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[NT] Hurt feelings and NT's

Stigmatic

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Huh? This is outlandish speculation at best. Why would anyone feel fear about this?
Because they either do not understand or do not wish to accept that people don't feel as they do, and that their more natural mode is regarded by some thinkers as the redheaded stepchild and by others as an inferior mode of meeting life's challenges. Nobody likes that.

Why waste my time trying to justify how others "should" do things that don't come naturally to them?
Why indeed! I am interested in your explanation for this common occurrence.

With that said, I don't think T's "process" emotions the same way that F's do. But they are there, and should be acknowledged to some degree, at least to one's self (not publicly, the bane of a T).
You sound more evolved on this. Acknowledging is a few steps from proclaiming depth where there is little.
 

SillySapienne

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You do realize that bitterness and melancholy are the effects of having prolonged never been dealt with *negative and hurt* emotions.

Many NTs seem to be forlorn just below the radar, being either bitter, or melancholy, or both.

EVERYBODY HAS FEELINGS.

Though we might not process them the same way, they still exist, and they still need to be processed.

For NTs to deny that they don't ever tend to suppress or repress their feelings, at times, is just downright untruthful, imo.

When it comes to hurt feelings, *as a general rule*, we NFs tend to nip it in the bud, whereas you NTs tend to ignore what initially feels like a mere irritation until it festers and grows into something you are forced to confront.

:peepwall:
 

runvardh

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Is there a flip version of this?

That the Feeler might fear to be seen as uncompassionate or not concerned/considerate enough and will have a tendency to cater to the emotive aspects of things regardless of what intellectual assessment might be made of the situation? (i.e., they know what was said and expected... but they still feel the need to cover their bases and show they were thinking of the other person's feelings.)

Just as T's might find emotive displays or acting off "personal values" rather than justifiable standards more threatening to their sense of well-being, do F's find the thought of acting from some impersonal assessment more threatening to their sense of being compassionate considerate people?

I'm just curious.

(I thought a lot of NTs that spoke here would rather be thought of as "mean" than "illogical," if given the choice. NFs often seem to veer in the other direction.)

Comes across correct to me. Ts could relax on seeming illogical while Fs could also worry less about seeming mean. That said, we're good at our own things for a reason. I'd rather get the emotions a T wants to give me rather than contrived ones just to make me happy even if they're neutral most of the time.
 

Stigmatic

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When it comes to hurt feelings, *as a general rule*, we NFs tend to nip it in the bud, whereas you NTs tend to ignore what initially feels like a mere irritation until it festers and grows into something you are forced to confront.

:peepwall:
Your observations contrast with mine.
Do you listen when NTs talk about their experiences with feelings? What do you think about the fact that so many do not agree with your description? Do you believe you know them better than they know themselves?
 

SillySapienne

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Your observations contrast with mine.
Do you listen when NTs talk about their experiences with feelings? What do you think about the fact that so many do not agree with your description? Do you believe you know them better than they know themselves?
I am obsessed with Ts, (they intrigue me), my best friend is one, my sister is one, my father was one, and my ex is one, just to name a few.

Granted, this is an incredibly small sample size, but I can only speak from my personal experience.

And, yes, I do sometimes think I understand what a T is feeling better than they know it themselves.

An emotionally intelligent, empathetic person will sometimes understand what an emotionally unintelligent person is feeling before, or better than that person does, or will.
 

Stigmatic

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Do you think by virtue of being a feeler you are more emotionally intelligent? Do you think you are less intellectually intelligent as a feeler?
I do not think so. Preference =/= ability.

It's easy to be off-base if you are wrong in "feeling out" a person.
 
G

garbage

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And, yes, I do sometimes think I understand what a T is feeling better than they know it themselves.

An emotionally intelligent, empathetic person will sometimes understand what an emotionally unintelligent person is feeling before, or better than that person does, or will.

Here's a T that can certainly see this being true.

