• You are currently viewing our forum as a guest, which gives you limited access to view most discussions and access our other features. By joining our free community, you will have access to additional post topics, communicate privately with other members (PM), view blogs, respond to polls, upload content, and access many other special features. Registration is fast, simple and absolutely free, so please join our community today! Just click here to register. You should turn your Ad Blocker off for this site or certain features may not work properly. If you have any problems with the registration process or your account login, please contact us by clicking here.

[NT] Harmless banter vs seriously speaking your mind

Amargith

Hotel California
Joined
Nov 5, 2008
Messages
14,717
MBTI Type
ENFP
Enneagram
4dw
Instinctual Variant
sx/so
I was saying what could happen with you and INTx group.

One question
Why placing imperative on connection with other people by a so large degree?

That's what makes me tick. I enjoy understanding others and bonding. It's a nice fuzzy feeling :devil: Small talk I've heard all before. But what is really going on in a persons mind and soul..that's incredibly interesting to hear. Makes me feel alive :) It's comparable to you having an 'AHA'-moment when experiencing a break-through with your abstract theories, I would wager.
 

Virtual ghost

Complex paradigm
Joined
Jun 6, 2008
Messages
19,769
That's what makes me tick. I enjoy understanding others and bonding. It's a nice fuzzy feeling :devil: Small talk I've heard all before. But what is really going on in a persons mind and soul..that's incredibly interesting to hear. Makes me feel alive :) It's comparable to you having an 'AHA'-moment when experiencing a break-through with your abstract theories, I would wager.

I can see your point and analogy is not 100% correct. Since I enjoy destroying my ideas and replacing them with better ones. But something tells me that you don't do that with friends. However I see your point.

Also I think you have nailed your own problem. If you want so much to look in others people mind I am not suprised that you can end up being rejected.
What in the end casues emotional problems for you.
 

Amargith

Hotel California
Joined
Nov 5, 2008
Messages
14,717
MBTI Type
ENFP
Enneagram
4dw
Instinctual Variant
sx/so
I can see your point and analogy is not 100% correct. Since I enjoy destroying my ideas and replacing them with better ones. But something tells me that you don't do that with friends. However I see your point.

Also I think you have nailed your own problem. If you want so much to look in others people mind I am not suprised that you can end up being rejected.
What in the end casues emotional problems for you.

I don't mind rejection as such, but it does make me wonder as to the reason I guess. If you let me know how to relate to you, whether or not in this deep way or in a superficial one, I'm all ok with that. It's the uncertainty of not knowing however that drives me mental :)

And thank you for not nitpicking at my analogy and understanding it the way I meant it ;)
 

Salomé

meh
Joined
Sep 25, 2008
Messages
10,527
MBTI Type
INTP
Enneagram
5w4
Instinctual Variant
sx/sp
I disagree with you on that :D You might feel that way, but I tend to get along with several male INTX as I love some brains in a man, and somehow they do not seem to mind my company at all although my primary language is feeling, and my main goal is to establish an emotional connection with the other person.

Hehe, well I didn't really think INTx congregated in group, other than online ;)
And the reason I take things personal is because I tend to cut the small talk and go straight for actually getting to know the person. And yes, it might be why sometimes I get hurt. It's also very rewarding when that connection does happen though. However, if that connection isn't there, I tend to disconnect myself unless I really do find them interesting. At this point I do not do the 'feeling'-thing though, just the curiosity-thing.

Like you, I do do the small talk when forced into it, but generally it bores me. I prefer a more personal one-on-one with a person though, or a good banter session in group (a chance to be silly is always fun), but that's it. Hence first encounters try my patience often, till I can figure out when it is safe to banter or get more personal. I guess what I'm looking for with this thread is a way to cut through all the small talk and get to the good stuff ;)

OK, Amargith. Let's cut the banter.
Don't play to type. INTX men don't have monopoly on intelligence. This is what I'm hearing from you: I find INTXs fascinating, but I don't like the way they won't give me the sort of emotional connection and respect for my feelings that I think I deserve. Please tell me how I can get them to give me what I want.

I think this is a bad position to start from. Emotional connection with random strangers isn't high on the list of priorities for INTs. This isn't something you can strategize, if someone has different needs and interaction style from you then I advise that you either modify your demands or look elsewhere. You can't get blood from a stone. If you are unable to tell whether someone is serious or joking, and you are unable to ask them directly, then you don't have a connection with that person and emotional intimacy is unlikely to occur.
 

