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[INTJ] Why is INTJforum So Boring?

entropie

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INTJf is designed to be a discussion forum and if that structure turns off people who are only looking to socialize then it works as intended.

I am still working on understanding the concept of realising a discussion between two human beings without a social aspect to it :D.

There was even a time, when socializing was expected from you, to be taken serious in public.

Guess without it we are working towards machine world, what of course would be desireable :heart:
 

Siúil a Rúin

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I am still working on understanding the concept of realising a discussion between two human beings without a social aspect to it :D.

There was even a time, when socializing was expected from you, to be taken serious in public.

Guess without it we are working towards machine world, what of course would be desireable :heart:
This is precisely why I like the forum. Idea space is a good place to be able to visit without all the distractions of social roles. There are few things better in this world than a discussion between two human beings without a social aspect to it.
 

Siúil a Rúin

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Sure there is not :)
It's a matter of degree. Two prominent elements in social interactions that can distract from exploring ideas are emotions and ego. These can also become intertwined. Emotional responses to ideas can distort the ideas, but if these are free from ego, they only require a little attending to to resolve them. Ego is the main social problem that distracts from and distorts ideas. Who am I and who are you? What is our relative social power and how does that affect the interpretation of our ideas? Are you too young to be right? Are you too poor? Wrong gender or race? Wrong personality? Not enough social charisma to be right? You aren't polite enough to be right? Or you aren't rude enough to have a good idea? Egotistical thinking invariably sets up "Us vs Them" paradigms that take priority over the ideas. All these social paradigms are irrelevant to the exploration of actual ideas. It doesn't matter who you are. Integrity is measured in the solidity of the idea. To be rid of (or minimize) these dynamics gives ideas their best chance at growth.

It is interesting that this doesn't naturally occur more often on the internet, since it cuts out the non-verbal communication and has a level of anonymity. That it is difficult to find in this context says a lot about human beings inability to think outside the box of social roles.
 

entropie

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Well ok that puts the issue in a light I can understand aswell. Concerning me myself for example I always try to mark statements as being influenced by ego to be fair with others.

I sometimes see aswell that there are things concerning the ego of a person that influence their judgement or reasoning or feeling. Ego things, like being to young or having a general lack of crucial information to generate an alternate PoV on a given situation.

That tho are things, I could never talk about. This would drain my energy and depress me to the point of no return, if I were to see, measured against an imaginative point zero, how much lack of ego-freeness / objectivenesses there is in the world.

I think maybe in the end, the INTJ and the ENTP seek out the same things, just go different ways and express it in different forms.

You can chat on INTJCentral, I personally wont bug you there and I am in no other forums concerning the mbti topic than this one.

Just bear in mind, when conversing with outwordlers from time to time, try not to sound too outerwordly :)
 

Uytuun

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I agree with you, toonia, on one level there is an exceptional form of freedom/openminded-ness at INTJf. INTPc seems to have the opposite form of openmindedness/freedom.
 

simulatedworld

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Because INTJs keep their interesting ideas (Ni) to themselves, except in the company of trusted friends.

Most of the outer world just sees their "get stuff done" Te function, so they appear really guarded and won't suddenly perk up and go on a tangent when the conversation shifts to one of their areas of interest the way INTPs do (thank Ne for that.)

The internet is certainly not classified as a safe environment where they can be totally open. INTJs rarely risk revealing more information than is strategically necessary--this is why they won't open up and share the interesting ideas we all know they're harboring.
 

Lethe

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INTPc seems to have the opposite form of openmindedness/freedom.

INTPcentral is closeminded, though it never fails to be interesting.

Because INTJs keep their interesting ideas (Ni) to themselves, except in the company of trusted friends.

Most of the outer world just sees their "get stuff done" Te function, so they appear really guarded and won't suddenly perk up and go on a tangent when the conversation shifts to one of their areas of interest the way INTPs do (thank Ne for that.)

The internet is certainly not classified as a safe environment where they can be totally open. INTJs rarely risk revealing more information than is strategically necessary--this is why they won't open up and share the interesting ideas we all know they're harboring.

Another agreement. ;) Sheesh, say something to get me to quit agreeing with you. :tongue:

I've been on a NTP populated forum (that was not INTPcentral) where most of the users adhered to serious discussions and rarely participated fostering companionship. Unlike INTJf, it remained invigorating at all times.

