[MBTI General] failing @life

[pardo]

I am ixtp and my friend's girlfriends hate me because I do not conform to social norms and because I don't suppress my own wishes to please the girls.

It's worth mentioning that in this country if you don't kiss EVERY FUCKING ONE in the cheek EVERY FUCKING TIME he comes and leaves, and the person in question happens to be an F and/or an SJ, she will hate you. It is also expected that you make chitchat with everyone everytime etc.

My girlfriend also hates me because I do not call her every 5 mins (like my friends do with their girls), and because I do not give attention to her when I'm with my friends.

When in the company of my friends + their girlfriends, I am embarassed because I know that the women hate me for the aforementioned reasons, and I know that I don't give a damn about it but I also know that ignoring the problem won't do any good (and the girls -damn them- will probably talk bad of me with my friends in private)

These issues have recently come to light because I started to introduce my girlfriend to my circle of friends. When I'm with HER friends, I am in "fake mode" and I seem to be widely accepted. This happened because I basically don't care a lot about interacting with my girlfriend's friends, so I can concentrate on faking social norms with them and being nice to the feelers.
When I'm with my friends it's a whole another story, because we usually WOULD have something interesting to do or talk about and so I don't WANT to be interrupted and sidetracked by the women (who, in my eyes, sabotage my attempts at having decent male activities with my friends.)

If all this seems silly and idiot, I apologize in advance.

 

[AOA]

Yeah, that's quite a predicament.

... Some times it's the case that the girl that likes you wants to show you off every single time, or wants you to overly pay attention to her life/needs, especially when she's with the girlfriends. Can get a little edgy.

The best suggestion I could give is, you're with her - so be cool, and honestly let her know how you feel about the relation. Hopefully, she'll understand you a little better.

Hope that helps.

 

[jenocyde]

Doesn't seem silly, and you are not failing at life. Maybe you just need to be with a person who is more complementary to you, rather than both of you punishing each other for being who you are naturally.

(Also, I hate that kissing thing. I've lived in countries where that was the norm and I refused to do it and was subsequently hated. I didn't care then and I still don't.)

 

[Qre:us]

I am ixtp and my friend's girlfriends hate me because I do not conform to social norms and because I don't suppress my own wishes to please the girls.

It's worth mentioning that in this country if you don't kiss EVERY FUCKING ONE in the cheek EVERY FUCKING TIME he comes and leaves, and the person in question happens to be an F and/or an SJ, she will hate you. It is also expected that you make chitchat with everyone everytime etc.

My girlfriend also hates me because I do not call her every 5 mins (like my friends do with their girls), and because I do not give attention to her when I'm with my friends.

When in the company of my friends + their girlfriends, I am embarassed because I know that the women hate me for the aforementioned reasons, and I know that I don't give a damn about it but I also know that ignoring the problem won't do any good (and the girls -damn them- will probably talk bad of me with my friends in private)

These issues have recently come to light because I started to introduce my girlfriend to my circle of friends. When I'm with HER friends, I am in "fake mode" and I seem to be widely accepted. This happened because I basically don't care a lot about interacting with my girlfriend's friends, so I can concentrate on faking social norms with them and being nice to the feelers.
When I'm with my friends it's a whole another story, because we usually WOULD have something interesting to do or talk about and so I don't WANT to be interrupted and sidetracked by the women (who, in my eyes, sabotage my attempts at having decent male activities with my friends.)

If all this seems silly and idiot, I apologize in advance.

That's a whole lot of angst and hate going on, especially towards the womenfolk. Is there anything you like about these women (besides the nookie)? I dunno, like, as odd as it may be for women to generally have interesting and thought-provoking conversations....maybe, just maybe, through a genetic mutation or something, one such rare woman exist? Who you don't have to hate?

Or, you may want to ride out this wave of teenage angst....(I'd be embarrassed if it turned out you weren't a teenager, err...my apologies)

Whichever....

 

[JocktheMotie]

Where in the world is there is a custom where you have to kiss people? Probably the Italians, those lunatics.

Anyways, sounds rough.

 

[AOA]

The guy's just on a roll - put himself in that position, and now 'thinks' it's worth bailing. Enough talk about 'failing at life'...

 

[Fluffywolf]

I feel you. Personally I dislike the 'mask' I need to put on at certain get togethers.

It's fairly INTP'ish to dislike behaviour that is expected of them, but that doesn't seem rational. We tend to rebelliously do the exact opposite in fact if they're really pushing it too far.

