[Jungian Cognitive Functions] Ni + Te = WTF?!?!?!

[SillySapienne]

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For all you strange kitty cat NTJs, please try to explain how these two functions *harmoniously* work!!!

INTJs, especially, I find to be exotically strange, rational, yet ethereal.

How can one be rational and ethereal?!?!

Your lot is level-headed yet, often times, somehow, believes in some pretty weird ass shit.

I'm not hating, I'm just sincerely curious.



Ne + Fi works quite harmoniously for me and other NFPs, I believe, but to have your primary or secondary intuition harnessed, or limited by an extroverted thinking function is just strange and counter-intuitive to me.

How the hell does this work and manifest?!?!

Also, Ni + Fe seems to make sense to me as well, NFJs, as cosmically strange of a species they are, well, I dunno, they are, um... consistent creatures, I guess.

i.e. An NFJ who is highly religious or spiritual, who believes in esoteric things, well, I dunno, that makes sense to me.

But, an NTJ who is highly religious or spiritual, and, or who believes in esoteric things, well, I dunno, that does not make sense to me.

Sorry, in advance, if a similar thread has been made concerning this topic.

It is just, that, of all the NTs, I absolutely find the NTJs to be the most confusing/fascinating/perplexing.

For anyone who is game, please share your insights!

Many thanks!!!

-SS

 

[murkrow]

Do you have a problem understanding TeNi or just NiTe?

 

[SillySapienne]

Both!!!

 

[Kalach]

"Harmoniously"?

What do I get if I explain the secret to our mental health? I haven't seen a lot of willingness to believe MBTI, so I'm guessing I get a lecture on the joy and happiness of disembodied hypersexuality?



NTJs are easier to understand if one doesn't need them to be Si/Ne.

 

[SillySapienne]

:steam:

 

[poppy]

Generally speaking: Ni imagines, Te constructs ways to make the imaginings real.

In terms of mystical beliefs: Ni is symbolic, so it can adopt beliefs that function for us as candles to illuminate other concepts, the beliefs themselves may be incidental and less than literal. What's important is that they have some utility, as required by Te. Te creates the underlying framework that connects different concepts.

*In my experience anyway. Many INTJs are more concrete and scientific than me.

 

[Kalach]

Are you a believer, sister? Do you have the faith?

Ni is intuition focused inward. The objects of contemplation are inside, not outside as for Ne. The contemplation is less a thing of the environment and not really a thing of the ether either, but more on the a priori, the connections between essences. In an NTJ the contemplation is structured by extraverted thinking, so seeks for the essences of the things and processes of the outer world. INTJ spends more time on essences; ENTJ spends more time on deriving processes.

I guess.


So what's your take on how the harmony could possibly exist?

 

[SillySapienne]

Perhaps I just need help with understanding the elusive Ni process.

Essences of what?!?!?

Of everything?!?!?

Essence as in truth/core!??!?

 

[Kalach]

Essence of anything viewable as a mechanism. Anything describable as a thing or a process. Anything that can be understood as some kind of system. Even beauty.

I guess.


The a priori doesn't afraid of anything, except a prioris structured by different extraverted judgment functions. Those things are scary and confining. (At least until they can be understood as systems in their own right.)

 

[Usehername]

I like to think of Te as the bulldozer function.

So if Ni Fe makes sense to you, just imagine that... but with the bulldozer approach to the outside world? Nidoms aren't much different on the inside.

 

[Virtual ghost]

I recommend that you go through my posts in this thread .


What non NJs think about Ni ?

However it is not impossibe that this will confuse you even more.

 

[Two Point Two]

The way it seems to me:

Te is what enables me to be totally rational and realistic in dealings with the external world.

Ni is what I really believe; the way I really see the world.

Te means that I only take the logical course of action; this is what works in practice, brings about the best results, etc. Ni is what allows me to simultaneously doubt the assumptions on which Te based its decisions. Ni recognises that there can be no certainty, ever, but Te won't often let other people know that I think that.

Edit: If I only used Ni, I would be perpetually confused, unable to interact with an unstable and unknowable reality. Te lets me ignore that confusion for the purposes of acting in the world.

It's also useful for expressing Ni ideas in a logical, approachable format for others.