Virtual ghost

Complex paradigm
Joined
Jun 6, 2008
Messages
19,769
I don't mind rejection as such, but it does make me wonder as to the reason I guess. If you let me know how to relate to you, whether or not in this deep way or in a superficial one, I'm all ok with that. It's the uncertainty of not knowing however that drives me mental :)

And thank you for not nitpicking at my analogy and understanding it the way I meant it ;)

1. Why do you have problems with not knowing did you or did you not make a connection? I simply don't see the reason why so much frustration in the air about it.


2.Would that course of action make any sense?
 

Amargith

Hotel California
Joined
Nov 5, 2008
Messages
14,717
MBTI Type
ENFP
Enneagram
4dw
Instinctual Variant
sx/so
OK, Amargith. Let's cut the banter.
Don't play to type. INTX men don't have monopoly on intelligence. This is what I'm hearing from you: I find INTXs fascinating, but I don't like the way they won't give me the sort of emotional connection and respect for my feelings that I think I deserve. Please tell me how I can get them to give me what I want.

I think this is a bad position to start from. Emotional connection with random strangers isn't high on the list of priorities for INTs. This isn't something you can strategize, if someone has different needs and interaction style from you then I advise that you either modify your demands or look elsewhere. You can't get blood from a stone. If you are unable to tell whether someone is serious or joking, and you are unable to ask them directly, then you don't have a connection with that person and emotional intimacy is unlikely to occur.

Then you heard wrong :) I never said they have the monopoly on intelligence. But I do tend to get talking with I's more than E's. I find ENTP's also very interesting, but that's not the type I usually end up talking to (with a few exceptions). You also misunderstood what I want. I want to understand. I do very much enjoy the rare occasions I can make a deep emotional connection, but I'm fine with just knowing where I stand with them as well and keeping it superficial. It's the uncertainty I'm trying to get a grip on :) I know connections with other people are not high on their list of priorities, but when they do make one, it's definitely worth the wait, IME.

1. Why do you have problems with not knowing did you or did you not make a connection? I simply don't see the reason why so much frustration in the air about it. 2.Would that course of action make any sense?

I usually know when a connection isn't working. What I'm uncertain about sometimes, is why. Occasionally it's clear: differences in values, opinions that are too sensitive to debate, or just a general dislike of too much interaction, or just plain rubbing each other the wrong way and not being able to get on the same page. And sometimes you can still readjust and superficially connect when you know what the cause is. When you don't know the cause, you cannot fix it :)
 

Virtual ghost

Complex paradigm
Joined
Jun 6, 2008
Messages
19,769
I usually know when a connection isn't working. What I'm uncertain about sometimes, is why. Occasionally it's clear: differences in values, opinions that are too sensitive to debate, or just a general dislike of too much interaction, or just plain rubbing each other the wrong way and not being able to get on the same page. And sometimes you can still readjust and superficially connect when you know what the cause is. When you don't know the cause, you cannot fix it :)

How do you actually know that you have actually made a connection?



You can fix it without knowing but in that case it is unlikely.
 

Amargith

Hotel California
Joined
Nov 5, 2008
Messages
14,717
MBTI Type
ENFP
Enneagram
4dw
Instinctual Variant
sx/so
How do you actually know that you have actually made a connection? You can fix it without knowing but in that case it is unlikely.

It's a feeling mostly. I guess it has to do with the responses of the other, who invested s/he is and if you are actually understanding what the other is saying, thinking and feeling.
 

Virtual ghost

Complex paradigm
Joined
Jun 6, 2008
Messages
19,769
It's a feeling mostly. I guess it has to do with the responses of the other, who invested s/he is and if you are actually understanding what the other is saying, thinking and feeling.

But, as you say that is only a feeling. Which means you maybe don't make deep connection as you think.
Can it be that that you are exaggerating about this and you don't even know it since you are doing it simply because you have needs?
 

Amargith

Hotel California
Joined
Nov 5, 2008
Messages
14,717
MBTI Type
ENFP
Enneagram
4dw
Instinctual Variant
sx/so
But, as you say that is only a feeling. Which means you maybe don't make deep connection as you think.
Can it be that that you are exaggerating about this and you don't even know it since you are doing it simply because you have needs?

Grin, it tends to get confirmed later down the line :)
Don't discount it coz it's a feeling. And there are different gradations in connections, btw.
 

ed111

New member
Joined
Sep 9, 2008
Messages
426
MBTI Type
INTJ
What about if you've been talking to this person for a while now, still first conversation and s/he has a certain attitude, twitch, whatever, that bugs you. You see, what I'm looking for is how do you guys 'hint' that you don't like the person and therefore would like to leave the conversation and not meet them again, and how is it different from the banter you use to bond?

If I don't like you, you won't be talking to me. I'll give you short responses, look disinterested and will try to make a fast escape.

