[MBTI General] How do you deal with ESFx's?

[algeerot]

I generally avoid meeting these types, but I can tolerate them for a while if we are friends. The ones who actually annoy me are the ones who lack self-recognition and make choices solely according to the most popular opinion. They come off as "fake" to me when they encourage everyone to do exactly same as they do. I have a sister who is a ESFP. I can easily predict and read my her actions and emotions because I know her background. But the new ESFx's I meet for the first time seem "less human" because I catch myself expecting an inferior "rationality" from them, and they probably feel the same way about me from how I appear to them instead lacking "feelings". That's enough bitching from me. What are your approaches?

 

[miss fortune]

maybe if you quit expecting them to be inferior on the rational front you'd have an easier time getting along with them... assume the worst in someone and they'll be happy to go along with that

 

[BlackCat]

maybe if you quit expecting them to be inferior on the rational front you'd have an easier time getting along with them... assume the worst in someone and they'll be happy to go along with that

Hey, this isn't Lex Talionis 2.0 now.

But to help some of us, is there a specific person you're having a hard time dealing with? Do you have to work with them or do a project with them? What's the deal? That would probably help the S's that want to answer.

 

[Stevo]

I'm friends with an ESFP and we get along pretty well. Sure she's a bit illogical at times but she's still a nice person and can be pretty fun. She's also pretty accommodating of my quirks as an INTP.

 

[miss fortune]

Hey, this isn't Lex Talionis 2.0 now.

But to help some of us, is there a specific person you're having a hard time dealing with? Do you have to work with them or do a project with them? What's the deal? That would probably help the S's that want to answer.

sorry, I'm tired and cranky and the words "inferior rationality" somehow jumped out at me and made me even grumpier

 

[HollyGolightly]

How do you deal with ESFx's?

Same as you deal with any type. You understand that they are different from you and remember that "wrong" isn't the definition of different. You will find it impossible to get on with some ESFxs, but that's not down to their type. Some people are just plain unhealthy and sometimes we just don't connect with people and this can be for several reason but it's not because of their personality type. So you just deal with them like you do with anyone....go in with an open mind and try to comprimise. If it's not owrking you just accept it and learn from it and you also have to realise that just because it didn't work out this time it doesn't mean it will be impossible to get on with other people of that type or of a similar personality.

I had a wide group of friends at school...some were Ns and some were Ss. I did connect better with the Ns, but I had a huge personal problem at one stage and I found a lot of my friends didn't stick by me. The majority of the ones that did were the sensors that I thought of as friends but there was no huge connection...I would never have regarded them as close friends and I found it hard to deal with most of them...I felt I had to hold back a lot and pretend I was someone else. But it made me realise that there are other things that are much more important. My friendships with the Sensors were more challenging that the ones with the intuitives...but only for silly reason...like I couldn't really talk to them about my theories etc and sometimes it was difficult to communicate. But having a good, loyal person in your life is more important IMO and worth all the other difficulties.

 

[Stanton Moore]

I generally avoid meeting these types, but I can tolerate them for a while if we are friends. The ones who actually annoy me are the ones who lack self-recognition and make choices solely according to the most popular opinion. They come off as "fake" to me when they encourage everyone to do exactly same as they do. I have a sister who is a ESFP. I can easily predict and read my her actions and emotions because I know her background. But the new ESFx's I meet for the first time seem "less human" because I catch myself expecting an inferior "rationality" from them, and they probably feel the same way about me from how I appear to them instead lacking "feelings". That's enough bitching from me. What are your approaches?

Try to smile more and expect less. It's your expectations that are causing trouble.
I find that I can get along with many people if I act friendly and non-judgemental (and expectation are a form of judgement).

 

[Kra]

Try to recognize their strengths, and focus on those. ESFx's are quite adept at showing you a fun time if you indulge them a little. You also never know when one is going to shatter your preconceptions of them. It's simply in their nature.

Admittedly, I don't have the most experience with ESFJ's. But I've found ESFP's to be fairly individual. Perhaps it's Fe that you're having the most difficulty with?

 

[Randomnity]

the new ESFx's I meet for the first time seem "less human"

errr.... what?!

Maybe you're having a hard time dealing with these people (I'll call them "ESF-like" because you obviously don't get to know them well enough to accurately type them) because they see you don't like them. It's hard to be nice to someone who considers you "subhuman".

 

[mrcockburn]

ESFx comes off as fake because they act differently than you do.

In order for you to operate like your ESFP sister, you'd HAVE to "fake" it. It's not your nature. It IS her nature though, so she's being as real as dirt.

Isn't it a bit irrational,oh Mr. Rational Person, to think that all non-INTPs should act like INTPs or else they're being fake?

Believe me, I am in NO way glorifying them. ESFx, at least the ESFJs, tend to drive me up a freakin WALL. But the worst part of it, and the point I was making, is that they don't even have to TRY to drive me batty bananas. It comes naturally to them.

 

[Weber]

How do I deal with ESFx's? Typically, I just don't.

 

[algeerot]

Hey, this isn't Lex Talionis 2.0 now.

But to help some of us, is there a specific person you're having a hard time dealing with? Do you have to work with them or do a project with them? What's the deal? That would probably help the S's that want to answer.

I have a long history of struggling with ESFx's.