For example, when I'm at some birthday party of someone I haven't seen or heard for an entire year but was expected to come for whatever reason (friends/family/came to my birthday (Dude, I didn't ask you.)). I tend to just throw a few degrading hilarious one liners that floor those annoying lil' buggers that expect you to be all guesty and nice. And usually it's filled with clueless ESFJ's that begin to laugh their ass off because of it. Which is in turn entertaining for me, the INTP, realizing they really don't have an effing clue of why I say the things I say.


As for the kissing. Here in the Netherlands it's three freaking kisses. Left, right, left. Now I have nothing against kissing nice and beautiful girls on their cheeks. But there's always a few that are just so enormously stuck in that custom that really sucks. There's a limit to how many times does not make things go awkward, every single day, the first time you see them and after that every time they go away again. And the next, and the next.

As much as I enjoy kissing certain people, this is taking the piss.

 

[Qre:us]

It's fairly INTP'ish to dislike behaviour that is expected of them, but that doesn't seem rational. We tend to rebelliously do the exact opposite in fact if they're really pushing it too far.

For example, when I'm at some birthday party of someone I haven't seen or heard for an entire year but was expected to come for whatever reason (friends/family/came to my birthday (Dude, I didn't ask you.)). I tend to just throw a few degrading hilarious one liners that floor those annoying lil' buggers that expect you to be all guesty and nice.

That's not very rebellious nor consistent of you. If it is expected, as you say, for you to go to these parties, get-togethers, the truest way to rebel against the EXPECTATION (the exact opposite, as you say) would be to not show up. Unless they hog-tie and force you to be there. Otherwise, I don't understand why you would willingly go to something, only to be degrading.

 

[Fluffywolf]

Well, I often do the exact opposite for many of the smaller things. But not going to someones birthday party because you believe you've no reasong to go but others around you say you do. Then not going will ultimatly only make the relations between you and the people close to you more annoying. So in those cases, you do go, but almost always try to be a little bit rebellious here and there, just to sting around a bit. Without making it obvious ofcourse.

But then, you're not at that party/get together for yourself, but for those few friends. Out of respect or whatever you want to call it.

 

[Qre:us]

Well, I often do the exact opposite for many of the smaller things. But not going to someones birthday party because you believe you've no reasong to go but others around you say you do. Then not going will ultimatly only make the relations between you and the people close to you more annoying. So in those cases, you do go, but almost always try to be a little bit rebellious here and there, just to sting around a bit. Without making it obvious ofcourse.

But then, you're not at that party/get together for yourself, but for those few friends. Out of respect or whatever you want to call it.

So, out of respect to your few friends, you go, in order to not strain the relations, but, in your mind you're playing them by taking jabs at them (but they "supposedly" don't know they're being played). Charming.
Will you be my friend?

 

[Fluffywolf]

Oh, not my best friends. It's just my family for me personally where I do this. Relations you're just stuck with regardless. (And I come from a fairly small town, with all these annoying traditions and habits that I just totally dislike.). But out of respect for the fact they are family, I do put up with them. And the jabs, like I said, are always fairly harmless, and often surprisingly well received, despite inner intentions.

With my best friends I never have these problems, because I enjoy being with them, and I don't care where I am then.

 

[pardo]

... Some times it's the case that the girl that likes you wants to show you off every single time, or wants you to overly pay attention to her life/needs, especially when she's with the girlfriends. Can get a little edgy.

my gf is esxj so it's normal for her to be like that... and I like her anyway. I like her
company, not just as sex tool.
We've been together for almost 2 yrs now, sometimes she is clingy but she seems to be ok... I hope -_-

That's a whole lot of angst and hate going on, especially towards the womenfolk. Is there anything you like about these women (besides the nookie)?

One is a heavy introvert, she is silent, she is not into the cheek-kiss-everyone norm. AND she is foreign, which explains everything.

Unfortunately, in my life there is a pattern of not liking the women of my city/area.

My gf is from the south, like most of her friends and relatives, and I've always felt more at home with them. Maybe it's not so hard to honour the social norms with them because I actually like them.
In my country there are big differences in people of north and south regions. I am myself of southern origins (my father moved when he was 17) so maybe this explains why I always felt so out of place with companies of locals.

Where in the world is there is a custom where you have to kiss people? Probably the Italians, those lunatics.