 

[Usehername]

The way it seems to me:

Te is what enables me to be totally rational and realistic in dealings with the external world.

Ni is what I really believe; the way I really see the world.

Te means that I only take the logical course of action; this is what works in practice, brings about the best results, etc. Ni is what allows me to simultaneously doubt the assumptions on which Te based its decisions. Ni recognises that there can be no certainty, ever, but Te won't often let other people know that I think that.

Our identity is an Ni dom.

We use Te.

 

[blizzy]

Ne + Fi works quite harmoniously for me and other NFPs, I believe, but to have your primary or secondary intuition harnessed, or limited by an extroverted thinking function is just strange and counter-intuitive to me.

Regardless of type, there is a favored introverted process that is relatively limitless, in the sense that an introverted process is not constricted by the outer world and thus reflected upon the more infinite vastness of one's inner world. There is also a favored extraverted process that is relatively limited, in the sense that an extraverted process is constricted by the outer world and thus relfected upon the more finite structure of the outer world.

If you want to ask an xNTJ how it is possible that the relatively harnessless Ni could be limited by the relatively harnessing Te and still achieve synergy, the same could be asked of you -an ENFP- how the relatively harnessless Fi could be limited by the relatively harnessing Ne and still achieve synergy. I would ask: how could one achieve synergy without the presense of a cognitive process that maintains its roots in the outer world to compliment a process that reflects upon the vastness of one's inner world?

In general, for an xNTJ, Te is a standard basis of measure by which the visions of Ni may be checked to determine which visions are worthy of action or not. After all, Te in both extraverted (focused on the outer world) and judgmental (focused on information processing), resulting in actions upon the outer world.

 

[Kra]

Our identity is an Ni dom.

We use Te.

Yep, pretty much.

 

[Kalach]

^ while that is definitely true, it's a tiny little bit difficult to relate to. Couple o reasons:

Technical: I don't think Ni can exist without some judgment function on hand to provide focus. (Side Q: STPs: is your intuitive world Ti-flavoured or Fe-lickable? Or--Gawd--both?)

Pragmaticalistical: Who sees Ni? Almost no one, I think. It's a rare, rare thing to see it in others. It must be there, lots of types have it, but the Doms, I rarely come across them. When I do, and recognise them, it's like floating along in the ocean and realising you just passed a gigantic iceburg. A weighty and relate-able iceburg. So i assume no one sees Ni much. Thus, Te's what I've got for being around people, by and large. So it's become part of the identity? Or has it? Dunno. Have to think about it.

Do other people see someone else's Ni?

 

[entropie]

Best way to get to an Ni+Te is make them talk about themselves. But dont ask me how that's to be accomplished

 

[Heart&Brain]

Pragmaticalistical: Who sees Ni? Almost no one, I think. It's a rare, rare thing to see it in others. It must be there, lots of types have it, but the Doms, I rarely come across them. When I do, and recognise them, it's like floating along in the ocean and realising you just passed a gigantic iceburg.

Do other people see someone else's Ni?

When my Te-lookout and Fi-telegraph have repeatedly announced calm waters and clear course I'll command full speed ahead to the machinist downstairs and go for dinner while the music's playing. When I suddenly get thrown to the ground and hear the relentless roar of impenetrable metal being torn up, my last thought before going down will be: I've found Ni.

 

[Haphazard]

If you stop thinking of them as conflicting forces, things make a lot more sense.

 

[Andy]

Intuitive functions have two asapects, as far as I can see, an possibility generating side and an information processing side.

Ne and Ni both throw up possibilities, but Ne uses the current environment and situation as inspiration. As an introverted function, Ni needs little or no outside stimulous to work. It will throw up ideas that have nothing to do with what is currently happening, and possbily have no parallel with anything that was existed before! In a primary Ni, the subconcious mind is continually churning away throwing up random ideas and thoughts, forming a great big heap that the auxillary function sorts through. For an intj, Te looks through all the idea, judging which are likely to happen, could be made to happen, or prevented from happening. It is this that gives INTJs their reputationfor contingency planning, as they frequently thought of it long before the situation ever arose. On those occations where we are caught out by something we missed, we don't usually think as fast as an Ne, which is why we prefer to take our time and work out everything in advance, constructing procedures to deal with all eventualities, which is probably where the nickname "mastermind" comes from.