[MBTI General] ENFP Anti Weakness

[INA]

I think males are a lot more likely to tolerate that behavior in females than vice versa.

Yes.

And asking for directions to someone's place doesn't seem to me like something that would trigger the need to tell someone to man the *$^& up. I know men are generally better at finding their way around, but this is not on the order of asking for spoon-feeding.

 

[substitute]

I think males are a lot more likely to tolerate that behavior in females than vice versa.

maybe that's so, but i don't think the single case cited in the OP was an example of that... the person really was being super lame, I can't imagine many people thinking that wasn't lame without gender being in the equation.
I mean I can imagine lots of people doing it any damn way to just shut him up, but I expect most people would reserve the right to think he should've/could've done it himself.

Asking for directions is one thing - but asking someone to mapquest something FOR YOU, thereby acknowledging that there's a free, easy and available resource that would enable YOU to get your OWN directions, but yet still somehow making out the other person has to do it for you... that's just LAME. Sorry. If he'd said "gimme your zip code" or street address or whatever, so he could find it himself - fine. But asking you to do it? Gah!!!

 

[ajblaise]

And asking for directions to someone's place doesn't seem to me like something that would trigger the need to tell someone to man the *$^& up. I know men are generally better at finding their way around, but this is not on the order of asking for spoon-feeding.

Yeah, it's a pretty weak example of weakness.

 

[ajblaise]

maybe that's so, but i don't think the single case cited in the OP was an example of that... the person really was being super lame, I can't imagine many people thinking that wasn't lame without gender being in the equation.
I mean I can imagine lots of people doing it any damn way to just shut him up, but I expect most people would reserve the right to think he should've/could've done it himself.

Asking for directions is one thing - but asking someone to mapquest something FOR YOU, thereby acknowledging that there's a free, easy and available resource that would enable YOU to get your OWN directions, but yet still somehow making out the other person has to do it for you... that's just LAME. Sorry. If he'd said "gimme your zip code" or street address or whatever, so he could find it himself - fine. But asking you to do it? Gah!!!

How could he use mapquest if he's in his car? And I don't think many guys would say "Oh my girlfriend is so weak!" if she called and asked for directions and was a little worried.

 

[Rachelinpa]

Well, I think it was, as previously said, more the WAY he said it. It was the fear and angst that turned me off. And as BlownAway wrote, I think it's because if anyone is going to be angsty, I want it to be me. A quality of weakness I hate in myself and hence hate more when I see it in others.

 

[INA]

Well, I think it was, as previously said, more the WAY he said it. It was the fear and angst that turned me off. And as someone else wrote, I think it's because if anyone is going to be angsty, I want it to be me. A quality of weakness I hate in myself and hence hate more when I see it in others.

Yeah, I can't imagine that trait drops many panties. Men, ask for help in a masterful way! Rawr!

 

[substitute]

ah well, I didn't get the part about him being in the car. soz.

still, general principle applies in most cases, as i said... do your own legwork, dammit lol

The fear and angst in the voice triggering the contempt... yes, I can relate to that, definitely. But in me it doesn't depend on gender really at all.

Yeah if he'd said it like "okay you're gonna need to mapquest that for me" in a businesslike kinda way, like talking to his PA or something hahaha, I guess that'd come across less pathetic and more masterful... cunning!!

 

[Rachelinpa]

How could he use mapquest if he's in his car? And I don't think many guys would say "Oh my girlfriend is so weak!" if she called and asked for directions and was a little worried.

Yeah, I downplayed tone. It wasn't just that he asked. I also sensed urgency and anxiety. Plus, I felt like he wanted me to take on his frustration of being lost... no, thank you.

Men, ask for help in a masterful way! Rawr!

YES!

 

[ajblaise]

Yeah, I can't imagine that trait drops many panties. Men, ask for help in a masterful way!

"Listen dumb hoe, get the fuck on mapquest now, if I stay lost for another second I will make you sleep in the middle of the road"

I know what I'm saying if I ever need directions from a girl.

 

[INA]

"Listen dumb hoe, get the fuck on mapquest now, if I stay lost for another second I will make you sleep in the middle of the road"

I know what I'm saying if I ever need directions from a girl.

masterful =/= disrespectful, something that's lost on the youth of today. Try the "sweetcheeks" approach described above.

Poor dudes.

 

[phoenix13]

You're weird

I swear... what has this world come to where one ENFP calls another ENFP weird...

 

[betterthandead]

This is type oriented for ENFPs. Despite their outward zest and appeal for emotional outpourings they would like someone who is solid yet not dependent on them.

ENFPs like to advise and help someone but not so much as doing the actual task they just like suggesting in words. ENFPs I believe also prefer to have their own space which people who fall for the ENFP's "ways" become surprised to figure this one out. I've known ENFPs who would be enthusiastic about being friends or dating a person only to find themselves wanting to leave them if the other person seems "dependent" on them or tries to control the ENFP.

ENFP women have it a lot easier than ENFP men. So if you're a woman, go sit back and shut up.

 

[Rachelinpa]

ENFP women have it a lot easier than ENFP men.

How do you figure?