Sometimes I don't think a feeler's assessments of my feelings are accurate (as in another post I made in this thread). But I've very often seen where they'll pick up on something about my feelings that I don't in myself. For example, when I was talking to my therapist about my mother, he noticed my facial expressions change and he noticed something like a tic in my foot.. and he had to make me aware of those for me to see exactly how I felt.

I know that I'm not in touch with my own feelings at times, and it's something that I'm very actively working on. "Emotional intelligence" is probably an apt term for what I'm trying to gain.
 

Kestrel

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Is there a flip version of this?

That the Feeler might fear to be seen as uncompassionate or not concerned/considerate enough and will have a tendency to cater to the emotive aspects of things regardless of what intellectual assessment might be made of the situation? (i.e., they know what was said and expected... but they still feel the need to cover their bases and show they were thinking of the other person's feelings.)

Just as T's might find emotive displays or acting off "personal values" rather than justifiable standards more threatening to their sense of well-being, do F's find the thought of acting from some impersonal assessment more threatening to their sense of being compassionate considerate people?

Actually, there is. Occasionally it does occur to me that I might come across as crass or obnoxious. And I do offend others sometimes, usually not on purpose. It's mostly because see I myself as someone who is aware (or tries to be) of others' emotions - so that if I do say something like that, I really have no excuses and I better be prepared to justify my actions. But I'm hard on myself about things like that. And a T might not be. T's are probably much more forgiving about things like that - with themselves and with others.

And sometimes emotions are thrown into situations where they do not necessarily help in moving things along. This can be annoying for me, actually. If something needs to get done, no amount of crying, yelling, jumping up and down is going to to accelerate the process. Hopefully, most of us are beyond this stage. :D

So yeah, I can acknowledge that if you try to shove feelings where they don't belong, things tend to implode. I've been there, done that. Too messy.
 

SillySapienne

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Do you think by virtue of being a feeler you are more emotionally intelligent? Do you think you are less intellectually intelligent as a feeler?
I do not think so. Preference =/= ability.
Pfft, no.

I think I happen to be both empathetic and emotionally intelligent, (though both things go hand in hand), and that I had a genetic predisposition to be both.

I also happen to be an ENFP, and I would imagine that there is some correlation between being emotionally intelligent and empathetic and being an NFP, (I can't speak for the other NF, or F types because I don't share their functions).
 

SillySapienne

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Here's a T that can certainly see this being true.

Sometimes I don't think a feeler's assessments of my feelings are accurate (as in another post I made in this thread). But I've very often seen where they'll pick up on something about my feelings that I don't in myself. For example, when I was talking to my therapist about my mother, he noticed my facial expressions change and he noticed something like a tic in my foot.. and he had to make me aware of those for me to see exactly how I felt.

I know that I'm not in touch with my own feelings at times, and it's something that I'm very actively working on. "Emotional intelligence" is probably an apt term for what I'm trying to gain.
Wow, this example perfectly illustrates my point.

Thank you for sharing.

:hug:
 

Stigmatic

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They may pick up on moods and feelings, but I am not sure they assess them correctly. I cannot tell you how many times FPs have believed me to be angry with them because they "felt me out" wrongly. A lot of false positives.
I am wary of people who try to tell people they have problems because they do not feel or act like they want or expect them to.
I am disappointed that I have yet to hear a feeler explain their obsession with doing this.
 
G

garbage

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Wow, this example perfectly illustrates my point.

Thank you for sharing.

:hug:

It'd help you to know that the guy was an ENFP, too.


Regarding false positives, I've certainly misclassified, mis-organized, and mis-planned myself at times. We'll all screw up, even where we're strong.

And if a feeler does feel more than us, they might expect us to tend toward the same. That's because their own viewpoint is what they naturally default to. ..just as we can't see why they get all emotional about certain things.
 

Stigmatic

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But we are talking about assessments about other people's emotional depths or lack thereof, where the FPs are super-confident in their ability to tell you how you feel and how you deal with feelings better than you are, and therefore ascribe pathology if you say they are wrong. Why the need to see pathology? Let's probe the feelers on this. Because they are more often wrong on diagnosing me than thinkers are.
 

