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[NT] NTs and God

squibbles

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Jun 23, 2008
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77
MBTI Type
INTJ
Yes, I am a practicing Christian (practicing in the sense that I attend and enjoy church/Bible study, I try to incorporate prayer into my every-day life, and my faith affects my decisions and behavior) and test as an INTJ. I have lots of NT friends who are also Christian, though it's clear that (at least among the Christians I know), the NTs are probably the least common group.

I notice that I approach faith differently from most other Christians I know. I question a lot of things and believe that my faith can be reconciled with science. I believe in evolution of all beings, but that God was behind it. I don't rely on a God-of-the-gaps ideology to give evidence for my belief in God. Much of the basis for my belief is comprised of how I perceive God to have affected my own life and the lives of those around me.
 

blanclait

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Oct 7, 2008
Messages
305
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ENTP
It was harder for rules to be applied and people were uneducated.

if what you say is true, % of religious people will continue to drop? since people are now more educated. And this will continue. To the point of?

Based on your previous post, you seem to think everyone is independent and strong enough to get through life happily without God. If god is not present, in what will they shelter their insecurities in? (that's honestly, a question i've been wondering :D)
What else can perform that emotional support? Religion's effect on us increases depending on how much we believe in it. Its hard to believe some wacko cult, based on a pen. But 1000 year old system. Its eaiser to trust in. Increase of faith, strength -> increase of comfort and truely believing god loves you. Which -> aid fighting against depression, traumatic, experiences, etc

On a site note
I believe the whole concept of god was created, of course to reinforce laws, morals, etc. But also to free one's worries. eg. "This crop season may turn out bad" so to free oneself from that anxiety they created some god. By offering a tribute, now one can rest in peace.
Those who don't follow some god like rituals, may lead to other rituals. Let say, superstitions. Lucky underwear, lucky pencil, etc. etc.

But just like rumors, people are more like to believe in something, when done in a group. This causes whatever the religion promises (lets say happiness) to strengthen, as the follower's belief will strengthen.


Shit the bell went off, srry if something doesnt make any sense.
 

Nihilen

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Oct 27, 2008
Messages
977
MBTI Type
ISTP
if what you say is true, % of religious people will continue to drop? since people are now more educated. And this will continue. To the point of?

I am basing this on observation, and it is obvious; 3rd world countries have much more religious zealots than developed ones.

But education and implemented rules are definitely not the only factors, but they're the most influential.

Based on your previous post, you seem to think everyone is independent and strong enough to get through life happily without God. If god is not present, in what will they shelter their insecurities in? (that's honestly, a question i've been wondering :D)
What else can perform that emotional support? Religion's effect on us increases depending on how much we believe in it. Its hard to believe some wacko cult, based on a pen. But 1000 year old system. Its eaiser to trust in. Increase of faith, strength -> increase of comfort and truely believing god loves you. Which -> aid fighting against depression, traumatic, experiences, etc

On a site note
I believe the whole concept of god was created, of course to reinforce laws, morals, etc. But also to free one's worries. eg. "This crop season may turn out bad" so to free oneself from that anxiety they created some god. By offering a tribute, now one can rest in peace.
Those who don't follow some god like rituals, may lead to other rituals. Let say, superstitions. Lucky underwear, lucky pencil, etc. etc.

But just like rumors, people are more like to believe in something, when done in a group. This causes whatever the religion promises (lets say happiness) to strengthen, as the follower's belief will strengthen.


Shit the bell went off, srry if something doesnt make any sense.

It's not about what makes more happy, I would have been much happier believing in flying unicorns, talking tomatoes, tooth-fairy strippers and eternal life in heaven having wild orgies with 77 virgin hotties.

But once people exercise their brains, many cannot keep believing in such BS, even if they would rather believe.
I don't see contradiction in what you're saying and the point I expressed, I agree that's what religion is and that's the social function it was created to serve. But if you give people real alternatives to counter their worries, they will not seek fake ones.
 

Nigel Tufnel

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Nov 30, 2008
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116
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ENTP
No self-help book has provided me with as much guidance as the New Testament.

That said, I have a big problem with other Christians who are dogmatic and won't challenge anything the Bible says. I believe in there being a God, not in me being a sheep. Also, while I attend church and vote Republican, I don't believe in creationism.
 

Synarch

Once Was
Joined
Oct 14, 2008
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8,445
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ENTP
No self-help book has provided me with as much guidance as the New Testament.

That said, I have a big problem with other Christians who are dogmatic and won't challenge anything the Bible says. I believe in there being a God, not in me being a sheep. Also, while I attend church and vote Republican, I don't believe in creationism.

Total agreement. Especially the passages on the power of love.
 

Kristiana

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Dec 28, 2007
Messages
326
MBTI Type
INTJ
Yes, I am a practicing Christian (practicing in the sense that I attend and enjoy church/Bible study, I try to incorporate prayer into my every-day life, and my faith affects my decisions and behavior) and test as an INTJ. I have lots of NT friends who are also Christian

Same... only in my circles there are a lot of Christian intellectuals, so many are NT types too...
 

Risen

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Mar 19, 2008
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3,185
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9w8
I believe in God, though my concept of what God is is solely based upon whatever bits of spiritual knowledge and wisdom I've been able to derive from my own searching and life experiences. I've never been one to believe in "God" for the sake of believing it or because the Christian (or other religion) church says I must. I think the concept of God would be much more attractive to INTP's if they were inclined to seek greater understanding of it the way they do everything else, as opposed to taking one concept of God as it is offered in one particular belief system without subjecting it to their own "search and analyze" mission. My "belief" in God could probably be likened to more of a spiritual theory toward a theoretical understanding of how reality, of and beyond the material universe, is structured...
 

