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[ENTP] Christian ENTPs?

What is your view on religion as an ENTP?

  • I am Christian and very serious about it

    Votes: 11 26.2%
  • I'm Christian...whateva

    Votes: 1 2.4%
  • I was raised Christian and came to my senses

    Votes: 13 31.0%
  • Christians freak me the funk out, stay away!

    Votes: 4 9.5%
  • I'm down with the Buddha

    Votes: 3 7.1%
  • I'm Muslim

    Votes: 1 2.4%
  • Judaism is my thing

    Votes: 3 7.1%
  • Athists are better lovers

    Votes: 8 19.0%
  • Agnostics are fearless lovers

    Votes: 12 28.6%
  • Dude, what the hell, you forgot mine!

    Votes: 5 11.9%

  • Total voters
    42
O

Oberon

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Eck, every ENTP makes an ass of himself from time to time.

This appears to be your time.

It's okay... we'll help you through it...
 

EcK

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The funny thing is.

If we (the believers) are wrong we lose nothing.

If however, you are wrong... you lose everything.
It's actually the opposite my boy.
If you live your life believing you'll get a secret present because you've been a good boy and then die and rot and stuff. Which is what 'll happen to you based on current knowledge (knowing you are unlikely to have access to secret knowledge).
Also I'm not sure I could respect a god like creature who asks people to suck up to it and act like some kind of crazed ex girlfriend based on the bible's fairy tales.

If you don't believe in a god, live your life on that belief and then you die and that's it just as predicted you, by definition, lose nothing in the deal.

Frankly, ontological arguments like Pascal's wager only work on and for idiots.
 

onemoretime

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This is really a gross mischaracterization. Nobody interprets that verse as supporting greed... but, many christians in their pursuit of wealth simply ignore it.

Jesus was speaking on a personal level. The point of that verse is not that people must give up their possessions, but that they must give up anything they treasure more than God. For the rich young ruler that was his possessions. But, this is no new concept since the very first commandment is that "you may not have any other gods before me."

The original writers of the Gospels used particular words and forms when Jesus was speaking in a allegorical fashion, such as in the parables. They used different ones when he was speaking plainly. Everything Jesus said involving wealth and treatment of the poor was written in the literal fashion.

Jesus wasn't just saying that he needed to give up his possessions because he valued them more than God; he was saying that to have excess wealth was in itself valuing it more than God. If you placed God first, you would willingly give up your wealth to help others, as God had commanded. Remember the two great commandments - "Love the Lord your God with all your heart, and all your mind, and all your soul" and "Love your neighbor as yourself." If you hoard wealth when someone else needs it, you are disobeying the second commandment, and by not keeping His commandments, you are breaking the first.

I won't deny that this is often the case. But, the source of this view is Abraham Kuyper who believed there was an organic unity between between special (the bible) and general (all other observable truth) revelation.

Kuyper once famously said: "Oh, no single piece of our mental world is to be hermetically sealed off from the rest, and there is not a square inch in the whole domain of our human existence over which Christ, who is Sovereign over all, does not cry: 'Mine!'

This was in opposition to Augustine and those that taught that there are two distinct worlds a kingdom of man and a kingdom of God. Kuyper has won out in contemporary evangelicalism and so Christians are constantly trying to find truth in the world that is in unity with the truth of their faith. It gives them a sense of wholeness when the world they live in matches up with the world they have faith in.

That also runs counter to the words of Jesus, who specifically spoke of not being of "this world," of a Kingdom where all the assumptions are turned on their head, of rendering unto Caesar what is Caesar's, and to God what is God's... it honestly doesn't sound anything close to what Jesus said.

Out of interest what would be evangelical + more liberal?
I'm not saying that evangelicals can't be liberal I'm just curious what this means to you since both terms are very difficult to nail down.

I'm guessing the ones that emphasize a consistently Christian worldview, but not necessarily social conservatism.
 

Domino

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I still say this whole debate should be held in a Jello wrestling pit. I want to see some gelatin-covered combatants. Jello makes everything official.
 

Domino

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Frankly, ontological arguments like Pascal's wager only work on and for idiots.

Eck's Black List Du Jour:

1. Descartes
2. Pascal
3. (who will fall next?!) I wager on Camus! French people hate other French people.
 

EcK

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I still say this whole debate should be held in a Jello wrestling pit. I want to see some gelatin-covered combatants. Jello makes everything official.

I bought this whole box of jellos at target and devoured them in the purest bear in winter fashion. I then proceeded to sort of go expire on the sofa.

and there's nothing wrong with Camus.
To quote french people, Sartre said that Hell is other people (l'enfer c'est les autres). *hums happily*
 

EcK

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What can I say, I learned from French theologians. :D
You sure are good at repeating what your elder said. The issue is theologians only talk to theologians and people who can't wait to get their confirmation bias fed. Theology, ontology etc is at best comical.
For the last time Peguy, what ever made you think that you had any talent at rational thought. You're barely able to construct a coherent argument.
 

onemoretime

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Indeed it is. And the denial of God's existence is perhaps the biggest delusion of all.

Absolutely. He exists just as Edmond Dantes exists. If He didn't exist, there would be nothing to talk about. Selah.

The funny thing is.

If we (the believers) are wrong we lose nothing.

If however, you are wrong... you lose everything.

What exactly is there to be lost?
 
S

Sniffles

Guest
For the last time Peguy, what ever made you think that you had any talent at rational thought. You're barely able to construct a coherent argument.
This is rich from a cartoon bear whose only recourse is resorting to Argumentum ad lapidem.
 

Domino

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and there's nothing wrong with Camus.
To quote french people, Sartre said that Hell is other people (l'enfer c'est les autres). *hums happily*

Well, Balzac hates you. And that's enough for me. *dainty glove slaps*
 

onemoretime

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I bought this whole box of jellos at target and devoured them in the purest bear in winter fashion. I then proceeded to sort of go expire on the sofa.

and there's nothing wrong with Camus.
To quote french people, Sartre said that Hell is other people (l'enfer c'est les autres). *hums happily*

You know, if every interaction Sartre had was a negative one, he might have wanted to look at what the constant factor was... :tongue:
 

EcK

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This is rich from a cartoon bear whose only recourse is resorting to Argumentum ad lapidem.
I'm actually refering to all the past situations when on the forum or especially on ventrilo you displayed a complete inability to think coherently.
 
O

Oberon

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The issue is theologians only talk to theologians and people who can't wait to get their confirmation bias fed. Theology, ontology etc is at best comical.

If there was any doubt before that you might have a less-than-open mind on the topic, you certainly dispelled it with that post. It leads me to believe that you've got your own confirmation bias to feed. Lemme guess... you only read atheists, right?
 

EcK

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You know, if every interaction Sartre had was a negative one, he might have wanted to look at what the constant factor was... :tongue:

Well it's from a novel, not his life, books need to have catch phrases. He actually considered politics etc to be a fact of life with the idea that there's no such thing as 'not taking a position'. He wasn't living in a cave or anything. S
 

EcK

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If there was any doubt before that you might have a less-than-open mind on the topic, you certainly dispelled it with that post. It leads me to believe that you've got your own confirmation bias to feed. Lemme guess... you only read atheists, right?

I took courses in theology. Also I'm not an atheist and never claimed I was. I just said that religious people are delusional, which until proof of the contrary is as much a fact as saying that rain is wet.
 
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