I'm friends with an ESFP and we get along pretty well. Sure she's a bit illogical at times but she's still a nice person and can be pretty fun. She's also pretty accommodating of my quirks as an INTP.

sorry, I'm tired and cranky and the words "inferior rationality" somehow jumped out at me and made me even grumpier

Yeah on second thought , "inferior rationality" is too harsh. (you think!) I had a hard time choosing the correct term for my subconscious hunches. Maybe "less acceptable logical rational" for their position would work. But ehh, what do I know about their position? And I put it in quotes because I do not consciously believe it, but I get those hunches from their past decisions after the fact. It's funny only a few ascii characters could do.

You understand that they are different from you and remember that "wrong" isn't the definition of different. ..

I agree.

I had a wide group of friends at school...some were Ns and some were Ss. I did connect better with the Ns, but I had a huge personal problem at one stage and I found a lot of my friends didn't stick by me. The majority of the ones that did were the sensors that I thought of as friends but there was no huge connection...I would never have regarded them as close friends and I found it hard to deal with most of them...I felt I had to hold back a lot and pretend I was someone else. But it made me realise that there are other things that are much more important. My friendships with the Sensors were more challenging that the ones with the intuitives...but only for silly reason...like I couldn't really talk to them about my theories etc and sometimes it was difficult to communicate. But having a good, loyal person in your life is more important IMO and worth all the other difficulties.

I had a best friend who is a ESFJ. He came across as nice and fun at first, but there was a difficulty communicating. He liked to start conflicts and usually get me involved as a scapegoat which got annoying and I like talk about flaws. It seemed like a mutual and accepted antagonization, but we would eventually ignore each other opinions for mine were too mean and his were too fake. It came down to our difference in humor. When I was serious, he take it to be funny. When he was serious, I lacked support. I thought I was usually lenient with his opinions because I did not like conflict, but as soon I put my foot down. He blow up. It wasn't until I was away from him for a while did I realize we did not have a healthy relationship. That's just an example. I usually am not able to sustain a relationship with any ESFx. When I have a close relationship with a ESFx, it usually ended the same with me. Fun. Miscommunication. Suspicion.

 

[proximo]

Same as you deal with any type. You understand that they are different from you and remember that "wrong" isn't the definition of different.

Something that needs to be internalised first of all, before the OP can move onto the next stage of human relations, by the looks of it.

I had a huge personal problem at one stage and I found a lot of my friends didn't stick by me. The majority of the ones that did were the sensors ....But having a good, loyal person in your life is more important IMO and worth all the other difficulties.

+1000

That's a lesson I learned in a similar way. When I went through my "controversial crisis", it was the Sensors who stuck by me and the Intuitives mainly, who found they couldn't reconcile their "beliefs" with my circumstances and so, were willing to overlook the many years of loyal friendship and the facts of my actual personality, in order to decide, based on a theory, that I wasn't worthy. The Sensors would say "you're a decent guy, you never let a friend down, you're fun to hang out with, anything else doesn't matter".

My two best friends now are an SP and an SJ.

You just be yourself, and as long as "yourself" actually is someone worthwhile, then your choices and actions will be Sensed by those Sensors, they'll notice, and that will speak volumes to them. Just because they might not be "hip" to all your (amazing and astounding and original, no doubt) ideas, doesn't mean they don't "get" you. I've learned that the Sensors in my life often get me in a way I don't even get myself. They're there to give me reality checks - in a way it's their respect that means more to me than anything else, because they tell me whether my ACTIONS actually match my theories and principles.

 

[algeerot]

You just be yourself, and as long as "yourself" actually is someone worthwhile, then your choices and actions will be Sensed by those Sensors, they'll notice, and that will speak volumes to them. Just because they might not be "hip" to all your (amazing and astounding and original, no doubt) ideas, doesn't mean they don't "get" you. I've learned that the Sensors in my life often get me in a way I don't even get myself. They're there to give me reality checks - in a way it's their respect that means more to me than anything else, because they tell me whether my ACTIONS actually match my theories and principles.

I see where you are coming from. My best friend who I've known for years is a ISTJ. He keeps me in check with reality when I get too lost into my theories and I help him remain open. We keep each other honest. We have had many mature and constructive self-critical conversations and there were rarely any loss of reliability or hurt feelings.

 

[Amethyst]

Just don't get them on their bad side.
I've recently met a lot of people at my new job who seem to be ESFx. They're pretty fun as co-workers, they actually appealed to me most when I just started, and so far appear to be nice, but I don't really talk to them because we have entirely different interests. Mine is usually about games and other geeky stuff, theirs is talking about where they do their nails.

 

[Coriolis]

ESFx comes off as fake because they act differently than you do.

In order for you to operate like your ESFP sister, you'd HAVE to "fake" it. It's not your nature. It IS her nature though, so she's being as real as dirt.

Believe me, I am in NO way glorifying them. ESFx, at least the ESFJs, tend to drive me up a freakin WALL. But the worst part of it, and the point I was making, is that they don't even have to TRY to drive me batty bananas. It comes naturally to them.

I agree. I wouldn't say they come off as fake, just as superficial, and often intrusive. They want to touch, and get endless validation on an interminable litany of banalities. Yes, I'm sure they just like a different flavor of conversation than I do. We may like different flavors of ice cream, too, but no one begrudges me my own preference there.

I do my best when around ESF's to be tolerant and polite, and I seem to do reasonably well, but as you say, I feel like a fake doing it. More than fake, it feels almost like self-betrayal. If I put out this kind of effort, it is generally for a very worthwhile goal, or a very close and valued friend.