[MBTI General] The "Bugzapper" Effect

[Engineer]

Hello all. I am back again, this time with a new question and/or discussion opportunity.

Having recently come to understand certain signs and behaviors, I have given up my long-term pursuit of the ENFP I've been on about for awhile now. Seeing as I'm an INTJ, and the "glorious plan" had to be entirely scrapped, I'm sort of at square one again and am currently reviewing the leftovers of previous relationships to establish some form of pattern of failure. In all of them, there seems to be a mysterious point where the woman's interest in me ends-- not really slowly, but all of a sudden, a great drop-off: the bugzapper effect. Things will be going fine one week, the next there's nothing going on at all.

With my INFP ex, this happened after a week, with my ENFP prospect, this happened after a single day, and developed into a downward spiral where I am apparently not allowed to ignore her, but she is allowed to ignore me all she wants. Even recently, girls that seem interested will pull away mysteriously after a couple of days.

What exactly am I doing wrong here? Is my robotic inside just that uninteresting? Am I too cold, too morbid, too awkward? Asking from a stance of genuine curiosity here, not like I'm being emo. I'd like to fix this, as I have been told that I am in the 7.6 to 8.2 range of looks, so having an equally-attractive method of approach would be nice.

As for discussion, has any other NT had this happen to them as well? Is it that we seem a bit too calculating to other people or what? I am honestly confused, since this has happened five times in a row now and is seriously (super-super-cereal, guys) getting old.

Help?

 

[Coriolis]

Before replying I will ask two questions. (1) Just what do you want out of a romantic relationship at this point in your life? (2) Have you asked any of these ladies why they suddenly lost interest in you? Their replies would be helpful data.

Everything you suggest is probably true. When they get to know you well enough, what they see inside might not be interesting to them. You may very well be "cold, morbid, awkward and calculating" compared with other guys they have dated, or even casually known. If you knew with certainty that this was the case, though, what would you do? Try to change? It's fine to compromise on matters of taste (which movie to see), or to work on truly annoying behaviors (always being late), but it is counterproductive to try to be someone you are not. Better to find someone who appreciates who you really are, and whom you can appreciate as they are.

This may not be very satisfying if your goal is to have immediate casual company, since finding such a person may take time and patience. Substitute "intense" for "morbid", and I share your suspect qualities, no doubt the reason I had had even fewer relationships than you by the time I finished university. This didn't bother me because I knew I was far too busy to give a relationship the attention it deserved. Fast forward a few years, though, and I met someone who cared for me despite (because?) of these and other qualities. We have held each other's interest for over a decade now.

 

[Engineer]

Before replying I will ask two questions. (1) Just what do you want out of a romantic relationship at this point in your life? (2) Have you asked any of these ladies why they suddenly lost interest in you? Their replies would be helpful data.

1) Honestly, the ideal relationship would be a serious one, but I'd even settle for a casual short-term one. I'm frankly just tired of being alone for so long.
2) I attempted to ask the INFP, but got a bizarre roundabout answer that did not settle anything whatsoever (plus she was emotionally damaged and had cheated on me twice previously). The ENFP barely acknowledges me in public and will not respond to any electronic methods of communication whatsoever, so that particular option is not viable.

Everything you suggest is probably true. When they get to know you well enough, what they see inside might not be interesting to them. You may very well be "cold, morbid, awkward and calculating" compared with other guys they have dated, or even casually known. If you knew with certainty that this was the case, though, what would you do? Try to change? It's fine to compromise on matters of taste (which movie to see), or to work on truly annoying behaviors (always being late), but it is counterproductive to try to be someone you are not. Better to find someone who appreciates who you really are, and whom you can appreciate as they are.

Don't worry, I heartily agree. I have (foolishly) tried to change before, and it's definitely not worth the hassle. The funny thing is that this effect has happened in different places inside my knowing them, anywhere from two weeks of one girl being interested in me to three months into a relationship. It is confusing, so most of my attempts to understand it are basically just conjecture at this point.

