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[NF] Why Immature F-ers give me the creeps?

sciski

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Thanks--okay, that is different to an immature feeler... I actually wasn't trying to level out the playing field with my question, but was wondering if you were reacting to immaturity in all forms, as opposed to the 'feeling' side, which might just be incomprehensible to you at present.

But your views of immature feelers/thinkers seem to be linked by their stubborn refusal to see other points of view, whether the basis is from logic or from values. My guess is that your annoyance comes from the refusal to compromise and the creepiness comes from the refusal to explain?

People who act in unconscionable ways while saying 'they felt like it' creep me out too, but I doubt these behaviours are limited to feelers. Someone said it before and it's worth stating again - often 'I felt like it' is a crap excuse for someone who either, i) can't be bothered to rationalise their own behaviour, or ii) can't be bothered to explain their rationalisation to you. It's a very easy exit clause to take, because often, the 'uhh- felt like it' statement bamboozles the other person so much that they drop the subject or start focusing on that statement instead of the action that led to it.

That sort of statement could come from an F or a T - though ironically, it's MORE likely to come from a T. Fs generally want to either connect with you or to express themselves... so you'll more likely get a HUGE overexplanation (ie, a dreadful rant/lecture that will leave you running for the hills) or a flustered attempt at a rationalisation-that-barely-makes-sense than a brush-off.

I'm kinda thinking, in your example waaaay back with your policeman friend, that sort of response could have come from any of my TJ friends - spite is not limited to Feelers at all. My ENTJ friend would have taken great joy in giving someone a ticket for being an asshole. But -- and here's the difference -- if so inclined, he would have been able to give you an acceptable logical, rational explanation for his behaviour, which to me (as an F) would have sounded like pure bullshit.

I guess my point is that any type is capable of crappy behaviour, but I think some can simply explain it to you in a way that sits better with you, while others will not be able to... and it might simply be your own predisposition towards Thinking that is stopping you seeing from the Feeling perspective. I know some strong Feelers can find Thinking actions incomprehensible, but if they ratcheted down the Feeling somewhat, would be able to see from the Thinking perspective. If you truly want to understand the Feeling perspective, you'll have to let go your bias - at least temporarily. :)

Hopefully that made some sense!
 
T

ThatGirl

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I do think I am zeroing in on immaturity in general. Thinkers don't creep me out because on some level whether I agree or not, I get it, and know how to react to it. I find feelers to be unpredictable and unhealthy feelers to be dishonest with themselves and others. I guess it comes down to the loyalty issue. I am also still anoyed with the forced participation in feeler like activities.

Example from two days ago:

NF friend brings SFP friend to my place even though she knows I can't stand SFP but she wants us to get along. SFP sees a hand knit blanket and asks if he can have it. I tell him that it belongs to someone else so it is not mine to give away. I am thinking who walks into someones place and just asks if they can take something. NF intervenes by saying "aww just give it to him it would make him happy," no kidding she says this. Then I have to be the big bitch that ruins SFPs happieness. I sternly tell him no.

Now I know that feeling means value judgement but there does seem to be a pattern with dominant feelers using emotions as the basis of their decisions. It seems from my observation that overly empathetic feelers make poor value judgments as a tactical way of making the negitive emotions subside as quickly as possible. This narrow goal can lead to huge flaws in terms of long term solution if the value judgments are interconnected to external circumstances. I am now guessing that these extreme F people I am noticing have underdeveloped T functions in general leading to the assumption of immaturity.

All I know it that after a while of being surrounded Fs I breath easy in the company of my INTJ friend who could care less which is fine with me. There just seems to be no preconcieved expectations for us to define the standards of our friendship with. We just enjoy each others conversations then go about our buisness.
 

entropie

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I do think I am zeroing in on immaturity in general. Thinkers don't creep me out because on some level whether I agree or not, I get it, and know how to react to it. I find feelers to be unpredictable and unhealthy feelers to be dishonest with themselves and others. I guess it comes down to the loyalty issue. I am also still anoyed with the forced participation in feeler like activities.

Example from two days ago:

NF friend brings SFP friend to my place even though she knows I can't stand SFP but she wants us to get along. SFP sees a hand knit blanket and asks if he can have it. I tell him that it belongs to someone else so it is not mine to give away. I am thinking who walks into someones place and just asks if they can take something. NF intervenes by saying "aww just give it to him it would make him happy," no kidding she says this. Then I have to be the big bitch that ruins SFPs happieness. I sternly tell him no.

Now I know that feeling means value judgement but there does seem to be a pattern with dominant feelers using emotions as the basis of their decisions. It seems from my observation that overly empathetic feelers make poor value judgments as a tactical way of making the negitive emotions subside as quickly as possible. This narrow goal can lead to huge flaws in terms of long term solution if the value judgments are interconnected to external circumstances. I am now guessing that these extreme F people I am noticing have underdeveloped T functions in general leading to the assumption of immaturity.

All I know it that after a while of being surrounded Fs I breath easy in the company of my INTJ friend who could care less which is fine with me. There just seems to be no preconcieved expectations for us to define the standards of our friendship with. We just enjoy each others conversations then go about our buisness.