SillySapienne

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They may pick up on moods and feelings, but I am not sure they assess them correctly. I cannot tell you how many times FPs have believed me to be angry with them because they "felt me out" wrongly. A lot of false positives.
I am wary of people who try to tell people they have problems because they do not feel or act like they want or expect them to.
I am disappointed that I have yet to hear a feeler explain their obsession with doing this.
HAHAHAHA!!

I'm sensing a little bit of anger, spite and bitterness, here, care to share? :newwink:
 
G

garbage

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But we are talking about assessments about other people's emotional depths or lack thereof, where the FPs are super-confident in their ability to tell you how you feel and how you deal with feelings better than you are, and therefore ascribe pathology if you say they are wrong. Why the need to see pathology? Let's probe the feelers on this. Because they are more often wrong on diagnosing me than thinkers are.

Dunno. I get overconfident about my strengths at times, too, and I sometimes defend them when I'm told that I've applied them incorrectly.

Surely because it's my strength, I must have applied it correctly, right? Surely, the other person is wrong!

Not necessarily.


Since it is my strength, I do tend to be good with it. Doesn't mean that I'm infallible with it, though.
 

Stigmatic

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HAHAHAHA!!

I'm sensing a little bit of anger, spite and bitterness, here, care to share?
And here we have an example of what I mean. You are sensing wrong. I explained in clear terms, then a feeler takes offense and reads between the lines when there is little there. Then the laughter that rings disingenuous because it is clear that it comes from anger based on the diagnosis of bitterness. Because the feeler would rather the thought that you feel bitter than understand where you are coming from.There is a need to impute ill will and spite. Why do you do that?
 

Stigmatic

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Dunno. I get overconfident about my strengths at times, too, and I sometimes defend them when I'm told that I've applied them incorrectly.

Surely because it's my strength, I must have applied it correctly, right? Surely, the other person is wrong!

Not necessarily.

This is what I mean about feeler overconfidence in diagnosing others' feelings ! Sometimes common sense is a better guide than spidey senses.
 

SillySapienne

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And here we have an example of what I mean. You are sensing wrong. I explained in clear terms, then a feeler takes offense and reads between the lines when there is little there. Then the laughter that rings disingenuous because it is clear that it comes from anger based on the diagnosis of bitterness. Because the feeler would rather the thought that you feel bitter than understand where you are coming from.There is a need to impute ill will and spite. Why do you do that?
LOL!!!

I was joking!!!

But now I am being for real, are you ok?

You seem, hrm, what's the word, yeah, tense.

Are you sure you're feeling ok?

:D
 

Stigmatic

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LOL!!!

I was joking!!!

But now I am being for real, are you ok?

You seem, hrm, what's the word, yeah, tense.

Are you sure you're feeling ok?

:D

Is this Sunshine part II?

I am fine. But yes, I am honestly interested in hearing the feeler viewpoint on it. I have asked directly, but people dance around it instead of answering. I think it is odd that, as common as it is, I haven't heard a feeler explain why they do it. :/ I even provided a provocative explanation to stimulate a correction, but only received a "why would we" response instead of an explanation.
I will get to the bottom of this.
 

Totenkindly

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LOL!!!
I was joking!!!

That was extraordinarily bad timing, then.
The context was completely wrong for that sort of joke.
It was pretty clear he was being quite serious and in "analysis" mode, and your "joking" tone didn't deviate from your "serious" tone. (I don't actually think you have a large degree between the two; your tone seems pretty much the same.)

So is that an Fi thing, or an Fe thing... or just bad timing... or what?

note: I don't think his response meant "mad" in case you're curious... just slightly annoyed because of the lack of getting an answer to his question.

stigamatic said:
I am fine. But yes, I am honestly interested in hearing the feeler viewpoint on it. I have asked directly, but people dance around it instead of answering. I think it is odd that, as common as it is, I haven't heard a feeler explain why they do it. :/

Ayup, there it is.
 
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