[ENTP] ENTPs how do you stop yourselves being assholes

[CJ99]

I realised today that most people either think i'm a complete asshole or a really nice guy or most commonly both.

I realized that while - i think - i can be a really nice genuine friendly guy i can also be a complete and utter asshole and be really cheeky and generally cruel.

I think this is an ENTP thing but it might just be an NT thing. But i wanted to know from other ENTPs especially the older mature ones how you keep you nasty side in check?

 

[Jaguar]

There are NF's who are asshole extraordinaires.

 

[marmandahalf]

Lots of times I just don't say what I'm thinking out loud.

Seriously, though, just cultivating a better understanding of other people's POVs and how they think and trying to learn to respect that helps a lot. For example, I've learned this year with an ISFJ roommate that I use words primarily to play and discover truth, while words for her carry a lot of emotional import. So knowing that and not roughhousing with her has been key.

Then I found an ENTJ to roughhouse with instead!

It's all just about knowing your audience.

 

[professor goodstain]

How about older unmature ones? If you took a pole in here of who likes stain and who doesn't, it would turn out with absolutely no middle ground. The thing about an entp though is an entp will still like someone even though the someone doesn't like the entp. i think because the entp thinks *at least they're consistent at being an asshole/or not, and that makes them not boring*. Hell, i don't even think an entp would go so far as thinking someone was a complete a-hole because of a potential disagreement that provoked the entp (to only appear to be) an a-hole in the end. i even think it would be kinda nice to get a complementary reach around with a-hole qualities/overtones that are at the same level as what is perceived to be mine. Maybe just that accusation of being an a-hole is that reach around i needed. idk.

You do bring up a good point about the whole NT realm of possibly having these (what are speculated as) a-hole qualities. Except ENTJ. They can be an a-hole and still come to the conclusion that it was the other who was really the a-hole. i surely don't understand their logic with this.

Come to think of it, i think maybe only ENTJs can come off as either complete a-holes or genuinly friendly.

 

[jenocyde]

I'm not nasty at all, but I am honest. A lot of people think that honesty is nastiness, and that's their issue not mine. I think being dishonest is the worst trait a person can have. Dishonesty for the sake of harmony. Ick.

To survive in this world, I've learned when it is appropriate to speak up and when it's appropriate to let things go. This has not been easy, it involved a serious study of body language over many years. I don't offer opinions unless directly asked for one. I have learned (or am still learning) how to cushion my words to be gentle but still direct. Every day is like walking a tightrope. Every single day.

And if I am going to let something go, I have to physically remove myself from the situation. I can't sit there with something on the tip of my tongue and not say it, so I really do have to get up and leave as quickly as possible.

My only advice is to pay attention to people's reactions. I know how difficult this is, as your mind probably races a mile a minute like mine. But I try to say a phrase and then wait and watch. If it goes over well, then continue. If not, apologize right away for your lack of tact.

 

[professor goodstain]

I'm not nasty at all, but I am honest. A lot of people think that honesty is nastiness, and that's their issue not mine. I think being dishonest is the worst trait a person can have. Dishonesty for the sake of harmony. Ick.

To survive in this world, I've learned when it is appropriate to speak up and when it's appropriate to let things go. This has not been easy, it involved a serious study of body language over many years. I don't offer opinions unless directly asked for one. I have learned (or am still learning) how to cushion my words to be gentle but still direct. Every day is like walking a tightrope. Every single day.

And if I am going to let something go, I have to physically remove myself from the situation. I can't sit there with something on the tip of my tongue and not say it, so I really do have to get up and leave as quickly as possible.

My only advice is to pay attention to people's reactions. I know how difficult this is, as your mind probably races a mile a minute like mine. But I try to say a phrase and then wait and watch. If it goes over well, then continue. If not, apologize right away for your lack of tact.

+1. i'm still quite deep into the tough love sea though. Tact=dishonesty

 

[Qre:us]

There are NF's who are asshole extraordinaires.

There are people who are asshole extraordinaire, so I don't see how this commentary is in any way revealing or helpful to the questions raised in the OP.

