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[INTJ] Why do people hate INTJs?

Coriolis

Si vis pacem, para bellum
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Why are we arguing over this? Kind of dumb thing to argue about...Don't you think? I feel like we're bickering just for the sake of bickering. Who cares??

Again, who cares? I'm not arguing about this anymore because we've clearly lost sight of the argument and we're falling into pointless bickering. This argument could literally go on forever..
No, actually. Now that your definitions and assumptions have been spelled out, your meaning is clear and there is nothing more to argue about. Had you written initially, "INTJs often appear to be passive because when we take action, it is usually without aggression and also behind the scenes", I would have agreed immediately. Moreover, I find that many if not most "arguments" that occur here are based on similar misunderstandings, where someone is using non-standard definitions, making unstated assumptions, or hasn't been clear enough in their initial statement.
 

Felix5

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No, actually. Now that your definitions and assumptions have been spelled out, your meaning is clear and there is nothing more to argue about. Had you written initially, "INTJs often appear to be passive because when we take action, it is usually without aggression and also behind the scenes", I would have agreed immediately. Moreover, I find that many if not most "arguments" that occur here are based on similar misunderstandings, where someone is using non-standard definitions, making unstated assumptions, or hasn't been clear enough in their initial statement.

Gee. I wonder why people wouldn't like INTJs? Could it be their obsessive tendency to drag out arguments? Or their inability to let something go when someone else actually insists upon it?

I said I didn't want to discuss it anymore.

Let it go. The world is not going to end because you didn't win an argument or get the last word in. Sheesh.

This is something I've learned to do over time, because you know what? No one gives a sht in the end, except you. Which is kind of sad.

The people on this board insist upon claiming that all INTJs are like them. Well sorry...but we're all different people, including me. A personality type is not set in stone, all it shows is that people share similar approaches to thinking and perceiving the world around them.
 

CitizenErased

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Well, my dad is an INTJ and I'm an INTP,and I find myself feelinglike this all the time:

9104c942bd3af04a5a193419f36ea5c0.jpg

I think this sums it all up.

... But if not, there's no way to win them, mostly because EVERYTHING is a contest and not winning means dishonor, which leads to ALWAYS being prepared to win.
 

Felix5

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... But if not, there's no way to win them, mostly because EVERYTHING is a contest and not winning means dishonor, which leads to ALWAYS being prepared to win.

Arguing is a competition for some INTJs...I used to think this way myself. If I didn't win the argument that it was like losing face. Now I couldn't care less, if anything I prefer to avoid arguments.
 

Coriolis

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Arguing is a competition for some INTJs...I used to think this way myself. If I didn't win the argument that it was like losing face. Now I couldn't care less, if anything I prefer to avoid arguments.
I prefer to learn from arguments, either about the topic, or about more effective ways to get my point across. It is rather frustrating to go through an argument only to realize you and the other person are in general agreement after all. I would like a dollar for every time an argument has ended in someone basically saying, "if you had explained it this way the first time . . . ".
 

Felix5

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I prefer to learn from arguments, either about the topic, or about more effective ways to get my point across. It is rather frustrating to go through an argument only to realize you and the other person are in general agreement after all. I would like a dollar for every time an argument has ended in someone basically saying, "if you had explained it this way the first time . . . ".

Sometimes people come to the same point through different perspectives, it's frustrating when you realize that you're arguing for no reason. Sometimes I find this happens a lot with INFJs and INTPs.

Some people get a kick out of confrontation too, my dad is like that. He's an ESTJ. If he's not arguing your point (no matter how right or wrong he is), then it isn't a discussion. I don't he can talk without arguing.
 

the state i am in

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i think i've said this before, but e5s can be annoying, especially when bringing so many carefully curated assumptions to the table, many reworked and somewhat incongruous with general ones.

i think each type can make assumptions or enact their preferences for how interactions should go, which can be frustrating as well.

then, once an argument situation is set up, finding some balance and agreement on rules and values is still needed to not create havoc. i will say that i enjoy more of an expressive side even in argumentative contexts. i find, in general, it's really difficult to find situations where there is a quality of mutual truth-seeking that can go on without some space for expression too. to think that at any point, it's all just verification from here, isn't very realistic when engaging with the real world, unless you are doing it as an experiment more than as a decisive act of defining the truth that sometimes it seems like it is purported to be. in these situations, it really doesn't seem cooperative or constructive for Fe types, bc noticing and discovering more about the underlying perspectives and needs and analyzing those sometimes seems better to me than counting on fully objectified assumptions.
 