This may not be very satisfying if your goal is to have immediate casual company, since finding such a person may take time and patience. Substitute "intense" for "morbid", and I share your suspect qualities, no doubt the reason I had had even fewer relationships than you by the time I finished university. This didn't bother me because I knew I was far too busy to give a relationship the attention it deserved. Fast forward a few years, though, and I met someone who cared for me despite (because?) of these and other qualities. We have held each other's interest for over a decade now.

I'm glad that you mentioned that. It at least gives me hope that there might be a bit of light at the end of this bizarre tunnel I seem to be in.

 

[Coriolis]

Time is the wrong metric for analyzing how and why your past relationships ended. It is more likely event driven, and will be different for each person you dated. Each one probably got to know you at a different rate, possibly in different circumstances, and had a different threshold for compatibility/continued interest. The fact that one lost interest after a few days and another after a few months says more about them than you.

It sounds like you are more bothered by the lack of companionship than I ever was. I had more concern for the long term, but never really minded being alone. I suspect Enneagram instincts come into play here; I am sp/sx and 5 to boot, which compounds to be rather reclusive.

 

[Xyk]

Maybe you smell. Like really really bad and only after random intervals.

 

[uncommonentity]

From a personal standpoint neither INFP or ENFP are the ideal partners for us at all. I'd try your hand at the following types.

INTJ - mutual relation a little on the cold side [Identity]
ENTJ - mutal relation a little on the warm side [Pal]
ENFJ - partial relation a little on the sexy side [Tribesman]
INFJ - partial relation a little on the submissive side [Companion]
ESFJ - balanced relation where you call the shots [Novelty]
ESTP - decent relation despite you having to make minor adjustments [Cohort]
ISFP - slightly estranged relation but highly sexual [Supplement]
ESFP - mentor relation with a traditional value set [Anima]

I don't know how 'tight' of an INTJ you are. From your OP you don't sound too angry or stubborn so it's more than likely a compatiblity issue.

INTP - more of a brotherly love [Complement]
ENTP - more of a contrasted love [Contrast]
ISTP - more of an office love [Suitemate]
INFP - more of an advisory love [Advisor]
ENFP - more of an arranged love [Pedagogue]
ISFJ - more of a family love [Enigma]
ISTJ - more of a neighbour love [Neighbour]
ESTJ - more of a business love [Counterpart]

I'll jokingly take $1,000,000 paypal to elaborate on the full physical, sexual and mental dynamics we have with either type.

You can alternatively dismiss this post while I score mad babes.

 

[Engineer]

Time is the wrong metric for analyzing how and why your past relationships ended. It is more likely event driven, and will be different for each person you dated. Each one probably got to know you at a different rate, possibly in different circumstances, and had a different threshold for compatibility/continued interest. The fact that one lost interest after a few days and another after a few months says more about them than you.

It sounds like you are more bothered by the lack of companionship than I ever was. I had more concern for the long term, but never really minded being alone. I suspect Enneagram instincts come into play here; I am sp/sx and 5 to boot, which compounds to be rather reclusive.

That's... a really interesting way to put it. I think you're actually correct in pointing out that time's not the right idea, because honestly, I feel like there were certain events transpiring in the background of each situation that I was not privy to. At the time I dismissed that since I'm more on the paranoid side, but I think that with enough distance, it's what you've said. What I meant by the timeframe was the decline, however. Each of the relationships continued for either two months (at minimum) to even just a six month pursuit/friendship (in the case of the ENFP).

I really am. I don't like to be, because I'm really good at being alone, but deep down inside, that little 6-type says I need a partner in crime for security purposes. I'm sp/sx too, but that manifests in being somewhat flippant towards social rules. My INFJ brother tells me that it's not appropriate for me to go around flaunting that fact, especially if I want to seek attractive and interesting women.

Maybe you smell. Like really really bad and only after random intervals.

My personal hygiene is impeccable, I assure you. I shower once in the morning, and usually once at night, provided I have the time. In between I follow the usual social practices of wearing deodorant and clean clothing, so I'm not quite sure that's the problem. Though this did make me laugh.