If I like you and I'm making comments then they're almost always meant in a light-hearted way.

You'll be able to tell if my sarcastic comments are meant in a nasty way as I'll have a slightly aggressive tone to my voice and I'll be frowning.
 

Amargith

Hotel California
Joined
Nov 5, 2008
Messages
14,717
MBTI Type
ENFP
Enneagram
4dw
Instinctual Variant
sx/so
If I don't like you, you won't be talking to me. I'll give you short responses, look disinterested and will try to make a fast escape.

If I like you and I'm making comments then they're almost always meant in a light-hearted way.

You'll be able to tell if my sarcastic comments are meant in a nasty way as I'll have a slightly aggressive tone to my voice and I'll be frowning.


That's interesting...so if you don't like someone..do they get a chance to redeem themselves or is that it?
 

Virtual ghost

Complex paradigm
Joined
Jun 6, 2008
Messages
19,769
Grin, it tends to get confirmed later down the line :)
Don't discount it coz it's a feeling. And there are different gradations in connections, btw.

I am not saying that there is no connection at all I am questioning how deep you actually go.
The question is: Do you really go deep or you think that you do.
 

Amargith

Hotel California
Joined
Nov 5, 2008
Messages
14,717
MBTI Type
ENFP
Enneagram
4dw
Instinctual Variant
sx/so
I am not saying that there is no connection at all I am questioning how deep you actually go.
The question is: Do you really go deep or you think that you do.

Depend on the person. I've had all kinds of connections with people. But I've had several people being surprised at telling me things they tell no one, and I consider that pretty deep and special. I also tend to have conversations with those people for hours on end about personal stuff. The most intimate connections are often with people that over time become soulmates. And yes, I do check if they feel the same way :)
 

ed111

New member
Joined
Sep 9, 2008
Messages
426
MBTI Type
INTJ
That's interesting...so if you don't like someone..do they get a chance to redeem themselves or is that it?

It depends. If they're the type of person that's generally aggressive, arrogant and nasty then no, I won't ever want to talk to them.

Other than that I am quite a forgiving person and can be quite sociable so there's always an opportunity for them to either apologise if they've wronged me, admit they were wrong, come to some understanding with me, or prove that they are either interesting, funny or competent.
 

Virtual ghost

Complex paradigm
Joined
Jun 6, 2008
Messages
19,769
Depend on the person. I've had all kinds of connections with people. But I've had several people being surprised at telling me things they tell no one, and I consider that pretty deep and special. I also tend to have conversations with those people for hours on end about personal stuff. The most intimate connections are often with people that over time become soulmates. And yes, I do check if they feel the same way :)

The reason why my posts have so much sceptiscism is because this kind of things in not typical behaviour for me and I don't understand it in all of its aspects.
 

Amargith

Hotel California
Joined
Nov 5, 2008
Messages
14,717
MBTI Type
ENFP
Enneagram
4dw
Instinctual Variant
sx/so
The reason why my posts have so much scepticism is because this kind of things in not typical behaviour for me and I don't understand it in all of its aspects.

I know, and I don't mind your sceptiscism :)
I realize that it doesn't work that way for you. And I wish I could take you to my world and show it to you, so you could understand. But I'm happy just sharing how I understand the world, if you are in need of such answers.
 

Virtual ghost

Complex paradigm
Joined
Jun 6, 2008
Messages
19,769
I know, and I don't mind your sceptiscism :)
I realize that it doesn't work that way for you. And I wish I could take you to my world and show it to you, so you could understand. But I'm happy just sharing how I understand the world, if you are in need of such answers.

Saying that I don't understand is not completly true I understand the motives, dinamics and logic of this. It is just that F part is out of my reach and I am not particulary bothered by this.
 

Tiltyred

New member
Joined
Dec 1, 2008
Messages
4,322
MBTI Type
INFP
Enneagram
468
Instinctual Variant
sx/sp
So how is one to tell them apart with NT's? I mean, when you know someone already, then it usually isn't that hard to tell, but when you've just met them and they make a potentially hurtful comment, it can be hard. What are the telltale signs that we shouldn't take it serious, and when do you actually mean it? Or, do you use those remarks to test the waters yourself? Help us poor confused NF's understand... :huh: *goes hide*

It's such a good question. I don't understand banter and some of the things NTs say to each other set my hair on end, so they do make me nervous, too. Even with ones I know well, I never feel like I know what's really going on.
 

Salomé

meh
Joined
Sep 25, 2008
Messages
10,527
MBTI Type
INTP
Enneagram
5w4
Instinctual Variant
sx/sp
Be afraid. Be very afraid.
:ninja:
 
Top