Coriolis

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Sometimes people come to the same point through different perspectives, it's frustrating when you realize that you're arguing for no reason. Sometimes I find this happens a lot with INFJs and INTPs.

Some people get a kick out of confrontation too, my dad is like that. He's an ESTJ. If he's not arguing your point (no matter how right or wrong he is), then it isn't a discussion. I don't he can talk without arguing.
I have seen the highlighted often enough that one of the things I try to learn in discussions is how to identify sooner that the other person and I really agree, or how to present my side in such a way that our agreement is more readily apparent to the other person, just so we don't waste time and effort just arguing.

I don't enjoy confrontation for its own sake, but won't shy away from it if I think it is necessary or useful. The closest I come to arguing for its own sake is if I am in a discussion with someone who is being really obnoxious in some way and needs to be taken down a peg or two.
 

her-space-holiday

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I love INTJs!

I was raised by two- though my mom does seem like she could be on the borderline between F and T.

Literally all the INTJs I run into I like. They're definitely cooler and more detached at first - I think I scare(or bore, hard to say with them) them a little upon first impression, because I usually come off as very upbeat and mannerly until I move past pleasantries.

I get along with them super well, we share the same sort of humor and penchant for good, intellectual, stoned conversation. They seem to be simultaneously perplexed and satisfied with not being able to figure me out easily.

The only thing I dislike is that their negativity is...very negative. I mean, I'm cynical as all fuck, and I like to think of myself as a realist - but I look for the good in things wherever I can - I have to or else I would be smothered by my own depression. IME, the intjs I know either scoff at me or find it kind of charming, usually both.

By far one of my favorite types. ENTPs might beat them, but only marginally.
 

PeaceBaby

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What a timely bump. Thank you new person, for inadvertently illustrating that the concept of hatred knows NO typological bounds.
 

Chrysanthe

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Damn, what could Introverted Magic be? Something you INTP's have? Mi.

yeah intps are Mi doms. I think the definitions are along the lines of...

Extraverted Magic ~ The ability to successfully thwart the efforts of all other extraverted functions in favor of what you want. (forcing someone to jump off a cliff)
Intraverted Magic ~ The ability to reprogram others' intraverted functions to your own desire. (Making someone suddenly have strong emotional connections to chocolate)
 

Forever

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yeah intps are Mi doms. I think the definitions are along the lines of...

Extraverted Magic ~ The ability to successfully thwart the efforts of all other extraverted functions in favor of what you want. (forcing someone to jump off a cliff)
Intraverted Magic ~ The ability to reprogram others' intraverted functions to your own desire. (Making someone suddenly have strong emotional connections to chocolate)

The Fifth Function sounds like a movie. :newwink:

Hmm, as my Me pal, I should just grab Elmo and program to tell people what I desire through random pre-programmed sayings.

Hmm... Mi sounds scarier though at least my Me doesn't ruin their inside and die untruthfully lol.
 

Masokissed

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Introverted Magic ftw. :ninja:


Te is either sexy or repulsive to me. Like actual sex. If if it's with someone nice (however you interpret -nice-) in an intimate setting, hell yeah. If it's some creepy guy trying to bend you over in public, you kick them and run! You always have to kick those TJs when they're being douchebags.
 

Virtual ghost

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You always have to kick those TJs when they're being douchebags.

Are you sure about that ?


 

Chrysanthe

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Are you sure about that ?



no no he meant lick. We understand the need for TJs to not be violated through excessive physical hurt, but rather through soft and tender love by use of the Muscle of Compassion, also known as tongues. Te can easily be tamed this way, and I don't even have to bring out my tools for it to work.
 

Felix5

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The only thing I dislike is that their negativity is...very negative. I mean, I'm cynical as all fuck, and I like to think of myself as a realist - but I look for the good in things wherever I can - I have to or else I would be smothered by my own depression. IME, the intjs I know either scoff at me or find it kind of charming, usually both.

I imagine some of the more disheartened ones may be very negative, when I was younger I used to be. I kind of dropped it altogether when I realized that I wasn't doing myself or anyone any favors by having such a negative perspective all the time. We tend to ruminate a great deal and this can lead to depression.

I'm a cynic and I rarely ever expect anything to turn out well, but I've learned to stop looking at it in a negative way. Things will work out when they do, good things will come when you're ready for them. I think INTJs need a great deal of trial in their life to truly understand this. I've been through a great deal of set backs in my life, I find great things come to me when I'm not demanding them and when I don't expect them.
 
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