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[NT] BEST Critic: INTJ or INTP?

Afkan

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Jan 3, 2009
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What type [in a vacuum] makes the most logical, unbiased, painfully true critique? I am looking for a type that is most naturally capable (and does so actively on the most regular basis) of making a summation not crafted to drive the nail in deeper, sway to their personal point of view, or even flatter/attempt to avoid offending.

Assumptions:
Most likely this type is a rational.
Most likely the type is Introverted for pure internal analysis, also most naturally suited for writing as opposed to speaking/interacting/debating in groups.

I am hung up on the J/P:

Cons-
J would be the most decisive, more likely to have formed opinions on issues already
P's as in INTP's have extraverted feeling, thus more likely to be biased in attempting at times to not hurt feelings

Pros-
J more likely comfortable with drawing an end conclusion
P more likely to weigh both sides of an argument

I found from this thread []INTP - The Critic? [Archive] - Typology Central that INTP is often named the critic. I would love to see a more in depth discussion here. If the INTP is the most natural at being a critic, does that really mean they are naturally unbiased? Or are they most critical? If you are an INTP or an INTJ, what is your position?

Of course feel free to argue the first assumptions.
However, please address INTP/INTJ.
 

murkrow

Branded with Satan
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ENTJs do it better.

Knowing how well something is performing it's role and how it could perform it better is our greatest strength as a type.

I could make arguments based on the function dynamics but I find those always rely a little too much on extrapolation.

I would put INTPs as a close second for critics, and in some ways they are superior.

INTPs are generally better at criticizing something after the fact, ENTJs are better at constructive criticism. Both can do either pretty well though.

This isn't to say that INTJs aren't good critics, they just don't spend all their time criticizing everything everywhere to the greatest detail the way INTPs and ENTJs do.
 

Misty_Mountain_Rose

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4w5
This is a tough one.

"logical, unbiased, painfully true critique"

Logical - INTP
Unbiased - INTJ
Painfully True - Tie

Pick your poison, do you want logic to rule or do you want 'fairness' to rule?

INTP (in my humble opinion) gets very bogged down in their search for ENTIRE understanding. This need to understand it all probably makes them better at stepping through the logic, bit by bit... but keep in mind that they're still intuitors so its all based on what they've gathered and intuited.

INTJ has 'possibilies' on their side, where they want to CONSIDER everything (different from UNDERSTANDING everything), however briefly, before they decide.

INTP's can stump me when I get into debates with them... but usually on semantics and not so much the idea itself. Usually they do not change my mind.

I would say, if you sat both types down and gave them data... say a file from a court case... where they don't have any pre-conceived ideas about it beforehand, the INTJ would be a better person for the analyzing simply because they can express their findings a little better than an INTP and they aren't so worried about what people might think of their response. INTP's, from what I've seen, care a little more about how they come across to people than an INTJ would.
 

ajblaise

Minister of Propagandhi
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INTP
ENTJs do it better.

Knowing how well something is performing it's role and how it could perform it better is our greatest strength as a type.

Maybe when it comes to criticizing a business plan. But when it comes to things as nuanced and subtle as music, film, theater, art etc. the articulate Ti analysis of INTPs is more fitting. Observation and precision in language is the INTPs realm.
 

Afkan

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ENTJs do it better.

Knowing how well something is performing it's role and how it could perform it better is our greatest strength as a type.

Right- ENTJs are pretty sweet at product reviews and sales, from what I understand.

ENTJs do it better.

INTPs are generally better at criticizing something after the fact, ENTJs are better at constructive criticism.

So INTPs aren't as good at constructive criticism because there is nothing that can be done after the fact. Touche.
In a way you proved my point that Introversion is better regarding writing- writing IS after the fact. Its internal. You are speaking of external events, especially as I believe human interaction- during which I would agree, ENTJs would respond quicker.
 

BlackCat

Shaman
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ESFP
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9w8
Instinctual Variant
sx/sp
I'd say the best critic would be every single type jammed together into one brain. :D
 

Afkan

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Pick your poison, do you want logic to rule or do you want 'fairness' to rule?

You make me laugh.

INTJ has 'possibilies' on their side, where they want to CONSIDER everything (different from UNDERSTANDING everything), however briefly, before they decide.

GOOD point.

INTP's can stump me when I get into debates with them... but usually on semantics and not so much the idea itself. Usually they do not change my mind.

If they stump you on semantics, does that mean they possess more knowledge than you, or that they take more of their environment in because they constantly consider everything?