That gives me the creeps
 

heart

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NF friend brings SFP friend to my place even though she knows I can't stand SFP but she wants us to get along. SFP sees a hand knit blanket and asks if he can have it. I tell him that it belongs to someone else so it is not mine to give away. I am thinking who walks into someones place and just asks if they can take something. NF intervenes by saying "aww just give it to him it would make him happy," no kidding she says this. Then I have to be the big bitch that ruins SFPs happieness. I sternly tell him no.

That just sounds like someone being a clueless flake and having no respect for other's things. You're totally correct you don't just walk into someone's home and treat it like a rummage sale.
 

entropie

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^^

Except a girl is walking with you inside your home, then you absolutly will treat the environment like a rummage sale. xD
 

nolla

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There just seems to be no preconcieved expectations for us to define the standards of our friendship with. We just enjoy each others conversations then go about our buisness.

Hmm... This sounds like me describing some of my best relationships, except that I would replace "conversations" with "company". I don't like it when people start expecting me to be there for them all the time. But its quite easy to solve, anyways, just ignore the calls and say your mobile was lost somewhere... ;)
 

entropie

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hahaha, I gave up finding excuses, I just tell I havent powered my mobile up for like 3 weeks xDD

But I am offtopic here, will go now :)
 

sciski

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ThatGirl; said:
NF friend brings SFP friend to my place even though she knows I can't stand SFP but she wants us to get along. SFP sees a hand knit blanket and asks if he can have it. I tell him that it belongs to someone else so it is not mine to give away. I am thinking who walks into someones place and just asks if they can take something. NF intervenes by saying "aww just give it to him it would make him happy," no kidding she says this. Then I have to be the big bitch that ruins SFPs happieness. I sternly tell him no.

Hehe, I think that story only makes sense if the SFP in question is less than 12 years old, and the NF in question is his mother.

I agree that the coolness and (general) predictability of Ts is very soothing. :)

Balance is good.

As for your opinion of DomFs, be careful that you don't start projecting behaviours upon them... This is mainly from your statement, "unhealthy feelers to be dishonest with themselves and others." I have judged an ESTJ friend like this in the past as well, but who knows, maybe she is actually completely honest, but I just don't understand her frame of reference. Having said that, you could of course be correct in your assessment.
 
T

ThatGirl

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Lol! So the blanket thing wasn't just me. Thank god.

By dominant feelers I wasn't refering to function but more dominating feelers. Like you will respect the feeling I told you to or else dominance.
 

heart

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Lol! So the blanket thing wasn't just me. Thank god.

No, that blanket thing was really strange. I'm with the person who wondered if this was a child and a mother, but then I re-read your post and saw that nope you were really talking about adults. :shock:
 

Carebear

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Hmm... This sounds like me describing some of my best relationships, except that I would replace "conversations" with "company". I don't like it when people start expecting me to be there for them all the time. But its quite easy to solve, anyways, just ignore the calls and say your mobile was lost somewhere... ;)

Same here. There are some E--J "friends" of mine that don't take too well to this view of friendship/relationship, but ignoring calls normally works great. :D
 

SquirrelTao

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ThatGirl, may I ask you this? What are you really seeking? Do you hope to change Feelers? Do you hope to shame them into changing? You began the thread by saying you wanted to understand. Then you responded to me once in this thread saying you understood Feelers better than we thought. As this thread has worn on, you have demonstrated more sophistication in your understanding of Feelers. Is this sophistication new, due to learning from your conversations here? Or were you feigning naivity in your original post and early responses?

Further, may I say to you that you have the right to take issue with somebody who is harming you or another person with their mysterious Feeling ways. If they are not causing you or another person harm, however, your creeped out feeling is your issue, not theirs. I.E., if you do not understand me - but I am not harming you - but you feel creeped out by me - that is your issue, not mine. It places no burden on me to alter myself to fit into the narrow spaces of your understanding.
 
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ThatGirl

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I came into this thread with a very good understanding of the superficial cause and effect interaction when dealing with feelers. I was creeped out from not understanding where this motivation comes from as well as not observing the existence of what you say is a mature feeler. I also have the ability to grasp someones capabilities from very early on and am creeped out to realize what unhealthy feelers are capable of in different circumstances. As I read and listened I became aware of the subdivided groups of feelers that exist and gained a better understanding of each that hopefully helps me to recognize the differences within a type that I had previously generalized. The sophistication, I hope, comes from understanding of the evolving thread. It may also help that I finally won the war of the mice that kept me preoccupied with work, excessive cleaning, and three weeks without anything close to a decent nights sleep. They would come on my bed in the middle of the night.
 

SquirrelTao

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If you can open your mind that fast in conversing with others who give you new information, then you can't be all bad :yes:

Okay, but you then you say you have not observed the existence of a mature feeler.

Are the mature feelers on this board the only ones you've yet encountered?

What kind of people are you surrounded by?

Okay, okay, I'm through giving you a hard time.

Here's wishing that you meet more mature feelers in your life.
 
T

ThatGirl

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I think I was putting all the other feelers into the thinking box automatically if they made sense.
 

runvardh

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I think I was putting all the other feelers into the thinking box automatically if they made sense.

This is what had my roommate put me in the rational box at first.
 

runvardh

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Wording and reminder of intent. Too many people don't know enough about different personality types to really know how to take what a person says.
 
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