• You are currently viewing our forum as a guest, which gives you limited access to view most discussions and access our other features. By joining our free community, you will have access to additional post topics, communicate privately with other members (PM), view blogs, respond to polls, upload content, and access many other special features. Registration is fast, simple and absolutely free, so please join our community today! Just click here to register. You should turn your Ad Blocker off for this site or certain features may not work properly. If you have any problems with the registration process or your account login, please contact us by clicking here.

[NT] Was Carl Jung an NT?

Athenian200

Protocol Droid
Joined
Jul 1, 2007
Messages
8,828
MBTI Type
INFJ
Enneagram
4w5
Does this mean I can't be INFJ anymore?

:boohoo:

No, I think the INTP meant that we just have to avoid thinking thoughts big enough to bruise their fragile ego.

Fine, INTPs. I'll stop thinking. I'll just blame YOU everytime something goes wrong in my life. Satisfied? ;)

See, this could turn out well... we can make the INTPs do that "thinking" work for us. No need to get our hands dirty. I can just come up with ideas and hold other people responsible for making them happen. Ooh, I like this! :)
 

Llewellyn

New member
Joined
Oct 30, 2008
Messages
330
MBTI Type
INtj
Enneagram
9w1
Uh oh. I don't know why you couldn't be INFJ anymore...

I'm watching the Jung movies only now (I'm starting the fourth).
It's true even an INFJ (as far as I know) can be thinking a lot of the time, but it doesn't seem to be all the time.
It would be most characteristic of an INTJ to be thinking all the time, which I'm now sure Jung was.
As to an INFP, she comes across as more considerate than an INFJ (but spare me, I've known/do know only one of each), more conscientious, more quiet (the latter certainly not always). Though in temperament an INFP is less stable and predictable, in what she says she is a lot more stable and predictable.
 

Snow Turtle

New member
Joined
May 28, 2007
Messages
1,335
Uh oh. I don't know why you couldn't be INFJ anymore...

I'm watching the Jung movies only now (I'm starting the fourth).
It's true even an INFJ (as far as I know) can be thinking a lot of the time, but it doesn't seem to be all the time.
It would be most characteristic of an INTJ to be thinking all the time, which I'm now sure Jung was.
As to an INFP, she comes across as more considerate than an INFJ (but spare me, I've known/do know only one of each), more conscientious, more quiet (the latter certainly not always). Though in temperament an INFP is less stable and predictable, in what she says she is a lot more stable and predictable.

I'll be more blunt for the NFJs. What exactly is thinking?
 

Llewellyn

New member
Joined
Oct 30, 2008
Messages
330
MBTI Type
INtj
Enneagram
9w1
I'll be more blunt for the NFJs. What exactly is thinking?

The act of delving into something else. So, actually like mining...

Edit: It's an environment, it's a landscape!
 

Lauren Ashley

Revelation
Joined
Aug 19, 2008
Messages
3,067
MBTI Type
INFJ
Enneagram
4
Instinctual Variant
sx/sp
It's true even an INFJ (as far as I know) can be thinking a lot of the time, but it doesn't seem to be all the time.
No one thinks all of the time.
It would be most characteristic of an INTJ to be thinking all the time, which I'm now sure Jung was.
Why would an INTJ "think" more than, say, an INTP?

As to an INFP, she comes across as more considerate than an INFJ (but spare me, I've known/do know only one of each), more conscientious, more quiet (the latter certainly not always). Though in temperament an INFP is less stable and predictable, in what she says she is a lot more stable and predictable.
I think (;)) it should be obvious to you why you shouldn't use one individual (that may or may not be correctly typed) to come to conclusions about a whole type.

The act of delving into something else. So, actually like mining...

Isn't this Ni? (Someone please correct me if it's not)
 

Llewellyn

New member
Joined
Oct 30, 2008
Messages
330
MBTI Type
INtj
Enneagram
9w1
No one thinks all of the time.
Time is a product of our thinking. Way, I'm INTP again.

Why would an INTJ "think" more than, say, an INTP?
Honestly, because I read so somewhere.
An INTP would probably generally seem to be more interested in (excitement by) reality.

I think (;)) it should be obvious to you why you shouldn't use one individual (that may or may not be correctly typed) to come to conclusions about a whole type.
Did I suggest otherwise?

Isn't this Ni? (Someone please correct me if it's not)
Ok, about the into part it might be Ni, but for the structural part (also the most inner part of that) it's then Ti.
 

