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[MBTI General] I'm Not Good at Being a "Girl"

Tallulah

Emerging
Joined
Feb 19, 2008
Messages
6,009
MBTI Type
INTP
Kinda tangentially, but still relevant, I idolized Bette Davis growing up. So I grew up thinking it was just fine to be a strong, intelligent woman who doesn't suffer fools. It took me a long time to realize that that confidence in non-traditional femininity was developed in a vacuum, and dudes don't really aspire to date women like Bette. Which is fine, but it also sucks, because it has always felt like I had to be less of what I truly am to interest a man. I always related to those strong women like Bette and Katharine and Roz Russell, because I felt like they were who they were on their own terms. They weren't ever the girlfriend of the real star--they were the headliner, with a strong-and-equal sparring partner who adored them by their sides. I honestly don't think I'll ever quite get over that fantasy. I love and hate Hollywood for that.
 

Idealatious

New member
Joined
Sep 17, 2011
Messages
116
MBTI Type
INFJ
Enneagram
91?
I've often considered that if I'd had a choice to be male or female, I would have totally been a man so I wouldn't have to care about the many superficial things women are expected to care about and invest in. What a curse! I so wish I could just get a buzz cut and not be complexed about it or worry what people would think.

I'm not sure what I would be if I had a choice - but I do otherwise agree! I'm not good at being a woman, but I don't think I'd be good at being a man either! I don't much care what I look, have a short haircut because it's easy to care for, and am generally independent. But for being a typical man, I think I cry too much over things in the news, squee over cute things a lot, and am generally not very assertive or athletic! ...I'd rather society change rather than myself, but how likely is that?

Kinda tangentially, but still relevant, I idolized Bette Davis growing up. So I grew up thinking it was just fine to be a strong, intelligent woman who doesn't suffer fools. It took me a long time to realize that that confidence in non-traditional femininity was developed in a vacuum, and dudes don't really aspire to date women like Bette. Which is fine, but it also sucks, because it has always felt like I had to be less of what I truly am to interest a man. I always related to those strong women like Bette and Katharine and Roz Russell, because I felt like they were who they were on their own terms. They weren't ever the girlfriend of the real star--they were the headliner, with a strong-and-equal sparring partner who adored them by their sides. I honestly don't think I'll ever quite get over that fantasy. I love and hate Hollywood for that.

:( ...Wait, women who aren't just love interests? I need to watch better movies.
 

kingtacchan

New member
Joined
May 8, 2012
Messages
6
MBTI Type
INTJ
Enneagram
1
Me too! My mother always accuses me of having bad hairdo, can't seem to get make-ups right, etc etc that relates to appearance.
And then relate it to some random event when I complained to a cashier in a facial parlor. Or relate it to why I am an arrogant bastard that doesn't have a boyfriend (I do, but she just won't recognize him. Le sigh)
God, why must I have a mother like that OTL
 

entropie

Permabanned
Joined
Apr 24, 2008
Messages
16,767
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entp
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783
Dont worry. Most men dont like good girls
 

Stumblebum

New member
Joined
Jan 27, 2013
Messages
28
MBTI Type
ENTP
Enneagram
7x8
Instinctual Variant
sp
Ah, yes, a kindred spirit.

I'm also quite bad at doing things that are "girly." I'm sans the ability to put on make-up and I'm well known for having unmanageably frizzy hair. Actually, the other day my friend overheard a couple of girls in our grade discussing the many ways I resemble a crack-addict, what with my hair, pallid complexion, and apparently "hollow" face. ;P NT women are better matched with things that are important, like identifying all the reasons such societal conventions are detestably plebeian.

All the same, I'm not really masculine. I'm bored to pieces by things like cars, sports, fighting, and gore.
 

ehcriktic

Permabanned
Joined
Jan 20, 2013
Messages
23
MBTI Type
INTP
like identifying all the reasons such societal conventions are detestably plebeian.

I believe the aristocrats may have been even more strict in adherence to 'societal conventions'; but I agree such things are annoying.
 

Stumblebum

New member
Joined
Jan 27, 2013
Messages
28
MBTI Type
ENTP
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7x8
Instinctual Variant
sp
I believe the aristocrats may have been even more strict in adherence to 'societal conventions'; but I agree such things are annoying.