01011010

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Jun 22, 2008
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I don't believe in God or religion. I'd be open to considering the concept if compelling evidence emerged. True empirical proof, but until then...
 

Spartacuss

wholly charmed
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Apr 27, 2008
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677
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I believe in God, though my concept of what God is is solely based upon whatever bits of spiritual knowledge and wisdom I've been able to derive from my own searching and life experiences. I've never been one to believe in "God" for the sake of believing it or because the Christian (or other religion) church says I must. I think the concept of God would be much more attractive to INTP's if they were inclined to seek greater understanding of it the way they do everything else, as opposed to taking one concept of God as it is offered in one particular belief system without subjecting it to their own "search and analyze" mission. My "belief" in God could probably be likened to more of a spiritual theory toward a theoretical understanding of how reality, of and beyond the material universe, is structured...

And how did you conclude that the analysis that led you to belief was atypical of INTPs?. In other words: what, besides a conclusion different from yours, indicates that non-believing INTPS are not "inclined to seek greater understanding of it the way they do everything else, as opposed to taking one concept of God as it is offered in one particular belief system without subjecting it to their own "search and analyze" mission"?
 

Mycroft

The elder Holmes
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Jun 7, 2007
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Instinctual Variant
so/sp
Anyone of any type who so chooses can believe in anything. NTs who believe in God will approach the subject with the intellectual equivalent of chest-beating our group is known for.

The SJ believes in God because he was raised to. The NT believes in God because he was raised to, but first, to sate his intellectual bent, must spend hundreds of hours in thought and writing justifying his belief to himself. In the end, the SJ simply chose the Path of Least Hand-Wringing.

If-and-when I encounter an NT whose reason for belief in God amounts to more than "Gosh, I just really want to", I may take that man or woman's argument seriously.
 

desiree

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Okay, I'm an NT, and I believe in God.

I don't have a religion. I don't think I need one, and I'm sure the majority of you fine young democratic people don't either. But many people who lack moral compasses do. They're not bad inventions for keeping people in check. As long as they don't slip into infringement on personal freedom (read: Crusades).

I also don't think of God as being outside of myself, which may sound crazy, and may be crazy, but is also kind of the point of most mystical teachings.

I can do God's work, or I can be as God, or I can be God--that all means the same thing to me.
 

desiree

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Er, also, for those of you interested in getting scientific/empirical proof/evidence in the existence of God...

The experience of God is supposed to be above the faculty of your perceiving senses or your analytical mind. That's why people who don't believe in God will never find it, and people who do believe in God can't ever convince anybody else. God-ness (being with God, or whatever) amounts pretty much to a state of consciousness.

So don't hold your breath for empirical evidence.
 

desiree

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I think he was tipsy and added too much sulpher, and lol@your sig.
 

EcK

The Memes Justify the End
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What do NTs think of God, and how do they relate to Him ?

Him ? Do you have any documentation proving ur point ?
Why would an absolute god be a guy ? Does he(it) reproduce?

Three Christian-culture NTs I know admit either indifference or little understanding of what they call "religion."

ow, and when you say that, You must be kidding, Religious people are often those who understand religion the LESS (doh). I did myself study some theology, i'm not a specialist alright, but really, a good and benevolant god doing HORRIBLE things half of the time, then acting all goodie goodie.

Also, the bible views on physics is really SO bad you wonder how the MAKER OF THE DAMN UNIVERSE could make so little sense about his own creation.

Is it possible for an NT to be interested in God ?
You really don't want me to answer that.
 

EcK

The Memes Justify the End
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Er, also, for those of you interested in getting scientific/empirical proof/evidence in the existence of God...

The experience of God is supposed to be above the faculty of your perceiving senses or your analytical mind. That's why people who don't believe in God will never find it, and people who do believe in God can't ever convince anybody else. God-ness (being with God, or whatever) amounts pretty much to a state of consciousness.

So don't hold your breath for empirical evidence.


yeah, sure, but then what about miracles ? Every religious text talks about that.
prayers ?
Jesus and all the other prophets?
Immaculate conception for christian?

I do call those effects on the physical word, logical consequence: god is part of what physics can study, yet, no signs what so ever

Also, If god is omniscient and omnipotent, he's part of the universe, therefore:

1) he's a mean, lazy, misoginistic, child killing, jealous, childish, (goes on for 10kms) son of bitch.
2) Wait, how can he know EVERYTHING at EVERYMOMENT if information can't travel faster than light ?
3) as a force he must have a force carrier, so, is god a magnet or something? Should I praise the holy gluon just yet? And doesn't solve the issue about speed of light

Conclusion of the study: This is MAJOR bs.




NO PROOF WHAT SO EVER
 

Ishida

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Joined
May 5, 2008
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132
MBTI Type
INTJ
Yes, they can. People should know well enough by experiences with other temperaments that such foolishness as "NTs won't believe in God" is just that, foolishness. I guess the good part about this is not caring what other people think, whether they think you inferior, stupid, deluded, etc.
Even if it's your family.
 

EcK

The Memes Justify the End
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Yes, they can. People should know well enough by experiences with other temperaments that such foolishness as "NTs won't believe in God" is just that, foolishness. I guess the good part about this is not caring what other people think, whether they think you inferior, stupid, deluded, etc.
Even if it's your family.

I do see ur point, and i respect it.
but then you have to respect my belief in pink magical rainbow unicorns as being as likely if not more than today's religions (the bibliography is more recent and documented)
 
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