From a personal standpoint neither INFP or ENFP are the ideal partners for us at all. I'd try your hand at the following types.

INTJ - mutual relation a little on the cold side [Identity]
ENTJ - mutal relation a little on the warm side [Pal]
ENFJ - partial relation a little on the sexy side [Tribesman]
INFJ - partial relation a little on the submissive side [Companion]
ESFJ - balanced relation where you call the shots [Novelty]
ESTP - decent relation despite you having to make minor adjustments [Cohort]
ISFP - slightly estranged relation but highly sexual [Supplement]
ESFP - mentor relation with a traditional value set [Anima]

I don't know how 'tight' of an INTJ you are. From your OP you don't sound too angry or stubborn so it's more than likely a compatiblity issue.

I'm kinda relaxed and withdrawn. I'm likely not going to change very much in order to get a relationship, but it would be nice to see what type of lady is interested in what exactly I have to bring to the table in that regard.

INTP - more of a brotherly love [Complement]
ENTP - more of a contrasted love [Contrast]
ISTP - more of an office love [Suitemate]
INFP - more of an advisory love [Advisor]
ENFP - more of an arranged love [Pedagogue]
ISFJ - more of a family love [Enigma]
ISTJ - more of a neighbour love [Neighbour]
ESTJ - more of a business love [Counterpart]

I'll jokingly take $1,000,000 paypal to elaborate on the full physical, sexual and mental dynamics we have with either type.

You can alternatively dismiss this post while I score mad babes.

Actually all of this seems really interesting to me! I can seriously see where so many of my relationships (even the non-romantic ones) are here. I felt like I was "managing" the ENFP and "guarding" the INFP. My roommate is an ENTP, my lil' sis is an INTP, and my best friend is an ISFJ.
The only problem with these pairings is that none of them seem to be "love" love. What's up with that? Provided I give you a $1,000,000 paypal, would you mind elaborating on which "mad babes" have the best or most fun personality types?

 

[Lark]

I've experienced that too, I've always suspected that in those relationships that the women involved were only dating me as an inbetweener and looking to "upgrade" at the first available opportunity, I couldnt blame them though because I felt the same way about them. I was young. What odds.

 

[AphroditeGoneAwry]

NFPs are 'supposedly' the cat's meow for intjs.

I think it's just hard for introverts to meet others period, once out of college. Especially those with whom me mesh well. We are lonely, yet we don't really mind being alone enough to get out in the 'real world' and make that change.

That's why there is the internet. :uni:

 

[Ginkgo]

So they just drop off the radar? Sounds like either a) they came and got what they wanted, seeing no more potential in the relationship or b) saw something about the relationship as irreconcilable.

I can empathize with the need to find trends in what's up, but the burden may rest more upon the people you're interested in and less on you. Then again, if you're interested in the first place, then the burden falls on you a bit more.

The ENFP sounded pretty unfair in her dealings with you. I'm not sure what the reasons were, and perhaps if you became more of a priority in her eyes, then your exchange would have balanced out a bit. Just because she talked at your ceaselessly doesn't mean she cares about you.

You should just wear this shirt:

. It acts as sort of an artificial mating call.

I'm a dude but I would give you mad props for that regardless.

 

[Engineer]

NFPs are 'supposedly' the cat's meow for intjs.

I think it's just hard for introverts to meet others period, once out of college. Especially those with whom me mesh well. We are lonely, yet we don't really mind being alone enough to get out in the 'real world' and make that change.

That's why there is the internet. :uni:

Blergh. The day I submit myself to eHarmony is the day I become a lesser man, who has given up on scouring the world around him for an appropriate mate. Not meaning any offense if you're a fan of internet dating, mind you. It's just not my thing. And hopefully never ever shall be.

So they just drop off the radar? Sounds like either a) they came and got what they wanted, seeing no more potential in the relationship or b) saw something about the relationship as irreconcilable.

I can empathize with the need to find trends in what's up, but the burden may rest more upon the people you're interested in and less on you. Then again, if you're interested in the first place, then the burden falls on you a bit more.

