Now I'm curious - is it in fact that Ti lends itself to expressing complex concepts more readily? I'm pretty sure other INTJs will back me up on this, but putting our thoughts into words is really, really difficult. I often feel like I've learned to speak Human as a second language.
 
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Xander

Lex Parsimoniae
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Actually, somewhat on that note, I'm curious: do INTPs tend to have difficulty putting their thoughts into words? ENTPs seem to have nooooooo problem with this, but I've been chalking it up to the E more than anything else. Now I'm curious - is it in fact that Ti lends itself to expressing complex concepts more readily? I'm pretty sure other INTJs will back me up on this, but putting our thoughts into words is really, really difficult. I often feel like I've learned to speak Human as a second language.

I guess I'm changing the subject entirely though.
Oh it's my third language and I'm using a program to translate the words :D

My problem, personally, is never putting my thoughts down in words it's more the other end with all those expressions of :huh:. I should get a camera and start collecting :D
 

Natrushka

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Putting my thoughts into words which express my exact intent can be difficult. I know what I mean to say, getting it out coherently is another matter. Especially when dealing with my SJ husband.
 

Totenkindly

@.~*virinaĉo*~.@
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I have a lot of trouble talking out loud, at least in feeling I'm coherent.

If it is something I have thought about a great deal, I can sound very articulate. But often, especially in "personal" discussions, I'm thinking and exploring as I go, and it's very hard to find the exact words I want to use -- it's more like sketching, where I start by speaking very very generally, then slowly hone in as I go, dropping the false turns and clarifying the parts that are right.

But I hear how bad I sound sometimes (bad = VAGUE, very vague!) and so do others, and they've learned to be patient with me and give me some more talking time so I can figure out what I want to convey.

I notice that when I talk to or write to ENTPs, they tend to bowl me over. Very wordy... and go on and on, they've got words galore. I tend to be more precise, or at least pick over my words a lot more (especially when writing). It's sort of amusing, in a good-natured way -- I laugh to myself sometimes when I get their letters, they just ... talk and talk! No shortage of words.

A last point: When I do get honed in on an idea (or as I hone the idea), words MATTER. Maybe I am sketching at first, but at some point I choose certain words because they capture the nuance of what I mean. I'm being very careful. And I've been highly annoyed or frustrated when someone either responds to me without considering the nuances (and sometimes even changing the words, without realizing they've now changed my meaning) or doesn't realize how very very purposefully precise I was being.

The need for precision is another reason I struggle over words.
 

rivercrow

shoshaku jushaku
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Verbally? Sometimes more so. Unless I am consciously assuming a role.

In writing? Sometimes less so. I think in words a lot of the time.

I tend to lose phrases and exact words and end up groping around for them, but experience has improved my ability to cover flubs. Also, I've adopted a Columbo-esque speaking method. ;)
 

rivercrow

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Now I'm curious - is it in fact that Ti lends itself to expressing complex concepts more readily? I'm pretty sure other INTJs will back me up on this, but putting our thoughts into words is really, really difficult. I often feel like I've learned to speak Human as a second language.

Do you have more troubles in written or verbal communication?
 

The Ü™

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INTJs have trouble putting thoughts into words -- at least I do.
 

Xander

Lex Parsimoniae
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The oddest thing that happens to me is when I write in order, check the order, check the content, recheck the order then the first person to read it goes :wtf:

Makes me wish I were a postal worker :devil:
 

Natrushka

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INTJs have trouble putting thoughts into words -- at least I do.

Mycroft said:
I'm pretty sure other INTJs will back me up on this, but putting our thoughts into words is really, really difficult. I often feel like I've learned to speak Human as a second language.

Yes, me, too. That was the reason for my initial contribution to this thread; reading Mycroft's comment on INTJs having a similar problem.
 

Usehername

On a mission
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INTJs have trouble putting thoughts into words -- at least I do.

YEAH I totally relate here.