You got it :|

 

[Qre:us]

my gf is esfj so it's normal... and I like her anyway. I like her
company, not just as sex tool.
We've been together for almost 2 yrs now, sometimes she is clingy
but she seems to be ok... I hope -_-


One is a heavy introvert, she is silent, she is not
into the cheek-kiss-everyone norm. AND she is foreign, which explains everything.
Unfortunately, in my life there is a pattern of not liking the women of my city/area.
My gf is from the south, like most of her friends and relatives, and I've always felt more at home with them. Maybe it's not so hard to honour the social norms with them because I actually like them.
In my country there are big differences in people of north and south regions. I am myself of southern origins (my father moved when he was 17) so maybe this explains why I always felt so out of place with companies of locals.

One thought: the more out of place you think you feel, the more out of place you'll show in your thoughts/actions. Which will exaggerate the condition.

One of the coolest things about differences is, paradoxically, there's always a common thread stringing randomly irrelevant things together (esp. people)....if you deem it worthy enough to make an effort to look for that common thread.

 

[ThatsWhatHeSaid]

I'm similar to you. I don't like faking for anyone and often call attention to empty, superficial rituals like small talk and BS compliments ("did you lose weight?"). People think I'm a jerk while I think they're ignorant and afraid. They can usually tell that I'm still a relatively kind person, so the awkwardness is somewhat abated.

With that said, there are girls out there, like you, who aren't so inflexible about social conformity. Best of luck finding them.

 

[Oom]

I have the same problem with my girlfriend. She needs me to be there all of the time when I'm with her, if my mind wanders off she knows... You've got to straight up tell her that you don't like the pressure of being socially acceptable. And as my friends say, you've just got to show her who wears the pants, or in your case who needs to pass the pants on.

 

[FDG]

Where in the world is there is a custom where you have to kiss people? Probably the Italians, those lunatics.

Anyways, sounds rough.

By the nickname I think he's Brazilian. Anyway, I think it's a great custom (we have it too), you can kiss girls for free, duh.

Oh no ho letto ora. Beh, mi pare sia un po' una marea di cazzate, non esiste nessun posto dove ti "odiano" solo perchè non dai i due baci sulla guancia. Oltretutto al sud è ancora PEGGIO in questo senso, le norme sociali sono molto più rigide per molti versi. Insomma, è probabile che tu ti senta un disadattato senza che nessuno lo stia realmente pensando.

 

[Venom]

my gf is esxj so it's normal for her to be like that... and I like her anyway. I like her
company, not just as sex tool.
We've been together for almost 2 yrs now, sometimes she is clingy but she seems to be ok... I hope -_-


One is a heavy introvert, she is silent, she is not into the cheek-kiss-everyone norm. AND she is foreign, which explains everything.

Unfortunately, in my life there is a pattern of not liking the women of my city/area.

My gf is from the south, like most of her friends and relatives, and I've always felt more at home with them. Maybe it's not so hard to honour the social norms with them because I actually like them.
In my country there are big differences in people of north and south regions. I am myself of southern origins (my father moved when he was 17) so maybe this explains why I always felt so out of place with companies of locals.


You got it :|

you sound ISTP and she sounds ESFJ. i fully realize im overgeneralizing, and have little data about you... but i know a ISTP/ESFJ and they act like all the things you've said. plus you just sound ISTP (i have no S bias, one of my best friends is ISTP).

 

[Salomé]

my gf is esxj so it's normal for her to be like that... and I like her anyway. I like her company, not just as sex tool.

How many times do they make you kiss in Glorious Nation of Kazakhstan ?

Anyway, I think it's a great custom (we have it too), you can kiss girls for free, duh.

Oh no ho letto ora. Beh, mi pare sia un po' una marea di cazzate, non esiste nessun posto dove ti "odiano" solo perchè non dai i due baci sulla guancia. Oltretutto al sud è ancora PEGGIO in questo senso, le norme sociali sono molto più rigide per molti versi. Insomma, è probabile che tu ti senta un disadattato senza che nessuno lo stia realmente pensando.

(that was probably well dirty)

 

[Moiety]

I'm similar to you. I don't like faking for anyone and often call attention to empty, superficial rituals like small talk and BS compliments ("did you lose weight?"). People think I'm a jerk while I think they're ignorant and afraid. They can usually tell that I'm still a relatively kind person, so the awkwardness is somewhat abated.

I can relate to that. I kinda sugarcoat it with humor so I can get away with pretty much everything . I don't really see people as ignorant and afraid though.