The ENFP sounded pretty unfair in her dealings with you. I'm not sure what the reasons were, and perhaps if you became more of a priority in her eyes, then your exchange would have balanced out a bit. Just because she talked at your ceaselessly doesn't mean she cares about you.

You should just wear this shirt:

. It acts as sort of an artificial mating call.

I'm a dude but I would give you mad props for that regardless.

Honestly, the INFP was merely in it for sex. She was messed up, and couldn't get what I saw in her, so when I wanted her to slow down and take things easy, she freaked out and ran away. Messy affair, that. I have no idea about the ENFP, other than I think she still feels somewhat possessive of me, but in the way that one feels possessive of a house ficus one keeps in their bedroom window, which is to say, not that great on my end. The way you state priority seems to imply that there's something I could have done to adjust my current status... (at least that's the way I'm choosing to interpret it, so yeah) would you mind elaborating on that? I'm kind of interested, since keeping an ENFP's attention for longer than a nanosecond has proved an extremely difficult art for me to master-- or even grasp.

That shirt is completely awesome. However, I'm not exactly the "SCIENCE!" type, despite what my name implies, so I'm afraid it might mislead all of those hot babes who are lining up for red-hot nerd sex. Since I'm not that type of nerd, I feel they'd be disappointed.

 

[ceecee]

Blergh. The day I submit myself to eHarmony is the day I become a lesser man, who has given up on scouring the world around him for an appropriate mate. Not meaning any offense if you're a fan of internet dating, mind you. It's just not my thing. And hopefully never ever shall be.

I was rejected by eharmony and match. This was a long time ago and I have nothing against online dating. I met my husband online. It was just a very specific interest site.

Honestly, the INFP was merely in it for sex. She was messed up, and couldn't get what I saw in her, so when I wanted her to slow down and take things easy, she freaked out and ran away. Messy affair, that. I have no idea about the ENFP, other than I think she still feels somewhat possessive of me, but in the way that one feels possessive of a house ficus one keeps in their bedroom window, which is to say, not that great on my end. The way you state priority seems to imply that there's something I could have done to adjust my current status... (at least that's the way I'm choosing to interpret it, so yeah) would you mind elaborating on that? I'm kind of interested, since keeping an ENFP's attention for longer than a nanosecond has proved an extremely difficult art for me to master-- or even grasp.

The INFP, I don't think we, INTJ's, are into project people, although maybe some are. Getting involved with anyone that requires that much work or is that messed up isn't usually going to end well for us. The ENFP..who knows although I agree, all the chatting seems like she friend zoned you or you were a rebound. She found something else and boom, you were history. Are we calculating, yes. Does everyone see this as a problem? No.

That shirt is completely awesome. However, I'm not exactly the "SCIENCE!" type, despite what my name implies, so I'm afraid it might mislead all of those hot babes who are lining up for red-hot nerd sex. Since I'm not that type of nerd, I feel they'd be disappointed.

Don't wear the shirt but there are women very into red-hot nerd sex. Mine has made a spread sheet of pros and cons when wanting to make a large purchase. SO. HOT.

 

[Anew Leaf]

Hello all. I am back again, this time with a new question and/or discussion opportunity.

Having recently come to understand certain signs and behaviors, I have given up my long-term pursuit of the ENFP I've been on about for awhile now. Seeing as I'm an INTJ, and the "glorious plan" had to be entirely scrapped, I'm sort of at square one again and am currently reviewing the leftovers of previous relationships to establish some form of pattern of failure. In all of them, there seems to be a mysterious point where the woman's interest in me ends-- not really slowly, but all of a sudden, a great drop-off: the bugzapper effect. Things will be going fine one week, the next there's nothing going on at all.

With my INFP ex, this happened after a week, with my ENFP prospect, this happened after a single day, and developed into a downward spiral where I am apparently not allowed to ignore her, but she is allowed to ignore me all she wants. Even recently, girls that seem interested will pull away mysteriously after a couple of days.