Lauren Ashley

Revelation
Joined
Aug 19, 2008
Messages
3,067
MBTI Type
INFJ
Enneagram
4
Instinctual Variant
sx/sp
Honestly, because I read so somewhere.
An INTP would probably generally seem to be more interested in (excitement by) reality.
According to MBTT, INTP has Ti as their dominant function, where an INTJ has Ni. So an INTP would "think" more.

Did I suggest otherwise?
...Just noticed that you're European. Were you referring to "she" as in actual people, or "she" as in "theoretical INFJ/P female?"

Ok, about the into part it might be Ni, but for the structural part (also the most inner part of that) it's then Ti.

Okay. So then why would Jung be INTJ over INTP, if Ti is the "thinking" function (not that I believe him to be INTP, but just curious)?
 

Kalach

Filthy Apes!
Joined
Dec 3, 2008
Messages
4,310
MBTI Type
INTJ
INJs, by virtue of being in the Ni, will do a poopload more processing than falls strictly under the MBTI heading of "thinking". Thus I am for example relatively content to have my type be labelled the least rational of the rationals, because I, erm, intuit that intuition has some mighty fine chops. Ni synthesizes imperative sureties at a level others barely even know exists. Booyah, thinkers. In your face!

Hey, does that mean INFJs are the least idealising of the Idealists?
 

Lauren Ashley

Revelation
Joined
Aug 19, 2008
Messages
3,067
MBTI Type
INFJ
Enneagram
4
Instinctual Variant
sx/sp
I, erm, intuit that intuition has some mighty fine chops. Ni synthesizes imperative sureties at a level others barely even know exists.
...I agree :D

Hey, does that mean INFJs are the least idealising of the Idealists?

No, I don't think it works the same way for INFJs. Because the Ni is largely what makes them idealistic. So they are arguably the most idealistic.
 

Llewellyn

New member
Joined
Oct 30, 2008
Messages
330
MBTI Type
INtj
Enneagram
9w1
According to MBTT, INTP has Ti as their dominant function, where an INTJ has Ni. So an INTP would "think" more.
According to some descriptions INTJs are in their head more.

...Just noticed that you're European. Were you referring to "she" as in actual people, or "she" as in "theoretical INFJ/P female?"
I thought I'd use she as general, indeed, but the reason so because the one INFP I know is female.

Okay. So then why would Jung be INTJ over INTP, if Ti is the "thinking" function (not that I believe him to be INTP, but just curious)?

Because he behaves like ISTJs I know (e.g. my father); this type of modesty, and 'good cause', a.o. And that points to INTJ.
 

Athenian200

Protocol Droid
Joined
Jul 1, 2007
Messages
8,828
MBTI Type
INFJ
Enneagram
4w5
INJs, by virtue of being in the Ni, will do a poopload more processing than falls strictly under the MBTI heading of "thinking". Thus I am for example relatively content to have my type be labelled the least rational of the rationals, because I, erm, intuit that intuition has some mighty fine chops. Ni synthesizes imperative sureties at a level others barely even know exists. Booyah, thinkers. In your face!

Hey, does that mean INFJs are the least idealising of the Idealists?

Depends on what you mean by idealizing. We could be considered the most idealistic in terms of having created a vision of how we want things to be that we're holding everything up to.

But if you mean in terms of idealism about human behavior or an absolute sense of right and wrong, then we probably are the least idealistic. Remember, we're the most suspicious NFs, according to what I've read. The others are more trusting/naive.

So we're idealistic about the good our visions will do when reached, and not so idealistic about values in and of themselves. At an extreme, it might manifest as us abusing or ignoring morality/emotion for the sake of our visions... we could take the attitude that the end justifies the means, though we'd have to be pretty unhealthy to do that. Normally we bend it a little to make it fit, but we won't go too far.
 

Llewellyn

New member
Joined
Oct 30, 2008
Messages
330
MBTI Type
INtj
Enneagram
9w1
INJs, by virtue of being in the Ni, will do a poopload more processing than falls strictly under the MBTI heading of "thinking". Thus I am for example relatively content to have my type be labelled the least rational of the rationals, because I, erm, intuit that intuition has some mighty fine chops. Ni synthesizes imperative sureties at a level others barely even know exists. Booyah, thinkers. In your face!

And this processing might require a lof of thinking (Te) of Fe-ing, to get it anywhere. And also the Ni sureties may be sureties, but still have to be evaluated by a rationalizing function (F or T).
 

Kalach

Filthy Apes!
Joined
Dec 3, 2008
Messages
4,310
MBTI Type
INTJ
And this processing might require a lof of thinking (Te) of Fe-ing, to get it anywhere. And also the Ni sureties may be sureties, but still have to be evaluated by a rationalizing function (F or T).

