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[MBTI General] "Logically"

Ghost of the dead horse

filling some space
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Sep 7, 2007
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3,553
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Why is this word misused so badly to assure the listener of just about anything?

My girlfriend can serve as an example. She rarely makes errors of logic, but if she does, they're usually bundled up with the magic word, "logically".

Many other people like to give statements according to the same template:

Looking at the situation in <here> and seeing what logic applies <here> (with disregard of crucial information in the matter) , one should arrive to this concusion in <here>.
 

murkrow

Branded with Satan
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I wonder what sort of method is being applied when logic goes unspoken.

My favorite is "Let's be reasonable.".
 

Ghost of the dead horse

filling some space
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I'm thinking, some people imagine real life problems appear in a neat, isolated way, like in a math test: John has two pairs of shoes, and he gets another pair. How many pairs of shoes does he have then?

Logic works perfectly with perfect information. Logic is easy to use, too, assuring the one using it of inerrant conclusions. The problem is therefor the innocent wish that perfect and adequate information have been received, so one may be inerrant with the use of logic.

So ideally, there would be no giving shoes away, throwing old shoes in the trash can, trading them to something or anything of the kind in the above scenario. And if there were, it wouldn't be the logic users fault. Logic user's task is to just take what's given, not to search for information, and then put the stamp of logic on his decision. Or so he would like.
 

Grungemouse

Widdles in your cream.
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People mistaking being unemotional for "behaving logically" annoys me.

Unemotional =/= logical.
 

Mondo

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A statement or assertion that is truly logically sound doesn't need to be explicitly stated as logical- it is clear to both parties that the statement is logical. That's my guess to why your girlfriend does what she does- she knows deep inside that what she's saying is somewhat flawed but wants you to think otherwise. :devil:
 

murkrow

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your ENFP impersonation is exact.

*thundering applause*
 

erm

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People mistaking being unemotional for "behaving logically" annoys me.

Unemotional =/= logical.

I couldn't agree more.

Emotional =/= illogical, either.

I hear a lot of people describe courses of actions as being the "logical" one.

Logical for what goal? Anything that happens is logical, otherwise it would not happen. If there is a goal or value of some sort, then one can discriminate based on the most efficient method for achieving that goal. Those are two seperate forms of logic. What happens, and what should happen. The former is purely descriptive, the latter is an extension of morality, which is its foundation.

Two different people, can find two seperate actions the most "logical", without it being a contradiction. This is because it is the latter type of logic being used, where their values/goals are different, but their logic is flawless. Two different people cannot disagree using the former type of logic however, without at least one being wrong.
 

The_Liquid_Laser

Glowy Goopy Goodness
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Logic works perfectly with perfect information. Logic is easy to use, too, assuring the one using it of inerrant conclusions. The problem is therefor the innocent wish that perfect and adequate information have been received, so one may be inerrant with the use of logic.

Heh, this is so true. The misuse of the word "logic" is a pet peeve of mine. Going along with what you are saying here, many of the logical fallacies assume that both the speaker and listener are aware of all of the facts. But what if the facts are in question? Then logical fallacies do not really apply.

For example in order to establish fact one must often make an appeal to authority. "MSNBC reported these facts, while FOX News reported those facts." What if they parties involved in a discussion can not agree on the facts? Then logic is irrelevant. Often people try to establish a common or universal authority as a source of fact (rather than say as the source of innerrant logic). If the facts cannot be aggreed on, then the parties will never reach the step where logic is relevant.

People mistaking being unemotional for "behaving logically" annoys me.

Unemotional =/= logical.

This is true. However emotions do make us biased. When it comes to choosing sides, we tend to favor the side of our loved ones. Emotions do not impede logic, they impede impartiality.
 

thisGuy

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also, the thought process involved in subjectively defining things will seem logical to people...but that kind of logic usually falls apart when you zoom out and look at the big picture
 
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Logic to me is what makes most sense. It's easy to follow and it's without contradictions.
 

thisGuy

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i personally dont believe in cold rationalizations. feelings are what make life worth living

logic can be applied to absolutely anything and manipulated to explain anything

prostitution and drug use can be explained logically...why are they looked down upon?
 
Joined
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i personally dont believe in cold rationalizations. feelings are what make life worth living

logic can be applied to absolutely anything and manipulated to explain anything

prostitution and drug use can be explained logically...why are they looked down upon?

Very good question. And I could answer it but I won't bother. Also, if life were all about logic, maths and sterile environments, life would be fucking predictable and boring. Right-side brain brings novelty, and novelty is the spice of life. And yes, that makes life worth living. I think.
 

Blank

.
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Life would be predictable and boring? We could have jet packs!
 
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^^ Dude, we already do! But I see your point... I'm thinking about designing my own society based purely on logic, maths and fun/kicks/thrills, you in?
 

Blank

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Will this society involve orgies and free drugs to placate the masses like in Brave New World?
 

Cypocalypse

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Part of logic is the manner of the way it's defended, and making sense of whatever that's being asserted. Some people don't have the knack for that.
 

Grungemouse

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Logic to me is what makes most sense. It's easy to follow and it's without contradictions.

Until it becomes prescriptive. At that point it's tethered to the components of its time, gradually leaving it to be obsolete as the times change and new information comes in. Continued practice of it is then illogical.
 
Joined
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Until it becomes prescriptive. At that point it's tethered to the components of its time, gradually leaving it to be obsolete as the times change and new information comes in. Continued practice of it is then illogical.

Sure. Logic within the big picture. Otherwise you would be basing your logical conclusions on false and obsolete data. Is that what you meant?
 
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