The excerpt from Portrait of an INTJ really hit me when I first read it.
It is not easy for the INTJ to express their internal images, insights, and abstractions. The internal form of the INTJ's thoughts and concepts is highly individualized, and is not readily translatable into a form that others will understand. However, the INTJ is driven to translate their ideas into a plan or system that is usually readily explainable, rather than to do a direct translation of their thoughts. They usually don't see the value of a direct transaction, and will also have difficulty expressing their ideas, which are non-linear.

My INTP female friend is golden with expressing herself when people stop talking and just listen to her.

I really feel like I have so many amusing smartass one-liners from linking ideas/situations/thoughts in my head that I just can't "translate" into words in time to spit them out for "witty repartee" to make sense. (I also tend to mumble, which makes it worse.)

But I find that typing is the place for me. It's like the "optimal speed" for my brain to translate my ideas and get them down so I can move on to the next idea.

Speaking is difficult (I have to go slowly if it's a real deep thought) and handwriting takes too much time; my brain moves faster and I lose things. But typing is where I find the happy medium. (at roughly 60 wpm)
 

Natrushka

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I really feel like I have so many amusing smartass one-liners from linking ideas/situations/thoughts in my head that I just can't "translate" into words in time to spit them out for "witty repartee" to make sense.

:yes:

handwriting takes too much time; my brain moves faster and I lose things. But typing is where I find the happy medium. (at roughly 60 wpm)

Do you have "Doctor" handwriting, too, Usehername? :D
 

Usehername

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nah. it's not too bad, but it's not calligraphy calibre either.

it's really just the speed. i'm a fast typer; handwriting takes too long. it's my rate-determining step, to reference chemistry.
 

The Ü™

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My handwriting is actually very neat and legible -- some people think it came out of a computer. I'm really good at designing logos, too.

Though I am left-handed, and theoretically, lefties are often said to have better penmanship for some reason.
 

Nighthawk

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I've rarely had problems putting my thoughts into words ... particularly the written word.
 

The Ü™

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I've rarely had problems putting my thoughts into words ... particularly the written word.

I'm, of course, better with the written word. But my writing is often very wordy, I think. I remember writing movie reviews for the school newspaper back in high school, and while everyone said my reviews were really well-written and unbiased, they were sometimes wordy.

EDIT: I also did reviews for video games at Gamespot.com, and they elected me to the prestigious honor of joining the little online video game-reviewing club.
 

Totenkindly

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I'm, of course, better with the written word. But my writing is often very wordy, I think. I remember writing movie reviews for the school newspaper back in high school, and while everyone said my reviews were really well-written and unbiased, they were sometimes wordy.

Every writer (not non-writer, but WRITER) often struggles with wordiness. Learning to effectively get your point across in the shortest amount of words possible is a hard-won skill.

Being in a position where one has to write steadily and be edited by someone else for clarity and space (such as for a magazine or newspaper) is very good experience, because it teaches you how to condense your thoughts down to the core.

My best friend worked on a small-town newspaper for a number of years, and it was interesting when we tried to collaborate; I was the "musical artistic" one, so I was usually wordier, needing room to set up a rhythm to the prose... and he was the article writer, so his contributions would all be condensed, to the point, and very direct.
 

wildcat

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Actually, somewhat on that note, I'm curious: do INTPs tend to have difficulty putting their thoughts into words? ENTPs seem to have nooooooo problem with this, but I've been chalking it up to the E more than anything else. Now I'm curious - is it in fact that Ti lends itself to expressing complex concepts more readily? I'm pretty sure other INTJs will back me up on this, but putting our thoughts into words is really, really difficult. I often feel like I've learned to speak Human as a second language.
I read about an ENTP writer who could dictate an original and logically well constructed detective novel to his secretary in a day.
The ENTP has got the NP function (Ne) unhindered.
Alas the INTP has the critical function Ti above the Ne.
 

bluebell

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Yeah, I have a lot of trouble verbalising my thoughts. I have a lot of intuitive leaps and often I can't articulate the steps of how I got somewhere - it's like my brain rapidly connects the dots but subconciously and it can take me days to articulate the steps. I tend to be the 'pointer-outer of potential problems' at work, but I quite often can't verbalise why something might be a problem. Luckily I have a few colleagues who are happy to trust my instincts even if I can't explain myself :).

I'm a lot better at expressing myself in writing.
 
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