[MBTI General] ENTP and accessing Fi, barrier: third-person perspective

[Qre:us]

Do any ENTPs who have a hard time accessing/understanding Fi, as it applies to self, think that it is because they view the world from a third-person perspective, rather than a 1st-person perspective?

***I'll expand more later***

Would just like some brainstorming thoughts, for now. And, how you understand, relate (or don't) to the 3rd vs. 1st person perspective.

Muchas gracias.

 

[BlahBlahNounBlah]

Everything I do is from a third-person perspective. The "I" is a social nicety.

 

[The Decline]

Don't forget your INTP brethren in this one

I, for one, am extremely detatched. Though I'm also quite ENTP-ish functionally. Objective truth ranks in top priority, and my mind is always Ni-ing about, filling in missing puzzle pieces of a larger story. Fi sneaks in there when I'm to take a stand on a value judgment, and it's constantly affected by the newest piece of information I've gathered which can make the most humane, most functional, etc effect.

 

[LostInNerSpace]

Yes, detached is an appropriate adjuctive to accompany INTP.

 

[thisGuy]

yeah...it is

although Si fuelled Fe can appear to be mimicking Fi. its an unknown territory and somewhat finicky when approached

i found if i busy myself with highly technical stuff, the third person can sometimes take the back seat. when im working and if there is absolutely any brainpower on idle, it will be used up by me watching myself think...and so everything is in third person.

i found that learning about a new topic is done best by being fully immersed in it with no overhead thinking while application of that learning is done best with some overhead watching me and keeping my actions in check...and so catching my mistakes before they are made

 

[Qre:us]

Everything I do is from a third-person perspective. The "I" is a social nicety.

I agree.

Don't forget your INTP brethren in this one

I, for one, am extremely detatched. Though I'm also quite ENTP-ish functionally. Objective truth ranks in top priority, and my mind is always Ni-ing about, filling in missing puzzle pieces of a larger story. Fi sneaks in there when I'm to take a stand on a value judgment, and it's constantly affected by the newest piece of information I've gathered which can make the most humane, most functional, etc effect.

True, there's those little INTPs. I guess my first thought was, they have enough issues accessing F as it is, Fe being 4th, that it's too premature/unfair to add more complexity such as Fi.

yeah...it is

although Si fuelled Fe can appear to be mimicking Fi. its an unknown territory and somewhat finicky when approached

i found if i busy myself with highly technical stuff, the third person can sometimes take the back seat. when im working and if there is absolutely any brainpower on idle, it will be used up by me watching myself think...and so everything is in third person.

i found that learning about a new topic is done best by being fully immersed in it with no overhead thinking while application of that learning is done best with some overhead watching me and keeping my actions in check...and so catching my mistakes before they are made

You know, there's some truth to what you say about Fe/Si mimicking Fi. What is past (memories) will be my own, and add to that the realm of F, I can see how some weird form of Fi can be manifested. And, since it's a weird form, it may be even more foreign for us to handle or figure out what the hell to do with it.

As for the learning differences (theory vs. application), I can see your argument too. Although, when I learn theory, IA, there's this focus in me (something like an INTJ comes out)...so yeah, I can see the "Fi", but, for me, there's no conscious 'me' orientation, as much as it is a focus on the knowledge itself. It's a full immersion (or trying to) where I don't even know myself from the knowledge I'm trying to acquire. But, I can see how accessing Fi would help in giving honest evaluation of how much I think I know/learned. I just don't think it's very conscious for me, more like a gut 'feeling' of knowing what I know/don't know. Si maybe?

 

[man]

Wait, you talk about yourselves in the third person????

 

[Qre:us]

Wait, you talk about yourselves in the third person????

Q is not allowed to divulge that information.

 

[ZiL]

I understand exactly where you're coming from with the "third-person" perspective thing, more so than ever after having been with an ENFP for the last 8 months. He is extremely comfortable with stating his opinion (which is based on how he feels about something himself) and earlier on he said he felt like he was dominating our relationship because I didn't express myself or what I wanted to do often. I didn't think he was dominating anything, but it's true, I do feel very uncomfortable stating how I feel about things when I always feel I have to be true to any other information i might be overlooking. That's just how my mind works.

Fi is fascinating to watch and rather inspiring if you suck at using the function, but the difference between Fi and Fe can be really confusing in the realm of personal relationships. Lots of miscommunications happen because of these different ways of reacting to information and personal feelings.

 

[Blank]

Yeah, I go through life pretty much thinking I'm a disembodied head.

 

[entropie]

If I had problems accessing Fi, I would need to accept the composition of the human soul of MBTI functions first, what I dont, therefore I have no problems with Fi.

I really hate generalisations and though I am a big fan of clichés, it is terribly hard to speak about a feeling, if you wont give a concrete subject you are bothered with.

Therefore I cant talk with you about my Fi. I just can give you the cliché that I would react, when someone dies, like everyone would react.

 

[Venom]

If I had problems accessing Fi, I would need to accept the composition of the human soul of MBTI functions first, what I dont, therefore I have no problems with Fi.

I really hate generalisations and though I am a big fan of clichés, it is terribly hard to speak about a feeling, if you wont give a concrete subject you are bothered with.

Therefore I cant talk with you about my Fi. I just can give you the cliché that I would react, when someone dies, like everyone would react.

Entropie is a closet ENTJ, therefore he's simply going to ruin this study

Could this 3rd person vs 1st person be a new way to differentiate NTJ vs NTP? I think the Fi aspect definitely creates a "first person view" for the NTJs:

Ayn Rand: "ME ME ME ME ME!!! I I I I I I!!!! MINE MINE MINE!"

vs

the joker: sooo 3rd person that he'll burn the money for no reason other than Gotham requiring an objectively better criminal


am i just talking out of my ass?

 

[BlahBlahNounBlah]

I understand exactly where you're coming from with the "third-person" perspective thing, more so than ever after having been with an ENFP for the last 8 months. He is extremely comfortable with stating his opinion (which is based on how he feels about something himself) and earlier on he said he felt like he was dominating our relationship because I didn't express myself or what I wanted to do often. I didn't think he was dominating anything, but it's true, I do feel very uncomfortable stating how I feel about things when I always feel I have to be true to any other information i might be overlooking. That's just how my mind works.

When people want me to have a single opinion, especially about something I've only just begun to think about, their expectations will be unmet. Until I've given something full consideration, I will have two, three, or more conflicting opinions about the same thing, and they will just have to accept that.


But when my opinion has firmed up, I express it frankly, frequently, and without hesitation. And it will not be moved unless there is a heap of conflicting evidence.