Lots of times I just don't say what I'm thinking out loud. (1)
Seriously, though, just cultivating a better understanding of other people's POVs and how they think and trying to learn to respect that helps a lot. (2)

Like she said, (1) learning to curb one's thoughts. Before I said anything and everything that came to mind, now? Less so, but, it's still quite strong, this inclination to share my inner world/thoughts...however, now, I do a quick mental analysis of possible ramifications of the thought, and decide, irregardless of it, my desire to share the thought (so as to spur further thought) is worth more than decorum or something. So it basically comes down to doing a quick value-evaluation of one's own thought before spitting it out.

(2) is paramount......and a cool gift that I think ENTPs have, to put self in other's shoes. Perspectives. Try to harness this maybe while keeping the thought of respecting that person's personhood at forefront. It'll be quite insightful in social dealings.

I realised today that most people either think i'm a complete asshole or a really nice guy or most commonly both.

I realized that while - i think - i can be a really nice genuine friendly guy i can also be a complete and utter asshole and be really cheeky and generally cruel.

I think this is an ENTP thing but it might just be an NT thing. But i wanted to know from other ENTPs especially the older mature ones how you keep you nasty side in check?

I think one thing some of us on this forum forget is, we're not our type first. We're us, who, just happen to be X type. So, don't try to be ENTP. It will do more harm than good. Don't look at the world with the knowledge of MBTI if it does harm. E.g., I don't really need to respect SJs because they're boring and not as smart as me, an NT.

Let go of all this. Be you, and if you so happen to fall into the category of ENTPs, so be it.

Personalities cannot change, but, behaviour can be modified.

Hence, as much as I will admit to a 'nasty' side, I know that with time and effort, I can actually kill that nasty side. Or put a lock on it. I do this through my actions. I can have a thousand and one terrible thoughts in my head, but, ultimately, whatever I put out to the world (i.e., my action), will be the only thing of merit and significance.

Meaning: challenge your inner asshole to a duel and know that what's at stake is finding more doors opening up for you, people willingly wanting to open those doors for you, which will allow for success in this world.
(as an extravert)

You will attract more bees with honey that poison. Respect is the honey for most of us.

 

[Kasper]

I like people. I find that helps.

 

[Jaguar]

There are people who are asshole extraordinaire, so I don't see how this commentary is in any way revealing or helpful to the questions raised in the OP.

I didn't realize I had to state the obvious: being an asshole is an equal opportunity job.
It's not an ENTP thing or an NT thing. An NF or an ABCD
can be an asshole extraordinaire.

If someone is an asshole to the core, asking how to stop being an asshole
is as ridiculous as looking up at the sky while asking how to stop the rain from
falling to the ground.

 

[Qre:us]

I didn't realize I had to state the obvious: being an asshole is an equal opportunity job.

Hence, no need to state it as a specific either, esp. one whose category is irrelevant to an NT's own behavior....NF.

If someone is an asshole to the core, asking how to stop being an asshole is as ridiculous as looking up at the sky while asking how to stop the rain from falling to the ground.

Not really. Most people can recall moments of being an asshole. Very few people out of the population will proclaim they are an asshole. To the core is a subjective matter that only that person can figure out. Not you, nor I can call that shot. (maybe psych professionals, and they may give it a fancy name, btw are you one?)

As I told the OP, personality cannot be changed, behaviour can be modified. It is the nature of humans, we can nurture inclinations within us. Rain, unfortunately (fortunately?), is only bound to the strictest whim of nature.

 

[Jaguar]

To the core is a subjective matter that only that person can figure out. Not you, nor I can call that shot. (maybe psych professionals, and they may give it a fancy name, btw are you one?)

Am I one what?
An asshole or a psychologist?
An asshole who is a psychologist?
An asshole who isn't a psychologist?
A psychologist who isn't an asshole?
A psychological asshole?

How about someone with a degree in psych who can at times be an asshole?

I happen to disagree with you that the only person who can decide if they are an asshole to the core is the person in question.

Frankly, they are the last person on earth to make that call .
People rarely see themselves as they are, rather as they wish themselves to be.
People have varying degrees of consciousness which is why I think MBTI is pointless.
It doesn't assess what the person does in real-life circumstances.

I'm going to end here since I'm starting to laugh;
dissecting what is, and what is not, an asshole.