It's a self-directed arrogance joke. ;)
 

Mole

Permabanned
Joined
Mar 20, 2008
Messages
20,284
In discovering my inner woman I grew my hair down to my waist, and my girlfriend and I would wash our hair in the bathtub together. I wore a sarong, and learnt relaxing massage. And I attended an encounter group to learn to communicate. And I attended the Aquarius festival to become a hippy. And then a clown workshop to become a happy hippy.

How lucky I was not to go to war and instead discover my inner woman.
 

Elaine

New member
Joined
Sep 16, 2013
Messages
87
MBTI Type
INTJ
Enneagram
1w9
Well, my family try their hardest to turn me into a girl, yet I rebel. I might look girly on the outside( they dress me up like a girl), but I have a heart of a tomboy. I' m a feminist, I believe it' s up to a woman to choose whether she will be a housewife or dedicate herself to career. I am myself a rationalist, thinking - over - feeing person, prefer keeping my feelings inside, my mind always rules my actions( though feelings can influence them as well, after all, I' m not amoral or ideal - free, I can also act out of pride or the morality pattern I believe in) , and I hate that society expects me to be emotional, illogical and weak. My ESFJ grandma always blames me on beeing too masculine, but I just ignore her. I hate putting on make up except the one to hide facial flaws( somehow I must fight these annoying zits) , I also dislike high heels( just plain uncomfortable and impractical) , or revealing dresses( I don' t want to look sexualized in the eyes of others) . Others also dislike that I do push ups and have broad shoulders. When I show signs of tomboyishness, my family members ask me if I am a lesbian. Goddamn it, how many times do I need to tell them that a tomboy does not auto equal a lesbian? My orientation is all right, I am a tomboy AND a heterosexual, the thing that I have a soft spot on feely, idealistic guys( maybe to equalize my rationalism) is a totally different thing!
I am what and who I want to be, not what and who society expects me to. I am intelligent, and I' m not afraid to show it, even though most girls consider me a bore. I like science and computers instead of fashion and dating. My primary goal in life is self perfection and career achievement instead of relationship and family. Being single is okay to me. I don' t like all the girly stuff, and I never will. I am not a herd animal, I never was, and I prefer solitude where I can have freedom of thought, instead of company where I always have to be someone who is not myself. I am what and who I am. People and society might try to change me, but it will never work. I know it' s difficult to live with such a rebellious outlook, but why do I have to refuse something just because it' s difficult?
You know, sometimes I gaze in the far future, when I am an old woman, and shortly before my death I recall all my life( I hope my mind will be clear enough by that time) . If I chose the easy way, I would recall that I lived my entire life as a pretender, putting on the masks others enforced on me, but which I hated myself, lived not my own life, but the life of another preson, exchanged my true self just for complete calmness and quiet life, wasted all these years God has given me, not releasing my true potential. In my case, I am religious, so I believe I might have another life, but there is still doubt, since no one knows what is after death. And if there is no reincarnation, I wasted the great gift called life, full of possibilities and surprises. But I don' t choose that, I choose different. When I die, I want to recall living my own life as I wanted, being myself, not shaping myself into that the others told me to. Yes, I might' ve had difficulties, it wasn' t easy, but I deliberately chose it. My true self remained untoched, and I preserved it the whole life. My life wasn' t the quiet one, but I didn' t want a quiet life, I wanted to release my potential and have a freedom of choice. And I did it. I never gave up, I always fought, standing up for my ideas. I might ' ve been a white raven, but I had no problem with it. I was myself, and it requires a great deal of courage to be yourself. I made my won decicions, I lived my own life. I may not have children, but my legacy will live on in my deeds, even though not all might notice that. And then I will not be ashamed for the life I lived. So be yourself, live as you want, so that when you' re old, you won' t regret the choices you made in your life.
I guess I got too philosophical... But anyway, be yourself. Live the way you want. Don' t listen to the society and what it enforces on you. Because there may not be another life to live.
 

skylights

i love
Joined
Jul 6, 2010
Messages
7,756
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INFP
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6w7
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so/sx
[MENTION=19831]Elaine[/MENTION] I think it's awesome that you have such a strong sense of self and what you value.
 