What exactly am I doing wrong here? Is my robotic inside just that uninteresting? Am I too cold, too morbid, too awkward? Asking from a stance of genuine curiosity here, not like I'm being emo. I'd like to fix this, as I have been told that I am in the 7.6 to 8.2 range of looks, so having an equally-attractive method of approach would be nice.

As for discussion, has any other NT had this happen to them as well? Is it that we seem a bit too calculating to other people or what? I am honestly confused, since this has happened five times in a row now and is seriously (super-super-cereal, guys) getting old.

Help?

Well, I think you can discount the INFP from your study as a statistical error. If she was that messed up it had nothing to do with you, and you should simply look at your reasons for staying with her.

Unfortunately I can't give the specific advice I would if I was an rl friend of yours. I do think cor is spot on with a lot of what they posted.

Continue being yourself. Some women do appreciate the more reserved types of men (all the more mystery for us to unravel!) and one will stumble across you someday in the future. Maybe tomorrow, maybe 6 months from now... The best you can do is to take care of you so you will be prepared for that day.

P.s. I is sorry for sneaking into this thread, but I wanted to give you some encouragement.

 

[fripping]

you might just be really boring.

 

[Ginkgo]

This albatross is ISTJ

 

[Wanderer]

Blergh. The day I submit myself to eHarmony is the day I become a lesser man, who has given up on scouring the world around him for an appropriate mate. Not meaning any offense if you're a fan of internet dating, mind you. It's just not my thing. And hopefully never ever shall be.

Don't knock it; statistically speaking I think EHarmony is a great idea. There's something to be said for scientifically approaching relationships, it's certainly not as messy as "hey I don't know if this has good odds of panning out but let's try anyway!"

Just saying.

 

[PeaceBaby]

2) I attempted to ask the INFP, but got a bizarre roundabout answer that did not settle anything whatsoever (plus she was emotionally damaged and had cheated on me twice previously).

What was the "bizarre roundabout answer" if I may be so bold as to ask?

The ENFP barely acknowledges me in public and will not respond to any electronic methods of communication whatsoever, so that particular option is not viable.

Has she told you to "stay away from me"? Why does she not acknowledge you in public, in your opinion, and / or hers if she has shared it?

 

[JAVO]

^ yeah, we need more details about what happened: nonverbals, issues brought up or not brought up

One thing which might help is casually mentioning early in the relationship that you appreciate constructive feedback and don't perceive it as criticism. (I'm assuming from your type that this is true.) And, of course, don't betray that openness by getting angry or critical about the feedback.

It could be this simple: Many types are good at covering their flaws and making people like them, even when people don't like the real them. INTJs tend to do that less. Congratulate yourself, as you may have already avoided a future divorce.

 

[Coriolis]

One thing which might help is casually mentioning early in the relationship that you appreciate constructive feedback and don't perceive it as criticism. (I'm assuming from your type that this is true.) And, of course, don't betray that openness by getting angry or critical about the feedback.

This seems not to work very well, at least with F's. The only F who has ever given me critical feedback is my ENFP friend, and we have known each other well and for a long time. I am sure I do not act 100% to the liking of the others; they just never say anything about what might put them off.

 

[Engineer]

The INFP, I don't think we, INTJ's, are into project people, although maybe some are. Getting involved with anyone that requires that much work or is that messed up isn't usually going to end well for us. The ENFP..who knows although I agree, all the chatting seems like she friend zoned you or you were a rebound. She found something else and boom, you were history. Are we calculating, yes. Does everyone see this as a problem? No.

Don't wear the shirt but there are women very into red-hot nerd sex. Mine has made a spread sheet of pros and cons when wanting to make a large purchase. SO. HOT.

I dunno, I am kind of a fixer-type INTJ. I only recently have realized that people can't be fixed well, and that my only successful project person was something of a miracle. I dislike the term project people... Makes it seem so impersonal, when really I just care a lot about what happens to them and want to help them sort out issues.

I take it as an extremely good sign that spreadsheet and calculations can be a turn on SOMEWHERE in the world!

you might just be really boring.

Possible.

This albatross is ISTJ
-ALBATROSS REDACTED FOR SPACE CONCERNS-

AWK AWK AWK.