Here's the rub: it doesn't seem consciously like all that often the auxiliary can ever veto an Ni product. It seems like consciously the auxiliary is there just to sigh and backtrack to found or express or build a case for whatever thing Ni came up with. Ni products are sureties, after all. I assume this lack of veto power is true because unconsciously the auxiliary was in on the job all along, focusing, regulating, shaping, even though the real Ah Ha moment was mostly intuition. Or that's what it feels like, and intuition rightly hogs the limelight. So, at least in INTJ, it's not really about evaluating so much as finding ways to make other people believe it too.

(Coincidentally, to be self-serving for a moment, the above means faulting an INTJ on his logic doesn't always, or perhaps directly ever, make a discussion go better. Intuition pumping is the real key. Or at least a key the INTJ will like better. Way to claim being bullet proof.)

And in a heroic turning of the tide back to the topic: does Jung sound like he worked that way?


(I have no idea. I joined the discussion when I saw the INFJs getting pissy about being thinkers.)
 

Lauren Ashley

Revelation
Joined
Aug 19, 2008
Messages
3,067
MBTI Type
INFJ
Enneagram
4
Instinctual Variant
sx/sp
^+1 (except for the last sentence...hush panda!)

According to some descriptions INTJs are in their head more.
Where are these descriptions? "In your head," doesn't have to mean "thinking" in the MBTI sense, btw.

I thought I'd use she as general, indeed, but the reason so because the one INFP I know is female.
Okay...so what I said previously: one individual does not speak for an entire type.

Because he behaves like ISTJs I know (e.g. my father); this type of modesty, and 'good cause', a.o. And that points to INTJ.
So your whole point about "thinking," that really has little to do with why you've typed Jung as INTJ? It's really because he reminds you of ISTJs? Well can't argue with that...moving right along :D
 

the state i am in

Active member
Joined
Feb 12, 2009
Messages
2,475
MBTI Type
infj
Enneagram
5w4
Instinctual Variant
sx/sp
thinking is not just processing.

perceiving = processing
judging = processing

perceiving arranges information. we focus on integrating information into a picture, a vision, a series of ideas.
judging weighs information. it sorts and classifies, attempting to know the value of information and the relationships between specific things.

i say jung was an infj. he has that big hanger grin, pulls you in with Fe. Ni dom bc the world is inside of his mind, so symbolic and representational. i see more Ti than Te, and he seems to want to connect in that infj with others, ideas, the world, etc.

kalach, i don't think we injs (or any type) are as completely one way street as you seem to think. in my experience Fe or Te can overrule Ni or take the reins at times (and in a healthy way), Ni just has to get better at letting go and accepting not-knowing. Ni has a great understanding of the past but predict as it might, the future isn't yet written. and i think we over-rely on our first function bc we are afraid of letting these things clash and accepting a new way of viewing ourselves.
 

Kalach

Filthy Apes!
Joined
Dec 3, 2008
Messages
4,310
MBTI Type
INTJ
kalach, i don't think we injs (or any type) are as completely one way street as you seem to think. in my experience Fe or Te can overrule Ni or take the reins at times (and in a healthy way), Ni just has to get better at letting go and accepting not-knowing. Ni has a great understanding of the past but predict as it might, the future isn't yet written. and i think we over-rely on our first function bc we are afraid of letting these things clash and accepting a new way of viewing ourselves.

No, I agree, it can't possibly be a one-way street. Ni has to have some judgment Xe, I think more or less constantly measuring outside information into the mix. The intuition has to be pumped or it isn't intuition.

I am however very fond of stoically standing by such simple claims as "I am always right" or "I know everything." And people can list the number of times I've been wrong or ask me things I don't know, and it'll make no difference because trusting my intuition is the bedrock of my personality.

I actually can't think of a better way than that of expressing how I approach being Ni dominant. A sentence like "I am always right" is the Te shortcut (in fact falsehood) to the truism claim that I trust my intuition more that I'll trust anything else. In fact I'm--*grits teeth*--not always right, but you'll never catch me suggesting, say, that true knowledge is impossible or that it's better to err on the side of doubt. Those and all similar claims amount to refusing trust in intuition, most particularly intuition focused inside.

Yeah, almost everything I said just now is logically ludicrous. But there's a deep, dark layer of Ni under all those words where it's all true.



*spirit fingers*
 

Llewellyn

New member
Joined
Oct 30, 2008
Messages
330
MBTI Type
INtj
Enneagram
9w1
Ni has a great understanding of the past but predict as it might, the future isn't yet written. and i think we over-rely on our first function bc we are afraid of letting these things clash and accepting a new way of viewing ourselves.
I think this is really a great sentence.
 
Top