THANK YOU Misty, for the very specific examples.
 

murkrow

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Maybe when it comes to criticizing a business plan. But when it comes to things as nuanced and subtle as music, film, theater, art etc. the articulate Ti analysis of INTPs is more fitting. Observation and precision in language is the INTPs realm.

Right- ENTJs are pretty sweet at product reviews and sales, from what I understand.

While I enjoy the display of shameless and baseless stereotyping, I can't accept it as a valid point.

I'm an ENTJ and I'm far more involved in arts than business.


So INTPs aren't as good at constructive criticism because there is nothing that can be done after the fact. Touche.
In a way you proved my point that Introversion is better regarding writing- writing IS after the fact. Its internal. You are speaking of external events, especially as I believe human interaction- during which I would agree, ENTJs would respond quicker.

Writing is not necessarily after the fact. You can be in the process of writing something and ask someone to critique it, in this situation an ENTJ is more likely to give you useful information instead of simply pointing out the problems. An ENTJ is more likely to be able to take into consideration the intention of the piece, and for that reason their criticism will be more useful and more effective.

If you are talking about being a literary critic, as in one who writes for a publication and has no intention of aiding the writer but simply criticizing the work, then INTP might be better.

However this depends heavily on the publication and intent of the article. IxFPs also make great critics when the enjoyability of something is the concern.
 

Afkan

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Maybe when it comes to criticizing a business plan. But when it comes to things as nuanced and subtle as music, film, theater, art etc. the articulate Ti analysis of INTPs is more fitting. Observation and precision in language is the INTPs realm.

Ahh!!! This throws a wrench in. Observation and precision sound pretty flippin important when it comes to...ummm...a writer of encyclopedia articles, of which I am looking for.
 

Shimmy

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If you wanted a something peer reviewed I think that INTP's make better critics. If you want a judgement on something then INTJ's would probably make better critics.
 

ajblaise

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While I enjoy the display of shameless and baseless stereotyping, I can't accept it as a valid point.

I'm an ENTJ and I'm far more involved in arts than business.

ENTJs can be involved in the arts, but concerning art critiques, they simply just aren't one of the more observational and analytical types out there.
 

Afkan

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I'm an ENTJ and I'm far more involved in arts than business.

I was referring to selling an idea/ convincing others, and product reviews in writing.

While I enjoy the display of shameless and baseless stereotyping, I can't accept it as a valid point.

While I do love putting people into boxes, :) I did not say you cannot possibly have any more talents than selling ideas. I can see extraverted thinking may at times lead to overgeneralization.

I do not argue that you are a very artistic individual. I'm sure you paint pictures, dance, and go to the Orchestra all day heeheehee.

Although I do jest, I am not completely sarcastic- my brother is an animator for Pixar. I have seen his talent present since his kindergarten years. He is ESTJ, with extraverted thinking as a dominant function. Extraverted thinking can be very helpful in creating art.
 

Kalach

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What type [in a vacuum] makes the most logical, unbiased, painfully true critique? I am looking for a type that is most naturally capable (and does so actively on the most regular basis) of making a summation not crafted to drive the nail in deeper, sway to their personal point of view, or even flatter/attempt to avoid offending.

The type that's getting paid to do it.

Every type's going to make a mess of it in their own special way, but whichever one's getting paid is probably also finding ways to find the skillz.


ISFJ.
 

Afkan

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The type that's getting paid to do it.

Every type's going to make a mess of it in their own special way, but whichever one's getting paid is probably also finding ways to find the skillz.


ISFJ.

Eww, really? ISFJs? Please give examples. I work with a lot of ISFJs, and they are all social workers. That's pretty much the ideal job for them- Mother Theresa was an ISFJ.
 

murkrow

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ENTJs can be involved in the arts, but concerning art critiques, they simply just aren't one of the more observational and analytical types out there.

What is the strength of the INTJ over the ENTJ?

The ENTJ's primary function is Te, his focus is therefore more impersonal and objective than the Ni led INTJ.

The fact that ENTJs do not sit back and watch does not mean they are less observational. Is the active scientist in an experiment less aware of it's results than an observer? ENTJ thinking at its most healthy is a matter of recognizing, acknowledging and synthesizing webs of cause-effects with objectives. How this thinking does not apply to criticism is beyond me.

Criticism is at it's core a function of Thinking. ENTJs are more focused on thinking than INTJs.
 
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