Don't knock it; statistically speaking I think EHarmony is a great idea. There's something to be said for scientifically approaching relationships, it's certainly not as messy as "hey I don't know if this has good odds of panning out but let's try anyway!"

Just saying.

I'd honestly still rather try my luck in the real world. eHarmony just kinda smells like desperation to me, no matter how good or not good it may be. I mean, ceecee found hers online, so it works, obviously, but I just don't think I'm really the right type to feel comfortable using it.

What was the "bizarre roundabout answer" if I may be so bold as to ask?

Has she told you to "stay away from me"? Why does she not acknowledge you in public, in your opinion, and / or hers if she has shared it?

Sure, I don't mind elaborating. After about two months of a seriously intense relationship, where she was even mentioning getting married (warning bells!), she suddenly turns around and ends it with the reason being "I guess it just wasn't there." When inquiring about this further, I was told, "I don't know, alright! Please stop making this hard!" So I did. Inside, I didn't really take it all that well, and she knew that. I treated her with a lot more respect than she got from many of her other relationships, and I don't think she really understood why that was, so she freaked out. Even today, though I have cut ties (she suddenly turned rather nasty after a couple weeks and I decided I didn't need to stand for that), when we pass on the street or happen to be in the cafeteria she'll usually have an interesting expression and will always look at me at least once. Caught her going back to her room with a different guy once, I just smiled and she looked away. In the words of Forrest Gump, "That's all I have to say about that..."

The ENFP certainly did not say any of those things. Over the summer, she simply stopped communicating with me. I attempted to reestablish contact twice over the summer, then gave up. Came back, she was all friendly again, but really dodgy when I asked her about what had happened over the summer. Had to call her a bunch of times to get her to give me my textbook back (she'd borrowed it and forgot to give it back over the summer), as she was terrible at remembering to bring it to class. She said we'd get dinner one night, talk about stuff, and she'd give me the book then. I said ok, she didn't show, so I called her twice and got no answer. Next day I get a text saying she didn't have her phone with her that night (she's a self-admitted cell junkie, so I doubt it). Brought the book the next day, so cool.

Still confused about everything, I proposed coffee Labor Day weekend, but she was going out of town, so she said next weekend would be fine. I said ok, left her alone. Next week she bombs again, so I decide enough is enough and refuse to continue pursuing her, with the reasoning that even a halfway decent friend would be able to do a simple thing like getting coffee with a week's notice. In public, she was already ignoring me quite, but after I decided to react in turn, she started making snide comments to and about me in class to provoke a reaction, which I stolidly ignored. This just aggravated the situation, and she kept on until I had a talk with my INFJ brother who said I needed to at least pretend that I was still friendly toward her so that the social system wouldn't be weird.

So now, that's what I'm doing. She'll say hi to me occasionally, and I'll acknowledge her in class.

She has neither shared her reasoning nor provided me a clue as to why the sudden change, so I am completely in the dark.

^ yeah, we need more details about what happened: nonverbals, issues brought up or not brought up

One thing which might help is casually mentioning early in the relationship that you appreciate constructive feedback and don't perceive it as criticism. (I'm assuming from your type that this is true.) And, of course, don't betray that openness by getting angry or critical about the feedback.

It could be this simple: Many types are good at covering their flaws and making people like them, even when people don't like the real them. INTJs tend to do that less. Congratulate yourself, as you may have already avoided a future divorce.

I think you may be quite right. Hope the detail above was decent enough to give you an idea? I love feedback, honestly! It's the easiest way for me to learn and get better. I'm usually stuck with the minesweeper approach, though, which is frustrating.

This seems not to work very well, at least with F's. The only F who has ever given me critical feedback is my ENFP friend, and we have known each other well and for a long time. I am sure I do not act 100% to the liking of the others; they just never say anything about what might put them off.

This is exactly right. In my experience, F-types really really don't like being critical of others (whether they may or may not be that way of them in their minds), so they'll refrain from addressing the issue as bluntly as Ts like to. Unless they know you're okay with receiving criticism (e.g. my INFJ brother).