So I doubt INTJf's dull atmosphere is more attributed to the lack of social outlets, than it is by the lack of Ne as Simulatedworld and Economica pointed out. SW is spot on with his observation: they restrict the interesting ideas to themselves. Ne is the superior function when you want a group conversation to carry over. It gives the participants a chance to bounce ideas between each other and arrive to entirely new thoughts. The ball (a topic) will keep on rolling and rolling and rolling as long as you feed it new material.

INTJs are usually the two cent gurus. The ones who say the last word of vaulable insight, harvest the juicy feedback and then retreat back to their cave to ponder in solitude about their next idea. The issue is that 70-80% of everyone there is the two cent guru. SW explains it well when he says INTJf is hesitant to take advantage of those tangents and run wild with it because they're too uncomfortable with running on little preparation. Instead the user speaks their position... and that's it. Resolution. You can't really keep the flames consistently going.

Ni is great for alone time, one-on-one situations or smaller interpersonal situations in terms of continuity. Since my first experience with online forums in 2004, I'd say what truly keeps anything (and the excitement) going are the Ne & Se. I've never seen a Ni or Si dominant forum successfully ridding external boredom unless it's a speculation forum (example: discussion about novels).

To tackle the Fe portion, their social areas can grow extremely lackluster for the same reasons. You get the, "Oh, I'm surprised you can smile!" jokes, the "My, you're in a room with another human being!" astonishment, the "Wow, our little INTJ is finally socializing!" applauds and including the all-time classic, " ... Is that a laugh, I hear? Dreaming about taking over the world again?" snark. It's funny the first few rounds, but then you see it again and again for the 1000th time. Few dare to go crazy with the banter.

Nevertheless, things get exciting in topics that require active creativity -- engaging their Ni to think and show the viewer how they had conjured an original solution to a problem. You'll find a plethora of mind-blowing ideas here. This is where the INTJs intensely come alive. When they're theorizing, not preaching.
 

Asterion

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If the aim is trolling, please don’t. I like it there and find trolling lame :)

I've just started getting into this trolling thing... but since you find it boring, I'll spare them my crap :)
 

MacGuffin

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INTPcentral is closeminded, though it never fails to be interesting.



Another agreement. ;) Sheesh, say something to get me to quit agreeing with you. :tongue:

I've been on a NTP populated forum (that was not INTPcentral) where most of the users adhered to serious discussions and rarely participated fostering companionship. Unlike INTJf, it remained invigorating at all times.

So I doubt INTJf's dull atmosphere is more attributed to the lack of social outlets, than it is by the lack of Ne as Simulatedworld and Economica pointed out. SW is spot on with his observation: they restrict the interesting ideas to themselves. Ne is the superior function when you want a group conversation to carry over. It gives the participants a chance to bounce ideas between each other and arrive to entirely new thoughts. The ball (a topic) will keep on rolling and rolling and rolling as long as you feed it new material.

INTJs are usually the two cent gurus. The ones who say the last word of vaulable insight, harvest the juicy feedback and then retreat back to their cave to ponder in solitude about their next idea. The issue is that 70-80% of everyone there is the two cent guru. SW explains it well when he says INTJf is hesitant to take advantage of those tangents and run wild with it because they're too uncomfortable with running on little preparation. Instead the user speaks their position... and that's it. Resolution. You can't really keep the flames consistently going.

Ni is great for alone time, one-on-one situations or smaller interpersonal situations in terms of continuity. Since my first experience with online forums in 2004, I'd say what truly keeps anything (and the excitement) going are the Ne & Se. I've never seen a Ni or Si dominant forum successfully ridding external boredom unless it's a speculation forum (example: discussion about novels).

To tackle the Fe portion, their social areas can grow extremely lackluster for the same reasons. You get the, "Oh, I'm surprised you can smile!" jokes, the "My, you're in a room with another human being!" astonishment, the "Wow, our little INTJ is finally socializing!" applauds and including the all-time classic, " ... Is that a laugh, I hear? Dreaming about taking over the world again?" snark. It's funny the first few rounds, but then you see it again and again for the 1000th time. Few dare to go crazy with the banter.

Nevertheless, things get exciting in topics that require active creativity -- engaging their Ni to think and show the viewer how they had conjured an original solution to a problem. You'll find a plethora of mind-blowing ideas here. This is where the INTJs intensely come alive. When they're theorizing, not preaching.

That was a great post. How did the NTP forum you mentioned stay on "serious discussions and rarely... foster{ed} companionship"?
 

Uytuun

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INTPcentral is closeminded, though it never fails to be interesting.