 

[Fuent]

Well, I think it was, as previously said, more the WAY he said it. It was the fear and angst that turned me off. And as BlownAway wrote, I think it's because if anyone is going to be angsty, I want it to be me. A quality of weakness I hate in myself and hence hate more when I see it in others.

You know what's weak? Bashing other people for being like this but accepting it in yourself.

 

[Little Linguist]

<Okay, I decided to put this in my rant in rave section just in case someone might go apeshit and think I was trolling.>

 

[redacted]

I personally am the same way. I like people around me to be in complete control over their emotional responses. When they let themselves go, it looks weak to me. It's not the position that they're in, it's the amount of control they have over their actions.

Now, I surround myself with people that all let themselves go much more than I do, so that probably says something about me -- I need to be the "strong" (defined as control over emotions) one in all situations. But when looking for a significant other, I need them to be like me in that way...

 

[SillyGoose]

This is type oriented for ENFPs. Despite their outward zest and appeal for emotional outpourings they would like someone who is solid yet not dependent on them.

ENFPs like to advise and help someone but not so much as doing the actual task they just like suggesting in words. ENFPs I believe also prefer to have their own space which people who fall for the ENFP's "ways" become surprised to figure this one out. I've known ENFPs who would be enthusiastic about being friends or dating a person only to find themselves wanting to leave them if the other person seems "dependent" on them or tries to control the ENFP.

ENFP women have it a lot easier than ENFP men. So if you're a woman, go sit back and shut up.

I'll agree with most of this, except for the shutting up part. That's not very nice

 

[Valiant]

Ok, I'm not sure what I'm asking here, so you can answer how you want.

Basically, I've noticed that I (female ENFP) get annoyed with guys (not so much girls) that are weak. Like, it almost embarasses me on their behalf. You know, I want them to be sensitive, but I don't want them to be too sensitive. I want them to be able to take care of themselves and not get all dependent and gushy at me.

I think it is "weakness" that bugs me, but I'm not sure.

For example, my guy friend (ISFP) calls me from the road on his way to visit me this weekend. It's like a 3 hour trip and he's been to my house before, but for whatever reason he got lost. He (almost fearfully) says to me, "Don't you have a map or something? I think you're going to need to mapquest this for me."

Now, I can't place my own emotion, but for some reason this rubs me the wrong way. I'm not annoyed that he's asking for help (because ordinarily I love helping people), but kind of! I'm annoyed, but I can't figure out why. It's a perfectly reasonable request, but I feel like, ok dude, what do you really want me to do here? Figure it out yourself. Don't be such a baby. Ugh.

Thoughts?

I don't think that there are many people with strong will and a pride of their own who would like to keep a "weak"/sensitive/spineless person company.
I've had this issue a lot. In school, mostly. When i've defended others from various things and they simply clung onto me like children holding their mothers' skirt.

And I've dated really timid girls up until now. My girlfriend nowdays is a really tough INFP It doesn't make any sense, I know But i'm not even sure who would win in a fistfight! She's got an irish temper

 

[animenagai]

How do you figure?

i'll give it a shot. an ENFP is often drawn to art, literature, etc. because of creativity and hidden meanings. this could be seen as quite a 'sissy' thing to do. manly men don't go around art galleries when they can be eating steaks and playing sport. in a world where so many people chase trends and norms, the female ENFP is considered more 'normal'.

back on topic though, i like tough people, but i don't mean that they necessarily have to take on every responsibility in the world. i like people who are intellectually independent. i don't really care if you don't have a job or if you still live at home. there's more to a guy than that.

 

[CzeCze]

I don't think showing vulnerability is weak. Pretending you don't have any yourself is weak.

I do think this may be an ENFP achille's heel, but it's also just human nature.

We despise the things that remind us either of our own weaknesses or fears.

And nobody can be as disgusted with us as we are with ourselves.

I've definitely gotten fed up by people who wallow in their own inertia, depression, blah blah blah and refuse to do anything about their lives. Even after given many opportunities, tools, advice, directives.

I know currently I try to avoid these people at all costs and minimize their effect on my life. And I can get really irritated when I feel like they're trying to drag me down with them or trying to bring everyone down around them or basically reducing themselves to rubble even against advice and *obvious* signs pointing them in another direction.

Why? Partly because I can identify with this kind of damning inertia and "stubborness"
And there is no way I want to get stuck with that bag again. That issue is my krytopnite! So when I see it manifest in others, my reaction is

I know what being in that situation is like and more importantly, I feel like I know how to get out of it. "I can do it, you can, too!" That's what I think more or less. And watching people struggle like that frustrates me to no end because it reminds me of my own struggles and reminds me of a place that feels uncomfortably close or just plain unpleasant.

Soooo, that's kinda how I'm reading your situation.

Where's Edahn Mr. Buddhist/transformational therapy devotee? I wanna see what he has to say!

Anywhoo, I also don't like how the term 'weakness' is thrown around so easily. It needs defining. Otherwise, I just take the value of 'weak' which to me automatically means 'wrong', 'inferior', 'loser' -- and I kinda think that's what you meant.

I think the 'NF males have it harder' argument can be carried on in its own thread -- which was started by Angry Aryab.