Coriolis

Si vis pacem, para bellum
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Apr 18, 2010
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sp/sx
[MENTION=19831]Elaine[/MENTION] I think it's awesome that you have such a strong sense of self and what you value.
Elaine's post captures my sentiments as well. I'm not sure if either of you has been following the discussion of rape on the Everyday Sexism thread. The attitude expressed here is one our best weapons against rape, and sexism of every kind. It is the antidote to "rape culture", and the broader disempowering and limitation of women so common around the world.
 

greenfairy

philosopher wood nymph
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May 25, 2012
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4,024
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iNfj
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sx/sp
Hera, I saw your picture. You look beautiful.
That's what I was going to say! I never would have expected you to say you have difficulty looking feminine. Not that it's any more important for a female to be beautiful than a male. I think many humans are beautiful. Being alive is beautiful. Humans lived for millennia before makeup and all that was invented, and each person who reproduced with another thought that person was beautiful in their own way. Even cave dwelling hairy stinky people thought each other was beautiful at least some of the time. In the ancient past people probably still had some ideas about how males and females were supposed to act, but I think it wasn't as important as being good at surviving. Decorating yourself can be fun, but it's by no means necessary. I say be comfortable with yourself and be good at being a human, whatever that means to you. I know it kind of sucks because people will still have these expectations, but I think you can get to a point where it doesn't really bother you.
I only appreciate it for this reason. Get them off-guard. Nothing is more shocking than a female NT for most people. ;)
NT females are awesome!

As for myself, I used to think I was NT, and one reason was that I used to have a hard time with being girly too. The thing was that I really wanted to be. I don't think that's typical of NT's. Now I am very girly in some ways, but still tomboyish and "masculine" in others. People are just people, and have both feminine and masculine energy, like yin and yang, and most things are just neutral. No one should have to conform to anything. I love being feminine and glamorous, and I wouldn't feel like myself if I wasn't, but I like just being natural too.

Anyway, end of ramble.
 

Galena

Silver and Lead
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Mar 12, 2013
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Haha, opposite. As a young teenager, I wished I could fit in with people like the OP and scorned myself for being too sensitive and having too much fun dressing up. Then I rioted or something because most of the "masculine" and "feminine" markers that come up in discussions like this are so surface-level. Strength comes from underneath the decorations.

Whoever you are, own it deeply and it won't be weak.
 

mooseantlers

Knobgoblin
Joined
Feb 18, 2012
Messages
322
MBTI Type
ESFP
Enneagram
9
Gender would not be an issue if it was acceptable for somebody to express themselves in whichever way they felt comfortable, whether born male or female.
 

gromit

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Mar 3, 2010
Messages
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...most of the "masculine" and "feminine" markers that come up in discussions like this are so surface-level. Strength comes from underneath the decorations.

Whoever you are, own it deeply and it won't be weak.

:2ar15:
 

gromit

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Mar 3, 2010
Messages
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Also, sort of in response to what [MENTION=17945]Webslinger[/MENTION] posted...

I see a lot of "sensitive" guys whining that ladies don't appreciate them because they are aren't stereotypically masculine or whatever. It's not that. It's that the guys don't truly OWN their sensitive beautiful natures, they aren't confident in their own skin, who they are. It's the insecurity and self-shame that turns people away, not the lovely characteristics. So really embrace your sensitivity, your kindness, your sweetness. That's the stuff ladies/people actually really value in a relationship, if you can get over yourself.

Like a mothafucka.
 

violet_crown

Active member
Joined
Jun 18, 2009
Messages
4,959
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sx/sp
Gender would not be an issue if it was acceptable for somebody to express themselves in whichever way they felt comfortable, whether born male or female.

You've just won the thread, sir. Enjoy this set of fine china as your prize.
 

Elaine

New member
Joined
Sep 16, 2013
Messages
87
MBTI Type
INTJ
Enneagram
1w9
Elaine's post captures my sentiments as well. I'm not sure if either of you has been following the discussion of rape on the Everyday Sexism thread. The attitude expressed here is one our best weapons against rape, and sexism of every kind. It is the antidote to "rape culture", and the broader disempowering and limitation of women so common around the world.

I haven' t been there yet, but I' ll check it out.
 
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