Depends, I consider the way the forum is handled, the off-topic Ne tangents, the absurd topics etc. to be a form of open-mindedness. It is quite clear to me that INTPc generates topics that I could never have thought of and that they deal with certain issues in a more open-minded/laid-back way. They lack the INTJf openness (primary judgers after all, also Si and Fe), but they have freedom and openmindedness of their own.
 

Limey

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Any forum that frowns upon public masturbation doesn't deserve my participation.
 

uumlau

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Without any attempts to bash it, I've been trying to wrap my head around it. Why is INTJforum so boring? What MBTIological reason could there be to explain the phenomenon that occurs when you bring a bunch of Ni/Teers together?

One on one, I have found the few INTJ relationships I have had to be full of sparks (and then full of "forgetting to communicate" time, but, still, the INTJ-INTJ singular relationship is not boring).
Why is it boring when you bring a bunch of INTJs together?

Is it the moderation of the forum? The mod seems like a kind but incredibly closed-minded (and therefore forum-limiting?) person, from general observation and the few PMs I have exchanged with her. Is it a Cognitive Function reason?

Why? Why?

I can't figure it out. Someone please explain or throw out ideas.

(I found this thread interesting enough to join this forum and reply. This is my first post.)

A lot of time has passed since this first post was made, so things may have changed, but assuming not, here is my speculation.

Quite simply, you find it boring because you don't get INTJs. It's OK, we're used to it. You might know some INTJs in real life that seem more fun, but the INTJf is a place where INTJs go to think and talk like INTJs, without having to translate ourselves for others' convenience. The fascinating INTJ(s) you know personally are so happy to have someone like you even get them a little bit, they're going to a great deal of effort to connect to you, emphasizing those aspects of themselves that you have made clear that you like, and hiding those that they're all too keenly aware that just confuse (if not offend) others.

When I started seriously researching MBTI several months ago, INTJf was the only place I found with threads that thoroughly discussed the differences between INTJ and INTP: the discussions and interactions in those threads were very enlightening. I could watch the self-designated INTJs make short brief points, self-designated INTPs would respond verbosely with seemingly impeccable logic, and the INTJs would then respond to the INTPs with statements along the lines of "That's not what I'm talking about. And no, I'm not jumping to conclusions." I'd reread the INTJ posts, then see the tangent develop in the INTP posts, and eventually realized: I get the INTJs ... I sort of understand the INTPs, but the INTJ people are thinking like I think. Wow.

INTJf is perhaps one of the most social places I've encountered on the net. Without really trying, I made a lot of friends fairly quickly. Let me run that by you again: I'm an INTJ, and, without really trying, I made a lot of friends fairly quickly. INTJs do not, as a rule, make friends quickly, and we have to really try with the ones we do make. Most other people just don't "get" us.

To get into the typology of it, I noted several remarks in the thread which suggested that Ne and Fe are what make threads/forums, that Te generally seems boring, and Ni and Fi (where all the interesting action is at) are hidden away deep inside. These observations aren't entirely off the mark, but they demonstrate that those who posted them don't get INTJs.

Really, it's just the Ni. There are two MBTI types that emphasize Ni (INTJ, INFJ), and both of them have this problem of being/feeling misunderstood by others. Characteristic of Ni is that strong Ni users can "just look" at a situation, and immediately understand it with great depth and accuracy, subject to a the remarkably rare possibility for error due to confirmation bias. It's difficult to explain this understanding - it isn't words, it's a construct, like a computer program. The construct very quickly, and very much subconsciously, processes observations we make in the real world, and hands us insights. When we state these insights, most other people (non INxJs) have a hard time understanding how we can be so certain, and most Ni users have a hard time explaining that certainty, and without a strong Te, have difficulty "reverse engineering" a logical rationale for their entirely intuitive observation. This strong Ni is why INTJs tend not to get along with many people, yet are often good at troubleshooting complex, seemingly intractable problems.

Some of the most interesting threads I see on INTJforum are started by those who are not INTJs asking about how to deal with INTJs because someone important in their life is an INTJ. "You mean he really does love me?" "Yeah, he just decided to stay in your town in spite of the fact that he doesn't have many career opportunities there. He's head over heels in love with you. We INTJs do not reorganize our lives to that degree for anyone, unless that one is extremely important to us. We just suck at emoting that love, is all." This dialog of how INTJs can communicate with non-INTJs is of utmost importance to us: we're well aware of the fact that people just don't get us ... it's perhaps the most fascinating yet intractable problems we try to solve.
 

ajblaise

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Why is the INTJforum so boring?

Isn't that question kind of redundant? They're INTJs. This didn't need 22 pages to explain.
 
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