 

[Domino]

Tact=dishonesty

I'm going to have to disagree with you, my good Professor. Tact is a method of delivering the truth in a manner tailored for the ears receiving it. I would never take the same approach with every person. My ESTJ mother prefers that I approach her in a manner much different from the way I approach my INFJ dad, or my INTJ bff, or my ENTP friends. You can tell the truth kindly while being firm.

There's no need for a gaping flesh wound when you could avoid that AND relay your message. Tact is an art form of efficiency. I've been dealing with a particular ENTP male friend over the years about his methods of delivery - he's a really great guy, and shoots straight (which I love him for, I can't say that enough), but I told him that he's going to have to learn some tact in order to get his views/messages heard by intolerant people (and perhaps powerful people who can make or break his career aspirations) who may not grant him the audience he requires.

I'm his friend, if he wants to say something blunt or awful he can say it, knowing that I'm going to return the favor. Truth is to be admired and the method of it's execution.

 

[Udog]

To add to that, tact is delivering the truth in a way to minimize emotional scarring and backlash.

If you can say the truth in a way that A) hurts the person and invokes an emotional reaction that makes them less cooperative or B) makes the person glad for your honesty, what do you choose?

 

[jenocyde]

Tact is an art form of efficiency.

Truth is to be admired and the method of it's execution.

To add to that, tact is delivering the truth in a way to minimize emotional scarring and backlash.

So wise. It's easier said than done, but I'm still learning. I'm only 32, after all...

 

[Qre:us]

To add to that, tact is delivering the truth in a way to minimize emotional scarring and backlash.

If you can say the truth in a way that A) hurts the person and invokes an emotional reaction that makes them less cooperative or B) makes the person glad for your honesty, what do you choose?

You surely excel at mastering the skill of repeated mistakes, so rather than looking at this as me firing you, I hope you see this as an opportunity to be presented with the freedom to fully embrace this special skill of yours, full time.

Thank YOU!! I love you!!!

 

[Domino]

To add to that, tact is delivering the truth in a way to minimize emotional scarring and backlash.

If you can say the truth in a way that A) hurts the person and invokes an emotional reaction that makes them less cooperative or B) makes the person glad for your honesty, what do you choose?

Well said, Udawg. That's the point I try to make with him. That's it's not manipulation, it's about working successfully and efficiently within a social frame work that compels his willing/unwilling participation. He doesn't have to be buddies with anyone. I just want him to understand that he doesn't get all that far by being harsh, that truth is a weapon that can't be fired point-blank unless he's actually trying to take someone down.

I try to reinforce his views though if he's right about something/someone. I don't want him to feel that I'm not hearing him. But the method does matter when it comes to human interaction.

 

[jenocyde]

But the method does matter when it comes to human interaction.

this is why I long for the day when AI will filter out that need...

 

[Domino]

So wise. It's easier said than done, but I'm still learning. I'm only 32, after all...

Same here, babe... 32 and still learning when not to drop the blade on someone's neck. Being an ENFJ - you hear the guillotine thumping at any hour of the day or night. While tact may be an NT problem, I have to learn restraint.

You surely excel at mastering the skill of repeated mistakes, so rather than looking at this as me firing you, I hope you see this as an opportunity to be presented with the freedom to fully embrace this special skill of yours, full time.

Thank YOU!! I love you!!!

Delightfully euphemistic. lol

 

[Domino]

this is why I long for the day when AI will filter out that need...

Jude Law sex bots, here we come. (oh dear, what a terrible pun I just made...)

 

[Udog]

So wise. It's easier said than done, but I'm still learning. I'm only 32, after all...

As long as you try. I imagine it has to be like walking on a mine field where you only have the vaguest of ideas where the mines are located. There are alot of people out there that reward points for effort. As long as you don't run out there, screaming, jumping wildly up and down everywhere trying to hit off as many mines as possible, you deserve some credit.

You surely excel at mastering the skill of repeated mistakes, so rather than looking at this as me firing you, I hope you see this as an opportunity to be presented with the freedom to fully embrace this special skill of yours, full time.

Thank YOU!! I love you!!!

:yim_rolling_on_the_

Jude Law sex bots, here we come. (oh dear, what a terrible pun I just made...)

If by terrible, you mean sexy. /Zap Brannigan